F1 Grand Prix 3 - just a minor step forward

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> Well, it seems that GP3 won't be too much different than GP2. After all > talks about 3dfx support and 4 CD's, it looks that GP3 will more like some > kind of upgrade to GP3. It will be something like more completed GP2 with > all features that GP2 should have but it has not. > What do you expect from the next part of best sport and racing game ever > made? > I just hope that Microprose will work on graphic optimisation. I didn't like > what they did with hardware requirements last time. > And they will base the game upon 1997 season (less important). What should > that mean - Jos in the gravel almost every race?

Where did you get this information? I love GP2 and would be quite happy just to have the game run faster so I can get a higher frame rate. However, I had read previously about 3dfx, network support, 4 CD's .etc. as you suggest. The addition of an option for rain would be a big plus! Keith. -- please remove _spam from e-mail address when replying

Well, it seems that GP3 won't be too much different than GP2. After all talks about 3dfx support and 4 CD's, it looks that GP3 will more like some kind of upgrade to GP3. It will be something like more completed GP2 with all features that GP2 should have but it has not. What do you expect from the next part of best sport and racing game ever made? I just hope that Microprose will work on graphic optimisation. I didn't like what they did with hardware requirements last time. And they will base the game upon 1997 season (less important). What should that mean - Jos in the gravel almost every race?

On Wed, 3 Dec 1997 02:06:44 +0100, "Vedran Dracic"

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>Well, it seems that GP3 won't be too much different than GP2. After all >talks about 3dfx support and 4 CD's, it looks that GP3 will more like some >kind of upgrade to GP3. It will be something like more completed GP2 with >all features that GP2 should have but it has not. >What do you expect from the next part of best sport and racing game ever >made? >I just hope that Microprose will work on graphic optimisation. I didn't like >what they did with hardware requirements last time. >And they will base the game upon 1997 season (less important). What should >that mean - Jos in the gravel almost every race?

Well, if MicroProse has half the marketing sense as LucasArt or EIDOS, or whoever, they would be producing patches for GP2. However, they know nothing about graphics (ie using DX5). Even their latest Falcon4 use their own graphic engine!!! What a silly way of putting people off.

Seriously, GP2 is the best game i have ever played just that the wet condition was omited from GP1 for some reason. other improvements that GP3 should have over GP2 is the graphics engine to be used.

>Well, if MicroProse has half the marketing sense as LucasArt or EIDOS, >or whoever, they would be producing patches for GP2. However, they >know nothing about graphics (ie using DX5). Even their latest Falcon4 >use their own graphic engine!!! What a silly way of putting people >off. This is a joke, right? DX5 as an example of 'correct' graphics programming? I guess that's why Papyrus sells so poorly, using their own graphics engine and all. Drop over to a flight sim newsgroup and see what a great job "Flight Sim '98" is (slowest graphics since FS4 on 8088).

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> Well, it seems that GP3 won't be too much different than GP2. After > all > talks about 3dfx support and 4 CD's, it looks that GP3 will more like > some > kind of upgrade to GP3. It will be something like more completed GP2 > with > all features that GP2 should have but it has not. > What do you expect from the next part of best sport and racing game > ever > made? > I just hope that Microprose will work on graphic optimisation. I > didn't like > what they did with hardware requirements last time. > And they will base the game upon 1997 season (less important). What > should > that mean - Jos in the gravel almost every race?

One more thing, there won't be any game called Grand Prix 3, Microprose lost the FIA licence which means that they'll have to change the title and that they can only sell GP2 until the end of the year, at least under that name anyway. The same thing happened to Papyrus and their Indy Car Racing 2, where they had to change the name to CART racing. BigBoss

have u got Ubi F1? I personally think its great and I don't find myself thinking about GP3 anymore because of it. Ubi F1 already has great optimization, 3dfx support, its programers have already started working on a patch so thats all the bases covered

Is there a demo to download of Ubi F1? -- Don Burnette I-65 Racing Dburn on Ten

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>> Well, it seems that GP3 won't be too much different than GP2. After >> all >> talks about 3dfx support and 4 CD's, it looks that GP3 will more like >> some >> kind of upgrade to GP3. It will be something like more completed GP2 >> with >> all features that GP2 should have but it has not.

