Flashpoint Racing Series begins tonight!

Flashpoint Racing Series is accepting registration for the 2005 Season 1 starting the week of February 14th - February 20th. Also, Flashpoint members who are Premium OLR members also qualify to compete in the Driver Shootouts each month for plaques and cash. Below is a breakdown of our leagues and events. For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch at that time. OSCAR Series: Is an open setup league that features over 10 divisions in 4 skill groups (Outlaw, Sportsman, CGN, and Freedom Cup) All drivers in OSCAR trying to achieve the ultimate goal of making it into Freedom Cup. $1,000 in cash is up for grabs in OSCAR Freedom Cup. Top 15 drivers win cash and top 5 receive trophies. FASCAR Series: Is an all fast-fixed setup league that features over 14 divisions in 4 skill groups (Novice, Stock, Semi Pro, and Pro Cup) All drivers in FASCAR trying to achieve the ultimate goal of making it into Pro Cup. $1,000 in cash is up for grabs in FASCAR Pro Cup. Top 15 drivers win cash and top 5 receive trophies. Newly created Hardcore Series: Is on open setup league that runs in cockpit view and aids disabled with 3 divisions (Stock, Semi Pro & Pro) Saturday nights at 8pm ET, starting with 30 min practice followed by race at 8:30pm ET. top drivers move up and bottom drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. Pro Series: Is an open setup league that runs 2 divisions (Semi Pro, & Pro) Sunday mornings at 10am EST. All drivers start in Semi Pro and at the end of each season, top drivers move up and bottom drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. Pro Fixed Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs 2 divisions (Semi Pro, & Pro) Saturday mornings at 10am EST. All drivers start in Stock and at the end of each season, top drivers move up and bottom drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. Truck Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs 3 divisions (Stock, Semi Pro, & Pro) in CTS mod Tuesday nights at 9:15pm EST. All drivers start in Stock and at the end of each season, top drivers move up and bottom drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. Short Track Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs one division in GN mod Friday nights at 9:00pm EST. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. We also run Flashpoint Monthly Shootouts every month. Drivers who are premium olr members and are in the top 30 based on qualifying compete in the Final Shootout for cash and prizes. On Feb 19th, EA is giving away 5 copies of NASCAR Sim Racing to the top 5 drivers. Google is paying cash to the top 3 drivers and FRSHosting.com is giving away plaques to the top 5. Flashpoint Racing Series http://www.onlineracin.com/flashpoint/ We also run the Super Speedway Series for cash and prizes and plan to start TRAC. Joe Lomas President Onlineracin.com,Inc. http://onlineracin.com We Provide Web Hosting Solutions http://frshosting.com

Great. Start on Valentine's day. Thanks a lot for that.

"For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch at that time." It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So what is the big issue so far? <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Flashpoint Racing Series is accepting registration for the 2005 Season > 1 starting the week of February 14th - February 20th. Also, Flashpoint > members who are Premium OLR members also qualify to compete in the > Driver Shootouts each month for plaques and cash. Below is a breakdown > of our leagues and events. > > For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, > if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch > at that time. > > OSCAR Series: Is an open setup league that features over 10 divisions > in 4 skill groups (Outlaw, Sportsman, CGN, and Freedom Cup) All drivers > in OSCAR trying to achieve the ultimate goal of making it into Freedom > Cup. $1,000 in cash is up for grabs in OSCAR Freedom Cup. Top 15 > drivers win cash and top 5 receive trophies. > > FASCAR Series: Is an all fast-fixed setup league that features over 14 > divisions in 4 skill groups (Novice, Stock, Semi Pro, and Pro Cup) All > drivers in FASCAR trying to achieve the ultimate goal of making it into > Pro Cup. $1,000 in cash is up for grabs in FASCAR Pro Cup. Top 15 > drivers win cash and top 5 receive trophies. > > Newly created Hardcore Series: Is on open setup league that runs in > cockpit view and aids disabled with 3 divisions (Stock, Semi Pro & Pro) > Saturday nights at 8pm ET, starting with 30 min practice followed by > race at 8:30pm ET. top drivers move up and bottom drivers move down. > Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. > > Pro Series: Is an open setup league that runs 2 divisions (Semi Pro, & > Pro) Sunday mornings at 10am EST. All drivers start in Semi Pro and at > the end of each season, top drivers move up and bottom drivers move > down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. > > Pro Fixed Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs 2 divisions > (Semi Pro, & Pro) Saturday mornings at 10am EST. All drivers start in > Stock and at the end of each season, top drivers move up and bottom > drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win plaques. > > Truck Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs 3 divisions > (Stock, Semi Pro, & Pro) in CTS mod Tuesday nights at 9:15pm EST. All > drivers start in Stock and at the end of each season, top drivers move > up and bottom drivers move down. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division win > plaques. > > Short Track Series: Is a fast-fixed setup league that runs one division > in GN mod Friday nights at 9:00pm EST. Top 5 drivers in Pro Division > win plaques. > > We also run Flashpoint Monthly Shootouts every month. Drivers who are > premium olr members and are in the top 30 based on qualifying compete > in the Final Shootout for cash and prizes. On Feb 19th, EA is giving > away 5 copies of NASCAR Sim Racing to the top 5 drivers. Google is > paying cash to the top 3 drivers and FRSHosting.com is giving away > plaques to the top 5. > > Flashpoint Racing Series > http://www.onlineracin.com/flashpoint/ > > We also run the Super Speedway Series for cash and prizes and plan to > start TRAC. > > > Joe Lomas > President > Onlineracin.com,Inc. > http://onlineracin.com > We Provide Web Hosting Solutions > http://frshosting.com >

Schooner wrote:

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> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, > if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch > at that time." > > It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So > what is the big issue so far? > > <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]...

"Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) Mitch -- Remove "nospam." to reply. SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a

Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]...

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> Schooner wrote: > >> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, >> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch >> at that time." >> >> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So >> what is the big issue so far? >> >> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:[email hidden]... > > > "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) > > Mitch > -- > Remove "nospam." to reply. > SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a

I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) Bill Bollinger www.gsxn.com "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89...

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> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to be too > buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May as well > say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) > > "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >> Schooner wrote: >> >>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season 2, >>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch >>> at that time." >>> >>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So >>> what is the big issue so far? >>> >>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>> news:[email hidden]... >> >> >> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >> >> Mitch >> -- >> Remove "nospam." to reply. >> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a > >

I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues are slowly drying up as is. I'm just curious about hat the OP said. "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]...

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>I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A session on >www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) > > NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) > > Bill Bollinger > www.gsxn.com > > > "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to be too >> buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May as well >> say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >> >> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>> Schooner wrote: >>> >>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season >>>> 2, >>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch >>>> at that time." >>>> >>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So >>>> what is the big issue so far? >>>> >>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:[email hidden]... >>> >>> >>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>> >>> Mitch >>> -- >>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >> >> > >

Bill - Any comments on what was said at the Teamspeak session? "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]...

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>I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A session on >www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) > > NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) > > Bill Bollinger > www.gsxn.com > > > "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to be too >> buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May as well >> say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >> >> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>> Schooner wrote: >>> >>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For season >>>> 2, >>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to switch >>>> at that time." >>>> >>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix it. So >>>> what is the big issue so far? >>>> >>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:[email hidden]... >>> >>> >>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>> >>> Mitch >>> -- >>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >> >> > >

Schooner, Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with a lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and others. plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands to used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) only a voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and some other things... Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case that EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff eventually right? BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be very 'Borg' like at EA. Schooner enlightened us with:

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> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues > are slowly drying up as is. > I'm just curious about hat the OP said. > > "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >> >> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >> >> Bill Bollinger >> www.gsxn.com >> >> >> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May >>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >>> >>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>>> Schooner wrote: >>>> >>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >>>>> season 2, >>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >>>>> switch at that time." >>>>> >>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >>>>> >>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>> >>>> >>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>>> >>>> Mitch >>>> -- >>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a

Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that it is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a buggy game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer features IMHO. "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08...

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> Schooner, > > Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light > onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with a > lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the f2-space > (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and others. plus ways > to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands to used by > admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) only a voting > system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of resuslts > files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and some other > things... > > Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a > "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to > convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. > > Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is > money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case that > EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff eventually > right? > > BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game > publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be very > 'Borg' like at EA. > > > > Schooner enlightened us with: >> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues >> are slowly drying up as is. >> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. >> >> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >>> >>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >>> >>> Bill Bollinger >>> www.gsxn.com >>> >>> >>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May >>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >>>> >>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>>>> Schooner wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >>>>>> season 2, >>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >>>>>> switch at that time." >>>>>> >>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >>>>>> >>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>>>> >>>>> Mitch >>>>> -- >>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a > >

Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin commands installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. Bill Bollinger www.gsxn.com "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89...

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> Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that it > is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a buggy > game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a > title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer features > IMHO. > > "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... >> Schooner, >> >> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light >> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with a >> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the >> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and others. >> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands to >> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) only a >> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of >> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and some >> other things... >> >> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a >> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to >> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. >> >> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is >> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case that >> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff eventually >> right? >> >> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game >> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be very >> 'Borg' like at EA. >> >> >> >> Schooner enlightened us with: >>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues >>> are slowly drying up as is. >>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. >>> >>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >>>> >>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >>>> >>>> Bill Bollinger >>>> www.gsxn.com >>>> >>>> >>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May >>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >>>>> >>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>>>>> Schooner wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >>>>>>> season 2, >>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >>>>>>> switch at that time." >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>>>>> >>>>>> Mitch >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >> >> > >

Hehe, yep, always amazing how the rose colored glasses work. Or how about the kudos that went to Papy for releasing a patch for 03, to fix the flaw that allowed unrealistic setups ? A basic flaw that you'd think after the umptienth Nx release wouldn't be in the game anyway. Or remember when ICR2 was released in such a mess, and the clamor about a patch for that ? Hehe, same old story; someone else does situation x, oh, the horror. Papy does the exact same thing.......cool, man, what great guys. LOL "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:qXwQd.5994$[email hidden]...

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> Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was > released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of > potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin commands > installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online > problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > > Bill Bollinger > www.gsxn.com > > > "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... > > Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that

it > > is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a buggy > > game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a > > title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmerfeatures

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> > IMHO. > > > > "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... > >> Schooner, > >> > >> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light > >> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with

a > >> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the > >> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car andothers. > >> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commandsto > >> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) onlya

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> >> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of > >> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and some > >> other things... > >> > >> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a > >> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to > >> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. > >> > >> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is > >> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case

that > >> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuffeventually > >> right? > >> > >> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game > >> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are bevery

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> >> 'Borg' like at EA. > >> > >> > >> > >> Schooner enlightened us with: > >>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues > >>> are slowly drying up as is. > >>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. > >>> > >>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... > >>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A > >>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) > >>>> > >>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) > >>>> > >>>> Bill Bollinger > >>>> www.gsxn.com > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... > >>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to > >>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch.

May

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> >>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) > >>>>> > >>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... > >>>>>> Schooner wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For > >>>>>>> season 2, > >>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to > >>>>>>> switch at that time." > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix > >>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Mitch > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. > >>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a > >> > >> > > > > > >

My concern is that it seems most feel wit ha patch and fixing this and that it will be a good as NR2003. Out of the box it seems most are not blown away by any stretch and it has a number of issues dealing with online setup/admin and so on. Comparing this to N3 means little, people are looking for and expecting something better than the current NR2003. EA has the money and resources to do it right, this should not be a half assed "first try". I hope it works out and it brings the life back to sim racing but the few words on it so far make it seem ok but nothing special. I guess only time and hands on testing will tell the true tale. "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:qXwQd.5994$[email hidden]...

