What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
cheating online?
Notable threadRobert Huggins cheating case revisited over RASCAR entry
John Simmons confirmed that Robert Huggins, caught cheating in Papyrus online racing years earlier, had applied to RASCAR and was refused. Tom Pabst argued Huggins was never proven to have cheated and that hearsay was unfair, while others insisted he was guilty; old Hawaii and TEN-era racers shared their memories. Claims that RAM cheats still worked in NR2003 were also raised, and the debate got personal at times.
Automated summary.
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> cheating online?
>
Michael Schumacher
In article <bd53of$g4n$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
No, a sim racer, and the sim was Nascar Racing.
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > "John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > cheating online? > > > > Michael Schumacher > > >What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> > cheating online?-------------------------
Was it SAVATS? He was accused many times in GPL.
--
Richard "ZZ" Busch
Member:
Screamers Racing League
CORS
RASCAR
GPL Rank + 17.415
MoGPL Rank + 318.586
N2002 Rank + 7.695
http://www.ZZBusch.com
----------------
Busch Motorsports:
Remember racecar is racecar spelled backward
-----------------
Busch Carpentry:
A good carpenter can nail anything
-----------------
>"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> cheating online?
Well there was many, but Robert Huggins was the "famous" one.
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
In article <U4pJa.715$[email hidden]>, francois-
[email hidden] says...
> >"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote
> > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> > cheating online?
>
>
> Well there was many, but Robert Huggins was the "famous" one.
Yup, that's the guy I was thinking of.
John Simmons wrote:
LOL, was wondering when someone would bring up this one :-)
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > In article <U4pJa.715$[email hidden]>, francois- > [email hidden] says... > > >"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > > cheating online? > > > > > > Well there was many, but Robert Huggins was the "famous" one. > > Yup, that's the guy I was thinking of.In article <[email hidden]>, elmana@int-
resources.com says...
Well, he applied for membership in RASCAR, and I wanted to be sure he
was the same guy I was thinking about before refusing his
application.
Old sim racers have really long memories - I'm so old, I needed help
with mine. I checked dejanews because I know it was discussed
frequently here. Then, someone on sierra's boards mentioned his
current ID's, and one of the ones listed is the one the applicant
provided. That was proof enough for me.
I figured he was the one when I found his name in a list alongside
Don Wilshe's.
Quoted text (17 lines)
> > > John Simmons wrote: > > > > In article <U4pJa.715$[email hidden]>, francois- > > [email hidden] says... > > > >"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > > > cheating online? > > > > > > > > > Well there was many, but Robert Huggins was the "famous" one. > > > > Yup, that's the guy I was thinking of. > > LOL, was wondering when someone would bring up this one :-) >
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Didn't you let Don run a few RASCAR races a while back?
Quoted text (13 lines)
> In article <[email hidden]>, elmana@int- > resources.com says... > > > > Old sim racers have really long memories - I'm so old, I needed help > with mine. I checked dejanews because I know it was discussed > frequently here. Then, someone on sierra's boards mentioned his > current ID's, and one of the ones listed is the one the applicant > provided. That was proof enough for me. > > I figured he was the one when I found his name in a list alongside > Don Wilshe's. >In article <bd5dph$mit$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
That was last season, and yeah we did. Then we found out he was
involved in fraudulent registrations in another league, and we
refused him (and his alter ego) entry into RASCAR this season.
Again, the decision to refuse him entry was his past with another
league. While I don't think he'll ever admit it, he tried the same
crap with us.
Quoted text (19 lines)
> > "John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > In article <[email hidden]>, elmana@int- > > resources.com says... > > > > > > > Old sim racers have really long memories - I'm so old, I needed help > > with mine. I checked dejanews because I know it was discussed > > frequently here. Then, someone on sierra's boards mentioned his > > current ID's, and one of the ones listed is the one the applicant > > provided. That was proof enough for me. > > > > I figured he was the one when I found his name in a list alongside > > Don Wilshe's. > > > Didn't you let Don run a few RASCAR races a while back? > > >John Simmons <[email hidden]> wrote in news:MPG.195fcbc2b3deac08989942@news-
server.satx.rr.com:
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> cheating online?
>
4th Turn is a huge cheat from what I hear
server.satx.rr.com:
4th Turn is a huge cheat from what I hear
Whoa, John!
If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do some
deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheating under
circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. At the time,
there's enough evidence that he was arbitrarily "kicked off TEN" by Papyrus
for not so noble reasons.....the excuse was that he was cheating. Nothing
was ever proven. I believe Robert's "response" was something along the
lines of "yes, I was cheating online.....but I was hired by Papyrus to do
that in order to prove to them the flaws in their online coding for NASCAR 3
(I believe it was N3....not totally sure about that)." He claims to have
had some "political problems" subsequently with several individuals at
Papyrus.......and that he was "framed" as a cheater for that reason. I'm
not sure of all of the details.....but my memory isn't too far off.....that
I am sure of.
I also can tell you that at the same time, I was having some problems with
some Papyrus staff as well......but for entirely different and unrelated
things. But, these few individuals I had problems with....if they were also
ones that were involved with Robert's deal.......these guys were not beyond
doing something like that. I will tell you that I did not sit back and take
this crap from these people idly......I took it to Havaas.....and within a
month all three of these individuals were mysteriously no longer working at
Papyrus! I'm not going to rehash old shit......but this occurred just after
the Huggins deal (by a few months).....so you can figure out the connection
yourself.
I would also like you to research how he has conducted himself since then,
and what he has contributed to this sim community's online racing software
since then. He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still, (I
believe).....and there's enough well respected people on that race team that
did enough "search and research" to satisfy themselves enough to have Robert
Huggins join the team (a couple years ago I believe). That, I would
think....should carry some weight with you as well. But, you should do your
own homework, too.
Finally, I will state emphatically that I am not friends with Robert
Huggins, that I have no ulterior motive for making these statements about
him. I am only making them in the interest of fair play. I think you are
making a mistake, John. That's the only reason I have responded to this
post.
My regards,
Tom Pabst
Pabst-Racing.com
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> cheating online?
>
Oh CRAP PEOPLE.......
Have we learned nothing from the witch-hunt days? From the Joe McCarthy
days?
CAN WE PLEASE AVOID THE *******"I HEARD SO-IN-SO IS A CHEATER"
STATEMENTS*******?????????
Zodiac....I don't have a clue who you are. But your "stock" in my book just
went to "zero!" That was one of the most "brainless" statements I've ever
heard come out of the mouth of a human being!
I do not know who "4th Turn" is either....but you owe him (or her) an
apology....as well as every member of this board!
TP
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught
> cheating online?
>
Wow, another twisted history session with Tom. Let's set it back the way it
reallly was because you are:
A. Someone who was not the least involved in Nascar sim racing at the time
Huggins began his cheating. Anybody here ever see Pabst on RAS during
Huggins cheating fiasco? NO. Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you,
Tom not only were you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some
time after it was running.
B. You were not responsible for the hiring or firing of any individuals
form Papy at that or any other time.
I remember asking some Papy guys if they ever heard of you long after TEN
was going. That was about the time you told us you were going to "pave the
way" for us in sims in your "farewell to all the lousy drivers" speech. They
said they'd never heard of you.
Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN. And by
then he was long gone from any beta test position. So much for the "framed"
theory.
And just why would Papy have any sort of need to "frame" anyone? Beta
testers are easy to find.
Couldn't care less if he is a great guy today.
This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history? Your stories are
getting craftier but there's still some left who know better.
Gavel
"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:t2tJa.61617$hz1.147153@sccrnsc01...
> Whoa, John!
>
> If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go dosome
> deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheating under
> circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. At the time,
> there's enough evidence that he was arbitrarily "kicked off TEN" byPapyrus
> for not so noble reasons.....the excuse was that he was cheating. Nothing
> was ever proven. I believe Robert's "response" was something along the
> lines of "yes, I was cheating online.....but I was hired by Papyrus to do
> that in order to prove to them the flaws in their online coding for NASCAR3
> (I believe it was N3....not totally sure about that)." He claims to have
> had some "political problems" subsequently with several individuals at
> Papyrus.......and that he was "framed" as a cheater for that reason. I'm
> not sure of all of the details.....but my memory isn't too faroff.....that
> I am sure of.
