F1GP2 - bugless?

Haven't seen one bug complaint (whine) about the game yet. Would that indicate that Sir Geoff has once again managed to produce a quality product so rare in today's *** industry (is ICR2 still in need of patches)? Still true multiplayer support (IPX, TCP/IP) with 26 players is somethng I want NOW! :) And I will most certainly not use it, if I'm expected to pay by the minute (will Hawaii EVER be available for Europeans, what about Finns). -TPP

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>Haven't seen one bug complaint (whine) about the game yet. Would that >indicate that Sir Geoff has once again managed to produce a quality >product so rare in today's *** industry (is ICR2 still in need of >patches)? >Still true multiplayer support (IPX, TCP/IP) with 26 players is somethng >I want NOW! :) And I will most certainly not use it, if I'm expected to >pay by the minute (will Hawaii EVER be available for Europeans, what about >Finns). > -TPP

Bugs??? They exists. A very anoying one doesn't allow me to save games when I run F1GP2 with Windows95 in the background. The game just stops... Very annoying when you just qualified you, which is very hard in GP2. Bye

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> >Haven't seen one bug complaint (whine) about the game yet. Would that > >indicate that Sir Geoff has once again managed to produce a quality > >product so rare in today's *** industry (is ICR2 still in need of > >patches)? > >Still true multiplayer support (IPX, TCP/IP) with 26 players is somethng > >I want NOW! :) And I will most certainly not use it, if I'm expected to > >pay by the minute (will Hawaii EVER be available for Europeans, what about > >Finns). > > -TPP > Bugs??? They exists. A very anoying one doesn't allow me to save games when I > run F1GP2 with Windows95 in the background. The game just stops... Very > annoying when you just qualified you, which is very hard in GP2. > Bye

It really isnt fair to say that a DOS game, that's recommended to be run in DOS, has a bug in it when it when it won't save a game in the operating system that it was NOT designed to run in. It may qualify as an annoyance, but hardly a bug. JEB

Hmmmm. I think the wheelspin log shows you the wheel speeds for each wheel - not the amount your wheels are slipping on the track. I'm hazy on this, but if this is the case the wheels should give a similar graph to actual car speed. But the wheelspin log will vary slightly depending on loss of traction or leaving the ground. Someone's bound to correct me on this!

One or two (very) minor glitches in the graphics, but nothing that in any way detracts from this great game. A few other things that could have benefited from a closer look at ICR2 (e.g. wheel lock as part of set-up, parade laps). In fact my only real gripe is the implementation of the black flags. If a penalty is required, it really must be stop-go, an arbitrary enforced slow down for a few seconds has no place in such a realistic sim. Richard

Hello, some graphics bugs are there, too. For example, if you spin in the Adelaide bend at Magny-Cours and then your car stops right after the corner, facing 90 clockwise from normal driving direction, you can see cars in the wall there. It is quite similar to the famous car in the wall at Monaco in F1GP. Another, very annoying bug is that if you watch a replay and then one of the camera views with the Page-Up-key, after the replay the race goes on, but the view doesn't switch back to***pit position. If you chose the rear-wing view, you're quite lost then! Greetings, Tjark Kalow

In my GERMAN copy of GP2 after the installation it trashed my harddisk, when i tried to set up my soundcard. So i had to rebuild my HD, no scandisk or NDD (Norton Disk Doctor) helped. THIS is no JOKE !

> Haven't seen one bug complaint (whine) about the game yet. Would that > indicate that Sir Geoff has once again managed to produce a quality > product so rare in today's *** industry (is ICR2 still in need of > patches)? As I said in a posting this a.m. - I think there might be a problem with the dat log of the wheelspin in that it seems to give much the same data as the speed plot which can't be right? Al

Well, I respect your opinion but I disagree. I mean that, as you say, "an arbitrary enforced slow down for a few seconds has no place in such a realistic sim", but now you can't do a time by riding outside the track, you have to be "fair". Stef

> > >Haven't seen one bug complaint (whine) about the game yet. Would that > > >indicate that Sir Geoff has once again managed to produce a quality > > >product so rare in today's *** industry (is ICR2 still in need of > > >patches)? Well, I've found one incompatability - F1GP2 won't run on my AMD DX4-120 unless I drop the clock speed to 100MHz. It crashes and dumps as I exit the pit lane. I spent ages trying boot disks, +/- emm386, smartdrv, univbe, minram and nosound options, and only as a last resort tried dropping the cpu speed. The hardware is completely stable at 120; it runs unix for days at a time, and runs Janes Apache, ICR2 and EF2000 (for examples) without trouble. I guess it must be some wierd timing related problem, but it's difficult to imagine what. Other none-bugs, but annoying never the less: the damage model is at odds with the otherwise realistic nature of this sim - you can play dodgems in the first corner and almost never take damage. Hit a wall head-on at 30mph? No problem. It's great to see support for clutch, but seeing as there are so few (any?) 3 - pedal controllers around it's not quite enough. Support for using a button would have been good, as would an option to enable stalling the engine. Overall though, this is a great simulation that's going to be grabbing a lot of my time. Regards, James.

