The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of
Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it. It's close to perfect,
missing only the wonderful (and dead accurate) off-course sandstorms of Dave
Noonan's earlier conversion. (And--yeah, I know--minus the concrete-filled
tires, a la GPL's Mexico, that were a well-known feature of the real
thing...but there are no collision planes in N2003 for such objects, so
what's the point?)
PWF's Riverside is one of the finest roadies to date, right up there, IMO,
with Gotzenburg, Oulton Park, St. Jovite, Monaco, Mosport, the Norisring,
and the mighty Nurburgring - greatest track of them all.
I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting 2.55-mile
"short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course, which is
prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration. Oh well, maybe its
historical significance will spur more online road-course Cup racing. I
seem to be the only guy left; I still race with the #121 that Gurney ran
with when he chauffeured the Wood Brothers Ford to five straight wins in the
Motor Trend 500.
Project Wildfire and The Pits release Riverside tracks
Steve Smith praised Project Wildfire's beta Riverside for NR2003, and Joachim Trensz noted that The Pits had also released a version by Dan Olbuck. Steve Smith, a former Car and Driver and Motor Trend editor, and another veteran who had raced at Riverside said neither captured the real track and criticised the Olbuck version's look. Posters also questioned how realistic the Trans-Am mods felt.
Automated summary.
"Steve Smith"
I've seen the sportscar course done for other mods...it 'should' happen
eventually for Nr2k3. I think you will find plenty of Road Racing, but
only with the mods. The PWF TA and TPTCC servers usually have a fair
crowd.
dave henrie
Quoted text (9 lines)
> I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > 2.55-mile "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR > course, which is prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration. Oh > well, maybe its historical significance will spur more online > road-course Cup racing. I seem to be the only guy left; I still race > with the #121 that Gurney ran with when he chauffeured the Wood > Brothers Ford to five straight wins in the Motor Trend 500. > >Steve Smith wrote:
> The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of
> Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it...
>
> I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting 2.55-mile
> "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course...
The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look, its
quite interesting.
Achim
So far, I find the TA mods somewhat less than compelling. I'm sure it's
just me....
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (16 lines)
> "Steve Smith" > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > > 2.55-mile "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR > > course, which is prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration. Oh > > well, maybe its historical significance will spur more online > > road-course Cup racing. I seem to be the only guy left; I still race > > with the #121 that Gurney ran with when he chauffeured the Wood > > Brothers Ford to five straight wins in the Motor Trend 500. > > > > > I've seen the sportscar course done for other mods...it 'should' happen > eventually for Nr2k3. I think you will find plenty of Road Racing, but > only with the mods. The PWF TA and TPTCC servers usually have a fair > crowd. > dave henrie >Thx, Achim - will have a look.
"Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]...
> Steve Smith wrote:
> > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of
> > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it...
> >
> > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting2.55-mile
> > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course...
>
> The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look, its
> quite interesting.
>
> Achim
Actually I found the same thing. In our league there hasn't been much
interest in the TA mod at all.
Its a great mod but I don't think most of the typical oval racers and
leagues are getting much out of it :-\
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:M4%6c.41642$[email hidden]...
happen
Quoted text (16 lines)
> So far, I find the TA mods somewhat less than compelling. I'm sure it's > just me.... > > "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > "Steve Smith" > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > > > 2.55-mile "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR > > > course, which is prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration. Oh > > > well, maybe its historical significance will spur more online > > > road-course Cup racing. I seem to be the only guy left; I still race > > > with the #121 that Gurney ran with when he chauffeured the Wood > > > Brothers Ford to five straight wins in the Motor Trend 500. > > > > > > > > I've seen the sportscar course done for other mods...it 'should'Quoted text (7 lines)
> > eventually for Nr2k3. I think you will find plenty of Road Racing, but > > only with the mods. The PWF TA and TPTCC servers usually have a fair > > crowd. > > dave henrie > > > >Just tried them both and have to say I like the "classic" feel of the Pits
version the best. Reminds you of the good old days watch the Cup cars
racing there.
"Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]...
> Steve Smith wrote:
> > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of
> > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it...
