rec.autos.simulators

Configure a "second modem" in Windows with the init strings to
limit it to V.34 (33.6k) and use that to connect when playing GPL.

Richard.
--
Richard Bellavance                     Enter-Net Inc.
                                       Phone:  (450) 652-7189 #16
Systems Administrator/                         (514) 990-1683 #16
  Analyst-Programmer                   Fax:    (450) 652-6973

Also, the only way a poorly set up client can downgrade the performance
of other clients in a race, is if he is warping in and out of the field
of cars and making a hazard of himself.
I think you will find anyone that is doing that will disconnect
themselves through decency, or they will be disconnected anyway, if
their connections are that bad.
They cannot effect the other clients in any other way at all..
Like i said Phillip, you are totally wrong on the concept of thinking a
.600 ping is useless, but that is your opinion, i just hope that other
on-line enthusiasts are not discouraged by this false assumption you
have made.
I will agree with you that in F1, pings over .550 are not real good,
but before you actually disagree with me again, take a F2 or F3 car to
a high ping server and you will see what i mean.
I have seen these comments about pings a few times, and it is always
from the guys that do not have a good connection, or have not taken the
time to set up their DUN's properly.
Try a F2 or F3 race with a ping of around .550 to .650 sometime, and as
long as your quality is good, you will be surprised at the performance.
Personally i feel sorry for anyone who believes that a ping of up to
.600 is bad news for GPL, as it explains why there is not a lot more
Australian sim racers in overseas leagues.
False assumptions are bad news for GPL on-line. :)

Cheers,
Ron

Like i just replied to Phillip, you are welcome to come to any decision
you like when it comes to personal opinions, but as far as pings over
.400 in GPL being less than desirable for racing, that simply isn't
true.
That isn't just my opinion, by the way, but we have proven that pings
of up to .600 are perfect in F2 &  F3 and likewise for pings of up to
550 in F1.
I am not going to try and dissuade you from what you believe Richard,
but if you are having problems at pings over .400, then there is still
something not setup right on your computer, or the hosts you were
connecting to were overtaxing their cpu's.
If you want help or information on tuning your DUN or improving your
connection for on-line racing, drop me a line and i will help you sort
it out a bit better.

Cheers,
Ron

No problems at all about you re-posting that info..
If we can improve the quality and connections of drivers in on-line
GPL and educate a few on the problems that can be encountered and how
to fix them, then we are miles in front.
Like i said earlier, if anyone is having problems with warping or
generally would like help in setting up their connections, you are
welcome to drop me a line and i will try to help you sort it out.
I will add, that since i wrote that article, GPL 1.2 has been released,
so in general you will find the new Synch method works fine now with
GPL, so there should be no need to alter the Synch method.
Synch method 1 (the new method) works almost perfectly now, but i will
add that if you find you are having a lot of disco problems, even
though your quality and ping seem good, try using the old Synch method
"0" with a clock delay of 12.
I have found that with a couple of the servers i connect to on a
regular bassis in the states, that the old Synch method still works
better for me, but usually i leave it at the new method of 1.

Cheers,
Ron

I disagree. Try a lesser figure. You have generalised. You've taken a
story that may apply to some circumstances and implied that it is
always the case.

What I have said is based not only on my own personal expenses, but
those of numerous people who do a lot more OS racing at the highest
levels than I do or have done.

Which of course, in fairness, must also apply to you.

All things being equal, and expecting nothing more than the usual mode
of status with the misc servers one finds, a 600 ping from Australia
to OS is in 98% of cases bad news. As I say, there are a few notable
exceptions where the connection quality is unusually stable for
whatever reasons.

If there are bad routers then you are more likely to get one with a 20
hop connection than a 7 hop connection.

No one is saying that latency alone is the cause of all ills. But as
has already been said - the reason you get a high latency in OS
connections from here is also likely to encompass the related reasons
why  the various other factors will also be on the poor side -
resulting in an overall less than attractive experience.

My comments relate to F1 races. And they are not just my comments but
those opinions that have been expressed to me by others - who have
simply told me exactly what I have repeated here.

Some have gone further to explain that it is a pain to race in
overseas races because of the lag problems - even when they are not
warping or clock smashing - in that they can't do the wheel to wheel
racing they expect or even to try an overtaking attempt that they
would have made otherwise.

I believe that if you got 100 people in Oz, set them up and let them
connect to 100 OS racers  on 100 OS servers with pings of 600 or more,
and then asked them what they thought of the racing experience they
had just had, you would get an overwhelming number saying that it was
useless.

My comments are for the general rule. Yours are for specific isolated
and unusual cases. It is more truthful , imho, to tell people what
they are most likely to encounter rather than what they might
encounter in a few special cases if they are lucky. It is more false
to use the best case scenario as a description to inform others of the
norm.

