rec.autos.simulators

Apology

Marc J. Nelso

Apology

by Marc J. Nelso » Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:00:00

I've pulled the N3 Beta article (as well as the SR-Opinion) from the SRO
site - not so much to appease Papyrus, this group, or anyone else for
that matter - but to allow my conscious some rest.  None of the actions
of those who've visited SRO in the past saying that they've deleted the
bookmark has anything to do with my decision - I don't have a problem if
you pass my site over. It was wrong and irresponsible for me to post the
information, especially since I hadn't even contacted Papyrus about it.

However, I've had plenty of time to think about the situation - looking
at it from the outside - and find that I'm guilty of sensationalism.  I
would be bullshitting everyone (and myself) if I was to continue fueling
the fire, thinking I was somehow being attacked - the chip landed square
on my shoulder, and I admit to daring anyone to knock it off.  My
inflated ego got the best of me, and for this I apologize.

I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
dragging this through the mud.

Cheers!

Marc - SRO

Don Burnett

Apology

by Don Burnett » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Very nice apology Marc, if i had seen it posted about an hour ago I wouldn't
have responded as I did.
Very respectful of you to come here and post the below.

--
Don Burnette
Dburn in N3 and Legends



Chuck Kandle

Apology

by Chuck Kandle » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Absolutely commendable.  We all make mistakes, but not everyone has it
within them to own up.  My hat's off to you.


> I've pulled the N3 Beta article (as well as the SR-Opinion) from the SRO
> site - not so much to appease Papyrus, this group, or anyone else for
> that matter - but to allow my conscious some rest.  None of the actions
> of those who've visited SRO in the past saying that they've deleted the
> bookmark has anything to do with my decision - I don't have a problem if
> you pass my site over. It was wrong and irresponsible for me to post the
> information, especially since I hadn't even contacted Papyrus about it.

> However, I've had plenty of time to think about the situation - looking
> at it from the outside - and find that I'm guilty of sensationalism.  I
> would be bullshitting everyone (and myself) if I was to continue fueling
> the fire, thinking I was somehow being attacked - the chip landed square
> on my shoulder, and I admit to daring anyone to knock it off.  My
> inflated ego got the best of me, and for this I apologize.

> I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
> dragging this through the mud.

> Cheers!

> Marc - SRO

--
Chuck Kandler  #70
ChuckK or KS70 on Won.net
K&S Racing
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195
The box said "Windows 95 or better", so I installed LINUX!
Tracey A Mille

Apology

by Tracey A Mille » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Very, very well said.

"Marc J. Nelson" wrote

Schlom

Apology

by Schlom » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Well said Marc.  Takes alot of guts to owe up to a mistake.  This ones for
you...

Chris

robswindell

Apology

by robswindell » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

 Maybe you could teach the IRL & CART a thing or two, Marc!


> I've pulled the N3 Beta article (as well as the SR-Opinion) from the SRO
> site - not so much to appease Papyrus, this group, or anyone else for
> that matter - but to allow my conscious some rest.  None of the actions
> of those who've visited SRO in the past saying that they've deleted the
> bookmark has anything to do with my decision - I don't have a problem if
> you pass my site over. It was wrong and irresponsible for me to post the
> information, especially since I hadn't even contacted Papyrus about it.

> However, I've had plenty of time to think about the situation - looking
> at it from the outside - and find that I'm guilty of sensationalism.  I
> would be bullshitting everyone (and myself) if I was to continue fueling
> the fire, thinking I was somehow being attacked - the chip landed square
> on my shoulder, and I admit to daring anyone to knock it off.  My
> inflated ego got the best of me, and for this I apologize.

> I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
> dragging this through the mud.

> Cheers!

> Marc - SRO

--
Rob Swindells
Goldline Bearings FFord Championship: http://swindells.8m.com
BAR-Honda-Jacques Villeneuve-2000 Champions
John Bodi

Apology

by John Bodi » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

LOL!

> Maybe you could teach the IRL & CART a thing or two, Marc!


>> I've pulled the N3 Beta article (as well as the SR-Opinion) from the SRO
>> site - not so much to appease Papyrus, this group, or anyone else for
>> that matter - but to allow my conscious some rest.  None of the actions
>> of those who've visited SRO in the past saying that they've deleted the
>> bookmark has anything to do with my decision - I don't have a problem if
>> you pass my site over. It was wrong and irresponsible for me to post the
>> information, especially since I hadn't even contacted Papyrus about it.

>> However, I've had plenty of time to think about the situation - looking
>> at it from the outside - and find that I'm guilty of sensationalism.  I
>> would be bullshitting everyone (and myself) if I was to continue fueling
>> the fire, thinking I was somehow being attacked - the chip landed square
>> on my shoulder, and I admit to daring anyone to knock it off.  My
>> inflated ego got the best of me, and for this I apologize.

>> I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
>> dragging this through the mud.

>> Cheers!

>> Marc - SRO

>--
>Rob Swindells
>Goldline Bearings FFord Championship: http://swindells.8m.com
>BAR-Honda-Jacques Villeneuve-2000 Champions

Jan Verschuere

Apology

by Jan Verschuere » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Eh... what happened?

Call me superficial but I didn't notice anything particularly insulting or
damaging about those articles (I'd re-read them to check, but then.. you
pulled 'm). Nor did I come across any libelous postings over here. I've got
to admit I skip about 80% of what's on here, but at least I think I'm
getting the major fall-outs. ;-)

Anybody care to fill me in?

Whatever happened this is a very noble gesture. It shows you're made of the
right stuff.