> >
> > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting2.55-mile
> > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course...
>
> The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look, its
> quite interesting.
>
> Achim
Don't get me wrong; I love the roadies...far more than the ovals. But I
also love the Cup cars, which I have often seen on the roadies
(Bridgehampton, Riverside, Watkins Glen, etc.). I'm just not
convinced--yet--that the T/As are as true to life as the Cup cars; the T/A's
seem much larger than life to me. I felt the same way abt. GPL's F1s and
F2s, and drove the F2s exclusively for 3 years before finally coming to
terms w. the F1s. As I say, I'm sure it's just me....
"Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:OB%6c.7909$[email hidden]...
Oh
> > > > well, maybe its historical significance will spur more online
> > > > road-course Cup racing. I seem to be the only guy left; I stillrace
but
Quoted text (16 lines)
> Actually I found the same thing. In our league there hasn't been much > interest in the TA mod at all. > Its a great mod but I don't think most of the typical oval racers and > leagues are getting much out of it :-\ > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:M4%6c.41642$[email hidden]... > > So far, I find the TA mods somewhat less than compelling. I'm sure it's > > just me.... > > > > "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > "Steve Smith" > > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > > > > 2.55-mile "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR > > > > course, which is prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration.Quoted text (7 lines)
> > > > with the #121 that Gurney ran with when he chauffeured the Wood > > > > Brothers Ford to five straight wins in the Motor Trend 500. > > > > > > > > > > > I've seen the sportscar course done for other mods...it 'should' > happen > > > eventually for Nr2k3. I think you will find plenty of Road Racing,Quoted text (8 lines)
> > > only with the mods. The PWF TA and TPTCC servers usually have a fair > > > crowd. > > > dave henrie > > > > > > > > >Not even close. Mr. Olbuck's Riverside looks no more like the real
Riverside than his Lime Rock bore any resemblance to that circuit. He just
doesn't seem to have the knack of capturing the feel of a place. It isn't
just the obvious mistakes (he makes Riverside look like it's in Shang-ri-la;
in fact it was in the middle of a windswept desert and the only mountains on
the horizon were the San Gabriels to the north); he hasn't captured the
sights, the textures, the rhythm, the Zeitgeist or the soul of the place.
(And worst of all, he removed Dave Noonan's off-course sandstorms!)
I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and Lime
Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street cars and
race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the other tracks
I drove: Bridgehampton, Laguna Seca, Watkins Glen, Sebring, Mosport,
Mid-Ohio, Willow Springs, Santa Barbara, Marlboro, Cumberland, Thompson and
the rest. I can still visualize laps of all these tracks with my eyes
closed and be within a second or two of my actual laptimes there. I can't
vouch for tracks I haven't driven (the only tracks I drove in Europe were
Solitude and Hockenheim), but I can tell when the tracks I that do know are
right and when they're wrong. This Riverside ain't it.
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:25%6c.41644$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (18 lines)
> Thx, Achim - will have a look. > > "Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]... > > Steve Smith wrote: > > > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of > > > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it... > > > > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > 2.55-mile > > > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course... > > > > The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look, its > > quite interesting. > > > > Achim > >Yes it seemed to be less dusty through the Ss than I recall seeing on TV but
it had a more realistic feel to it than the PWF version I thought, maybe it
was just the worn look as apposed to the PWF one that seemed newly built.
Track shape/design wise which one do you think is closer to what the real
thing was? Seem to be some major difference between the 2 for sure,
elevation changes being one of the noticeable ones.
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:2j07c.48812$[email hidden]...