>
> I also can tell you that at the same time, I was having some problems with
> some Papyrus staff as well......but for entirely different and unrelated
> things. But, these few individuals I had problems with....if they werealso
> ones that were involved with Robert's deal.......these guys were notbeyond
> doing something like that. I will tell you that I did not sit back andtake
> this crap from these people idly......I took it to Havaas.....and within a
> month all three of these individuals were mysteriously no longer workingat
> Papyrus! I'm not going to rehash old shit......but this occurred justafter
> the Huggins deal (by a few months).....so you can figure out theconnection
> yourself.
>
> I would also like you to research how he has conducted himself since then,
> and what he has contributed to this sim community's online racing software
> since then. He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still, (I
> believe).....and there's enough well respected people on that race teamthat
> did enough "search and research" to satisfy themselves enough to haveRobert
> Huggins join the team (a couple years ago I believe). That, I would
> think....should carry some weight with you as well. But, you should doyour
Quoted text (22 lines)
> own homework, too. > > Finally, I will state emphatically that I am not friends with Robert > Huggins, that I have no ulterior motive for making these statements about > him. I am only making them in the interest of fair play. I think you are > making a mistake, John. That's the only reason I have responded to this > post. > > My regards, > > Tom Pabst > Pabst-Racing.com > > > > "John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > cheating online? > > > >lol, i dont think savats cheated in the normal sense. He just tended to
drive over cars when overtaking rather than round them :) or just push them
off
"ZZ Busch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:rLoJa.7779$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (32 lines)
> What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > > cheating online? > ------------------------- > > Was it SAVATS? He was accused many times in GPL. > > -- > Richard "ZZ" Busch > > Member: > Screamers Racing League > CORS > RASCAR > GPL Rank + 17.415 > MoGPL Rank + 318.586 > N2002 Rank + 7.695 > > > http://www.ZZBusch.com > ---------------- > Busch Motorsports: > Remember racecar is racecar spelled backward > ----------------- > Busch Carpentry: > A good carpenter can nail anything > ----------------- > > > > > >In article <t2tJa.61617$hz1.147153@sccrnsc01>, [email hidden]
says...
> Whoa, John!
>
> If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do some
> deep research of the issues
Tom, you are one of the very few people (you, Robert, and manybe one
other person) that thinks he was railroaded. Like I said, it's not my
job to deal with the controversy - it's my job to make sure everyone
in RASCAR has as pure a racing environment as possible.
I refused his membership for the good and sanity of the group. It
wasn't personal.
>"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote
> If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go dosome
> deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheating under
> circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported.
<yawn>
Papy said he was. I don't care for whatever political or real reason. He
was. End of story. They don't have to prove it to their customers.
> He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still,
Yeah and there was never trouble with this team on the NROS <roll eyes>
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
>"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote
> Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you, Tom not only were
> you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some
> time after it was running.
<ding ding ding>
> Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN.
<ding ding ding>
> This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history?
<ding ding ding>
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
Dan_Leach wrote:
> lol, i dont think savats cheated in the normal sense. He just tended to
> drive over cars when overtaking rather than round them :) or just push them
> off
Agreed. He was a hotlapper with no racecraft, as soon as he had to move
off of the racing line he was fecked!
Gerry
John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much hearsay and innuendo, especially when it
comes to Robert.
Only the Papyrus & TEN employees involved in 1997, and Robert know what really happened and the last time I checked, Robert was the
only one still around.
Robert hasn't raced online in years and N2003 is no where near as 'hackable' as N1 was, hell that was DOS.
Plus, with all the aids people use online, who that heck could tell anyway.
RASCAR has never 'banned' anyone and if you start now, it will be the beginning of the end imho.
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
"Tim" wrote...
> John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse
> a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much
> hearsay and innuendo, especially when it
> comes to Robert.
I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature of RASCAR
racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have
cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenght of
excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him.
Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pride nearly
as much as it does the contenders'. <g>
Jan.
=---
N2003 is very easily hacked. You just need one program to increase grip, give you fresh tyres anytime, repair damage at a keystroke.
If anyone wants to cheat, its very easily done.
--
Steve
"In the old days, the Irish used to blow up our pubs, now they refit them tastefully"
The Pub Landlord.
"Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6GFJa.81297$[email hidden]...
> John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much hearsay and innuendo, especially when it
> comes to Robert.
>
> Only the Papyrus & TEN employees involved in 1997, and Robert know what really happened and the last time I checked, Robert was
the
> only one still around.
>
> Robert hasn't raced online in years and N2003 is no where near as 'hackable' as N1 was, hell that was DOS.
> Plus, with all the aids people use online, who that heck could tell anyway.
>
> RASCAR has never 'banned' anyone and if you start now, it will be the beginning of the end imho.
>
> --
> Tim White
> www.intracmotorsports.com
>
>
LOL....Greg, and what gives your memory the "certified accurate" stamp?
"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Wow, another twisted history session with Tom. Let's set it back the wayit
> reallly was because you are:
Greg, this is a "tired old claim" of yours that you keep digging up when
ever I make a post related to early sim racing online. Since I have/had no
stake in the Robert Huggins issue and clearly stated so, I don't see what
your point was/is.....other than to harass?
> A. Someone who was not the least involved in Nascar sim racing at thetime
> Huggins began his cheating. Anybody here ever see Pabst on RAS during
> Huggins cheating fiasco? NO. Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. Andyou,
> Tom not only were you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN untilsome
> time after it was running.
I stated that I wasn't completely sure of the time frame, but only recalled
the extenuating circumstances. I was relatively new to online racing, not
NASCAR sim racing or racing in general. I have never stated that I was
involved in the Hawaii online testing......let me say it more clearly for
you: I was never involved in the Hawaii online testing. You are correct
about when I started sim racing on TEN. It was at the end of its first
month of operation. What's your point about this?
> B. You were not responsible for the hiring or firing of any individuals
> form Papy at that or any other time.
Being "responsible for hiring and firing" at Papyrus would require me to
have been an employee of Papyrus.....something I've never claimed to be
(although you will probably find some "connection" to say that I have). My
"issue" with Papyrus was dealt with through Sierra and the Havas legal
departments. You know nothing of this and there's no possible way that you
could. The individuals at Papyrus who were central to the issue I had with
Papyrus were terminated within one month of my bringing this to the
Sierra/Havas legal departments. You can draw your own conclusions as well
as anyone else. Total coincidence? Possibly? But, probably not. These
people were not doing anything that was illegal in any way. They were
simply not behaving in a manner that was beneficial to the company they
worked for. And, that was my opinion then and is now. Maybe someone agreed
with me? Maybe it was all a coincidence? Who cares?
> I remember asking some Papy guys if they ever heard of you long afterTEN
> was going. That was about the time you told us you were going to "pave the
> way" for us in sims in your "farewell to all the lousy drivers" speech.They
> said they'd never heard of you.
Once again you make reference to some "farewell speach" that has had so many
"topics" according to your memory, that it must have been at least two
hundred pages long......something I don't ever recall writing or making
anywhere, including here. I do recall you popping into one of the TEN chat
rooms......in the middle of my talking with several drivers in there about
why I was giving up my TEN membership temporarily while I would be
rellocating to the SFO area from Portland, Oregon. Perhaps coming into a
chat room in the middle of a topical conversation could lead you to
misinterpret the meaning and the reason for the discussion? Who
knows.....and again, who cares? When I did get settled in down here, I had
a job interview with TEN. Nothing ever came of it, and a few months later
they dropped the NASCAR sim from their online gaming program. At the time,
I still wasn't setup for online racing here and by the time I was, TEN was
out of business. That is why I never rejoined TEN. You seem to have the
knack for twisting that fact around about 1,000 ways to suit your particular
purposes.