Jan.
----


<Snip>

Jan Koh

Apology

by Jan Koh » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

<snip>

I think you should be forced to race Bill Elliott's NASCAR Challenge from
now on...so there!  ;]

Cheers!


??Jan Kohl??        **The Pits Performance Team**
Computer Systems Programmer
USAF Air-Ground Operations School
Hurlburt Field, FL

Castle Graphics - http://www.castlegraphics.com/
The Pits - http://www.theuspits.com/

Jeffrey Haa

Apology

by Jeffrey Haa » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00



Uh, I have (sheepishly admiting it) a copy if he needs one :)

Jeff

Barton Spencer Brow

Apology

by Barton Spencer Brow » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

First, let me commend Marc Nelson for a first-rate apology -- a rare
thing on UseNet! Having lurked through this whole thread, and having
observed for a couple years Papyrus/Sierra's on-again, off-again
participation in this newsgroup -- certainly the largest of its kind on
the planet, and the closest thing to a public grapevine there is in sim
racing -- I wonder if the apology is entirely warranted. Papy's in a
tough position regarding what information (and patches, beta or
otherwise) they release and when, and are largely "damned if they do and
damned if they don't;" but, first and foremost, they are a consumer
product manufacturer. While it may be thought by some that the retail
truism "an informed consumer is the best advertising" doesn't
necessarily apply to the *** market, where apparently any old piece
of codswallop (Spirit of Speed, you name it) can be dumped on a
brain-dead public and make money, it just ain't so. While GPL is a
niche-market product that has had (understandably) modest sales, its
very excellence has polished Papyrus' star among those who know the
difference. NASCAR sims make the money, but a sim like GPL makes a
reputation. The problem with a company's reputation is that it's very
easy to besmirch -- they're the professionals after all, and are (like
it or not) held to a higher standard than Joe Blow NG poster -- and not
at all easy to reclaim.

People come to this NG largely to ask questions and get answers. No one
knows the answers to questions about Papyrus products better than the
people who make them. Whether Papyrus decides to share their information
is their decision, but a large part of any reputation is consistency, so
Papyrus needs to decide whether they're going to participate in this
newsgroup or not, as their consistency in this area has not been exactly
uniform, and they need to decide *how* they're going to participate, if
at all.

A statement like "...and people wonder why we are reluctant to involve
the racing community on a large scale" is neither useful nor
professional. In no way does it promote Papyrus' best interest, and if
it doesn't at the very least serve Papy's self-interest (let alone
answer anybody's question), what possible purpose *does* it serve?
Individuals can be arch and peevish in a public NG (though wouldn't it
be nice if they weren't?), but manufacturers can hardly afford that
selfish luxury without taking some of the gloss off their reputations.
Take enough of the gloss off, and your reputation goes into the negative column.

IMHO, before Papyrus got swallowed up by Sierra, there was a much more
open exchange of information between Papyrus and this NG. I'm sure part
of the lessening of the dialogue has to do with Sierra's more strict
corporate culture and quite possibly downsizing. Whatever the case,
Papyrus has to make a choice: either they're going to participate here
or not. If they're not, for whatever reason, fine. If they *are*, then
they have the professional obligation to act as model citizens, not to
contribute further to the muck. We are *not* Papyrus' "enemy," unless
Papyrus itself casts us in that role, as the quoted statement above
seems to do. We buy your products, we support your products through word
of mouth and the practically idolatrous labor of the many people who
have built websites devoted to your products -- you couldn't BUY
advertising like that, but you CAN throw it all away with a poor
corporate attitude.

Please think about it.

Bart Brown

Jan Koh

Apology

by Jan Koh » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Jeffrey Haas amazingly admitted in message ...

ROTFL!  Geez, Jeff, that's kinda like going on national TV and saying that
you
had relationships with your intern, isn't it?  ;]

Cheers!


??Jan Kohl??        **The Pits Performance Team**
Computer Systems Programmer
USAF Air-Ground Operations School
Hurlburt Field, FL

Castle Graphics - http://www.castlegraphics.com/
The Pits - http://www.theuspits.com/

John Bodi

Apology

by John Bodi » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

Sorry, Jan -- that's not severe enough.  Marc's going to have to develop a
physics hack for SoS that will give us some realistic steering inputs in
exchange for his horrific transgression.  THAT would show Papy, wouldn't it?
<G>

Either that, or he's should simply be forced to race only SoS from now on!

;-)

-- JB



><snip>
>>I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
>>dragging this through the mud.

>I think you should be forced to race Bill Elliott's NASCAR Challenge from
>now on...so there!  ;]

>Cheers!


>??Jan Kohl??        **The Pits Performance Team**
>Computer Systems Programmer
>USAF Air-Ground Operations School
>Hurlburt Field, FL

>Castle Graphics - http://www.castlegraphics.com/
>The Pits - http://www.theuspits.com/

Larr

Apology

by Larr » Sun, 21 Nov 1999 04:00:00

No, NO!  That's cruel and inhuman punishment!

-Larry



> <snip>
> >I also apologize to Papyrus - and more specifically to Shawn Wise - for
> >dragging this through the mud.

> I think you should be forced to race Bill Elliott's NASCAR Challenge from
> now on...so there!  ;]

> Cheers!


> ??Jan Kohl??        **The Pits Performance Team**
> Computer Systems Programmer
> USAF Air-Ground Operations School
> Hurlburt Field, FL

> Castle Graphics - http://www.castlegraphics.com/
> The Pits - http://www.theuspits.com/


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