If it's available in the stores it will be quite a bit different, from my perspective. I've been keeping my eye out for a copy of GP 2 at 2 places for the last few months and NADA! It seems very weird to me that such a well-reviewed game is completely unavailable. Microprose having distribution problems? (I recall they had problems for a while keeping Civ 2 in stores).

radiospace heeft geschreven in bericht GP-2 is no longer available. Microprose's license ended, so they had to stop production of GP-2. Ubisoft now has a license. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Flush The Seatbelt! Ekul in Sraw Rats ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sticks and stones CAN break my bones! Anonymous Stormtrooper on Endor. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1/35 Panther Ausf. F under construction ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm a Neutralist and proud of it! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.herbert.demon.nl http://www.macross.org/trooper -------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Is there a demo to download of Ubi F1? > -- > Don Burnette > I-65 Racing > Dburn on Ten Hi Don, Yes there is one at: http://www.o3dfx.allgames.com/ Its 35 meg but well worth the DL time :)! I have the old pirate demo from way back and I cant wait for my F1RS to get here from Germany :) Check it out, I doubt you'll want to go back to GP2 :)! Trev

Thanks Trevor, I'll try it out this weekend. -- Don Burnette I-65 Racing Dburn on Ten

On Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:46:13 +0100, "Seatbelt"

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>radiospace heeft geschreven in bericht >>If it's available in the stores it will be quite a bit different, from >>my perspective. I've been keeping my eye out for a copy of GP 2 at 2 >>places for the last few months and NADA! It seems very weird to me >>that such a well-reviewed game is completely unavailable. Microprose >>having distribution problems? (I recall they had problems for a while >>keeping Civ 2 in stores). >GP-2 is no longer available. Microprose's license ended, so they had to stop >production of GP-2. >Ubisoft now has a license.

Do you mean that Ubisoft is distributing the same game, or that Ubisoft as a license for the name and is making a new game with that name? (Hopefully the former)

> Do you mean that Ubisoft is distributing the same game, or that > Ubisoft as a license for the name and is making a new game with that > name? > (Hopefully the former) No they, are not distributing the same game, they've made a new game called F1 Racing Simulation and I can only say that I like it a lot more then GP2. GP2 was a great racing simulation but the feel of handling the car just wasn't right (and I've got a steering wheel with pedals), now the F1RS is a game that really deserves the name simulation, it's really the best. Don't miss it. BigBoss

I have had GP2 for quite some time now. I had shelved it do to the fact my P-90 would not run it with any decent graphics on. I installed it on my Dell 233 mmx system yesterday, and it's a totally different sim now. I am able to run with all textures on, except mirror, with trackside detail on medium. My processer occupancy is bopping between 100-130 %. I have my frame rate set to 25. I'm not sure I understand what the occupancy means, should I strive to get it at or below 100% cosistantly? To do this, do I decrease my desired framerate, or turn some textures off? I have been driving with the steering and brake help, but have just started with those aids turned off. Tough to get the hang of it, but I'm getting there. -- Don Burnette I-65 Racing Dburn on Ten

radiospace heeft geschreven in bericht No. GP-2 is history. No new production because Microprose aren't allowed anymore to use: The teamnames, tracks, sponsornames, adverts, tracks, rules, drivers-names and all else related. Ubisoft now has the license to use these names par Diques' name. And FYI, I've not yet SEEN any confirmed info GP-3 is at all being developed. It'll be buggy, just like GP-2. Remember! GP-2 was bugged when it was released. Only people start to forget that when comparing F-1 RS to GP-2. I liked GP-2, but F-1 RS has blown it out of my HD. When I actually have the sensation and feel of drifting my car through a corner, I can surely say F-1 RS outperforms GP-2. Just the menus..... Garage, fiddle the setup, then reloading the track? Come on.... gotto be a better way to do that. And just to give some proof. I switched on Melbourne from C-compound to A-compound without changing anything else of the car. Like hell it was loosing grip, I flew out of the first corner while shifting down to 2nd gear. How's that for accuracy? Also, in GP-2, if you spin, other pilots just keep pushing their nose in your car. F-1 RS has shown me drivers braking hard, putting it in reverse and driving around me. Anyone saying GP-2 is graphically better needs glasses. GP-2 looks very bad compared to F-1 RS. And on top of that, the feel of speed in F-1 RS is WAY better than in GP-2. You can also not clip a corner as in GP-2 because it slows you down from 300+ to 120 Km/H pronto in F-1 RS. In GP-2 I can cut a corner without loosing too much speed. You need to push that limiter button in the Pit. You need to steer around debris, a tire in front of you means a crash if you don't evade it. GP-2 was good, but now there is F-1 RS, which is a lot better. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Flush The Seatbelt! Ekul in Sraw Rats ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sticks and stones CAN break my bones! Anonymous Stormtrooper on Endor. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1/35 Panther Ausf. F under construction ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm a Neutralist and proud of it! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [link lost in import] [link lost in import] -------------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually the racing series formerly called "Indycar" had to change its name because they don't race at Indianapolis anymore. If you want explanation why you'll have to email me, it is a very long story. But the short answer is that Indycar is now called CART (Championship Auto Racing Teams). So Papyrus had to change the name of game for legal reasons not because they lost the license Neil B.