I, like many others I might add, have zero interest in F2 or F3 cars.
If others enjoy them then fine. But its defiantly not my cup of tea.

How on earth can you say that you personally know the DUN settings and
other factors involved on the systems of other racers you see who
happen to be having a bad connection time ? Do you simply see someone
with a bad connection and then assume that they must have certain
settings. Be advised, that there are many who have done all the DUN
settings etc that are commonly recommended and who can still not get a
decent OS race at 600 or greater pings. You assume too much.

I feel just as sorry for those who have connected with 600 OS pings
expecting to be able to race - and then simply find they spend one
frustrating hour after another and then give up as seeing the whole
thing as useless. Better to give them the proper scoop in the first
place and get them racing in an arena where they can experience the
kind of racing that most closely meets their expectations and hopes.

Do you honestly think that the bulk of Australian sim racers refrain
from OS races because someone has said the pings are too high? You
sound rather nieve. You could say all you want but the great many
people will go and try it for themslves anyway. The more likely reason
that more Australias do no run in OS races is that they have probably
all tried to do so on many occasions and have finally come to their
own conclusions that its not worth the bother.

Even over the last few weeks when we have been having problems
providing servers here in Oz, and where there has been no Australian
alternative, you still do not see many Aussies doing OS races at 600
ping or more - even when some are desperate for some racing. Many of
these people have been racing online with GPL since it first came out
and know which way is up. Proper DUN settings etc is not news to them.
Do you think that they are all refraining because someone has said the
pings are too high ? They know better I suggest.

False and misleading information is always undesirable in any area. I
don't know that you are squeaky clean in this matter.

Best Regards

Phillip McNelley

--
Don Scurlock
Vancouver,B.C.

Enjoy you on-line experiences...

Cheers,
Ron

**snipo **

I'm not really enthusiastic enough about on-line to worry about chasing the
best setup.......I simply use it for fun and if on-line is either too
glitchy or too expensive or too difficult to set up then that's okay.

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

Your being there might even get #33 out of his house. Tim is coming.
:-)

Norbury Technologies

It is not a wate of time getting the "truth" accross to anyone. Your
"truth" and mine seems to be at odds though.

For what its worth, from here on in I am more likey to tell people
that in my expierence an OS 600+ ping has almost always been a waste
of time BUT some have found such to be OK. I still think that
untimately everyone will try it for themselves and make up their own
minds regardless of what anyone tells them.

There is an old saying. When the truth seems to confict with
expeirience then go with experience.

In any case, with high bandwith connects soon to be available to many
at an affordable price in Australia perhaps these kind of discussions
will be irrelavant in due course.

I don't call relating the truth of my expieience over the last year or
more as being negative. I simply feel its better to tell people what
they are most likly to expierience - based on my understanding and
expieience.

If I say to somone avoid this but go for that because that will
utimatly give you the best expieience then I feel that's a way of
being possitive and helping them to not have a negative expierence.

Whatever.

Best Regards

Phillip McNelley

: Like i just replied to Phillip, you are welcome to come to any decision
: you like when it comes to personal opinions, but as far as pings over
: .400 in GPL being less than desirable for racing, that simply isn't
: true.
: That isn't just my opinion, by the way, but we have proven that pings
: of up to .600 are perfect in F2 &  F3 and likewise for pings of up to
: 550 in F1.

  Most people race in F1.  I wouldn't claim to be able to comment on F2
& F3 ping connections.  The reason I assume is that an F1 car simply
moves further in the .3 seconds taken to get info back from the server
if your pings are poor.

: I am not going to try and dissuade you from what you believe Richard,
: but if you are having problems at pings over .400, then there is still
: something not setup right on your computer, or the hosts you were
: connecting to were overtaxing their cpu's.
: If you want help or information on tuning your DUN or improving your
: connection for on-line racing, drop me a line and i will help you sort
: it out a bit better.

  Fine thank you - I actually do internet stuff as part of my
regular research work.  Specifically relating to router and TCP/IP
efficiency.  Higher pings in GPL are likely to lead to more disconnects
simply because (here in Europe at least) higher ping is often a sign
that there are more routers between you and the host - which means that
you are likely to have lower quality.  As I said, quality is as
important - but also harder to measure before you join a server.

  If Bruce can find himself < .4 ms ping sites then he's also likely to
get a higher quality connection.

--
Richard G. Clegg       Only the mind is waving
    Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group
      Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York
    www:  http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

  Bruce,
        he wasn't talking about buying a second modem - he was talking
about adding three or four characters into your modems configuration
which will improve the GPL performance by making it act like a slower
modem when you need it to.  It's pretty easy to do and does enhance the
online experience.

--
Richard G. Clegg       Only the mind is waving
    Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group
      Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York
    www:  http://www.racesimcentral.net/

And as you seem unable to notice that serveral variables are mentioned
i can'y say that I'm impressed with your ability to read and take
notice of what's being said.

Cheers

PM