rec.autos.simulators

N3 lookin' nice...but what's the "bobble" or dance the cars do from side to
side?  My guess
is that it's supposed to be the motion of the car messed up by slow downs in
the frame rate.
Anyone else noticing this?

Kyle

If you're into N3 being a "sim", then the real behavior of the AI cars IS
important to me...how many times have
there been posts about AI car behavior in other games?

N3 is not immune...

Kyle

I never looked at it as a flaw, but rather realism (but then again, I am all
screwed up<g>). I thought is was rather real looking. From watching races on
tv through a roof cam, the cars appear to do this. My guess is that close to
200mph your car isn't going to drive a perfectly straight line. On the other
hand, while driving behind the 31 car, I thought it was actually Skinner
driving. <vbg>

N3 is the best yet! I was glad after seeing the mess of N99.

Matt Harper
MHarper on TEN, Haven't picked a name for N3. :o)

P.S. Nice to see the Brickyard !!

After the reviews, I'm trying to stay away from K. Petty myself. ;-)

You can get slammed here if you pick on N3 too much, which is not what I'm
doing.  I've been racing since N1, but N3 isn't without minor nuances that
detract from the overall experience.  It's not enough to keep me from racing
by any means, but I was just trying to express my inquisitive nature in a
public forum.

I'm not calling it a flaw, either.  The side to side thing I've always seen,
but this one is new, sort of like chassis roll, vertically up and down, but
very quickly.  I just want to find out if I'm the only one (then I can
deduce that it's probably my hardware or software setup), or if others are
seeing it, it's a phenomenon of the game.  Remember, we're spoiled by GPL,
SCGT (some), etc...

Kyle

I did read your original post wrong to begin with. I read it as it being a
flaw. My mistake. I will pay closer attention to what you are talking about
tonight when (if I ever) get home from work. Then I have to sneak by the
wife and make my way down to my office, then CRANK the stereo that's hooked
up to my puter and race on!!!!!! By then she'll be on me for not taking the
garbage out this morning. Sorry honey!

Matt Harper

I noticed it to.  I didn't know if it was the cars leaning in the turns
with the addition of the sway bar or my frame rate, which isn't too
bad.  The "bobble" was annoying at first, but I am learning to ignore
it.

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

Initially I thought it was the AI trying to decide whether to keep drafting the
car they're behind or cut out on a new line to pass.  I've only really run
Talladega so far, and it only seems to happen when I'm closing on a car.  I
figured the AI wanted to cut out and pass, but I was close enough for it to try,
find out I was there, cut back in, try again, etc.  Maybe under certain
conditions, whatever prompts that decision making process is right on the edge,
so the car waffles for a while.  Then again, maybe this is all a complete pile
of crap.

            Zog

% Initially I thought it was the AI trying to decide whether to keep drafting the
% car they're behind or cut out on a new line to pass.  I've only really run
% Talladega so far, and it only seems to happen when I'm closing on a car.  I
% figured the AI wanted to cut out and pass, but I was close enough for it to try,
% find out I was there, cut back in, try again, etc.  Maybe under certain
% conditions, whatever prompts that decision making process is right on the edge,
% so the car waffles for a while.  Then again, maybe this is all a complete pile
% of crap.

As a member of the now defunct CCG NASCAR2 AI Project, I think what you
are observing is the AI engine in N2/99/3 pushed to its limit.  While we
were constructing a more realistic AI for N2, we encountered
this behavior alot.  There are some flaws in the AI engine in N2/ICR2
that were corrected in the GPL engine.  But, N3 is basically using the
same AI engine as N2, Papy just took a few lessons from those that
worked to improve their AI from the outside.  I even took a few of the
AI files from N3 and compared them to the CCG AI files and found alot of
similarities in Papy's new approach to "smarten" up the AI.

I also see the same in their approach to "paint jobs" this time around.
Not to mention the Internet gameplay features.  I think that those hard
working "hobbiests" and "amatuers" that have worked so hard over the
years improving Papy's sims deserve a good pat on the back for having
pushed Papy forward.  They, in my humble opinion, deserve a mention in
the credits for NASCAR3.

% > N3 lookin' nice...but what's the "bobble" or dance the cars do from side to
% > side?  My guess
% > is that it's supposed to be the motion of the car messed up by slow downs in
% > the frame rate.
% > Anyone else noticing this?
% >
% > Kyle

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I agree 100%  Those "hobbyists" have extended the life of Papy products and
therefore given me more VFM for years now.  A big THANKYOU to all.

Cheers,

Mark
Reading, UK

GOOD POINT!!
Papyrus did a crappy job on the paint jobs on Nascar 3.  I think even
Papyrus depends too much on the people out there who paint the cars and fix
the AI.  I still have this feeling that Nascar 3 needed a few more weeks to
work out the problems.  Hopefully they will come out with a patch soon.

YES!!!
It's like the cars have too much caffeine in their tanks and they are
jittery.  When viewing my car from an external view.. I don't notice the
jittery look.. but I DO notice it if I happen to see the car behind me in
the external view.
I think the best thing Papyrus can do is get a completely new team to work
on the NEXT version of Nascar Racing.  It's like Tombraider and Nascar
Racing are being made the same way.  "Let's take what we have and try to
'fix' something in it and sell it as a new product".
A Message to Papyrus:
                                    GET NEW CODE!!!!!!

I totally agree.

I know at least from my own experience, 98% of my time behind the wheel
of Nascar2 was while running The Pits Touring Car Patch.

Nascar2 in stock form bored me to tears (admittedly I'm not much of an oval
fan) and thanks to all the hard work of hobbiests who devoted their own free
time improving the N2 AI + car models + Dave's inexpensive ICR2 track
converter, many of us were able to have a great deal of fun with N2 in
modified form.

Hoping that at least some of those modifications will also be developed
for N3.

It would have been nice for the N3 credits to mention thanks to these
hobbiests who contribute much to the success of the Papyrus Nascar scene.

Seeyas on the track.

--John (Joao) Silva

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