> One or two (very) minor glitches in the graphics, but nothing that in > any way detracts from this great game. A few other things that could > have benefited from a closer look at ICR2 (e.g. wheel lock as part of > set-up, parade laps). > Richard I don't if anyone else has seen this bug - I've seen it 3 times now in 3 days. Here's what happens... I cause this totally evil crash - usually involving cars falling in half wheels and wings everywhere, you know the kind. Or I do an almightly overtaking move. Well I'm pretty impressed by this so I decide to get a replay... the thing is that what my car does in the replay is NOT what it does doing in the race - it gets slightly out of sync and ends up with your car on the grass smacking the barrier and wiggling the front wheels as you take the corners that aren't there anymore... This wouldn't be too bad apart from the fact that when you exit the replay you go back to the game as if the stuff you saw in the replay was really what happened. This can result in going from 3rd or 4th at the first corner to the back of the grid - pretty grim. -- Ian Rae, DSP Firmware Engineer, | Tel No: +44 1793 565159 Motorola GPD, 16 Euro Way, | E-mail: Blagrove, Swindon, England, SN5 8YQ.| It's a lovely day for a Guinness!

> In my GERMAN copy of GP2 after the installation it trashed my harddisk, > when i tried to set up my soundcard. So i had to rebuild my HD, no > scandisk or NDD (Norton Disk Doctor) helped. THIS is no JOKE ! Is your HD SCSI? I've seen some installs tell you not to let the sound card setup program do an autodetect as data loss may result. If you're not SCSI, I don't know what to say... Neil -- Meek and obedient you follow the leader down well trodden corridors into the valley of steel.. Neil Yeatman, Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

>Well, I respect your opinion but I disagree. I mean that, as you say, "an arbitrary >enforced slow down for a few seconds has no place in such a realistic sim", but >now you can't do a time by riding outside the track, you have to be "fair". I agree with you for "hot laps" - the slow down will help to ensure that we all compete on an equal and "fair" footing (still not convinced about the slow down though...). But other measures should be used in a race - e.g. plank wear leading to disqualification, making the kerbs big enough to give little chance of getting away with it, etc. Major cutting of corners should receive a stop-go penalty as in real life. Maybe it should refuse to save a hot lap if corner cutting occurred, although this would no doubt lead to other problems... Richard

> Hmmmm. I think the wheelspin log shows you the wheel speeds for each > wheel - not the amount your wheels are slipping on the track. I'm hazy on > this, but if this is the case the wheels should give a similar graph to > actual car speed. But the wheelspin log will vary slightly depending on > loss of traction or leaving the ground. Someone's bound to correct me on > this! I think you're right about this: I tested it last night, screeching the tires up to 4th gear (COOL! ;-) and the graph showed greater speeds for rear tires on that point of the track. With no wheelspin the graph is very similar to the speed graph. -- Tirolintie 2 A 308 90530 OULU +358-81-5507134 This is a witty quote. Really.

No, that's right. The wheelspin log is actually a graph of the speed of EACH wheel. If you want to look for wheelspin, overlay your left REAR wheel against your left FRONT wheel. If the graph suddenly spikes upward or your rear wheel is running faster than your front one, then your rear wheels are spinning (since the back of your car can't be overtaking the front!). Cheers! John _________________________________ __ _____| |_____ __ ________| |__| :| John Wallace | |__| |________ \ :| |::| :| Team WW Racing TSW | |::| | / > :| |::| :|_________________________________| |::| | < / :|__|::|____/ * Sim Racing News * \____|::|__| \ /______:/ \::/ http://sneezy.dcn.ed.ac.uk/simnews/index.htm \::/ \._____\ http://www.math.ohio-state.edu/~harmon/simnews

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>> Hmmmm. I think the wheelspin log shows you the wheel speeds for each >> wheel - not the amount your wheels are slipping on the track. I'm hazy on >> this, but if this is the case the wheels should give a similar graph to >> actual car speed. But the wheelspin log will vary slightly depending on >> loss of traction or leaving the ground. Someone's bound to correct me on >> this! >I think you're right about this: I tested it last night, screeching >the tires up to 4th gear (COOL! ;-) and the graph showed greater >speeds for rear tires on that point of the track. With no wheelspin >the graph is very similar to the speed graph. >-- >Tirolintie 2 A 308 >90530 OULU >+358-81-5507134 This is a witty quote. Really.