> Not even close. Mr. Olbuck's Riverside looks no more like the real
> Riverside than his Lime Rock bore any resemblance to that circuit. Hejust
> doesn't seem to have the knack of capturing the feel of a place. It isn't
> just the obvious mistakes (he makes Riverside look like it's inShang-ri-la;
> in fact it was in the middle of a windswept desert and the only mountainson
tracks
> I drove: Bridgehampton, Laguna Seca, Watkins Glen, Sebring, Mosport,
> Mid-Ohio, Willow Springs, Santa Barbara, Marlboro, Cumberland, Thompsonand
> the rest. I can still visualize laps of all these tracks with my eyes
> closed and be within a second or two of my actual laptimes there. I can't
> vouch for tracks I haven't driven (the only tracks I drove in Europe were
> Solitude and Hockenheim), but I can tell when the tracks I that do knoware
its
Quoted text (7 lines)
> the horizon were the San Gabriels to the north); he hasn't captured the > sights, the textures, the rhythm, the Zeitgeist or the soul of the place. > (And worst of all, he removed Dave Noonan's off-course sandstorms!) > > I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and Lime > Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street cars and > race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the otherQuoted text (17 lines)
> right and when they're wrong. This Riverside ain't it. > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:25%6c.41644$[email hidden]... > > Thx, Achim - will have a look. > > > > "Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]... > > > Steve Smith wrote: > > > > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of > > > > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it... > > > > > > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > > 2.55-mile > > > > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course... > > > > > > The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look,Quoted text (7 lines)
> > > quite interesting. > > > > > > Achim > > > > > >I think it's fair to say that the T/A's aren't true to life. The specs and
physics don't match any existing racing series. But they are still quite
fun. I just think of it as a fictional racing series and enjoy it for what
it is.
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:T007c.48728$[email hidden]...
> Don't get me wrong; I love the roadies...far more than the ovals. But I
> also love the Cup cars, which I have often seen on the roadies
> (Bridgehampton, Riverside, Watkins Glen, etc.). I'm just not
> convinced--yet--that the T/As are as true to life as the Cup cars; theT/A's
> seem much larger than life to me. I felt the same way abt. GPL's F1s and
> F2s, and drove the F2s exclusively for 3 years before finally coming to
> terms w. the F1s. As I say, I'm sure it's just me....
>
It isn't just that it isn't true to an existing (or even previous) series;
it doesn't seem to quite jibe with the laws of racing physics, as I
understand them. Maybe more like racing Landspeeders on Tatooine.
"Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> I think it's fair to say that the T/A's aren't true to life. The specsand
> physics don't match any existing racing series. But they are still quite
> fun. I just think of it as a fictional racing series and enjoy it forwhat
and
> > F2s, and drove the F2s exclusively for 3 years before finally coming to
> > terms w. the F1s. As I say, I'm sure it's just me....
> >
>
>
Quoted text (11 lines)
> it is. > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:T007c.48728$[email hidden]... > > Don't get me wrong; I love the roadies...far more than the ovals. But I > > also love the Cup cars, which I have often seen on the roadies > > (Bridgehampton, Riverside, Watkins Glen, etc.). I'm just not > > convinced--yet--that the T/As are as true to life as the Cup cars; the > T/A's > > seem much larger than life to me. I felt the same way abt. GPL's F1s"Steve Smith" wrote...
> Don't get me wrong; I love the roadies...<snip>
> But I also love the Cup cars, which I have often
> seen on the roadies <snip>
> As I say, I'm sure it's just me....
It's not just you... (and I'm glad it's not just me either <g>).
Jan.
=---
As Dan Olbuck stated in the readme, his version is a mishmash of several
eras, but the "distressed" track surface ("...memories of the demise of
Riverside are presented as a jagged tarmac loath with neglect, including
cracks oozing tar and slightly earthquaken [sic] bumps and grinds...grass
and dust invades the edge of the pit stalls and peeks through the concrete
and at the bottom of the walls...") seems wildly overdone, as if the track
had simply been abandoned (like Reims or Meadowdale) and not razed
altogether. The PWF version. OTOH, looks overly sanitized.
Olbuck's version seems based on Noonan's conversion of the Papyrus track in
NASCAR Legends, which I consulted on, but most of it except the back stretch
seems way too narrow. The elevation changes seem somewhat exaggerated (as
opposed to PWF's, which seem understated), but like so many trackmakers this
track seems sunken in its surroundings--almost as if in a shallow
trench--whereas the real track simply lay on the desert floor like a ribbon.
Turn 9 was recontoured a couple of times during the life of the track; it's
impossible to tell which variation Olbuck has chosen for his, um,
interpretation, but it was certainly a lot more steeply banked in 1970 (the
ostensible year of Olbuck's track) than it appears here.