I would turn off sky and mirror texture and turn the rest of your mirror options back on. Set the frame rate of the game so you don't exceed 100% during your lap. When you get occupancy of over 100% the game starts dropping frames just like a windows avi video does and your controls are not as reponsive. You should be able to play with everything on at 320 x 200 and at least 18 fps in 640 x 480 with the game set as I descibed above. Video cards don't mean much to this games when it comes to frame rate. The faster the processor the faster the frame rate. I have tried the Ubisoft F1 RS France demo but like POD this game wont work with my AMD K5 even though I have a 3Dfx card. I believe this was part of the Intel deal when the POD engine was developed for MMX. and Intel only game. POD and F1RS are the only two games I can't run with my AMD K5 and both were made by UBISOFT. Jerry Jerry

What goes around, comes around. The teams were originally referred to as CART well before they became popularised with 'IndyCars'. -- Bruce. "I envy people who drink. At least they have something to blame everything on." (Oscar Levant)

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> > Is there a demo to download of Ubi F1? > > -- > > Don Burnette > > I-65 Racing > > Dburn on Ten > Hi Don, > Yes there is one at: > http://www.o3dfx.allgames.com/ > Its 35 meg but well worth the DL time :)! I have the old pirate demo > from way back and I cant wait for my F1RS to get here from Germany :) > Check it out, I doubt you'll want to go back to GP2 :)! > Trev

Hi, is demo 3dfx only or both 3dfx and D3D?

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>>I have had GP2 for quite some time now. I had shelved it do to the fact my >>P-90 would not run it with any decent graphics on. I installed it on my >>Dell 233 mmx system yesterday, and it's a totally different sim now. I am >>able to run with all textures on, except mirror, with trackside detail on >>medium. My processer occupancy is bopping between 100-130 %. I have my >>frame rate set to 25. I'm not sure I understand what the occupancy means, >>should I strive to get it at or below 100% cosistantly?

You want it around 100%. The occupancy is a measure of how much of your computer's "horsepower" is being used to maintain the graphics settings you've requested (ie: frame rate and details levels). It will tend to flucuate, based on what is happening on the track. If it is consistently above 100%, you will not be getting the graphics performance you desire (more below). If it is consistently below 100%, you have extra CPU power to spare, and can afford to raise the frame rate or detail levels with no performance degradation (you lucky dog :). Either (or both) will do the job. No. This is the peculiar thing about GP2. In most other sims, they will "drop" (or skip) frames when they can't keep up. This leads to slower screen and control updates ("jerkiness"), which hampers smooth driving. In GP2, your requested frame rate is locked in. Come hell or high water, you'll get 20 fps (or whatever you've got it set for). When the processor occupancy goes over 100%, "sim-time" will start to run slower than real-time, to allow all the frames to be shown. The game will report that you turned a lap at 1:30 or whatever, but if you run a stopwatch you will find that that lap may have actually taken 2 or 3 minutes. You get the same result as dropped frames (jerkiness, since you're actually only seeing/reacting to a lower number of frames per *real-time* second) but you also have the game slowing down, wreaking havoc with the timing and rhythm of your own driving. I don't like it (if you hadn't guessed already ;). Interestingly, this is sort of the inverse of the "Turbo" mode in Papyrus Rendition ICR2/CART. There, the game is no longer locked into the real-time clock and is allowed to run as fast as the frame rate allows. You may run a 170 mph lap at Louden, but if you're achieving 60 fps (vs the normal max of 30), the lap only takes one half as long in real-time and gives a *tremendous* sensation of speed. At least Papyrus acknowledges in the Rendition readme that this is a sort of "gee-whiz" feature, not the way to design the game to normally run. :) BTW, there were some reports of a similar "faster than real-time" performance in GP2 when run at very low occupancy levels, although it was in the 1-2% variation range, not the almost linear variation in ICR2 Turbo mode. Otherwise in full agreement, Jerry. Before you send me UCE, I know what you're thinking... Did he complain to five or six postmasters last month? Now, you must ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do you, punk?

Is F1 RS available in the states??

Ooops! Mistake! __GP2 doesn't drop frames__ . It slows down simulation time! If you drive a 1m20 simulation lap with a constant processor occupancy of 200%, you will drive 2m40s in reality. In other words: if you select 20fps, the game GIVES you 20fps for that simulated second. With 200% PO, the simulated second will be a full 2 REAL seconds. This gives you MORE time to react and it is one of the most criticised things about GP2... JoH Please remove *anti-spam* from the email when replying. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= When everything else failed, we can still become im- mortal by making an enormous blunder.... John Kenneth Galbraith =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

>Ooops! Mistake! >__GP2 doesn't drop frames__ . It slows down simulation time! If you drive a 1m20 >simulation lap with a constant processor occupancy of 200%, you will drive 2m40s >in reality. In other words: if you select 20fps, the game GIVES you 20fps for >that simulated second. With 200% PO, the simulated second will be a full 2 REAL >seconds. This gives you MORE time to react and it is one of the most criticised >things about GP2... Bravissimo !!! Actually somebody who knows how the Gp2 engine works ! :-) Everybody can run Gp2 at 25fps, with ALL graphics on. EVERYBODY. Even with a P90 with a 2mb video card. EVERYBODY. But I can make myself a dinner while waiting for you to run a lap at 25fps with a p90. It may take very, very, very long..... 500% and more occupancy all the time ;( Fran?ois Mnard, Creator, rec.autos.simulators With great respect, May the downforce be with you, Good race at the Brickyard, (-o-) ymenard on NROS, sponsored by http://www.awpss.com/ SimRacing director, AWPSS - *Excuse me for my poor English(I'm French speaking) * -

On Sat, 20 Dec 1997 13:50:14 -0500, "Dan Blake" >If you live in the states, I saw GP2 at Best Buy in Atlanta recently for >$29.95, but I'll sell you mine for $500 <g>. At my local FutureShop it was still being sold for $49! I called them today, and they still don't have CPR or the BGN expansion pack! John

If you live in the states, I saw GP2 at Best Buy in Atlanta recently for $29.95, but I'll sell you mine for $500 <g>.

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>On Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:46:13 +0100, "Seatbelt" >>radiospace heeft geschreven in bericht >>>If it's available in the stores it will be quite a bit different, from >>>my perspective. I've been keeping my eye out for a copy of GP 2 at 2 >>>places for the last few months and NADA! It seems very weird to me >>>that such a well-reviewed game is completely unavailable. Microprose >>>having distribution problems? (I recall they had problems for a while >>>keeping Civ 2 in stores). >>GP-2 is no longer available. Microprose's license ended, so they had to

stop

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>>production of GP-2. >>Ubisoft now has a license. >Do you mean that Ubisoft is distributing the same game, or that >Ubisoft as a license for the name and is making a new game with that >name? >(Hopefully the former)

Schucks, I'll let ya have mine for $480.00 <g> -- Don Burnette I-65 Racing Dburn on Ten

BTW, they didn't even have the name for the track pack right! They called it the "Grand National Expert Pack"! Later, John

Maybe they should call themselves "Pastshop". Ken The Game Pad http://gamepad.org/

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> > At my local FutureShop it was still being sold for $49! I called > >them today, and they still don't have CPR or the BGN expansion pack! > >John > BTW, they didn't even have the name for the track pack right! They > called it the "Grand National Expert Pack"! > Later, > John

Ubisoft has a license to be THE official FIA F1 WC simulator. They developped a new game based on the '96 WC called "F1 Racing Simulation". I haven't played it yet, but I've seen it demonstrated and the grafics look MUCH better than in GP2. I hope the rest is just as good. Pat