rec.autos.simulators

I've been reading the discussion about GPL's degree of difficulty with
some interest, and would like to suggest a slightly different way of
looking at this.

There can be no argument that GPL is a very difficult game, and for
most people it takes longer to get up to speed in GPL than in other,
previous, racing sims. That, too, is my experience, and I am still
struggling along towards the back of the filed. But my times ARE
improving, albeit slowly. When I force myself to practice
methodically, I do reap the rewards via steadilt decreasing lap times.
Which lets me remain optimistic that, given enough time, I shall one
day be up there with Messrs Clarke, Hulme et al.

However, it will still be quite a while before I get that quick. I
have an Interact V3 wheel and pedals, which is pretty horrible but all
I can afford at the moment. Originally I was using a K6233 with a
Voodoo1 card. When GPL came out I bought an 8MB Thriller. This led to
a big improvement in frame rates, but still could not really manage
any AI cars, without turning virtually all the graphics off. So I
still felt a large part of my inabilty to control my car was due to
system limitations and the fluctuating frame rate.

It was at this time that GPL's inflexibilty really started to irritate
me. If I picked only 5 AI cars (and more than that was virtually
unplayable due to frame rate), GPL gave me the 5 quickest - who I
couldn't even get close to in races. So I could forget about racing.
Well how stupid! Why the heck doesn't the game allow me, via the menu
to system, to select the particular AI opponents I wish to race
against?

And, yes, I did download Alison Hine's tweaked driver.ini files, and
was able to use my own version of one of them to get the opponents I
wanted. But it should not have been necessary. The time I spent
downloading the files, working out where to put them, reading read
me's and FAQs and ini files, and making changes by trial and error -
that's all time I should have been playing the game. Why isn't this
capability an integral part of the game, allowing the player to select
the required opponents, set their speed and so on? Why can't the
player set the difficulty as he/she sees fit?

It's not like I'm alone in wanting to be able to make these sort of
changes. What's the first software programs written after a new sim is
releases? Invariably programs such as Steven Young's superb GP2Edit
(or F1RSrays for Ubisoft's F1RS). And it was only after installing
GP2Edit that I was able to really enjoy and get absorbed in GP2
because at last I could slow the AI down to my level of incompetence
;).

So from the moment I installed GPL I was searching this forum and the
various web pages for some clever person to have produced a program to
"fix" GPL. And ever since I installed Kari Ikonen's first, fairly
rudimentary version, of GPL AI Tweak, I have been able to alter GPL so
that now in my races I AM actually RACING! As I improve, so too can I
increase the performace of the AI cars. The latest version, 1.3,
allows numerous other tweaks to the AI performance.

Now you may consider that I would improve more quickly if I forgot
about racing for a while, and just got up to speed via training, as
recommended in the manual. And you're probably right. But, so what? I
wouldn't enjoy myself as much, and, for me, that's the whole point.
Eventually, after enough races, I will improve. But this is how I
choose to spend the time I have playing GPL. So why the heck does
Papyrus insist on ramming its preferences down every player's throat,
and make it so difficult to take a different approach?

Before people start replying with comments like "There's no
satisfaction beating the AI if it has been slowed down" or "Stick to
arcade games" or "this is SIMULATION, so we can't possibly allow
players to control anything" - that just misses the point. I'm not
suggesting the physics be comprimised in any way at all, nor that it
be made easier for me to control my own car. Indeed, I feel the
responsiveness of one's own car is what makes GPL the best sim ever
released by a long way. Of course one day I hope to be able to beat
full strength AI cars - and race successfully online. And I
acknowledge that is is only then that I will really have beaten the AI
cars. But in the meantime I can steadily improve my lap times, and,
more importantly, my overall race times, whilst at the same time
having some fantastic duesl with cars travelling at roughly the same
speed: provided there is a way to set the AI at a level appropriate
for me.

Some people prefer to improve "by themselves", and may feel they get a
greater sense of satisfaction when they do, finally, get quick enough
to challenge for the lead. Fair enough, that's their decision and I
can respect that. I just feel everyone should be permitted to make
their own decision about how they wish to play the game, and that the
game developer should facilitate that, not make it difficult to take a
different approach, as they do at present.

Over the past 12 months (the sum total of my time involved with PC
games), I've become more and more irritated by the "we know what's
best for you" attitude of the developers. I think it is almost a form
of arrogance: they spend years developing their "baby" and become
convinced the method they prefer for playing/learning the game is the
ONE RIGHT WAY. So they say in response to complaints such as mine
"Yes, GPL is a difficult simulation, and we make no apologies for
that." As I mentioned above, I'm glad, very glad, that GPL has such
superb "physics" and I agree any suggestion to alter that is stupid.
But altering the overall speed of AI cars is a different thing
altogether, and in no way compromises those "laws of physics". It's
just as if they are having a bad day and decide to drive 10% slower
;).

Anyway, that's how I feel. I wish Papyrus would put Kari on their
payroll and release a patch incorporating all his tweaks and more into
the menu system. That would help many players get more enjoyment from
their time with GPL (many of us may never get time to practice enough
to ever have have a real race - unless we use Kari's program).
Including this into the menu would also be a very good decision
commercially, because more players getting more enjoyment from GPL can
only improve sales.

Cheers

Alan.

Exactly.  Then you'd have to find something ELSE to *** about, and that would
be a lot of trouble.

Exactly.  You'd probably improve even faster if you practiced instead of raced.
 But that's your choice.

Okay, so you've identified what you call a problem, you've found a FREE
solution that someone was generous enough to make available.  What is the
problem here?

Just curious.

Pinebox

Why do you me object to me suggesting an improvement?

The problem is the amount of time wasted working out how to make the
changes I want - and the fact it takes an unpaid programmer to make my
enjoyment of the game complete.

I think it would be a better product, that more people could get
enjoyment from, with these changes included in the original game.

That's all.

Oh, I see.  Then, may I suggest you send a message with a header like "An AI
suggestion (or request, or demand, even)  for Papyrus," instead of "Do they
think we're stupid."  You don't appear to have much skill in gaining a
sympathetic ear, either from devotees of GPL in this newsgroup or the people at
Papyrus who might be in a position to do something about it.

Pinebox

Found! 1 sympathetic ear. Good post mate, Hey programmers and producers,
GIVE US OPTIONS!!

 Yes, but he did have a very good point.  Sierra did it for N2 and ICR2 and could
have very easily done it for GPL.  Poor foresight on their part. Paul

I agree GPL is very slim on settings and options.
Hopefully they'll splurge on Nascar.

rob.

While I agree that you should be able to tailor the level of the AI, I
would point out that options are a two headed monster. Program designers
are correctly taught that sparse, simple interfaces are better because
most users (who are generally not the people found on this ng) prefer
them. People complain like hell when programs are complex to use or have
too many options. GPL has a very simple and aesthically pleasing user
interface which does not allow for the kind of complex manipulation that
subscribers to this ng demand. But within days of the release of a decent
sim we can get scores of utilities developed by competant philathropists
that allow us to radically alter the look and feel of the sim. The only
change I'd make in response to your mail is an option to choose which
drivers you race against and perhaps an add-on program to load up sounds,
graphics and manipulate ini file settings. MGP has such a program.
However, Papyrus did give us ini files that are easy to edit - that's a
lot better than some others sims.
Paul

[snip]

Thought it might be worth pointing out that the changes are a simple
modification of a few values in an .ini file.  You hardly need to be a
programmer to read the comments and change the appropriate lines.

What the programmer has done is give the computer illiterate spawn
of Gates and his Windows monopoly a nice GUI way of setting the AI
values.  It's appreciated of course - but the easier you make something
the less control you have over it.

An example -

I spend a bit of time playing Quake and Quake2 online and the text
file based configuration system is widely accepted as the most flexible
and powerful way to make the game behave the way you want it to.
The control which this gives players is ideal as you can customise the
game to run well on your hardware as well as look good and play the
way you want it to.

Maybe you should buy a Macintosh as it will help you avoid learning
a little bit about how your software works.

Jet

regarding ...

If any nitwit thinks that a novice could keep up with the top drivers
of the 67 era, they must have rocks in their head.  Of course I dumbed
down the AI of the other drivers ;)

And, I don't feel bad about it one bit.  It has given me some great
races.  

If I feel good about coming in second with slower AI, and have more
fun than I would against the full strength AI ... Who should care?  If
I never get a chance to pass another driver, how in the hell am I
going to practice my passing skills?  I think one 'should' lower the
AI's abilities to be more in-line with who's racing.  As you get
better, pump them up.  For me, this keeps the fun-factor high, and I
can get accustomed to racing with other cars around me.  

I do think that Papy could have made this easier to do, but it's not
really that hard.  

But still, a way to override the AI adjusting to your speed and being able to set their
speed to whatever you like in the GUI should have been implemented. I sense a little
burnout here on Papy's part after 3 years of hard work. It would have prevented a lot of
frustration and is even more annoying for casual users/newbies because of the main
disappointment in GPL IMO - the ommision of being able to race at GP2 and GP3 level.
Though it doesn't effect me directly, it was a blow to the sport of sim racing and will
probably result in a lack of up and coming simmers. This is something that the likes of
Papyrus should feel responsible for. Even for their own financial future if nothing else.

--
 Byron Forbes
 Captain of Team Lightning Bolt

 http://members.tripod.com/~HOSHUMUNGUS

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