Fans of the track should have a look at "Riverside Raceway: Palace of
Speed," a 346-page paen of praise self-published by Dick Wallen (Box10561,
Glendale AZ, 85318) with hundreds of stats & photos. 'Spensive but worth
it.
"Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:_617c.7980$[email hidden]...
> Yes it seemed to be less dusty through the Ss than I recall seeing on TVbut
> it had a more realistic feel to it than the PWF version I thought, maybeit
isn't
> > just the obvious mistakes (he makes Riverside look like it's in
> Shang-ri-la;
> > in fact it was in the middle of a windswept desert and the onlymountains
> on
> > the horizon were the San Gabriels to the north); he hasn't captured the
> > sights, the textures, the rhythm, the Zeitgeist or the soul of theplace.
> > (And worst of all, he removed Dave Noonan's off-course sandstorms!)
> >
> > I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside andLime
> > Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street carsand
can't
> > vouch for tracks I haven't driven (the only tracks I drove in Europewere
course...
Quoted text (12 lines)
> was just the worn look as apposed to the PWF one that seemed newly built. > > Track shape/design wise which one do you think is closer to what the real > thing was? Seem to be some major difference between the 2 for sure, > elevation changes being one of the noticeable ones. > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:2j07c.48812$[email hidden]... > > Not even close. Mr. Olbuck's Riverside looks no more like the real > > Riverside than his Lime Rock bore any resemblance to that circuit. He > just > > doesn't seem to have the knack of capturing the feel of a place. ItQuoted text (7 lines)
> > race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the other > tracks > > I drove: Bridgehampton, Laguna Seca, Watkins Glen, Sebring, Mosport, > > Mid-Ohio, Willow Springs, Santa Barbara, Marlboro, Cumberland, Thompson > and > > the rest. I can still visualize laps of all these tracks with my eyes > > closed and be within a second or two of my actual laptimes there. IQuoted text (17 lines)
> > Solitude and Hockenheim), but I can tell when the tracks I that do know > are > > right and when they're wrong. This Riverside ain't it. > > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:25%6c.41644$[email hidden]... > > > Thx, Achim - will have a look. > > > > > > "Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]... > > > > Steve Smith wrote: > > > > > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of > > > > > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it... > > > > > > > > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interesting > > > 2.55-mile > > > > > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCARQuoted text (12 lines)
> > > > > > > > The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have a look, > its > > > > quite interesting. > > > > > > > > Achim > > > > > > > > > > > >"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:Ob27c.42048$[email hidden]:
> It isn't just that it isn't true to an existing (or even previous)
> series; it doesn't seem to quite jibe with the laws of racing physics,
> as I understand them. Maybe more like racing Landspeeders on
> Tatooine.
No WONDER that young kid does so well in our league...:)
So somewhere between the 2 versions is probably closer to reality which is
what I thought after trying both. Each seems to be too far in each
direction.
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:OV27c.50182$[email hidden]...
in
> NASCAR Legends, which I consulted on, but most of it except the backstretch
> seems way too narrow. The elevation changes seem somewhat exaggerated (as
> opposed to PWF's, which seem understated), but like so many trackmakersthis
> track seems sunken in its surroundings--almost as if in a shallow
> trench--whereas the real track simply lay on the desert floor like aribbon.
>
> Turn 9 was recontoured a couple of times during the life of the track;it's
> impossible to tell which variation Olbuck has chosen for his, um,
> interpretation, but it was certainly a lot more steeply banked in 1970(the
maybe
> it
> > was just the worn look as apposed to the PWF one that seemed newlybuilt.
> >
> > Track shape/design wise which one do you think is closer to what thereal
the
Thompson
know
far-more-interesting
> > > > 2.55-mile
> > > > > > "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR
> course...
