rec.autos.simulators

The leadoff story on Speednet is that Cleveland has backed out of the
IRL race next year and will try to get CART back. Cool !
Stuff that up yer' bum, Tony George!

To email me remove the "u"s

1)  What does this have to do with sims?  This is rec.autos. SIMULATORS --
these kind of posts belong in the R.A.S.I. newsgroup (rec.autos.sport.indy).

2)  Why should Tony George stuff ANYTHING up his bum because of this?  Tony
George and the IRL did NOT "deprive" Cleveland of their CART race, nor did
they prevent CART from racing at Cleveland.  Thanks to Cleveland's mayor,
there may be NO race in Cleveland in 2000 -- the IRL is definitely out, but
there is NO firm plan yet for CART to return, and if they do, it's going to
cost somebody . . . probably the fans, I would imagine.

If you don't know the full story, let me enlighten you :  There were
extensive negotiations between CART and IMG Motorsports, the promoter for
the Cleveland race, regarding CART's sanctioning fees for 2001 and beyond.
The announcement that the Cleveland Grand Prix would be an IRL race in 2000
only came about after negotiations between CART and IMG fell apart. CART was
reportedly increasing its sanctioning fee from $1.5 million to $2 million,
an amount that IMG felt would be unprofitable. In comparison, unconfirmed
reports indicate that the IRL's sanctioning fee will be between $750,000 and
$1 million.

With estimated attendance numbers of approximately 50,000 fans per year over
the past couple of years, it's doesn't take a math major to realize that an
IRL date stands to be more profitable for IMG. Using $50 as an estimated
average figure for ticket prices, a crowd of 50,000 would bring in $2.5
million in ticket sales. This means that a CART event with a sanctioning fee
of $2 million would only net $500,000 in profits for IMG.

In comparison, an IRL event with equal attendance and ticket prices minus
the IRL's $1 million sanctioning fee would result in $1.5 million in profit
for IMG. Even if an IRL event only brought in 35,000 spectators with an
average ticket price of $50 per ticket, IMG would reap $750,000 in profit --
which would still be a quarter of a million dollars more than what they
would earn with CART's $2 million sanctioning fee and attendance numbers in
the 50,000 range.

IMG obviously took all of this into account when they made the decision to
host an IRL event.

Now, because of politics (the mayor of Cleveland is the #1 reason why the
IRL race has been tabled), Cleveland fans will either have NO race in 2000,
or they'll be paying more for their tickets because you can bet that CART
won't be decreasing their sanctioning fees just to return to Cleveland --
THOSE negotiations already failed.  Also, I believe that Cleveland's Mayor
White also has instructed IMG to "go break some eggs and make some omelets
to make it (a CART race in 2000) happen" (or something to that effect) --
which tells me that he's telling them to bite the bullet, raise the money,
and pay the higher fee to get CART back (damn the IRL).  All of which makes
me wonder, is Mayor White a CART stockholder?  Somebody should be checking
that out, I think.

So, again, why should Tony George stuff anything up his bum?  Sounds to me
like he, the IRL, and race fans everywhere have been royally screwed by
political manipulations beyond their control.  And, somehow, CART comes out
looking like a saint.  Man, it must be nice to be so blissfully oblivious.

Now, tell me again -- what does ANY of this have to do with simulations?

And, let me say to the rest of you:  Regretfully, I once again have to
apologize for wasting precious bandwidth here in the R.A.S. newsgroup with
this type of inane, non-related tomfoolery, but it really irks me to let
this sort of vile rhetoric go unchallenged -- this kind of thing just breeds
ignorance, and we've already got enough of that to go around.

-- John Bodin
    Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
    http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/

-- snip --

Royally screwed? How can that be when Cleveland might get back CART, the
racing series that they have loved and supported for many years? I realize
you're an IRL fan, but for most people, getting CART back instead of an IRL
race is hardly getting screwed. It's more like the answer to their prayers.

As for ticket prices, why not wait and see what they are before assuming
they'll be much higher? Just because Bud Stanner *says* they would have been
higher doesn't make it so.

Of course, CART might not be back if no deal can be reached, but I'd bet
otherwise.

Jim

Nothing, except whether the Cleveland circuit is still current for ICR2.

Gotta agree with John.  Tony didn't "deprive" Cleveland of CART.  CART
didn't
"deprive" Cleveland of IRL.

CART or IRL? CART or IRL? Big names or little names?  Come on.  IRL has been
losing dates, no?  CART hasn't.  In fact they have been gaining them.  A
CART race
has been a part of Cleveland's entertainment/sports calendar for
years...somewhat
of a tradition.  Thats a lot of the reason the mayor wants it back.

He and the IRL already screwed race fans.  But thats solely opinions.  CART
looks
like a saint?  I don't know about that.  CART raised its santioning fees,
IMG/CART
relations fell apart so CART did not schedule a date.  Big deal.  But the
Mayor of
Cleveland wants CART back...CART hasn't said yes or no.  How does that make
CART
look like a saint?

Dunno,why didn't you cross post it? :)