My dealings at Papyrus were with two individuals only. And, because of the
nature of those dealings no one else at Papyrus probably would have been
involved (until much later had my dealings beared any fruit, which they did
not). So, unless you asked one of those employees about me, I doubt anyone
else even knew me at the time, since I was relatively new to online racing
anyway. Even if you'd asked one of these two individuals, its reasonable
because of NDA's that they would not have told you they knew me. And, who
the hell were you that someone had to respond to your questions about me
anyway?
> Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN. Andby
> then he was long gone from any beta test position. So much for the"framed"
> theory.
> And just why would Papy have any sort of need to "frame" anyone? Beta
> testers are easy to find.
I wasn't endorsing the validity of the issues with Huggins and I clearly
stated I was only "remembering" what the issues were about....and wasn't
totally sure of the timing but was pretty sure about the nature of the
issues. Your statements above are "judgemental"....mine were simply
reflective of the issues. And your "judgement" above is just as much
speculation as anyone's.....something you seem to not like when I do it but
its "okay" for you to do it, huh? That's a "double standard" there, Greg!
> Couldn't care less if he is a great guy today.
Gosh Greg, you are such a "warm and fuzzy" kind of guy! LOL......
>
> This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history? Your stories are
> getting craftier but there's still some left who know better.
>
> Gavel
And I am certain all of the intelligent individuals here on R.A.S., whom you
have just insinuated can't make reasonable judgements themselves about
things I write, are so pleased that you have taken on the role of the "keep
history straight" police, on their behalf! Do you know Ed Solheim? He's
the chief of of the "On Topic" police. Are you two members of the same
police force? Or, different ones? - TP
PS: "Gavel" is the online racing handle used by Greg Avella. According to
Francois Menard, from his response to an email I had sent him a couple years
ago (November 11, 2001 to be exact) asking who this "gavel" character is,
because I don't remember him at all when I was racing on TEN......."he is an
old pal from my Hawaii days. He ran in a league on TEN as an "also ran" but
spent most of his time in the TEN chat rooms rather than racing." Seems
Greg that you are an old "stir-monger" from way back?
under
> > circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. At the time,
> > there's enough evidence that he was arbitrarily "kicked off TEN" by
> Papyrus
> > for not so noble reasons.....the excuse was that he was cheating.Nothing
> > was ever proven. I believe Robert's "response" was something along the
> > lines of "yes, I was cheating online.....but I was hired by Papyrus todo
> > that in order to prove to them the flaws in their online coding forNASCAR
> 3
> > (I believe it was N3....not totally sure about that)." He claims tohave
> > had some "political problems" subsequently with several individuals at
> > Papyrus.......and that he was "framed" as a cheater for that reason.I'm
> > not sure of all of the details.....but my memory isn't too far
> off.....that
> > I am sure of.
> >
> > I also can tell you that at the same time, I was having some problemswith
a
then,
> > and what he has contributed to this sim community's online racingsoftware
about
> > him. I am only making them in the interest of fair play. I think youare
Quoted text (18 lines)
> > > > > > > > > > > > "Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:t2tJa.61617$hz1.147153@sccrnsc01... > > Whoa, John! > > > > If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do > some > > deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheatingQuoted text (8 lines)
> > some Papyrus staff as well......but for entirely different and unrelated > > things. But, these few individuals I had problems with....if they were > also > > ones that were involved with Robert's deal.......these guys were not > beyond > > doing something like that. I will tell you that I did not sit back and > take > > this crap from these people idly......I took it to Havaas.....and withinQuoted text (9 lines)
> > month all three of these individuals were mysteriously no longer working > at > > Papyrus! I'm not going to rehash old shit......but this occurred just > after > > the Huggins deal (by a few months).....so you can figure out the > connection > > yourself. > > > > I would also like you to research how he has conducted himself sinceQuoted text (12 lines)
> > since then. He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still, (I > > believe).....and there's enough well respected people on that race team > that > > did enough "search and research" to satisfy themselves enough to have > Robert > > Huggins join the team (a couple years ago I believe). That, I would > > think....should carry some weight with you as well. But, you should do > your > > own homework, too. > > > > Finally, I will state emphatically that I am not friends with Robert > > Huggins, that I have no ulterior motive for making these statementsQuoted text (19 lines)
> > making a mistake, John. That's the only reason I have responded to this > > post. > > > > My regards, > > > > Tom Pabst > > Pabst-Racing.com > > > > > > > > "John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > What was the name of that guy a few years ago that was caught > > > cheating online? > > > > > > > > >John...
I respect your reasoning for the decision. I just don't agree with it.
But, that's neither here nor there. I at least wanted to make sure you
weren't making the decision without reasonable knowledge. I would like to
point out that I was clearly not stating what "I think" about the Robert
Huggins thing....only what I remembered the issue to be about since you
didn't seem to know or who was involved.
I have no opinion one way or the other about whether Robert Huggins was
cheating on TEN, because I don't have enough information about the issue to
make a decision (other than bits and pieces of memory and lots of
speculation from others which isn't valid enough for me to form an opinion).
I just want to make sure that is clear to you?
It seems to me that setting yourself up as "safekeeper of the group's
sanity" is beyond a reasonable interpretation of your role with the RASCAR
group? Maybe you disagree? But, wouldn't it have been just as easy to just
make a post on r.a.s. and say, "I have a request from a Robert Huggins to
race in RASCAR. Does anyone have a problem with that? If so, email me
privately. If not, I will issue a car number to Robert." I don't know,
John....its just a suggestion.
Regards,
Tom
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> In article <t2tJa.61617$hz1.147153@sccrnsc01>, [email hidden]
> says...
> > Whoa, John!
> >
> > If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go dosome
Quoted text (9 lines)
> > deep research of the issues > > Tom, you are one of the very few people (you, Robert, and manybe one > other person) that thinks he was railroaded. Like I said, it's not my > job to deal with the controversy - it's my job to make sure everyone > in RASCAR has as pure a racing environment as possible. > > I refused his membership for the good and sanity of the group. It > wasn't personal.Francois....When have you ever been one to let someone else (Papy) do your
thinking for you? This doesn't sound like the "ymenard" that I know and
have been friends with for about 5 or 6 years. Do **you** think Robert was
cheating? Who cares what Papy said or didn't say!
And there were "troubles" with BHM and several other "teams" in
NROS....which was completely full of holes as you very well know. Some
people took advantage of them and some didn't. So what?
TP
PS: I liked your "ding - ding - ding" post, by the way. I figured it would
make your week to get Greg and I going at it again here on r.a.s. This
place has been kind of quiet and docile for you lately, huh?
"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:TSAJa.624$[email hidden]...
> >"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote
> > If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do
> some
> > deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheatingunder
Quoted text (26 lines)
> > circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. > > > <yawn> > > > Papy said he was. I don't care for whatever political or real reason. He > was. End of story. They don't have to prove it to their customers. > > > > He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still, > > Yeah and there was never trouble with this team on the NROS <roll eyes> > > > > > > > -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > >I raced RHuggins online on Hawaii and he surely had something funny going on
(cant remember what exactly but nitrous gives a hint g) but he said so much
when I chatted with him after the race. Something along the lines of
"testing the system for Papy".
So long ago can't remember all the details but I always felt he was an
honorable sort of guy, at least he came right out and said as much.
Cheating is so pakaged now anyone could do it if they wanted. I would say
give him a chance as we do anyone. Im kinda curious the arbitrary banning
based on heresay in Rascar.
Mitch
"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:AUAJa.625$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (21 lines)
> >"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote > > Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you, Tom not only were > > you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some > > time after it was running. > > <ding ding ding> > > > > Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN. > > <ding ding ding> > > > > > This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history? > > <ding ding ding> > > > >
Mitch_A wrote:
Robert was caught running a non standard game, that much is clear as I
believe he has admitted as much, the reasons *why* he did so is another
matter and only Robert himself and a few guys who worked for Papy/TEN
back then knows the full story, the rest of us can only guess based on
rumors and hearsay
But does it really matter much after 5 years ?
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > I raced RHuggins online on Hawaii and he surely had something funny going on > (cant remember what exactly but nitrous gives a hint g) but he said so much > when I chatted with him after the race. Something along the lines of > "testing the system for Papy". > > So long ago can't remember all the details but I always felt he was an > honorable sort of guy, at least he came right out and said as much. > Cheating is so pakaged now anyone could do it if they wanted. I would say > give him a chance as we do anyone. Im kinda curious the arbitrary banning > based on heresay in Rascar.I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem by banning Tom
Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more damage to a league then Huggins
ever would! It has been proven!
"Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:TQHJa.506$[email hidden]...
> I raced RHuggins online on Hawaii and he surely had something funny goingon
> (cant remember what exactly but nitrous gives a hint g) but he said somuch
Quoted text (36 lines)
> when I chatted with him after the race. Something along the lines of > "testing the system for Papy". > > So long ago can't remember all the details but I always felt he was an > honorable sort of guy, at least he came right out and said as much. > Cheating is so pakaged now anyone could do it if they wanted. I would say > give him a chance as we do anyone. Im kinda curious the arbitrary banning > based on heresay in Rascar. > > Mitch > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:AUAJa.625$[email hidden]... > > >"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you, Tom not only were > > > you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some > > > time after it was running. > > > > <ding ding ding> > > > > > > > Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN. > > > > <ding ding ding> > > > > > > > > > This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history? > > > > <ding ding ding> > > > > > > > > > >My thoughts exactly, Goy. If it was an "open and shut" case of
cheating.....busted, and admitted to for selfish reasons or not....I
wouldn't race with the guy if it has been 50 years.....or do anything else
with him. It would show a level of disrespect for racing that I love too
much....and wouldn't want to have anything to do with someone who blatantly
cheated.....real or sim world. But, this is not the case with the Huggins
deal....and considering the time (translated: Has he been dubbed as a
cheater since then, by any league or group he has been racing with?) I think
he should be allowed to join any sim racing league he's qualified to
join....and that certainly would be this RASCAR "fun" racing group!
But, I also respect John Simmon's right to make his own decision and bar
Huggins from racing, as long as the RASCAR "group" of drivers have given him
that power and/or responsibility previously. I'm not sure if they have or
not, and really, its not any of my business since I don't race with those
guys.
TP
"Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
>
> Mitch_A wrote:
> >
> > I raced RHuggins online on Hawaii and he surely had something funnygoing on
> > (cant remember what exactly but nitrous gives a hint g) but he said somuch
> > when I chatted with him after the race. Something along the lines of
> > "testing the system for Papy".
> >
> > So long ago can't remember all the details but I always felt he was an
> > honorable sort of guy, at least he came right out and said as much.
> > Cheating is so pakaged now anyone could do it if they wanted. I wouldsay
> > give him a chance as we do anyone. Im kinda curious the arbitrarybanning
Quoted text (19 lines)
> > based on heresay in Rascar. > > Robert was caught running a non standard game, that much is clear as I > believe he has admitted as much, the reasons *why* he did so is another > matter and only Robert himself and a few guys who worked for Papy/TEN > back then knows the full story, the rest of us can only guess based on > rumors and hearsay > > But does it really matter much after 5 years ? > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > "goyl at nettx dot no" > > http://www.theuspits.com > > "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" > --Groucho Marx-->"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote
> PS: I liked your "ding - ding - ding" post, by the way. I figured itwould
> make your week to get Greg and I going at it again here on r.a.s. This
> place has been kind of quiet and docile for you lately, huh?
<ding ding ding>
;-D
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
"Wayne Bradley" wrote...
> I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem
> by banning Tom Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more
> damage to a league then Huggins ever would! It has been
> proven!
Don't worry, mr. Bradley. Mr. Pabst is not attending any RASCAR races or
functions.
Jan.
=---
Wayne Bradley wrote:
>
> I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem by banning Tom
> Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more damage to a league then Huggins
> ever would! It has been proven!
I've said it before and I'll say it again, you should be in the
diplomatic corps Wayne :-)
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
You know I find it interesting and amusing when the stories start going
around
about Robert Huggins. It seems the further we get from the events the bigger
the
tales get.
I can guarantee there is no one this NG that knows the full story
including Robert
himself.
How do I know?
Well I was directly involved with a couple of Papy people at the time of
Roberts
indiscretions so I know what happened on their end.
Robert confided to me what happened at the time from his perspective and
confirmed my involvement.
I was the one who asked Robert Huggins to join us at BHMS, we wanted his
programming skills
which he freely gave to write utilities that were given out to the racing
community.
Although, I haven't spoke with him recently. I still do get the odd
email.
I'm not going to go into what did and didn't happen but lets just say
there are
always two sides to a story. But a lot of half truths and innuendo doesn't
make something
fact.
I will say this much though, Robert made mistakes and he paid for them
and is still paying
for them. Papyrus made mistakes and they paid for them as well.
I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his
request to join Rascar.
He could have done it under a false name and no one would have known. I
think the fact
that he was open and above board suggests he isn't the same person he was
many years
ago.
I will also tell you he has developed into one of the best racers around
without the need to
cheat. Although I'm sure he will be accussed of such untill the day he dies.
Hopefully, if my health improves I will be able to make a few races in
Rascar myself.
Pete
In article <6GFJa.81297$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
Actually, we refused Wilshe's application too.
Quoted text (17 lines)
> John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much hearsay and innuendo, especially when it > comes to Robert. > > Only the Papyrus & TEN employees involved in 1997, and Robert know what really happened and the last time I checked, Robert was the > only one still around. > > Robert hasn't raced online in years and N2003 is no where near as 'hackable' as N1 was, hell that was DOS. > Plus, with all the aids people use online, who that heck could tell anyway. > > RASCAR has never 'banned' anyone and if you start now, it will be the beginning of the end imho. > > -- > Tim White > www.intracmotorsports.com > > >In article <LuGJa.64060$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete
proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version
of the facts to which I have access.
Quoted text (14 lines)
> "Tim" wrote... > > John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse > > a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much > > hearsay and innuendo, especially when it > > comes to Robert. > > I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature of RASCAR > racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have > cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenght of > excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him. > > Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pride nearly > as much as it does the contenders'. <g> >In article <bd7m8l$brf$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
> I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem by banning Tom
> Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more damage to a league then Huggins
> ever would! It has been proven!
>
Tom doesn't like o race with us. :)
Pete wrote:
>
Even Voodoo4 got a break.....
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
N2003, the way I understand it, is the first version that moves the data around in memory. Eric B. has stated several times they
are not aware of any methods used in the past that work with this model.
Everyone always said moving the code around randomly, on the fly, was the simplest way to negate a standard tsr that knew where to
look. Every hack I ever heard of used that logic. But can someone hack into N2003? Sure. I just don't think it's as common as it
has been.
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
"Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7eqe$obdhh$[email hidden]...
> N2003 is very easily hacked. You just need one program to increase grip, give you fresh tyres anytime, repair damage at a
keystroke.
>
rofl
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
"Wayne Bradley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7m8l$brf$[email hidden]...
> I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem by banning Tom
> Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more damage to a league then Huggins
> ever would! It has been proven!
>
>
>
>
> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:TQHJa.506$[email hidden]...
> > I raced RHuggins online on Hawaii and he surely had something funny going
> on
> > (cant remember what exactly but nitrous gives a hint g) but he said so
> much
> > when I chatted with him after the race. Something along the lines of
> > "testing the system for Papy".
> >
> > So long ago can't remember all the details but I always felt he was an
> > honorable sort of guy, at least he came right out and said as much.
> > Cheating is so pakaged now anyone could do it if they wanted. I would say
> > give him a chance as we do anyone. Im kinda curious the arbitrary banning
> > based on heresay in Rascar.
> >
> > Mitch
> >
> > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> > news:AUAJa.625$[email hidden]...
> > > >"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote
> > > > Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you, Tom not only were
> > > > you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some
> > > > time after it was running.
> > >
> > > <ding ding ding>
> > >
> > >
> > > > Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN.
> > >
> > > <ding ding ding>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history?
> > >
> > > <ding ding ding>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Papy gave lots of breaks to others.
Pete
"Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (16 lines)
> > > Pete wrote: > > > > Even Voodoo4 got a break..... > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > "goyl at nettx dot no" > > http://www.theuspits.com > > "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" > --Groucho Marx--wow
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
> Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete
> proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version
> of the facts to which I have access.
>
Pete wrote:
>
> Papy gave lots of breaks to others.
Don't know about that, but what I was talking about, even Voodoo4 (yes I
know who he is) got a break by most of the guys he raced with back then
and who are still racing today, he got a 2nd chance
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
One program does it, the ram cheat, Ive seen a guy who cant drive do 200+ laps at Texas without ever lifting.
A couple of weeks ago Eric said he wasnt aware any cheat existed so they havent been researching too hard on the subject.
--
Steve
"In the old days, the Irish used to blow up our pubs, now they refit them tastefully"
The Pub Landlord.
"Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PeKJa.83186$[email hidden]...
> N2003, the way I understand it, is the first version that moves the data around in memory. Eric B. has stated several times they
> are not aware of any methods used in the past that work with this model.
>
> Everyone always said moving the code around randomly, on the fly, was the simplest way to negate a standard tsr that knew where to
> look. Every hack I ever heard of used that logic. But can someone hack into N2003? Sure. I just don't think it's as common as
it
> has been.
>
> --
> Tim White
> www.intracmotorsports.com
>
>
> "Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7eqe$obdhh$[email hidden]...
> > N2003 is very easily hacked. You just need one program to increase grip, give you fresh tyres anytime, repair damage at a
> keystroke.
> >
>
>
John Simmons wrote:
So he is banned for life until the above happens? Or is there a 'term'
that he must serve?
Quoted text (23 lines)
> In article <LuGJa.64060$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > >>"Tim" wrote... >> >>>John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse >>>a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much >>>hearsay and innuendo, especially when it >>>comes to Robert. >> >>I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature of RASCAR >>racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have >>cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenght of >>excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him. >> >>Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pride nearly >>as much as it does the contenders'. <g> >> > > Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete > proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version > of the facts to which I have access. >You said it all right here... And as it should be for anyone caught
cheating.
"Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]...
I will say this much though, Robert made mistakes and he paid for them
> and is still paying
> for them.
In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]
says...
As long as I have any say in it, and until somneone can provide
substantial and undeniable proof that he's innocent, he won't be
racing in RASCAR. Don Wilshe, on the other hand, is banned for life -
no discussion, no way (and he knows why).
Quoted text (29 lines)
> John Simmons wrote: > > In article <LuGJa.64060$[email hidden]>, > > [email hidden] says... > > > >>"Tim" wrote... > >> > >>>John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse > >>>a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much > >>>hearsay and innuendo, especially when it > >>>comes to Robert. > >> > >>I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature of RASCAR > >>racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have > >>cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenght of > >>excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him. > >> > >>Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pride nearly > >>as much as it does the contenders'. <g> > >> > > > > Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete > > proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version > > of the facts to which I have access. > > > > So he is banned for life until the above happens? Or is there a 'term' > that he must serve? > >In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
> I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his
> request to join Rascar. He could have done it under a false name
> and no one would have known. I think the fact that he was open and
> above board suggests he isn't the same person he was many years
> ago.
Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was
the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a
bit harsh.
If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that
matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and
approve his application.
I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst
without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on
his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the
initial refusal.
gddd wrote:
>
> You said it all right here... And as it should be for anyone caught
> cheating.
So when does he get a 2nd chance....it's not like he killed someone, or
even worse, is a known spammer ?
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
In article <[email hidden]>, elmana@int-
resources.com says...
You're right, I've never heard of any HugginsSpam. :)
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > > gddd wrote: > > > > You said it all right here... And as it should be for anyone caught > > cheating. > > So when does he get a 2nd chance....it's not like he killed someone, or > even worse, is a known spammer ? > >Not to mention the ones who DO KNOW FOR SURE pasted it on the TEN Welcome
screen everytime you logged in. lol That's all the proof anyone needs
whether you agree with it or not.
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
RASCAR
> > racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have
> > cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenghtof
> > excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him.
> >
> > Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pridenearly
Quoted text (9 lines)
> In article <LuGJa.64060$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > "Tim" wrote... > > > John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse > > > a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much > > > hearsay and innuendo, especially when it > > > comes to Robert. > > > > I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature ofQuoted text (7 lines)
> > as much as it does the contenders'. <g> > > > > Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete > proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version > of the facts to which I have access. >AMEN to that!
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Don Wilshe, on the other hand, is banned for life -
> no discussion, no way (and he knows why).
>
AMEN to that!
Don Wilshe, on the other hand, is banned for life -
Your sure that was N2003, cause I read where the ram cheat does not work in this version.
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
"Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7slh$perlk$[email hidden]...
> One program does it, the ram cheat, Ive seen a guy who cant drive do 200+ laps at Texas without ever lifting.
>
> A couple of weeks ago Eric said he wasnt aware any cheat existed so they havent been researching too hard on the subject.
>
> --
>
> Steve
>
> "In the old days, the Irish used to blow up our pubs, now they refit them tastefully"
>
> The Pub Landlord.
>
>
> "Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PeKJa.83186$[email hidden]...
> > N2003, the way I understand it, is the first version that moves the data around in memory. Eric B. has stated several times
they
> > are not aware of any methods used in the past that work with this model.
> >
> > Everyone always said moving the code around randomly, on the fly, was the simplest way to negate a standard tsr that knew where
to
> > look. Every hack I ever heard of used that logic. But can someone hack into N2003? Sure. I just don't think it's as common as
> it
> > has been.
> >
> > --
> > Tim White
> > www.intracmotorsports.com
> >
> >
> > "Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7eqe$obdhh$[email hidden]...
> > > N2003 is very easily hacked. You just need one program to increase grip, give you fresh tyres anytime, repair damage at a
> > keystroke.
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
this is better than TV
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (23 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his > > request to join Rascar. He could have done it under a false name > > and no one would have known. I think the fact that he was open and > > above board suggests he isn't the same person he was many years > > ago. > > Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was > the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a > bit harsh. > > If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that > matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and > approve his application. > > I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst > without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on > his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the > initial refusal. > > >Well done John :)
--
Tim White
www.intracmotorsports.com
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
> Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was
> the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a
> bit harsh.
>
> If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that
> matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and
> approve his application.
>
> I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst
> without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on
> his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the
> initial refusal.
>
>
"frederickson" said:
> this is better than TV
Go Ricki - Go Ricki !!!
--
ed_
http://rascar.racesimcentral.com
---------------------------------------
$10 say Petter Solberg wins the 2003 WRC
The right decision IMHO and well said John.
Takes a good man to think things through and act accordingly.
Mikkel
.
John Simmons <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (22 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his > > request to join Rascar. He could have done it under a false name > > and no one would have known. I think the fact that he was open and > > above board suggests he isn't the same person he was many years > > ago. > > Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was > the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a > bit harsh. > > If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that > matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and > approve his application. > > I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst > without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on > his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the > initial refusal. > >In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, "Pete"
<[email hidden]> writes:
> Hopefully, if my health improves I will be able to make a few races in
>Rascar myself.
>
I didn't know you were having health problems, man. Hope you feel better
soon...
Eldred
--
Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my
homepage)
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
"Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:tuKJa.83323$[email hidden]...
Ya see it's that whole new Ashcroft Justice Dept. thing.
"You have the right to confess. You have the right to prove your innocence.
If you can not prove your innocence and can not afford an executioner one
will be appointed to you."
Elrikk ;o)
PS. Besides, if he let him back in the terrorist win.
Quoted text (11 lines)
> wow > > -- > Tim White > www.intracmotorsports.com > > > > Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete > > proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version > > of the facts to which I have access. > >Jan Verschueren wrote:
Then why the heck is such a big stink being made over it ? Is Rascar that
all so important to league racing to cause all this debate over who can or
cannot race with Rascar?