> > > > >
> > > > > The Pits have also released a new version of Riverside. Have alook,
Quoted text (10 lines)
> As Dan Olbuck stated in the readme, his version is a mishmash of several > eras, but the "distressed" track surface ("...memories of the demise of > Riverside are presented as a jagged tarmac loath with neglect, including > cracks oozing tar and slightly earthquaken [sic] bumps and grinds...grass > and dust invades the edge of the pit stalls and peeks through the concrete > and at the bottom of the walls...") seems wildly overdone, as if the track > had simply been abandoned (like Reims or Meadowdale) and not razed > altogether. The PWF version. OTOH, looks overly sanitized. > > Olbuck's version seems based on Noonan's conversion of the Papyrus trackQuoted text (12 lines)
> ostensible year of Olbuck's track) than it appears here. > > Fans of the track should have a look at "Riverside Raceway: Palace of > Speed," a 346-page paen of praise self-published by Dick Wallen (Box10561, > Glendale AZ, 85318) with hundreds of stats & photos. 'Spensive but worth > it. > > "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:_617c.7980$[email hidden]... > > Yes it seemed to be less dusty through the Ss than I recall seeing on TV > but > > it had a more realistic feel to it than the PWF version I thought,Quoted text (16 lines)
> > thing was? Seem to be some major difference between the 2 for sure, > > elevation changes being one of the noticeable ones. > > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:2j07c.48812$[email hidden]... > > > Not even close. Mr. Olbuck's Riverside looks no more like the real > > > Riverside than his Lime Rock bore any resemblance to that circuit. He > > just > > > doesn't seem to have the knack of capturing the feel of a place. It > isn't > > > just the obvious mistakes (he makes Riverside look like it's in > > Shang-ri-la; > > > in fact it was in the middle of a windswept desert and the only > mountains > > on > > > the horizon were the San Gabriels to the north); he hasn't capturedQuoted text (12 lines)
> > > sights, the textures, the rhythm, the Zeitgeist or the soul of the > place. > > > (And worst of all, he removed Dave Noonan's off-course sandstorms!) > > > > > > I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and > Lime > > > Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street cars > and > > > race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the other > > tracks > > > I drove: Bridgehampton, Laguna Seca, Watkins Glen, Sebring, Mosport, > > > Mid-Ohio, Willow Springs, Santa Barbara, Marlboro, Cumberland,Quoted text (7 lines)
> > and > > > the rest. I can still visualize laps of all these tracks with my eyes > > > closed and be within a second or two of my actual laptimes there. I > can't > > > vouch for tracks I haven't driven (the only tracks I drove in Europe > were > > > Solitude and Hockenheim), but I can tell when the tracks I that doQuoted text (14 lines)
> > are > > > right and when they're wrong. This Riverside ain't it. > > > > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:25%6c.41644$[email hidden]... > > > > Thx, Achim - will have a look. > > > > > > > > "Joachim Trensz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:c3htbp$27nmtb$[email hidden]... > > > > > Steve Smith wrote: > > > > > > The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of > > > > > > Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it... > > > > > > > > > > > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done theQuoted text (12 lines)
> > its > > > > > quite interesting. > > > > > > > > > > Achim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >;-)
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (10 lines)
> "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in > news:Ob27c.42048$[email hidden]: > > > It isn't just that it isn't true to an existing (or even previous) > > series; it doesn't seem to quite jibe with the laws of racing physics, > > as I understand them. Maybe more like racing Landspeeders on > > Tatooine. > > No WONDER that young kid does so well in our league...:) >On Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:45:18 GMT, "Steve Smith"
<[email hidden]> wrote:
Steve,
Were you at C&D in the days of the C&D reader challenge race(s)?
Those were great days of the magazine and I'll bet a lot of fun.
>
>I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and Lime
>Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street cars and
>race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the other tracks
No, I was long gone by then. I was the Editor of Car and Driver in the 60s
(and Editor of Motor Trend in the 70s and the Editor of PC Computing in the
80s and...well, you get the idea - I'm a very old dude!).
"No Spam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
and
> >race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the othertracks
>
Quoted text (8 lines)
> On Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:45:18 GMT, "Steve Smith" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > Steve, > Were you at C&D in the days of the C&D reader challenge race(s)? > Those were great days of the magazine and I'll bet a lot of fun. > > > >I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and Lime > >Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street carsDamn...when I saw the title of your post I was praying that someone FINALLY
produced the Riverside short course...these guys just don't know what they
are missing do they Steve. Turns 6/7/7A had to be one of the coolest
combinations of turns in North America.
