rec.autos.simulators

All I'm hearing is how great Logitech's Driving Force Pro is, yet my
experience is that it is awful.  I first tried it with Need for Speed
Underground 2.  Basically, up until about 40 miles an hour there is no
noticeable force feedback.  Above 40, there is no feedback for about
two inches of turning in either direction but very hard feedback
outside of that.  This is completely unlike my experience with the
original Driving Force of the MOMO wheels, and I hate it.  It does not
in any way reflect what it feels like to drive a car.  It seemed so
awful I even exchanged it but the new one was the same way so
apparently that is just what they are like.  I tried it with GT4 but
could not control the car at all, and while I could think that is just
because it takes some getting used to, the fact that it was so awful
with NFSU2 makes me very suspicious of the wheel.

Does anyone have any thoughts about this?  Why does everyone like this
wheel so much?

It's working great for me in GT4.  There's a little play in the wheel,
but that's all.  It's anything but hard to control the cars in the GT4.
 In fact, I can place the car on the track with a great deal of
precision.  Which you really need when passing the AI since they're not
the smartest things on the track.

BTW, the only settings I've changed in GT4 are the driving asists and
there is a setting that reduces the amount of force feedback when
making rapid turns.  Not sure of the name of that setting, but I've
turned it off.

I just picked one up last week, to replace my aging Formula Force, and it's
been doing dual duty on my pc and PS2. I have used it on NR2003, RBR, LFS
and GT4, WRC. I'm pretty happy with it. I haven't noticed any of the issues
you mentioned. It is a little different than my old wheel, but I have not
complaints.

best wheelout there for nr2003, and its great in gtr too.

not good in gpl though (although im thinking this is more of a GPL issue
:( ).

pez

Hello,

You got that absolutely right, been wondering whether someone else
noticed this problem.

I bought the same Logitech's Driving Force Pro with high hopes.
And had exactly the same problems. Tried with toca, wrc, gt3 ja
gt4 prologue.

( I tested the same games with an old logitech gt force and momo force.
Everything worked smoothly with those two wheels. )

If you turn the wheel quickly enough you might not get force feedback
until
you have turned about 4 inches. Same thing happened with all the
games mentioned above. I returned the wheel and the dealer insisted
that I try another one but it didn't help either. Got a refund and been
playing with the original gt force and momo force wheels.

Some reports indicate that atleast in the Japanese version of GT4
the momo force is not supported.
http://www.firingsquad.com/games/gran_turismo_4/page5.asp

It is possible that some Logitech's Driving Force Pro wheels are
defective, gotta buy another one and try that after gt4 is released.

If the situation remains the same, someone might make a mod for
Momo force to make it look like GT force for the game.

-Mikko L

Yeah, MOMO doesn't work with GT4, which is a shame.  But I did get used
to using the DFP with GT4 and it really is an interesting experience
once you get used to the 900 degree steering.  It turns out you can use
the 900-degree steering with Need For Speed Underground 2 also, but
that unfortunately doesn't fix the force feedback issues.  I do think
the MOMO handled force feedback better for any of the PS2 games I've
tried it with, even though it's a PC wheel.  I have the red one with
the leather wheel, and I'm very sad whenever a racing game doesn't
support it.

In Need For Speed Underground 2 for PS2 there are extensive options to
set up your wheel's force. One setting in particular will make the
force stronger around center position, but not elsewhere. But the
drawback is that in case you let go the wheel it will become unstable
(which is why the default setting may feel a bit soft around center).
And another setting I believe will decrease overall force strength. So
you should be able to set it up exactly the way you like.
If you are using the PC version this does not apply since the Driving
Force Pro is not meant to be a PC wheel and the game wasn't tweaked
with it.
One reason why the wheel may feel like there is no force around center
is because the mechanics and electronics have been improved so there is
no motor friction. This way the wheel moves freely in case there is
very little force. Now if you swerve back and forth in games like NFSU2
or GT4 where the friction of the car's wheels are directly tied to the
wheel, there will be a moment around center where you are actually
moving along the force generated by the game which gives the impression
that there is no force at all. On older wheels you would get some motor
friction which would give the impression that there is some dampening
or spring force going on.
Dunno if that's very clear but hope it helps anyways...

its the best PC wheel ive used (with the new drivers), and that includes hi
end non FF stuff.

pez

ignore that last post, i didnt read your post properly.

pez

At first we though that this might be a design "feature" too.

But the "lag" in force feedback is evident especially in the corners.
-> You turn to the left and have oversteering -> try to correct
it by turning to the right and the lag is there.

The amount of lag depends on how fast you turn to the opposite
direction. If you turn quite slowly, you might experience less
than an inch of "lag" in FF but if you turn quickly, you might have
more that 4 inches of "lag". The lag means here the amount of
inches that you can turn the wheel until the force feedback
kicks in (and it kicks in quite heavily).

The two Driving Force wheels that we some early units. It's possible
that logitech have corrected this.

-Mikko L