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> Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was > released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of > potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin commands > installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online > problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > > Bill Bollinger > www.gsxn.com > > > "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... >> Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that it >> is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a buggy >> game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a >> title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer features >> IMHO. >> >> "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... >>> Schooner, >>> >>> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light >>> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with >>> a lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the >>> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and others. >>> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands >>> to used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) >>> only a voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting >>> of resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and >>> some other things... >>> >>> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a >>> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to >>> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. >>> >>> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is >>> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case that >>> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff eventually >>> right? >>> >>> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game >>> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be very >>> 'Borg' like at EA. >>> >>> >>> >>> Schooner enlightened us with: >>>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues >>>> are slowly drying up as is. >>>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. >>>> >>>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >>>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >>>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >>>>> >>>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >>>>> >>>>> Bill Bollinger >>>>> www.gsxn.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >>>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >>>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. >>>>>> May as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >>>>>> >>>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>>>>>> Schooner wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >>>>>>>> season 2, >>>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >>>>>>>> switch at that time." >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >>>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mitch >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >>> >>> >> >> > >

I think the issue is people are expecting a lot from it. EA claimed it was built for simmers and it is missing key online simming features. It is 2-3 years newer than NR2003 and most seem to say it might be on par at best. EA has burned people too many times and they have a lot of pressure on them with the release of a "sim" title. "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ZrxQd.21$[email hidden]...

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> Hehe, yep, always amazing how the rose colored glasses work. > > Or how about the kudos that went to Papy for releasing a patch for 03, > to > fix the flaw that allowed unrealistic setups ? A basic flaw that you'd > think after the umptienth Nx release wouldn't be in the game anyway. > Or remember when ICR2 was released in such a mess, and the clamor about a > patch for that ? > > Hehe, same old story; someone else does situation x, oh, the horror. > Papy > does the exact same thing.......cool, man, what great guys. > > LOL > > > "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:qXwQd.5994$[email hidden]... >> Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was >> released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of >> potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin >> commands >> installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online >> problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. >> >> Bill Bollinger >> www.gsxn.com >> >> >> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... >> > Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that > it >> > is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a >> > buggy >> > game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a >> > title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer > features >> > IMHO. >> > >> > "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> > news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... >> >> Schooner, >> >> >> >> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some >> >> light >> >> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold >> >> with > a >> >> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the >> >> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and > others. >> >> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands > to >> >> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) only > a >> >> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of >> >> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and >> >> some >> >> other things... >> >> >> >> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite >> >> a >> >> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to >> >> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. >> >> >> >> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it >> >> is >> >> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case > that >> >> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff > eventually >> >> right? >> >> >> >> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game >> >> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be > very >> >> 'Borg' like at EA. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Schooner enlightened us with: >> >>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues >> >>> are slowly drying up as is. >> >>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. >> >>> >> >>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> >>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >> >>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >> >>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >> >>>> >> >>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >> >>>> >> >>>> Bill Bollinger >> >>>> www.gsxn.com >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> >>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >> >>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >> >>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. > May >> >>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >> >>>>> >> >>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> >>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >> >>>>>> Schooner wrote: >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >> >>>>>>> season 2, >> >>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >> >>>>>>> switch at that time." >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >> >>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> >>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading >> >>>>>> ;) >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Mitch >> >>>>>> -- >> >>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >> >>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> >> > >

Gil, Sorry if your division runs on a Monday. When dealing with 7 FP leagues (35 divisions) running Monday thru Sunday, it's hard to keep away from some holidays over the course of 16 week seasons. We try to have enough off weeks, so admins can get with drivers on postponing some races for the offweeks. Of course, major holidays in which many people are off from work, we have those as off weeks. It's a catch22. I know most of the divisions we will on offweeks for those races. For the rest of the 30 divisions that run Tuesday thru Sunday still run their race. On NSR. I don't see many leagues jumping right over to the new game. Especially the fixed setup leagues, or leagues that need to have admins with the ability to boot drivers or issue black flags. I think it will be great for pickup racing, but not sure if it's ready for switch. I can assure you from my conversations with EA, they are working with us very hard to get as much accomplished as possible to resolve those issues for the patch. For Flashpoint, there is no way we can do this; because more than 50% of our leagues run fast-fixed setups. Also, the screen names for NSR requires you register with EA; which means many drivers will most likely be unable to use the same screen name they have used in their league. With any league, this will require those admins to get their rosters updated. Overall, I think EA is heading in the right direction and with our input, it can only get better.

Hey Bill, What were those online problems? Are you talking about the cup physics weight distribution? Even their Trans Am physics had a weird front right tire temp thing that was out of whack too? Niles On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 01:01:10 GMT, "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was >released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of >potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin commands >installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online >problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > >Bill Bollinger >www.gsxn.com > > >"Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... >> Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that it >> is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a buggy >> game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a >> title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer features >> IMHO. >> >> "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... >>> Schooner, >>> >>> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some light >>> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold with a >>> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the >>> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and others. >>> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commands to >>> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) only a >>> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of >>> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and some >>> other things... >>> >>> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quite a >>> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to >>> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. >>> >>> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it is >>> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case that >>> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff eventually >>> right? >>> >>> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game >>> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be very >>> 'Borg' like at EA. >>> >>> >>> >>> Schooner enlightened us with: >>>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues >>>> are slowly drying up as is. >>>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. >>>> >>>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... >>>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A >>>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) >>>>> >>>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) >>>>> >>>>> Bill Bollinger >>>>> www.gsxn.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... >>>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to >>>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch. May >>>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) >>>>>> >>>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... >>>>>>> Schooner wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For >>>>>>>> season 2, >>>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to >>>>>>>> switch at that time." >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix >>>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading ;) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mitch >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. >>>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a >>> >>> >> >> >

BILL, N3 doesnt really count in this discussion after all, including this stuff was a new concept in itself back then, nowdays it is a pre-requisite, dont you think? Bill Bollinger enlightened us with: > Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it > was released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a > LOT of potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed > (Admin commands installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They > have fixed the online problems N2003 have suffered from since N4.sniped for brevity

<shrug> Papy made statements/promises too, that they didn't deliver on, weren't correct, etc. I.e., "Nascar Racing 3 will be based on the gpl engine" etc. "We can't put a save game feature in" (n1 and 2). "We're unable to make the pit roads straight due to coding limitations" (EA did so in 1998). Also get a kick out of those slamming the car graphics in NSR. Until n4, none of the car graphics in the Nx releases even resembled a stock car. But anyway, I hear ya, know what you mean. "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:FFFQd.57338$gA4.48405@edtnps89... > I think the issue is people are expecting a lot from it. EA claimed itwas > built for simmers and it is missing key online simming features. It is2-3 > years newer than NR2003 and most seem to say it might be on par at best. > EA has burned people too many times and they have a lot of pressure onthem

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> with the release of a "sim" title. > > "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ZrxQd.21$[email hidden]... > > Hehe, yep, always amazing how the rose colored glasses work. > > > > Or how about the kudos that went to Papy for releasing a patch for 03, > > to > > fix the flaw that allowed unrealistic setups ? A basic flaw that you'd > > think after the umptienth Nx release wouldn't be in the game anyway. > > Or remember when ICR2 was released in such a mess, and the clamor about

a

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> > patch for that ? > > > > Hehe, same old story; someone else does situation x, oh, the horror. > > Papy > > does the exact same thing.......cool, man, what great guys. > > > > LOL > > > > > > "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:qXwQd.5994$[email hidden]... > >> Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it

was > >> released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of > >> potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin > >> commands > >> installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed theonline

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> >> problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > >> > >> Bill Bollinger > >> www.gsxn.com > >> > >> > >> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... > >> > Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager

that > > it > >> > is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to a > >> > buggy > >> > game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. Fora

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> >> > title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmer > > features > >> > IMHO. > >> > > >> > "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> > news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... > >> >> Schooner, > >> >> > >> >> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some > >> >> light > >> >> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go gold > >> >> with > > a > >> >> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the > >> >> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car and > > others. > >> >> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated

commands > > to > >> >> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read)only

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> > a > >> >> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of > >> >> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, and > >> >> some > >> >> other things... > >> >> > >> >> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly

quite > >> >> a > >> >> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to > >> >> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised apatch.

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> >> >> > >> >> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once it > >> >> is > >> >> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this case > > that > >> >> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuff > > eventually > >> >> right? > >> >> > >> >> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game > >> >> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are be > > very > >> >> 'Borg' like at EA. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Schooner enlightened us with: > >> >>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing.

Leagues

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> >> >>> are slowly drying up as is. > >> >>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. > >> >>> > >> >>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> >>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... > >> >>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A > >> >>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) > >> >>>> > >> >>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) > >> >>>> > >> >>>> Bill Bollinger > >> >>>> www.gsxn.com > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> >>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... > >> >>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release

to > >> >>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on thepatch.

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> > May > >> >>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> >>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... > >> >>>>>> Schooner wrote: > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For > >> >>>>>>> season 2, > >> >>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan

to

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> >> >>>>>>> switch at that time." > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix > >> >>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> >>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading > >> >>>>>> ;) > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Mitch > >> >>>>>> -- > >> >>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. > >> >>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a > >> >> > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > >

You don't get the Papy rocket launch upon car contact for one. "Niles Anders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Hey Bill, What were those online problems? Are you talking about the > cup physics weight distribution? Even their Trans Am physics had a > weird front right tire temp thing that was out of whack too? > > Niles > > > On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 01:01:10 GMT, "Bill Bollinger" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was > >released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a LOT of > >potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed (Admin

commands

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> >installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They have fixed the online > >problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > > > >Bill Bollinger > >www.gsxn.com > > > > > >"Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >news:64qQd.48642$gA4.44149@edtnps89... > >> Thanks. Well if it is missing that much out of the box I'd wager that

it > >> is dead already to most of the sim world. Waiting on a patch to abuggy > >> game that isn't even on the shelf isn't going to impress anyone. For a > >> title they focused at a simmers they are missing a lot of simmerfeatures

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> >> IMHO. > >> > >> "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >> news:LFnQd.62543$2p.25947@lakeread08... > >>> Schooner, > >>> > >>> Joe's website forums (www.ollineracin.com/forums) might shed some

light > >>> onto what your asking. TO ME, In a nutshell EA decided to go goldwith a > >>> lot of missing parts for "online" usability, for one example, the > >>> f2-space (that is in NRxx) to see intervals between your car andothers. > >>> plus ways to control dedicated servers remotely (no dedicated commandsto > >>> used by admins like we can papy dedicated servers as last I read) onlya > >>> voting system I guess? plus other things like outputing/exporting of > >>> resuslts files, you know so post editing can detected I think, andsome > >>> other things... > >>> > >>> Sorry I can't recall all the specific ones, there was seemingly quitea > >>> "list" from several different discussions... But EA has seemed to > >>> convince many that they will get this stuff fixed in promised a patch. > >>> > >>> Me? Well I dont know, it is kinda like selling anything... once itis > >>> money in your pocket, would you care? I can only hope in this casethat > >>> EA will, I mean they are going to want to sell me games stuffeventually > >>> right? > >>> > >>> BUT if things keep going, & they end up being the only game > >>> publisher/developer in town anymore, which some reports they are bevery

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> >>> 'Borg' like at EA. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Schooner enlightened us with: > >>>> I hope it is, we need something to revive NASCAR sim racing. Leagues > >>>> are slowly drying up as is. > >>>> I'm just curious about hat the OP said. > >>>> > >>>> "Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>> news:mpcQd.7544$[email hidden]... > >>>>> I wouldn't be saying that. Mr. Hawkins just had a FANTASTIC Q&A > >>>>> session on www.crazygameworld.com (Teamspeak) > >>>>> > >>>>> NSR looks to be a kick ass release :) > >>>>> > >>>>> Bill Bollinger > >>>>> www.gsxn.com > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> "Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>>> news:MXaQd.47523$gA4.26663@edtnps89... > >>>>>> Yes I agree. First stating that you expect the initial release to > >>>>>> be too buggy to use and they stating you are waiting on the patch.

May

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> >>>>>> as well say you have no plans to buy or use it ever ;-) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> "Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>>>> news:NCaQd.77$[email hidden]... > >>>>>>> Schooner wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> "For season 1, we plan to run NASCAR Racing 2003 Season. For > >>>>>>>> season 2, > >>>>>>>> if EA comes out with the patch for NASCAR Sim Racing, we plan to > >>>>>>>> switch at that time." > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> It hasn't been released yet and your waiting on a patch to fix > >>>>>>>> it. So what is the big issue so far? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >>>>>>>> news:[email hidden]... > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> "Planning" on a patch from EA is a slippery slope to be treading

;)

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> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Mitch > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> Remove "nospam." to reply. > >>>>>>> SuSE 9.2 Pro KDE 3.3.2a > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > > >

"JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:KiKQd.1$[email hidden]... > <shrug> Papy made statements/promises too, that they didn't deliver on, > weren't correct, etc. I.e., "Nascar Racing 3 will be based on the gpl > engine" etc. "We can't put a save game feature in" (n1 and 2). "We're > unable to make the pit roads straight due to coding limitations" (EA didso > in 1998). JP, you seem to do a lot of shrugging. A tick perhaps? ;-) > Also get a kick out of those slamming the car graphics in NSR. Untiln4, > none of the car graphics in the Nx releases even resembled a stock car. Uh, it's 2005 now. Papy sorted that out years ago. GP2 didn't look so hot either, come to think of it. Before being labeled a fanboy, let it be known that I'm all in favor of something that'll eclipse NR2003, whoever it comes from. And while NSR is a genuine step up from it's predecessors, I just don't see it clearing that hurdle. Losing the jittering online opponents and warp-driven online melees would be a true improvement if NSR can manage it and still get a full field, but there are so many other steps backward relative to NR2003 that only people focused on that one issue will be convinced of it's superiority. As for the known limitations of NR2003, remember it is two years old and hasn't had benefit of that time for additional refinement. If you plot the forward progress Papy made with the game while Sierra had the Nascar License and project where it would likely be for a NR2005, Papy-style, NSR isn't even in the same league. But EA do have the NASCAR license now, so I certainly wish the Tiburon guys luck in their efforts; I just wonder about the true level of commitment from EA to the narrow slice of the market we hardcore sim-heads represent. SB

"Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:KiKQd.1$[email hidden]... > > <shrug> Papy made statements/promises too, that they didn't deliver on, > > weren't correct, etc. I.e., "Nascar Racing 3 will be based on the gpl > > engine" etc. "We can't put a save game feature in" (n1 and 2). "We're > > unable to make the pit roads straight due to coding limitations" (EAdid > so > > in 1998). > > JP, you seem to do a lot of shrugging. A tick perhaps? ;-) No, why ? > > > Also get a kick out of those slamming the car graphics in NSR. Until > n4, > > none of the car graphics in the Nx releases even resembled a stock car. > > Uh, it's 2005 now. Papy sorted that out years ago. GP2 didn't look sohot > either, come to think of it. So, Papy gets a chance (that took, what seven years in terms of car graphics ?) to "sort it out", but EA doesn't ? Besides the fact that the criticisms of the EA cars are for very nit picking items imo, whereas the Papy stuff was huge, basic flaws. Regarding gp2, it looked fantastic for the period of it's release, not sure of the point there. > > Before being labeled a fanboy, let it be known that I'm all in favor of > something that'll eclipse NR2003, whoever it comes from. And while NSR isa > genuine step up from it's predecessors, I just don't see it clearing that > hurdle. Losing the jittering online opponents and warp-driven onlinemelees > would be a true improvement if NSR can manage it and still get a fullfield, > but there are so many other steps backward relative to NR2003 that only > people focused on that one issue will be convinced of it's superiority. To early to say imo, either way. > > As for the known limitations of NR2003, remember it is two years old and > hasn't had benefit of that time for additional refinement. If you plotthe > forward progress Papy made with the game while Sierra had the NascarLicense > and project where it would likely be for a NR2005, Papy-style, NSR isn't > even in the same league. 03 is just another rendition of N4. Surely, you can't deny that. > > But EA do have the NASCAR license now, so I certainly wish the Tiburonguys > luck in their efforts; I just wonder about the true level of commitmentfrom > EA to the narrow slice of the market we hardcore sim-heads represent. > > SB Agreed.

"Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7NJQd.42182$EG1.31117@lakeread04...

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> BILL, > > N3 doesnt really count in this discussion after all, including this stuff > was a new concept in itself back then, nowdays it is a pre-requisite, dont > you think? > > > Bill Bollinger enlightened us with: > > Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it > > was released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a > > LOT of potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed > > (Admin commands installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They > > have fixed the online problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. > sniped for brevity >

N3 and Flashpoint Racing Series. Hrmm. I remember. All N3 leagues dropped in the middle of a season with no explanation from Flashpoint. Sorry, I've avoided Flashpoint like the plague ever since. GJ

Well remember that this isn't EAs first NASCAR title either. And considering that people are already porting Thunder tracks into NSR I suspect that this new title isn't as totally new as some would like. Most of us want is a good solid sim title that is a step forward. I couldn't care less who makes it. For me and many the key will be the online racing. So far I have heard little about NSR online other than one post saying it doesn't support dialup and someone else mentioned to me that it may require 2-3 times the bandwidth for hosting. "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:1zLQd.7$[email hidden]...

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> > "Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:KiKQd.1$[email hidden]... >> > <shrug> Papy made statements/promises too, that they didn't deliver >> > on, >> > weren't correct, etc. I.e., "Nascar Racing 3 will be based on the gpl >> > engine" etc. "We can't put a save game feature in" (n1 and 2). >> > "We're >> > unable to make the pit roads straight due to coding limitations" (EA > did >> so >> > in 1998). >> >> JP, you seem to do a lot of shrugging. A tick perhaps? ;-) > > > No, why ? > > > >> >> > Also get a kick out of those slamming the car graphics in NSR. Until >> n4, >> > none of the car graphics in the Nx releases even resembled a stock car. >> >> Uh, it's 2005 now. Papy sorted that out years ago. GP2 didn't look so > hot >> either, come to think of it. > > > So, Papy gets a chance (that took, what seven years in terms of car > graphics ?) to "sort it out", but EA doesn't ? Besides the fact that the > criticisms of the EA cars are for very nit picking items imo, whereas the > Papy stuff was huge, basic flaws. > > Regarding gp2, it looked fantastic for the period of it's release, not > sure of the point there. > > >> >> Before being labeled a fanboy, let it be known that I'm all in favor of >> something that'll eclipse NR2003, whoever it comes from. And while NSR >> is > a >> genuine step up from it's predecessors, I just don't see it clearing that >> hurdle. Losing the jittering online opponents and warp-driven online > melees >> would be a true improvement if NSR can manage it and still get a full > field, >> but there are so many other steps backward relative to NR2003 that only >> people focused on that one issue will be convinced of it's superiority. > > > To early to say imo, either way. > > > >> >> As for the known limitations of NR2003, remember it is two years old and >> hasn't had benefit of that time for additional refinement. If you plot > the >> forward progress Papy made with the game while Sierra had the Nascar > License >> and project where it would likely be for a NR2005, Papy-style, NSR isn't >> even in the same league. > > > 03 is just another rendition of N4. Surely, you can't deny that. > > > >> >> But EA do have the NASCAR license now, so I certainly wish the Tiburon > guys >> luck in their efforts; I just wonder about the true level of commitment > from >> EA to the narrow slice of the market we hardcore sim-heads represent. >> >> SB > > > Agreed. > >

"Schooner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:HPLQd.242$iz2.210@edtnps91...

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> Well remember that this isn't EAs first NASCAR title either. And > considering that people are already porting Thunder tracks into NSR I > suspect that this new title isn't as totally new as some would like. > > Most of us want is a good solid sim title that is a step forward. I > couldn't care less who makes it. > > For me and many the key will be the online racing. So far I have heard > little about NSR online other than one post saying it doesn't support

dialup > and someone else mentioned to me that it may require 2-3 times thebandwidth > for hosting. Yep, agreed. EA has always been a hog with bandwidth, so definately interested in that too.

What? you talking about when FP moved up to another version or something? what I was talking to Bill about was, back in the day of NR3, where Papy gave the online stuff, for each user to setup and administer servers (on the user's own or rented bandwidth btw) it was a new concept. After all the NR3 was after or near when papy's involvement with TEN was over I think. Hell, come to think about it, all I would think to be equal to this is give Joe Lamas whatever he needs at "Pay to race OLR"(#1)" and a link to OLR on the desktop so users can creat an account then race "online" all they want. But this is 2005 I say. Some homes apparently have t-1's in them, and server spaces are everywhere to be rented. But EA produced a game for online play that has no CONTROL's for the server, & missing some pretty important clientside multiplayer stuff. maybe we wouldnt care if we hadn't experienced it with Papy's stuff? Hell I got on the BF1942 servers I didnt know how to see my pingrates in game, or how many seconds in front of or behind I was of someone like we use in racing... But then again I think I notice Admins punting Punk like a-holes off the servers... I dunno... Im just saying EA didnt produce on the golden CD, what even was produced back in pre 1999 days at least so far. Im also baited breath about the promised patch. Madden 05 IMHO is a patch for Madden 04... it goes on and on with EA it seems. Frankly if this turns out to be true, there's harldy anything left but Set-top box racing in our future... well distant future would be possible and completley follow the above model, "because" you don't patch PS2 games either, you sell them the "new version" nex year... *#1 No I am member of OLR, free account right now after year or so of premium, so Im not bashing OLR, in fact I really like it. * George Jetson enlightened us with:

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> "Plowboy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7NJQd.42182$EG1.31117@lakeread04... >> BILL, >> >> N3 doesnt really count in this discussion after all, including this >> stuff was a new concept in itself back then, nowdays it is a >> pre-requisite, dont you think? >> >> >> Bill Bollinger enlightened us with: >>> Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it >>> was released. I believe this release will be very good and shot a >>> LOT of potential. If they get the dedicated server package fixed >>> (Admin commands installed), everyone will move to NSR online. They >>> have fixed the online problems N2003 have suffered from since N4. >>> sniped for brevity >> > > > N3 and Flashpoint Racing Series. Hrmm. I remember. All N3 leagues > dropped in the middle of a season with no explanation from > Flashpoint. Sorry, I've avoided Flashpoint like the plague ever since. > > GJ

made a switch from N3 to N4 without noticed? I'm sorry, but that's pure BS!!! I have never switched titles without telling people. Flashpoint has made switch to new games from N2/N3, N3/N4, N4/N2002, N2002/N2003 and I will say the N3/N4 took the longest to get switched; because it was a rude awakening for many people. We were one of the last leagues to get switched and we ran practice sessions on new titles until our members were ready for the switch. I think N2003 to NSR is going to be like N3/N4, because not only will drivers and admins need to get acclimated to the new software, but screen names will most likely be different for many people; because they have to register with EA. > > N3 and Flashpoint Racing Series. Hrmm. I remember. All N3 leaguesdropped > in the middle of a season with no explanation from Flashpoint. Sorry,I've > avoided Flashpoint like the plague ever since. > > GJ

"JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:1zLQd.7$[email hidden]... > So, Papy gets a chance (that took, what seven years in terms of car > graphics ?) to "sort it out", but EA doesn't ? Besides the fact that the > criticisms of the EA cars are for very nit picking items imo, whereas the > Papy stuff was huge, basic flaws. No, it's just that as others have noted, this is far from the EA/Tiburon crew's first effort at Nascar. > Regarding gp2, it looked fantastic for the period of it's release, not > sure of the point there. Yes it did, but not now. NR2003 looked state of the art when it was released too, but it's tough to say that about NSR. It doesn't look awful, but it's no real advance that I can see. > To early to say imo, either way. Definitely with regard to online functionality, but as to the other aspects of the game where is it better? Surely not in the GUI, the replays, etc. > 03 is just another rendition of N4. Surely, you can't deny that. A refined version of the base engine, for sure. Which began with GPL. Doesn't mean it's a "mod" of GPL, just as it doesn't mean NSR is a mod of F1C, which it shares a bunch of code with. Just think that the main issues people have with NR2003 are a function of 2-year old code where the issues that are appearing with NSR are based on current code. > Agreed. Yes, we're all one big happy family of sim-heads here! But think about it; if the EA guys are checking out what's going on with the Sierra servers and there are way under 1,000 people online at any given point, how much are they going to care about the hardcore sim experience when they're focusing on moving units in the hundreds of thousands or more? That's one reason the extremely forgiveable nature of the demo cars' handling caught my notice. I saw it not so much as a shortcoming of an early build as a reflection of what they're shooting for with the final product. It's certainly possible to have a generally accessible product and still accomodate the likes of us, but how much effort's going to go into that extra bit needed? If I'm the product manager and I think something's only going to affect 5% of my target market and it's going to be a pain to implement, I'm not going to lose much sleep over it. Time will tell...

"Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:1zLQd.7$[email hidden]... > > > So, Papy gets a chance (that took, what seven years in terms of car > > graphics ?) to "sort it out", but EA doesn't ? Besides the fact thatthe > > criticisms of the EA cars are for very nit picking items imo, whereasthe > > Papy stuff was huge, basic flaws. > > No, it's just that as others have noted, this is far from the EA/Tiburon > crew's first effort at Nascar. Well, in terms of a non-console port, it is. > > > Regarding gp2, it looked fantastic for the period of it's release, not > > sure of the point there. > > Yes it did, but not now. NR2003 looked state of the art when it was > released too, but it's tough to say that about NSR. It doesn't lookawful, > but it's no real advance that I can see. Ah, ok, yeah, thats true. > > > To early to say imo, either way. > > Definitely with regard to online functionality, but as to the otheraspects > of the game where is it better? Surely not in the GUI, the replays, etc. Don't know yet myself (no game yet), and while there were some things even the demo did better imo, apples/oranges using that maybe. > > > 03 is just another rendition of N4. Surely, you can't deny that. > > A refined version of the base engine, for sure. Which began with GPL. > Doesn't mean it's a "mod" of GPL, just as it doesn't mean NSR is a mod of > F1C, which it shares a bunch of code with. Just think that the mainissues > people have with NR2003 are a function of 2-year old code where the issues > that are appearing with NSR are based on current code. Well, don't know how current it is, being based on F1x, etc. But anyway. > > > Agreed. > > Yes, we're all one big happy family of sim-heads here! But think aboutit; > if the EA guys are checking out what's going on with the Sierra serversand > there are way under 1,000 people online at any given point, how much are > they going to care about the hardcore sim experience when they're focusing > on moving units in the hundreds of thousands or more? That's one reasonthe > extremely forgiveable nature of the demo cars' handling caught my notice.I > saw it not so much as a shortcoming of an early build as a reflection of > what they're shooting for with the final product. It's certainly possible > to have a generally accessible product and still accomodate the likes ofus, > but how much effort's going to go into that extra bit needed? If I'm the > product manager and I think something's only going to affect 5% of mytarget > market and it's going to be a pain to implement, I'm not going to losemuch > sleep over it. > > Time will tell... Yep. Regarding the cars handling, more forgiving, etc. of course, doesn't necessarily mean less realistic. Usually the opposite in fact (more realistic) imo. I.e., it's been said that the cts mod for 03 more closely matches the way the cup cars should, and the cts mod is easier to drive. Anyway, I'm not a fan of the "it has to be difficult to be realistic" line of thought <g> Hell, Kaemmer himself said driving gpl was harder than the reality. But anyway, yep, will be interesting to see how the online aspect pans out. Big question marks there still.

On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:49:15 -0500, "Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> If I'm the >product manager and I think something's only going to affect 5% of my target >market and it's going to be a pain to implement, I'm not going to lose much >sleep over it. > >Time will tell... >

And that's what wrong with exclusive licenses. It doesn't let somebody that cares do the job correctly for a market that would pay for it. Screw EA . I DO CARE who makes the product. These bastards have worked their employees without proper compensation and then fired a bunch of them because they pissed away their money on exclusive licenses and can't pay the bills and/or keep the shareholders happy. I guess I still have my 60's idealism but I WILL NOT BUY ANOTHER EA game. I hope the pirates have a field day. Where's the day 1 warez site?

"not spam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:49:15 -0500, "Steve Blankenship" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > If I'm the > >product manager and I think something's only going to affect 5% of mytarget > >market and it's going to be a pain to implement, I'm not going to losemuch

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> >sleep over it. > > > >Time will tell... > > > And that's what wrong with exclusive licenses. It doesn't let somebody > that cares do the job correctly for a market that would pay for it. > Screw EA . I DO CARE who makes the product. These bastards have > worked their employees without proper compensation and then fired a > bunch of them because they pissed away their money on exclusive > licenses and can't pay the bills and/or keep the shareholders happy. I > guess I still have my 60's idealism but I WILL NOT BUY ANOTHER EA > game. I hope the pirates have a field day. Where's the day 1 warez > site?

Hehe, the 'ole "Boo hoo, EA is mean to their employees (a story that turned out to be at least partially fabricated iirc). If you're so worried about that kind of stuff, you might want to do some research as to why the Papy employees turned over so much.

"JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WfOQd.15$[email hidden]... > "Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > No, it's just that as others have noted, this is far from the EA/Tiburon > > crew's first effort at Nascar. > > Well, in terms of a non-console port, it is. ??? NSR is just the next-generation of NT2003/4, which were both PC products based on the ISI game engine. Sure it's got some new bits in there, but a lot's very familiar. > >Just think that the main issues > > people have with NR2003 are a function of 2-year old code where theissues > > that are appearing with NSR are based on current code. > > Well, don't know how current it is, being based on F1x, etc. Butanyway. Kind of my point, actually. It's being sold as a new product, which inherently means current code, but it has some legacy issues relating to the base engine. Same with GTR for instance; SimBin have done great things with the old F1C engine, but it's creaking at the seams. The middleware is definitely holding GTR back. But I guess that's all they have to work with until they can license a next gen engine. Who knows when that might be available, since ISI's still tweaking rFactor for their own upcoming release.

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> Regarding the cars handling, more forgiving, etc. of course, doesn't > necessarily mean less realistic. Usually the opposite in fact (more > realistic) imo. I.e., it's been said that the cts mod for 03 more closely > matches the way the cup cars should, and the cts mod is easier to drive. > Anyway, I'm not a fan of the "it has to be difficult to be realistic" line > of thought <g> > Hell, Kaemmer himself said driving gpl was harder than the reality.

Know what you mean - driving should be hard on the limit, but not below it. But staying on the limit should be hard, and with the NSR demo you could just about floor it all the way around Kansas and steer into and out of anything one-handed. I like to think I can drive OK, but dirt-tracking it at 170 on pavement... ;-) Perhaps the final (or more likely a patched final) will be better. Could be; just locking the rear end in the HDV file made the cars a lot more Papy-like in how they acted when the rear end let go. I just wonder if they WANT that much of an edge on it. You almost wish they'd take the approach MGI did with Heat and have the hardcore mode locked in a config file unknown to the masses, but available to those of us for whom it matters. That's funny about GPL though; I remember thinking GPL was too hard going slow back in the day, but now it seems so easy. And the experience of learning to drive a real sim from GPL translates to other modern sims, and vice versa. Driving is driving, it's just a matter of learning to read the cues in the 2D environment. Granted, the GPL cars had some seriously funky virtual tires on them. I remember driving GPL once and thinking if my mechanic gave me a real car that handled like that I'd drive right back to the pits and punch him out! But everyone had to use them, so it was fair and you just got on with trying to figure them out. Kaemmer's point then was that any accurate sim would be harder to drive than in reality because you lacked real-world feedback. Others have taken the approach of softening the edges to make it "seem" real (which is the gist of what Henrik Roos has said about GTR feeling more real with TC & ABS on low), but Kaemmer said it was just a matter of the user learning the environment, not changing the physics. I'm down with that. ;-)

"Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:WfOQd.15$[email hidden]... > > "Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> wrote inmessage > > news:[email hidden]... > > > No, it's just that as others have noted, this is far from theEA/Tiburon

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> > > crew's first effort at Nascar. > > > > Well, in terms of a non-console port, it is. > > ??? NSR is just the next-generation of NT2003/4, which were both PC > products based on the ISI game engine. Sure it's got some new bits in > there, but a lot's very familiar. > > > >Just think that the main issues > > > people have with NR2003 are a function of 2-year old code where the > issues > > > that are appearing with NSR are based on current code. > > > > Well, don't know how current it is, being based on F1x, etc. But > anyway. > > Kind of my point, actually. It's being sold as a new product, which > inherently means current code, but it has some legacy issues relating to

the > base engine. Same with GTR for instance; SimBin have done great thingswith > the old F1C engine, but it's creaking at the seams. The middleware is > definitely holding GTR back. But I guess that's all they have to workwith > until they can license a next gen engine. Who knows when that might be > available, since ISI's still tweaking rFactor for their own upcoming > release. Ah, ok. True enough. But then, we've seen this before ala Papy, including with 03 <g> > > > Regarding the cars handling, more forgiving, etc. of course, doesn't > > necessarily mean less realistic. Usually the opposite in fact (more > > realistic) imo. I.e., it's been said that the cts mod for 03 moreclosely > > matches the way the cup cars should, and the cts mod is easier to drive. > > Anyway, I'm not a fan of the "it has to be difficult to be realistic"line > > of thought <g> > > Hell, Kaemmer himself said driving gpl was harder than the reality. > > Know what you mean - driving should be hard on the limit, but not belowit. > But staying on the limit should be hard, and with the NSR demo you could > just about floor it all the way around Kansas and steer into and out of > anything one-handed. I like to think I can drive OK, but dirt-tracking it > at 170 on pavement... ;-) Perhaps the final (or more likely a patched > final) will be better. Could be; just locking the rear end in the HDVfile > made the cars a lot more Papy-like in how they acted when the rear end let > go. I just wonder if they WANT that much of an edge on it. You almostwish > they'd take the approach MGI did with Heat and have the hardcore modelocked > in a config file unknown to the masses, but available to those of us for > whom it matters. Yeah, I've seen several make just that comment about the demo (dirt tracking). Don't know why, but I didn't have that experience. Good questions though. > > That's funny about GPL though; I remember thinking GPL was too hard going > slow back in the day, but now it seems so easy. And the experience of > learning to drive a real sim from GPL translates to other modern sims, and > vice versa. Driving is driving, it's just a matter of learning to readthe > cues in the 2D environment. Granted, the GPL cars had some seriouslyfunky > virtual tires on them. I remember driving GPL once and thinking if my > mechanic gave me a real car that handled like that I'd drive right back to > the pits and punch him out! But everyone had to use them, so it was fair > and you just got on with trying to figure them out. > > Kaemmer's point then was that any accurate sim would be harder to drivethan > in reality because you lacked real-world feedback. Others have taken the > approach of softening the edges to make it "seem" real (which is the gistof > what Henrik Roos has said about GTR feeling more real with TC & ABS onlow), > but Kaemmer said it was just a matter of the user learning theenvironment, > not changing the physics. I'm down with that. ;-) Yep. Know what you mean re gpl, same experience myself. Run it now, and one wonders why it was ever so difficult <g>

>"Bill Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote > Remember that N3 didn't even have a dedicated server package when it was > released. But then again that was in 1999. Case closed. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 16:35:58 -0600, "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote: > Hehe, the 'ole "Boo hoo, EA is mean to their employees (a story that >turned out to be at least partially fabricated iirc). If you're so worried >about that kind of stuff, you might want to do some research as to why the >Papy employees turned over so much. > It wasn't Papy and there wasn't a monopoly on a racing series. Enjoy EA's piece of shit for the next many years.

"not spam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 16:35:58 -0600, "JP" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > Hehe, the 'ole "Boo hoo, EA is mean to their employees (a story that > >turned out to be at least partially fabricated iirc). If you're soworried > >about that kind of stuff, you might want to do some research as to whythe > >Papy employees turned over so much. > > > > It wasn't Papy and there wasn't a monopoly on a racing series. Enjoy > EA's piece of shit for the next many years. Thanks, I intend to. Enjoy crying in your beer for the same time frame. >