Thanks for backing me up!!!!! :))

writes There are some glitches which really should have been tidied up though. Offhand I can't recall them all, but the 3D depth plotting goes astray at times; and car damage seems too insensitive. Other touches would have helped too: a master volume as well as six individual ones would be useful for nighttime playing. And why does the game forget your Friday qualifying time? I thought in 94 the best of the 2 sessions was taken. Abandon Saturday qualifying and you're put at the back of the grid, regardless of Friday's time. On the whole, a great game, but someone here said not 4 years advancement on GP1, which is true. But then I suppose GP1 *was* years ahead of its time anyway! And I suppose we will still be playing it in 4 years time - in SVGA, full detail, at 25fps... on our P7 330Mhz machines. So let's hope it stays hard long enough. -- MarkN Birmingham.

: Well, I've found one incompatability - F1GP2 won't run on my AMD : DX4-120 unless I drop the clock speed to 100MHz. It crashes and : dumps as I exit the pit lane. I spent ages trying boot disks, +/- : emm386, smartdrv, univbe, minram and nosound options, and only as : a last resort tried dropping the cpu speed. It runs ok on my AMD DX4-120 but it noticeably slower under Win95 than under Dos. I get a lot of crashes with Duke Nukem 3D though. -- -------------------- __ _ John Punshon | / l \~-_ Bright | ,----~~~~--+-----`--~----____ Yellow | ~~\___/~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\___/~ --------------> http://www.cs.usask.ca/grads/punshon/ <---------------

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> Well, I've found one incompatability - F1GP2 won't run on my AMD > DX4-120 unless I drop the clock speed to 100MHz. It crashes and > dumps as I exit the pit lane. I spent ages trying boot disks, +/- > emm386, smartdrv, univbe, minram and nosound options, and only as > a last resort tried dropping the cpu speed. > The hardware is completely stable at 120; it runs unix for days at > a time, and runs Janes Apache, ICR2 and EF2000 (for examples) without > trouble. I guess it must be some wierd timing related problem, but > it's difficult to imagine what. > Regards, > James.

Hi James, I am running GP2 fine on my system, using an AMD 5x86-133, but which will not run in my motherboard, so I use it as an AMD DX4-120. I know this isn't quite the same.. it would seem maybe to be connected with it starting the data logger? Maybe a call to Microprose Support (?), though not on their 0891 'service'. Cheers, Ant -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% | /__ Anthony Holloway, Astronomy Group, Univ. of Manchester, UK. \ \|/ Phone : +44-161-275-4226 Fax : +44-161-275-4223 \--?--\ / | WWW : http://axp2.ast.man.ac.uk:8000/~ajh/ %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

My car (Damon Hill) was sandwished between 2 Ferraris and launched in the air. Then the system decided it had enough of this and duely crashed. For me, the reset button did the job. Gil.

I have not played the game yet, it is coming in the mail, but if the wheelspin plot is related to the speed plot, that is not unrealistic. Because of the way tires grip, they are constantly sliding. Most people think of friction either as static or dynamic (sticking or slipping) but with tires there is not a clearcut line as to where they start slipping. So any time any force is put on a tire it slips, therefore when accelerating or when at high speed, there is a lot of longitudinal force on a tire and therefore the wheel is actually slipping all the time (an odometer will actually read more miles travelled at high speed than at low speed, but the difference is almost negligible) and the opposite is true under braking where the wheel spins less than the distance the car travels. that propbaly is not to clear but oh well. John

The problem is that you MUST go trough friday qualifiying to reach saturdays qualifying. And this is boring Peter

On Thu, 25 Jul 1996 14:50:27 +0200, Peter Herzhoff >The problem is that you MUST go trough friday qualifiying to reach >saturdays qualifying. And this is boring Just put it onto accelerated time. It only takes about 45 seconds to get through a full 60 minute session! Richard

I agree, no real damaging bugs as in ICR2 -- All of the glitches described (aside from compatability problems) seem tolerable. One very minor one that I have come across is in the starting grid printout ... the display shows the actual car numbers of the qualifiers but the printout places the grid position where the car number appeared on the display. eric

It does not forget your time you just have to accelerate time instead of abbandon qualification.

>> And why does the game forget your Friday qualifying time? I thought in >> 94 the best of the 2 sessions was taken. Abandon Saturday qualifying >> and you're put at the back of the grid, regardless of Friday's time. >But if you drive on Saturday as well, does it then remember Friday's >time? Assuming that it's better? Hope so - that would be an enormous >bug. Yesterday I drove a non-championship race at Hockenheim just for fun. So I did one timed lap on Friday qualifying and on Saturday qualifying I just went to accelerated time. In the final qualifying standings I was 13th with my Friday time and some AI cars were also qualified with their Friday time. So, no problem here. I didnt try abandoning Saturday qualifying though... -- <-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-> < Tero Turtiainen | Yes Sir, may I*** your boots or do your Highness > <-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=->

Dont know if you would consider this a bug but when auto braking is selected the car will lock the brakes if you go off the line just a little bit. Makes overtaking in the corners just a little hard, ok alot hard. Pierre

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> > And why does the game forget your Friday qualifying time? I thought in > > 94 the best of the 2 sessions was taken. Abandon Saturday qualifying > > and you're put at the back of the grid, regardless of Friday's time. > But if you drive on Saturday as well, does it then remember Friday's > time? Assuming that it's better? Hope so - that would be an enormous > bug.

Yes it does - its shows you each driver's time at the end of both sessions with the best on highlighted. SAince there is not variable weather (not even variiable temperature as far as I can tell), is is pretty much random in which session each driver sets his fastest time. Julian _____________________________________________________________________ University of Oxford

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>>Dont know if you would consider this a bug but when auto braking is >>selected the car will lock the brakes if you go off the line just a >>little bit. Makes overtaking in the corners just a little hard, ok >>alot hard. >>Pierre >solution: don't use auto braking...

Well thats a clever solution...gee its so obvious. But what about this solution have the sim autobrake correctly. ICR2 can why cant GP2. And Im not saying that ICR is better or worse just that it does that much better. And since GP2 insists on locking the brake when you use the z key autobraking should work better for those who dont have an analog method of braking and dont feel its very realistic to lock the brakes in an F1 car. Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand

>And I suppose we will still be playing it in 4 years time - in SVGA, >full detail, at 25fps... on our P7 330Mhz machines. >So let's hope it stays hard long enough. I hope Intel won't stay that long!!! If the P series is still around by the end of this decade, this planet is damned!!!!!! Dave.

>Dont know if you would consider this a bug but when auto braking is >selected the car will lock the brakes if you go off the line just a >little bit. Makes overtaking in the corners just a little hard, ok >alot hard. >Pierre solution: don't use auto braking...

I run GP2 on a DX4/120 without any problems, though it is really only drvieable in VGA. Even then, I need to have it on Detail Level 1, and most of the texturing etc witched off. I end with *scenery* graphics much like GP1, but of course the car graphics are quite a bit better (and the gameplay is so much better too). I've also run it on a P90, and get virtually identical situation - but in SVGA. On the 5x86/133 front, a friend of mine runs one of these at /160, and gets pretty much P90 performance. This makes it a very economical upgrade in terms of $/bhp! (providing your 486 m/b can copy with /160). -- Andrew Jackson (Bracknell, Berkshire, England). Laissez le bon temps roulez!

I found one! In the out-of-car views, the shadows of the wheels always remain on the same side during an entire lap. Now, either all circuits in Crammondland are based on the north- or southpole and rotation of the earth is app. 1200 times as fast as in reality, or they simply forgot about this! :-) =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= The most civilized civilizations are as close to barba- rism as polished iron is to rust. Rivarol =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

>>Dont know if you would consider this a bug but when auto braking is >>selected the car will lock the brakes if you go off the line just a >>little bit. Makes overtaking in the corners just a little hard, ok >>alot hard. Some tracks on ICR 1.0 dur similars things, although the brakes do not lock, but they do come on too early and stay on too long on some corners. bryon -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man's conscience? -Apostle Paul (I Cor 10:29) Bryon Lape - currently living somewhere close to 35 57 38 N, 83 55 15 W

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>> > And why does the game forget your Friday qualifying time? I thought in >> > 94 the best of the 2 sessions was taken. Abandon Saturday qualifying >> > and you're put at the back of the grid, regardless of Friday's time. >> But if you drive on Saturday as well, does it then remember Friday's >> time? Assuming that it's better? Hope so - that would be an enormous >> bug. >The problem is that you MUST go trough friday qualifiying to reach >saturdays qualifying. And this is boring >Peter

Hi All, Boring it maybe... but accurate!. If an F1 Team does not appear for a qualifying session, they can face a hefty fine from the FIA (and this may include starting from the rear of the grid!). This is to ensure that the general public who are paying addmission are able to see cars and drivers go around the track on the respective days, regardless of the weather!!. A good example is the faulty corsets team...sorry Forty Coarse Hairs.... Dam who was it?!<g>. Oh I remember Forti Corsa... apparently they are facing a fine of around $20,000 per car for their non appearence at the German GP. As they are already strapped for cash... it may be the last we see of them now! (I am saying nothing!!<gg>). Regards, Ian.