Don
"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Xl_6c.16081$[email hidden]...
> The wild boys at PWF have released an alleged "beta" version of
> Riverside...only there's nothing beta about it. It's close to perfect,
> missing only the wonderful (and dead accurate) off-course sandstorms ofDave
> Noonan's earlier conversion. (And--yeah, I know--minus theconcrete-filled
2.55-mile
> "short sports car course" instead of the 2.62-mile NASCAR course, which is
> prolly the track's *least* interesting iteration. Oh well, maybe its
> historical significance will spur more online road-course Cup racing. I
> seem to be the only guy left; I still race with the #121 that Gurney ran
> with when he chauffeured the Wood Brothers Ford to five straight wins inthe
> Motor Trend 500.
>
>
>
Quoted text (9 lines)
> tires, a la GPL's Mexico, that were a well-known feature of the real > thing...but there are no collision planes in N2003 for such objects, so > what's the point?) > > PWF's Riverside is one of the finest roadies to date, right up there, IMO, > with Gotzenburg, Oulton Park, St. Jovite, Monaco, Mosport, the Norisring, > and the mighty Nurburgring - greatest track of them all. > > I only wish PWF (or *somebody*) had done the far-more-interestingLet another old dude chime in here. Steve, you are spang on the money
regarding both Riverside track versions. I drove R'side in most of its
variations from the late 50's on into the 60's and neither of these
are the track I can still see, hear smell and taste in memory from my
dad's TD on up to the grunting monster of the 427 Flip Top (The Turd)
that my partner and I bought out of the back of the hanger on Imperial
Ave.during Ford's big fire sale.
On Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:04:31 GMT, "Steve Smith"
<[email hidden]> wrote:
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>No, I was long gone by then. I was the Editor of Car and Driver in the 60s >(and Editor of Motor Trend in the 70s and the Editor of PC Computing in the >80s and...well, you get the idea - I'm a very old dude!). > >"No Spam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:45:18 GMT, "Steve Smith" >> <[email hidden]> wrote: >> Steve, >> Were you at C&D in the days of the C&D reader challenge race(s)? >> Those were great days of the magazine and I'll bet a lot of fun. >> > >> >I have the advantage of doing hundreds of laps of both Riverside and Lime >> >Rock when I was the Editor of Car and Driver (testing both street cars >and >> >race cars). The memories are indelible, as are memories of the other >tracks >> >Absolute Zero <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:
ya know the guy has made 4 versions of Limerock so far. I bet that if
you two approached him, he'd might be willing to take your input and
improve Riverside. The more info you two could pass along might be
invaluable. Of course he also might tell you both to jump in a lake, who
knows??? But with your input, MAYBE the lot of you could produce
something really special.
dh
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> Let another old dude chime in here. Steve, you are spang on the money > regarding both Riverside track versions. I drove R'side in most of its > variations from the late 50's on into the 60's and neither of these > are the track I can still see, hear smell and taste in memory from my > dad's TD on up to the grunting monster of the 427 Flip Top (The Turd) > that my partner and I bought out of the back of the hanger on Imperial > Ave.during Ford's big fire sale.Dave Henrie wrote:
...
Wise words. Steve, Zero, why don't you approach the guy and offer your
help and experience? We'd all be grateful, that much is sure!
Achim
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> ya know the guy has made 4 versions of Limerock so far. I bet that if > you two approached him, he'd might be willing to take your input and > improve Riverside. The more info you two could pass along might be > invaluable. Of course he also might tell you both to jump in a lake, who > knows??? But with your input, MAYBE the lot of you could produce > something really special. > > dhI'd be glad to give some input if contacted. The problem is that I
don't have a lot of time due to business demands. The last month I've
had a window of opportunity since I've been recovering from some
surgery. So, I've been exploring the add ons and things like Racer
Free Car.
It would be a little ironic that this thread started with Project
Wildfire's mod. My dad produced the first fibre-glass sports car kit
in the 50's. The name? Wildfire.
Gurney for President
On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:55:39 +0200, Joachim Trensz <[email hidden]>
wrote:
