NR2003 family of mods screw up my desktop on exit

Primarily when running online with either the GTP 1.1 mod or the beta-that-shall-not-be-named, when I exit GTP (either via the menu or 5 minus keys) windows will still sort of still function but the clock is missing from the systray and most everything I try to do (such as firing up a browser or email) will bring up a error message refering to VERSION.DLL not being able to start. If I go to reboot, the machine hangs and I have to do a reset. It happens about 75% of online sessions however rarely if ever when running standalone. The game it self operates just fine but it's a real pain in the ass for team driving. Win98se Gforce 4200ti with 4.14.10.6176 drivers AVG 7.0 (disabled while online) Onboard lan, cable broadband, no firewall software Logitec Momo with profiler running Presumably it would happen in any NR2003 family of mods but these are the only ones I'm using at the moment. Any ideas?

On 16 Nov 2005 10:46:16 -0800, "mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote: >no firewall software Yup, the above probably has something to with it. No firewall = messed up, sloooowww PC. Firewalls are not a luxury anymore, they are a necessary part of being online, second only to the actual connection itself. Phil

Why would <not> running a firewall program cause instability in 2 NR2003 mods and not in every other application that he runs online? I don't see a connection (sorry, bad pun) between one and the other. If the lack of firewall software causes problems with GTP and the "other" mod of NR2003, why wouldn't it occur when he runs CTS, PTA, BGN, IROC, TPTCC, etc. online? I don't have an answer, but I'm not going to offer some made up advice at least.

I didn't say I have no firewall, I said I had no firewall software that might be mucking up the mix of software on my PC (exactly why I disable my virus checker during online sessions). My router has a fully functional firewall for my protection.

>why wouldn't it occur when he runs CTS, PTA, BGN, IROC, >TPTCC, etc. online? I have no reason to think it wouldn't if I had those mods. Re TPTCC I do and it does (hang). I'm guessing it's likely something in the NR base code.

Cmon Art , join us in THIS century ;) Win98 went out with Y2krick ;) Mitch "mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> >why wouldn't it occur when he runs CTS, PTA, BGN, IROC, >>TPTCC, etc. online? > > I have no reason to think it wouldn't if I had those mods. Re TPTCC I > do and it does (hang). > > I'm guessing it's likely something in the NR base code. >

>Cmon Art , join us in THIS century ;) Win98 went out with Y2krick ;) When's the last time a virus targeted YOUR operating system? ;)

I had a long argument all laid out for ya Art but I think Ill just file it away till my next consult involving w98 upgrades ;) Mitch "mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > When's the last time a virus targeted YOUR operating system? ;) >

>I had a long argument all laid out for ya Art but I think Ill just file it >away till my next consult involving w98 upgrades ;) Hey don't get me wrong, if you can point to the area of conflict between NR code and Win98 I'll consider plunking down the $100 on the upgrade to XP (or whatever's in fashion this week). But as others are running 98 just fine it sounds like change for changes sake at the moment. The OS layer is just one of the tools that let me run the stuff I want, and so far 98 has proven to be an adequate hammer for my needs. The only thing it won't do (besides open itself up to hackers), is let my onboard sound card operate in surround mode (98 drivers won't support it). I've got a soundblaster on a shelf somewhere that will solve that when I get around to it. "To a little boy with a hammer, everything looks like a nail".

Nothing wrong with the W98SE and N2003 combo. Has worked well for years and for countless people, including myself. My system is not unlike yours, and leaving N2003 does screw up the desktop these days (although not as bad as in your case). The culprit could be the video driver version. In my system it's the only part that has changed from the early days. So you might give earlier versions a try and see if it improves anything. Most stable version for me (GF 4800 card) was 41.07. However, that one is unable to run rFactor which is why I upgraded to a later driver and accept the consequences. Drivers like 6167, that you use, just wreak havoc on my system. On the other hand, from the sound of it, your problem might as well be a virus or something. Now, isn't one of the great things about W98 that you can reinstall the OS and keep all your settings? :-) Bye, Leo

>On the other hand, from the sound of it, your problem might as well be a >virus or something. Now, isn't one of the great things about W98 that you >can reinstall the OS and keep all your settings? :-) The problem has persisted thru a windows re-install so I'm dissinclined to think virus. I can't remember what video drivers I had before the re-install, but no responsible company can release 61 releases of drivers and make any claim as to their being stable so I'm inclined to agree with your premise. Cheers

Mcewena, I wont try and convert yo to winxp, but I can tell you there is nothing stopping you if you some day make the move. Yeah XP is a hog compared, and removed support (mostly) for the old "gameport" joystic & wheels but other than that, I like XP better even though I thought I wouldnt. main thing is some errant applications dont bring the whole system down anymore like it used to in 98. But I agree 98 is "lighter" and with same hardware on most apps, seems faster by just a little to some, but adding memory usually equalizes XP to 98 standards. MMMMmmmmm, homer no work well memorey without... Oh if you have a Microsoft Sidewinder wheel, that is plugged into the gameport instead of USB, you will NOT want XP ever, lol. mcewena enlightened us with:

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>> I had a long argument all laid out for ya Art but I think Ill just >> file it away till my next consult involving w98 upgrades ;) > > Hey don't get me wrong, if you can point to the area of conflict > between NR code and Win98 I'll consider plunking down the $100 on the > upgrade to XP (or whatever's in fashion this week). But as others are > running 98 just fine it sounds like change for changes sake at the > moment. > > The OS layer is just one of the tools that let me run the stuff I > want, and so far 98 has proven to be an adequate hammer for my needs. > The only thing it won't do (besides open itself up to hackers), is > let my onboard sound card operate in surround mode (98 drivers won't > support it). I've got a soundblaster on a shelf somewhere that will > solve that when I get around to it. > > "To a little boy with a hammer, everything looks like a nail".

mcewena wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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>>On the other hand, from the sound of it, your problem might as >>well be a virus or something. Now, isn't one of the great things >>about W98 that you can reinstall the OS and keep all your >>settings? :-) > > The problem has persisted thru a windows re-install so I'm > dissinclined to think virus. > > I can't remember what video drivers I had before the re-install, > but no responsible company can release 61 releases of drivers > and make any claim as to their being stable so I'm inclined to > agree with your premise. > > Cheers >

Well, considering that both nVidea and ATI have been blitzing us with revised/updated and new drivers on a regular basis for years now, I think you'll be hard pressed to find a video card from a "responsible" company. I don't like it either, but it's a competitive world out there, and gamers keep demanding more and more fromtheir systems. Graphics is probably the most "visible" feature (pardon the pun) and it gets a lot of attention from prospecyive buyers. Even if there is no significant (or even "real") improvement, companies have to *appear* to be improving & supporting their products. Hence the rash of driver releases. I'd like it if there was a new videa card released on an annual basis, and an initial and then one later update driver for that card. (I might be able to afford to keep up then. <grin>) -- Darryl

>I wont try and convert yo to winxp, but I can tell you there is nothing >stopping you if you some day make the move. No doubt it's a better hammer, I use it everyday at work. But if my lap times won't be reduced and it's apparently not causing this problem why complicate my life by introducing another factor?

I've never owned an ATI card so I can't comment directly but I get the feeling they don't release new drivers as often as nvidia, maybe they make the code in their drivers more generic and have the firmware in the card sort it out. I think nvidia has released more versions of drivers then they've ever released cards. and it appears from the instability it seems to cause many people they do it too quickly for their quality control department to cope with.

Oh and spending money to do so...

Hammers and nails along with little boys and Win98... No wonder it doesnt work ;) Pour some coffee on it while your at it :) One thing I loved about Windows 98 was it's ability to keep my phone ringing and the cash flowing. This case is a perfect example. That cursed XP cost me some cash over the years :) Believe me the future of tech support won't be at the OS level as it's been. Not if you plan on making a living doing it (unless of course youre from India). If youre saying it's a vid driver issue then IT IS OS related.... Since the last driver release for Win98 (what, 3 years or so ago?) how many MS DirectX updates has there been? Can you honestly tell me that MS worried about Win98 during development of DX9? The OS, the video driver and DX all are intertwined closely. You can always go back to DX7 (with a reinstall) but is that really an option??? That is my point all along, for a sawbuck and a couple hours you WOULD FIX it and wouldnt have to spend your time justifying w98 on the usenet with all the shoulda woulda coulda's :) It was just a suggestion. I meant it in fun but this suggestion has a basis in reality. Mitch "mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> >I wont try and convert yo to winxp, but I can tell you there is nothing >>stopping you if you some day make the move. > > No doubt it's a better hammer, I use it everyday at work. > > But if my lap times won't be reduced and it's apparently not causing > this problem why complicate my life by introducing another factor? >

>That is my point all along, for a sawbuck and a couple hours you WOULD FIX it Likely true, but if others have found the secret combination that allows things to work then I should be able to as well. If it means spending money I'd perfer to update the video card so at least I'll see some tangible ontrack graphics improvement for my money. Spending money on an operating system is like spending money on a refridgerator, sure you'd like the newer model with with ice maker and the feezer portion on the bottom that uses 2% less electricity but as long as the old one keeps the beer cold the money is better spent on something sexy like a widescreen TV.

Thats the logic I don't follow Art. What good is all that Graphics hardware if youre running it using DX7/8 on Win98 with NR2003? Sometimes you need the cart AND the horse ;) You can get by without a horse and cart though, just have more kids and give each a bucket :)) My win98 quote of the week, hehe. Mitch "mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > If it means spending money I'd perfer to update the video card so at > least I'll see some tangible ontrack graphics improvement for my money. >

Win98 runs DX9 (b or c) and NR and my video board were designed when 98 was state of the art, yes it's antiqated now but no more so then the software I'm using it for.

"mcewena" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I've never owned an ATI card so I can't comment directly but I get the > feeling they don't release new drivers as often as nvidia, maybe they > make the code in their drivers more generic and have the firmware in > the card sort it out. > > I think nvidia has released more versions of drivers then they've ever > released cards. and it appears from the instability it seems to cause > many people they do it too quickly for their quality control department > to cope with. > >

I haven't counted them, but ATI has released at least 3 different driver updates in the last two months. They are about as (good/bad) as Nvidia these days. Most driver releases are to fix problems with specific apps/games these days. Once in a great while I will read in the "fixes" readme that something is "optimized" but that is rare. Folks used to complain about needing new driver updates and now that they are coming at a mile a minute folks complain.......hehe........ Ed