rec.autos.simulators

Tyre Wear In N4

Rod Princ

Tyre Wear In N4

by Rod Princ » Wed, 14 Feb 2001 20:57:35

Not being a NASCAR conniseur (I get to see it occassionally
on cable in Aus) I'm wondering if the tyres are as weak in
RL as they are in N4.

If I spin at Daytona, I'll usually always end up with at
least 2 blown tyres. If I spin at a slower paced oval, I'll
have to pit immediately due to badly damaged tyres.

Bravo if it mimics real life, but they seem very susceptible
to failure.

Cheers,
Rod.

Cliff Roma

Tyre Wear In N4

by Cliff Roma » Wed, 14 Feb 2001 21:26:01

If you watch a Nascar race and a car spins or locks up his tires, you will
always notice that they come in and change the tires because of Flat
Spotting them.

Alot of times yes, you will notice that by spinning a car will end up with a
flat tire and have to change it also.


Mike Donnelly J

Tyre Wear In N4

by Mike Donnelly J » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 00:43:45

It might be a touch overstated in N4, but not off by much.  Part of the
issue will be setup, another part driving style and finally, how hard
are you on the brakes?  Spinning and slamming on the brakes at high
speed will shred your *** faster than you'd think.  Remember there's
about 3/32 of *** on the tire.  (It pays to watch RPM2nite...  :)  )

> Not being a NASCAR conniseur (I get to see it occassionally
> on cable in Aus) I'm wondering if the tyres are as weak in
> RL as they are in N4.

> If I spin at Daytona, I'll usually always end up with at
> least 2 blown tyres. If I spin at a slower paced oval, I'll
> have to pit immediately due to badly damaged tyres.

> Bravo if it mimics real life, but they seem very susceptible
> to failure.

> Cheers,
> Rod.

daxe

Tyre Wear In N4

by daxe » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 08:27:23

On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 11:57:35 GMT, Rod Prince


>Not being a NASCAR conniseur (I get to see it occassionally
>on cable in Aus) I'm wondering if the tyres are as weak in
>RL as they are in N4.

Obviously you are not a NASCAR conniseur, or you would know they do
not have "tyres" or even "tires", but "tars."

Your pit crew will probably shrug and give you vacant look, since they
have no idea what "tyres" are.

What I really want to know is if they filled with simulated nitrogen
or not.

~daxe

Mark McCue

Tyre Wear In N4

by Mark McCue » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 08:36:16

Ohhhhh Yeah! (g)  3500 pounds of racecar sideways at 180 really ruins a
tire's social life!

I used hate dragging car sideways down the length of the backstretch knowing
I could pull right back out and go back to work.  Watch a real WC race and
what happens immediately after ANY kind of smoke creating incident on the
track.  You guessed it!  Pit!

--
=========================================
Control, Vision, Determination...
These are the 3 fundamental components
of the new generation race car driver
Speed is a By Product...Goin Fast
But Remember...
The Car is You...You are the Car...
Okay? ... ... Let's RIIIIIIIIIIIDE!

Mark McCuen  #35 Hooters Monte Carlo//#35 F150 (TNT Series)
                www.hooters-racing.com
=========================================

Larr

Tyre Wear In N4

by Larr » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 12:46:57

Scrub yer head along the ground at 190mph for 1/2 mile.

Stings, don't it :)

-Larry


Rod Princ

Tyre Wear In N4

by Rod Princ » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:33:30



Sorry, but I refuse to use the bastardised version of the English
language.

Cheers,
Rod.

Rod Princ

Tyre Wear In N4

by Rod Princ » Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:41:40


racing.com says...

The coverage we get on Nascar over here is very limited and usually at
4am in the morning, so I don't often get the luxury. ;( You have to
search far and wide to find any TV coverage other than the odd race
being broadcast on cable. Seen a few instances where a driver will
stay out after a small incident where they've smoked tyres and try
and feel as to whether there was any damage or flatspotting.

Always had an interest, but we're dominated by V8 supercar races who
don't appear to be as prone to a blown tyre, but admittedly, they are
a lighter car.

I've seen a tyre put through what would appear alot more abuse than
that of a stockcar and come out without a blowout. It's not considered
a safety risk having tyres blowout so readily in such a manner?

Cheers,
Rod.

Mike Donnelly J

Tyre Wear In N4

by Mike Donnelly J » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 06:42:41



> racing.com says...

> > I used hate dragging car sideways down the length of the backstretch knowing
> > I could pull right back out and go back to work.  Watch a real WC race and
> > what happens immediately after ANY kind of smoke creating incident on the
> > track.  You guessed it!  Pit!

> The coverage we get on Nascar over here is very limited and usually at
> 4am in the morning, so I don't often get the luxury. ;( You have to
> search far and wide to find any TV coverage other than the odd race
> being broadcast on cable. Seen a few instances where a driver will
> stay out after a small incident where they've smoked tyres and try
> and feel as to whether there was any damage or flatspotting.

Depends largely on the track, where they're running, how early/late you are in the
race.  If you're on the lead lap and it doesn't bring out the caution, you run
until the caution comes out or you get lapped (unless you hit your pit window
first).

At a track like Rockingham or Darlington, you get new tires as soon as you can.
The surface is just too abrasive to run around on bad ***.  The restrictor
plate tracks you *try* to stay out, but for an entirely different reason: once you
lose the draft it's a matter of time until you're lapped.  BUT, if you pit right
away, with the amount of time it take to go down pit lane and get back up to
speed, it's going to cost you at least one lap, possibly two or more.  OTOH, if
you flat spot it a Pocono, you want to get in and get new *** fast because you
*can* do it without going a lap down.

Also, if it happens early enough in the event, you get *** to be safe.  It may
cost you a lap or two, but a shredded tire that takes out a quarterpanel can ruin
your day.  Early in an event you've got time that can be made up on a
caution/restart.  With ten to go, chuck everything I said out the window.  It's
time to go and you have to use what you have.  Unless the caution comes out.  Then
duck in and get *** and beat them with fresh ***.  (THIS is definitely a
judgement call and why the crew chiefs are paid so well.)

Yes, it is.  But, since there's only one tire manufacturer in NASCAR, they're more
worried about the saftey aspect of the tire than getting the cars to go faster.
That said, the tire made are made to precise specifications to make them fairly
durable (or as durable as you can get racing in the sandhills of North Carolina),
yet there's only 3/32 of an inch of *** on the radial tires.  You *can*
manufacture them thicker, but then you're looking at an entirely different
operating enviroment (where operating tire temperatures *must* be lower to avoid
'cooking' the tire).

At the big tracks they use an 'inner liner' - basically a tire within the tire to
prevent a catostrophic failure from being a tragedy.

Rod Princ

Tyre Wear In N4

by Rod Princ » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 07:45:01


says...

<snip lots of great info>

Thanks Mike, taking time out to explain is really appreciated.

Knowing more about the sport helps you appreciate the sim
alot more.

One *** manufacturer? Designed to level the playing field?

We've got coverage of a race tommorrow morning at 5am, no
indication of where it is and what the event is. That's the
extent of coverage we get over here. (but at least we do get
the odd race)

Cheers,
Rod.

David Er

Tyre Wear In N4

by David Er » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 07:58:42

    There were two tire makers in NASCAR a couple of years ago.  Prior to
that there had been a long stretch with only one tire manufacturer in the
series.  When Hoosier began competing with Goodyear they arrived with tires
that were initially significantly faster than the Goodyear product (Geoff
Bodine in #7 particularly). Goodyear quickly responded and a technology race
was on.  The trouble with this is that NASCAR race cars are heavy vehicles
travelling at very high average speeds during green light runs on steeply
banked tracks.  The loads and wear on the tires are very high.  Since both
companies were pushing the envelope of tire technology  drivers started to
experience severe tire degradation with consequent handling oddities: *not a
good thing* when travelling close to 200 mph  and 8 feet from a concrete
wall.  Everyone pretty much breathed a sigh of relief when Hoosier bowed out
citing cost considerations.  I believe Hoosier is now  the sole tire choice
of one of the NASCAR feeder series but the name escapes me.
    Now quality of *** is pretty much taken for granted since Goodyear
can build them a durable as they need to be to match up with the mandated
fuel load  and consequent pitting interval.

Dave_Erb



> says...

> <snip lots of great info>

> Thanks Mike, taking time out to explain is really appreciated.

> Knowing more about the sport helps you appreciate the sim
> alot more.

> One *** manufacturer? Designed to level the playing field?

> We've got coverage of a race tommorrow morning at 5am, no
> indication of where it is and what the event is. That's the
> extent of coverage we get over here. (but at least we do get
> the odd race)

> Cheers,
> Rod.

Mike Donnelly J

Tyre Wear In N4

by Mike Donnelly J » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:33:31



> says...

> <snip lots of great info>

> Thanks Mike, taking time out to explain is really appreciated.

> Knowing more about the sport helps you appreciate the sim
> alot more.

> One *** manufacturer? Designed to level the playing field?

Not so much for competition reasons but safety.  Back in '92 (the season that
N1 modeled), there were 2 manufacturers - a tire war.  Both wanted to win,
and wanted to with a passion.  The other maker really pushed the envelope in
search of grip and there were several major accidents due to this pushing of
the envelope.  Since the second maker was blamed for going too far they
pulled out and since then, NASCAR mandated that there would be only one tire
maker.

Enjoy the Twin 125s then.

Mike Donnelly J

Tyre Wear In N4

by Mike Donnelly J » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:35:29

Probably the ARCA Re/Max series.

Michael Basde

Tyre Wear In N4

by Michael Basde » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:58:17

Nope Goodyear and Hoosier co-exist there nicely..



Rod Princ

Tyre Wear In N4

by Rod Princ » Fri, 16 Feb 2001 12:01:49


says...

Gee, a decision by an official body that put safety above commercial
gain, I never though I would see the day. ;)

Thanks again Mike.

Cheers,
Rod.


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