Last time I looked, Rascar was an invite league developed for and around the
people the frequent this forum. Heck, I don't even know that you could call
it a league , just a group of guys that got to know each other on this forum
and race together on Saturdays.
Seems to me, the ones that put in the time to make this happen for everyone
else, have every right to determine who does and does not get added to the
invite list.
Don't know why that would have such a major impact on anyone, especially
someone that does not even run in Rascar at all.
Ok, Robert Huggins. I don't know the guy personally, but he has a
"reputation" in the Nascar sim racing community. A reputation that started
with N1 on Hawaii, and extended evidently into N2 on Ten and the Nros. Back
when we were running on Hawaii, he was a hot topic :). And obviously a
reputation that has followed him around to today.
Understand, I don't know for a fact he ever cheated, and really don't
care. He may be one of the nicest guys in the world for all I know.
But as far as Rascar, I would respect any call the folks that play the
largest part in putting this show on for the members, makes on any
individual. Officially, he was banned from the Nros Series on Ten for
cheating. Only person to my knowledge that officially got banned for that.
That is fact, anything else is just speculation. Whether it is true or
false, is nothing more and will never be anything more than speculation.
Personally, if I knew of a good group of guys that raced together, that was
founded on their fellowship developed in a newsgroup forum, I would first
start reading and participating in that forum, and get to know the guys and
let them get to know me before I just came in and said hey, I want to race,
let me in.
Just my humble opinon gang.
Now if I can just get off my fat ass and race more with you guys - I am
single now, and Satruday evenings are a little tougher to make :).
I will say this from the few races I have got to participate in, you guys
that run in Rascar regular are some of the cleanest drivers I have seen, and
show more respect on the track than some of the better leagues out there -
you got a good thing going, so y'all must be doing something right so far
:).
--
Don Burnette
remove clothes when replying via email
Quoted text (11 lines)
> "Wayne Bradley" wrote... >> I somewhat agree and Rascar could solve a bigger problem >> by banning Tom Pabst. Seriously, Tom Pabst will do more >> damage to a league then Huggins ever would! It has been >> proven! > > Don't worry, mr. Bradley. Mr. Pabst is not attending any RASCAR races > or functions. > > Jan. > =---John Simmons wrote:
Man, make up your mind :)
I would have to agree with Pete's comment about him being open and not
trying to hide under another name .
--
Don Burnette
remove clothes when replying via email
Quoted text (20 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... >> I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his >> request to join Rascar. He could have done it under a false name >> and no one would have known. I think the fact that he was open and >> above board suggests he isn't the same person he was many years >> ago. > > Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was > the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a > bit harsh. > > If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that > matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and > approve his application. > > I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst > without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on > his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the > initial refusal. Thanks Eldred. I've actually tried to get ready for the last few races
but
with the pain killers i'm taking I don't want to screw up and cause wrecks.
Its
easy enough to do under normal conditions.
I have been doing some setups for the road courses and if anyone needs
something let me know.
Pete
"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
my
> homepage)
> Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
>
> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
Quoted text (9 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, "Pete" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > I didn't know you were having health problems, man. Hope you feel better > soon... > > Eldred > -- > Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on Here ya go, like our last meeting where I present your own words and you
try to wriggle out of their meaning. You tell us to go and do some research
because..( the inference is that John somehow got it all wrong)....then you
explain how it was. I explained how it wasn't.
1.You postulate that he was arbitrarily kicked off. We were told that he was
cheating.
2. You say he was accused of cheating under circumstances that subsequent
evidence never supported. What evidence? They said he was cheating.Period.
You never had any evidence so your statement means what?.
3. ..And please explain what evidence this was that proved he was
"arbitrarily" kicked off of TEN? Do you have this evidence? No, you couldn't
have!
4. So you go on to infer that Papy's "excuse" to dump him was cheating. If
it wasn't produce the evidence you reference.
You can't. You don't have it. I never saw anything but what Papy said and
what I observed on Hawaii and the RAS at the time and that was that he was
cheating by admission and commission.
Yep, I probably spent more time on the TEN ng than driving. I drove in
some leagues. I am an also ran. But I aint bad for a guy who hasn't driven a
race car in his life.
I have been called a stirrer. I have subjects I'll speak out about. But
I don't post very much and I certainly don't pretend to have done what I
haven't.
Huggins doesn't bother me. That was a long time ago.
"If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do
some
deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheating under
circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. At the time,
there's enough evidence that he was arbitrarily "kicked off TEN" by Papyrus
for not so noble reasons.....the excuse was that he was cheating. Nothing
was ever proven. I believe Robert's "response" was something along the
lines of "yes, I was cheating online.....but I was hired by Papyrus to do
that in order to prove to them the flaws in their online coding for NASCAR
3"
John, I think you have made a good call. Robert will have a tough
time earning peoples respect and he will be under constant scrutiny.
If he decides to reapply(and I hope he does) I don't think he would
be foolish enough to do anything untoward.
Pete
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (15 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, >> Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was > the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a > bit harsh. > > If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that > matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and > approve his application. > > I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst > without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on > his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the > initial refusal. > >Pete, I'm interested in yer roadie setups. I'm thinking of writing a setup
guide (I know: oh noooooooo!!!!!!).
"Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:98OJa.1892$[email hidden]...
> Thanks Eldred. I've actually tried to get ready for the last few races
> but
> with the pain killers i'm taking I don't want to screw up and causewrecks.
better
Quoted text (13 lines)
> Its > easy enough to do under normal conditions. > I have been doing some setups for the road courses and if anyone needs > something let me know. > > Pete > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, "Pete" > > <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > I didn't know you were having health problems, man. Hope you feelQuoted text (12 lines)
> > soon... > > > > Eldred > > -- > > Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on > my > > homepage) > > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > > > > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply. > > LOL been there done that. Its actually hard work.
Email me at [email hidden]
Its a work in progress for me. Its been a long time
since I did road course setups. Some of them seem to
be working very well.
I love the way car responds to the changes.
Pete
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:TzOJa.99183$[email hidden]...
> Pete, I'm interested in yer roadie setups. I'm thinking of writing asetup
> guide (I know: oh noooooooo!!!!!!).
>
On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 02:20:35 GMT, "Steve Smith"
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>Pete, I'm interested in yer roadie setups. I'm thinking of writing a setup
>guide (I know: oh noooooooo!!!!!!).
Could you .pdf it so I can print it out to read on the commode?
Jason
Pete,
I know you been fighting the health issues for a while. Best of luck and
hang in there.
I have been there before, and know what it can be like.
Don
Pete wrote:
Quoted text (25 lines)
> Thanks Eldred. I've actually tried to get ready for the last few > races but > with the pain killers i'm taking I don't want to screw up and cause > wrecks. Its > easy enough to do under normal conditions. > I have been doing some setups for the road courses and if anyone > needs something let me know. > > Pete > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, "Pete" >> <[email hidden]> writes: >> >> I didn't know you were having health problems, man. Hope you feel >> better soon... >> >> Eldred >> -- >> Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from >> Michigan(info on my homepage) >> Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett >> >> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply."Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:98OJa.1892$[email hidden]...
> Thanks Eldred. I've actually tried to get ready for the last few races
> but
> with the pain killers i'm taking I don't want to screw up and causewrecks.
> Its
> easy enough to do under normal conditions.
> I have been doing some setups for the road courses and if anyone needs
> something let me know.
>
> Pete
Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned...
> I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst
> without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on
> his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the
> initial refusal.
>
>
Hold on there John, aren't you being a little hasty? After all this
thread is only a few days old...lets beat this around for a couple of weeks
before you cave in. :)
dave henrie
(I actually raced ONE race on Hawaii.){None on TEN}
>"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote
> Then why the heck is such a big stink being made over it ?
Because it's fun. I see everybody, fighting over things that are SO old
they won't change anything at all. All those arguying are filled with such
innacuracies and memory lapses. It's natural. You know, everybody in this
NG some time or another had a bad thing or two that other people could slap
their fingers on. Robert or Tom or me or anybody else.
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
>"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote
> Francois....When have you ever been one to let someone else (Papy) do your
> thinking for you? This doesn't sound like the "ymenard" that I know and
> have been friends with for about 5 or 6 years. Do **you** think Robertwas
> cheating? Who cares what Papy said or didn't say!
You know, as being a NROS Guide, I was on both side of the fence on the NROS
and the whole cheating issues. No, wait, I was kinda sitting plain on top
of it. I know a lot.
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
Thanks Don. It takes it toll as much mentally as physically.
Thankfully, I can escape with the PC.
Pete
"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (7 lines)
> Pete, > > I know you been fighting the health issues for a while. Best of luck and > hang in there. > I have been there before, and know what it can be like. > > Don Well, I have been accused of being stoned when I wasn't. :-)
The worst part is having severe pain and you don't even get a
buzz out of the pain killers. Plus the tolerance level keeps going
higher and higher. Need more to get the same relief.
Pete
"frederickson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:wwPJa.157694$[email hidden]...
> "Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:98OJa.1892$[email hidden]...
>
> Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned...
>
>
John,
why don't you start a little poll among the RASCAR drivers (here or on your
website). That decision will affect each and every driver, and if such a
question were arising in my league, I'd like to have a vote in it, as I'd be
so directly affected.
Achim
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (22 lines)
> In article <lFJJa.1485$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his > > request to join Rascar. He could have done it under a false name > > and no one would have known. I think the fact that he was open and > > above board suggests he isn't the same person he was many years > > ago. > > Well, hell. I sat here reading all this stuff (and Pete's message was > the kicker), and I gotta admit that my decision may have been made a > bit harsh. > > If you tell Robert to indicate on the RASCAR forum (or here for that > matter) that he still wants to race with us, I'll go ahead and > approve his application. > > I hereby officially apologize to Robert for assuming the worst > without actually experiencing it. I hope there's no hard feelings on > his end, and that he understands where I was coming from on the > initial refusal. > >Reminds me of the movie 'A beautiful mind' ...
"What's the use of being crazy if you can't have a little fun with it."
:)
"frederickson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:wwPJa.157694$[email hidden]...
> Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned...
>
>
In article <bd8sdl$pvjop$[email hidden]>, [email hidden]
says...
> John,
>
> why don't you start a little poll among the RASCAR drivers (here or on your
> website). That decision will affect each and every driver, and if such a
> question were arising in my league, I'd like to have a vote in it, as I'd be
> so directly affected.
In every race in which he participates, he will be the most
scrutinized driver. I'm trying to be fair to the guy, but that
doesn't mean I have to be completely trusting, and it would not be
prudent to fail to maintain a careful watch on his performance (and
he should expect that kind of treatment).
Yup, take a look at someone doing 200+ laps at Texas in the TLS forums, the fact that Eric Busch said he wasnt aware of any cheat
suggests they havent fixed the ram cheat.
--
Steve
"In the old days, the Irish used to blow up our pubs, now they refit them tastefully"
The Pub Landlord.
"Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:QFLJa.89684$[email hidden]...
> Your sure that was N2003, cause I read where the ram cheat does not work in this version.
>
> --
> Tim White
> www.intracmotorsports.com
>
>
> "Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7slh$perlk$[email hidden]...
> > One program does it, the ram cheat, Ive seen a guy who cant drive do 200+ laps at Texas without ever lifting.
> >
> > A couple of weeks ago Eric said he wasnt aware any cheat existed so they havent been researching too hard on the subject.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > "In the old days, the Irish used to blow up our pubs, now they refit them tastefully"
> >
> > The Pub Landlord.
> >
> >
> > "Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PeKJa.83186$[email hidden]...
> > > N2003, the way I understand it, is the first version that moves the data around in memory. Eric B. has stated several times
> they
> > > are not aware of any methods used in the past that work with this model.
> > >
> > > Everyone always said moving the code around randomly, on the fly, was the simplest way to negate a standard tsr that knew
where
> to
> > > look. Every hack I ever heard of used that logic. But can someone hack into N2003? Sure. I just don't think it's as common
as
> > it
> > > has been.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Tim White
> > > www.intracmotorsports.com
> > >
> > >
> > > "Edgecrusher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bd7eqe$obdhh$[email hidden]...
> > > > N2003 is very easily hacked. You just need one program to increase grip, give you fresh tyres anytime, repair damage at a
> > > keystroke.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
I wonder if anybody remembers the story I instigated during the Seventies in
Car and Driver which proved conclusively that smoking marijuana makes you a
better driver. Okay, the methodology was flawed. THC ruins yer long-term
concentration, but the C/D test was over a simple gymkhana course.
Short Attention-Span Sports: During the Sixties, I won several drag races
whilst twisted out of my face.
Brit journo Charles Fox (aka the Duke of Methodone; he was the guy who
crashed Sam Posey's Lola @ VIR) was driving across the Golden Gate Bridge in
a Triumph Spitfire under the influence of an unauthorized substance when he
became convinced that it was a Supermarine Spitfire, and pulled back on the
"stick" with disasterous consequences....
"frederickson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:wwPJa.157694$[email hidden]...
> "Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:98OJa.1892$[email hidden]...
> > Thanks Eldred. I've actually tried to get ready for the last fewraces
> > but
> > with the pain killers i'm taking I don't want to screw up and cause
> wrecks.
> > Its
> > easy enough to do under normal conditions.
> > I have been doing some setups for the road courses and if anyoneneeds
Quoted text (7 lines)
> > something let me know. > > > > Pete > > Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned... > >I don't get much chance to race with you guys anymore since I work all day
saturday but I thought I would add my 2 cents. I have know Robert since the
inception of online racing and while i have questioned his capabilities at
times (-:, I have always enjoyed racing with him. He helped expose many
loopholes in the early versions and I see no reason to not trust that he
will abide by the rules set forth. For all anyone knows for sure, we could
all be cheaters.
"John Simmons" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
RASCAR
> > racing, I'd go with innocent until proven guilty, i.e. proven to have
> > cheated or otherwise misbehaved in a RASCAR race, before going to lenghtof
> > excluding someone. One doesn't have to like a person to race him.
> >
> > Then again, one more guy blowing my doors off doesn't hurt my pridenearly
Quoted text (9 lines)
> In article <LuGJa.64060$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > "Tim" wrote... > > > John, I don't see how you can honestly refuse > > > a guy to race in RASCAR based on so much > > > hearsay and innuendo, especially when it > > > comes to Robert. > > > > I can sympatise with both viewpoints, but, in view of the nature ofQuoted text (7 lines)
> > as much as it does the contenders'. <g> > > > > Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete > proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version > of the facts to which I have access. >>Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned...
>
Hmmm...
/me calls an unscrupulous pharmacist...
Eldred
--
Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my
homepage)
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 03:25:16 GMT, "frederickson" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>Well.... I won my first race online with N2003 when I was stoned...
I've heard that LSD makes for a great GPL concentration companion.
3rd hand report and all that.
Jason
Must have missed that one. :-)
Pete
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:jAWJa.31315$[email hidden]...
> I wonder if anybody remembers the story I instigated during the Seventiesin
> Car and Driver which proved conclusively that smoking marijuana makes youa
in
> a Triumph Spitfire under the influence of an unauthorized substance whenhe
> became convinced that it was a Supermarine Spitfire, and pulled back onthe
> "stick" with disasterous consequences....
>
Quoted text (8 lines)
> better driver. Okay, the methodology was flawed. THC ruins yer long-term > concentration, but the C/D test was over a simple gymkhana course. > > Short Attention-Span Sports: During the Sixties, I won several drag races > whilst twisted out of my face. > > Brit journo Charles Fox (aka the Duke of Methodone; he was the guy who > crashed Sam Posey's Lola @ VIR) was driving across the Golden Gate BridgeMust have missed that one. :-)
Pete
> I wonder if anybody remembers the story I instigated during the Seventies in
> Car and Driver which proved conclusively that smoking *** makes you a
in
> a Triumph Spitfire under the influence of an unauthorized substance when he
> became convinced that it was a Supermarine Spitfire, and pulled back on the
> "stick" with disasterous consequences....
Quoted text (7 lines)
> better driver. Okay, the methodology was flawed. THC ruins yer long-term > concentration, but the C/D test was over a simple gymkhana course. > Short Attention-Span Sports: During the Sixties, I won several drag races > whilst twisted out of my face. > Brit journo Charles Fox (aka the Duke of Methodone; he was the guy who
elrikk wrote:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
>
--
Ric Seyler
Online Racing: RicSeyler
GPL Handicap 6.35
[email hidden]
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~ricseyler
--------------------------------------
"Homer no function beer well without."
- H.J. Simpson
Quoted text (30 lines)
>"Tim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:tuKJa.83323$[email hidden]... > > >>wow >> >>-- >>Tim White >>www.intracmotorsports.com >> >> >> >> >>>Well, until someone involved in the entire thing can provide concrete >>>proof that he didn't cheat, the "heresay" stands as the best version >>>of the facts to which I have access. >>> >>> >>> > >Ya see it's that whole new Ashcroft Justice Dept. thing. > >"You have the right to confess. You have the right to prove your innocence. >If you can not prove your innocence and can not afford an executioner one >will be appointed to you." > >Elrikk ;o) > >PS. Besides, if he let him back in the terrorist win. >HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
We old HAWAII guys sure are a crusty bunch!!
ymenard wrote:
--
Ric Seyler
Online Racing: RicSeyler
GPL Handicap 6.35
[email hidden]
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~ricseyler
--------------------------------------
"Homer no function beer well without."
- H.J. Simpson
Quoted text (35 lines)
>>"Gavel" <[email hidden]> wrote >>Huggins was cheating waaay before TEN. And you, Tom not only were >>you NOT on Hawaii but you didn't show up on TEN until some >>time after it was running. >> >> > ><ding ding ding> > > > > >> Banned arbitrarily? He agreed to the rules when signing up for TEN. >> >> > ><ding ding ding> > > > > > >> This your annual attempt at re-writing sim history? >> >> > ><ding ding ding> > > > > > > > >
Pete wrote:
Just to add a little humor.....
We pay for Papy's mistakes, about $49.00 at a time. hehehehe
--
Ric Seyler
Online Racing: RicSeyler
GPL Handicap 6.35
[email hidden]
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~ricseyler
--------------------------------------
"Homer no function beer well without."
- H.J. Simpson
Quoted text (33 lines)
> You know I find it interesting and amusing when the stories start going >around >about Robert Huggins. It seems the further we get from the events the bigger >the >tales get. > I can guarantee there is no one this NG that knows the full story >including Robert >himself. > How do I know? > Well I was directly involved with a couple of Papy people at the time of >Roberts >indiscretions so I know what happened on their end. > Robert confided to me what happened at the time from his perspective and >confirmed my involvement. > I was the one who asked Robert Huggins to join us at BHMS, we wanted his >programming skills >which he freely gave to write utilities that were given out to the racing >community. > Although, I haven't spoke with him recently. I still do get the odd >email. > > I'm not going to go into what did and didn't happen but lets just say >there are >always two sides to a story. But a lot of half truths and innuendo doesn't >make something >fact. > I will say this much though, Robert made mistakes and he paid for them >and is still paying >for them. > >Papyrus made mistakes and they paid for them as well. >Quoted text (19 lines)
> I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his >request to join Rascar. >He could have done it under a false name and no one would have known. I >think the fact >that he was open and above board suggests he isn't the same person he was >many years >ago. > I will also tell you he has developed into one of the best racers around >without the need to >cheat. Although I'm sure he will be accussed of such untill the day he dies. > > Hopefully, if my health improves I will be able to make a few races in >Rascar myself. > > Pete > > > >
Steve Smith wrote:
I love these old stories
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
http://www.theuspits.com
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--
Quoted text (14 lines)
> > I wonder if anybody remembers the story I instigated during the Seventies in > Car and Driver which proved conclusively that smoking marijuana makes you a > better driver. Okay, the methodology was flawed. THC ruins yer long-term > concentration, but the C/D test was over a simple gymkhana course. > > Short Attention-Span Sports: During the Sixties, I won several drag races > whilst twisted out of my face. > > Brit journo Charles Fox (aka the Duke of Methodone; he was the guy who > crashed Sam Posey's Lola @ VIR) was driving across the Golden Gate Bridge in > a Triumph Spitfire under the influence of an unauthorized substance when he > became convinced that it was a Supermarine Spitfire, and pulled back on the > "stick" with disasterous consequences.... How true! :-)
Pete
"Ric Seyler" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Just to add a little humor.....
We pay for Papy's mistakes, about $49.00 at a time. hehehehe
--
Ric Seyler
Online Racing: RicSeyler
GPL Handicap 6.35
[email hidden]
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~ricseyler
--------------------------------------
"Homer no function beer well without."
- H.J. Simpson
What the Hell! Who cares about Character anyway? I would never assume a person can reform without first hand knowledge. And I give a damn about character. That's right intolerant and judgmental I am. And I like it!
"Ric Seyler" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Pete wrote:
You know I find it interesting and amusing when the stories start going
around
about Robert Huggins. It seems the further we get from the events the bigger
the
tales get.
I can guarantee there is no one this NG that knows the full story
including Robert
himself.
How do I know?
Well I was directly involved with a couple of Papy people at the time of
Roberts
indiscretions so I know what happened on their end.
Robert confided to me what happened at the time from his perspective and
confirmed my involvement.
I was the one who asked Robert Huggins to join us at BHMS, we wanted his
programming skills
which he freely gave to write utilities that were given out to the racing
community.
Although, I haven't spoke with him recently. I still do get the odd
email.
I'm not going to go into what did and didn't happen but lets just say
there are
always two sides to a story. But a lot of half truths and innuendo doesn't
make something
fact.
I will say this much though, Robert made mistakes and he paid for them
and is still paying
for them.
Papyrus made mistakes and they paid for them as well.Just to add a little humor.....
We pay for Papy's mistakes, about $49.00 at a time. hehehehe
I will make one point in Roberts defence. He was open in making his
request to join Rascar.
He could have done it under a false name and no one would have known. I
think the fact
that he was open and above board suggests he isn't the same person he was
many years
ago.
I will also tell you he has developed into one of the best racers around
without the need to
cheat. Although I'm sure he will be accussed of such untill the day he dies.
Hopefully, if my health improves I will be able to make a few races in
Rascar myself.
Pete
--
Ric Seyler
Online Racing: RicSeyler
GPL Handicap 6.35
[email hidden]
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~ricseyler
--------------------------------------
"Homer no function beer well without."
- H.J. Simpson
Saruman!
"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:ADHJa.58$Fy6.65@sccrnsc03...
> Francois....When have you ever been one to let someone else (Papy) do your
> thinking for you? This doesn't sound like the "ymenard" that I know and
> have been friends with for about 5 or 6 years. Do **you** think Robertwas
would
He
Quoted text (9 lines)
> cheating? Who cares what Papy said or didn't say! > > And there were "troubles" with BHM and several other "teams" in > NROS....which was completely full of holes as you very well know. Some > people took advantage of them and some didn't. So what? > > TP > > PS: I liked your "ding - ding - ding" post, by the way. I figured itQuoted text (18 lines)
> make your week to get Greg and I going at it again here on r.a.s. This > place has been kind of quiet and docile for you lately, huh? > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:TSAJa.624$[email hidden]... > > >"Tom Pabst" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > If you are talking about Robert Huggins, then I think you better go do > > some > > > deep research of the issues.....because he was "accused" of cheating > under > > > circumstances that subsequent evidence never supported. > > > > > > <yawn> > > > > > > Papy said he was. I don't care for whatever political or real reason.Quoted text (21 lines)
> > was. End of story. They don't have to prove it to their customers. > > > > > > > He's a member of Black Hole Motorsports still, > > > > Yeah and there was never trouble with this team on the NROS <roll eyes> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > >No shit :)
-Larry
"frederickson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:rLLJa.122669$[email hidden]...
> this is better than TV
