rec.autos.simulators

by **Philste** » Mon, 28 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I have read a couple of times peoples remarks on Nascar 3. "I'm not
gonna buy it if it's based on the Nascar 2/1999 engine. It would have
been so much better based on the GPL engine..."

On the other side of the story, Papyrus told us that the N2 game engine
would be highly modified. What if it was so modified as to present a
totally new game? One example comes to mind: Quake II and Half-Life. I
was no big fan of Quake or FPS, but once I received Half-Life has a
gift, I was hooked. How could a game based on an old (relatively
speaking) be so good? Because Valve (the makers og HL), took the
existing Quake II code, changed it, added new features (like other
colors beside brown and shades of brown and even more brown) and better
gameplay (namely in game puzzles). What if Papyrus does the same with
the N2 engine. Well, I'm willing to try it out.

Philster

by **Ben** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Cool, we can have tetris on the dashboard! <tic>

Ben

by **Tracey A Mille** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

That's not a good comparison. The "Quake 2 engine" used by Half-Life is
a graphics engine, not a physics engine. Nascar 3 is going to have all new
graphics and sounds, but the physics are still going to be the same old 2
dimensional ***which we all thought was great a few years ago when Nascar
Racing came out. All of that changed when GPL was released. It's going to be
real hard for some of us to spend money to go backwards.
I said the same thing though about GPL, I didn't want to go backwards in
time to 1967. The only reason I bought it was to get a good look at the
Nascar 3 engine. I just wish we could get Papy to make one sim with the GPL
engine but modern cars, preferably Nascar but F1 or CART would do fine.

Philster wrote

by **Michael E. Carve** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

% That's not a good comparison. The "Quake 2 engine" used by Half-Life is
% a graphics engine, not a physics engine. Nascar 3 is going to have all new
% graphics and sounds, but the physics are still going to be the same old 2
% dimensional ***which we all thought was great a few years ago when Nascar
% Racing came out. All of that changed when GPL was released. It's going to be
% real hard for some of us to spend money to go backwards.
<snip>

We do not know for a fact that NASCAR3 will use the "exact" same physics
engine as the N2 series. From what has been said, it would appear that
the physics engine is getting a complete overhaul as well.

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

by **Norm L** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

The time difference from the release of Quake 2 to Halflife is alot
different than the time span between N2 and Nascar 3, as well as the fact
that if Valve( creaters of Halflife) would have had a better game engine in
an already released game that was better than Quake 2, I think they would
have went to the newer engine. Papy has a better engine in GPL yet we are
going to get yet again a modified N2 game. I just hope they pull some Papy
magic with it cuz I haven't bought a Nascar game since 2.

Norm

by **Ron R.** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Well, if it is based on the N2 engine at least I'll have a prayer of
being able to run it and stay in my offline league <G..

Tried GPL on a P200 with 64 meg of ram and a 16 meg Monster and I get
chop and stutter on the front straights with any other cars besides
mine at all tracks. You don't even want to know what it does with a 5
car field in the turns <G..

Ron

>I have read a couple of times peoples remarks on Nascar 3. "I'm not
>gonna buy it if it's based on the Nascar 2/1999 engine. It would have
>been so much better based on the GPL engine..."

>On the other side of the story, Papyrus told us that the N2 game engine
>would be highly modified. What if it was so modified as to present a
>totally new game? One example comes to mind: Quake II and Half-Life. I
>was no big fan of Quake or FPS, but once I received Half-Life has a
>gift, I was hooked. How could a game based on an old (relatively
>speaking) be so good? Because Valve (the makers og HL), took the
>existing Quake II code, changed it, added new features (like other
>colors beside brown and shades of brown and even more brown) and better
>gameplay (namely in game puzzles). What if Papyrus does the same with
>the N2 engine. Well, I'm willing to try it out.

>Philster

--
Ron Riekens II

ICQ# 1780898

Co-Owner/Driver:
Pacific Rim Racing/Wendys Restaurants
NWST'99 CTS #97 Chevy C10

NWST'99 for N99:
http://www.nwstracing.com/nascar99/

NASS'98 N1, BGN Champion
Pacific Rim Racing NASS'98 N1, BGN Team Champions
NASS'98 N1 Rookie & Team Points Statistician

NASS'99
http://www.nasscar.com/

Pacific Rim Racing located at:
Oregon Division Site:
http://www.pacifier.com/~ronrii/prr/index.html

Hawaii Division Site:
http://www.frelance.com/prr/index.html

Members of the Team Sites webring since 3-99
http://mars.spaceports.com/~nasunite/GDR/Teamsitering.html

by **Ron R.** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Oops!
Forgot to turn of that oversize sig of mine again on previous post :(
Sorry if offends anyone <G..
Ron

>I have read a couple of times peoples remarks on Nascar 3. "I'm not
>gonna buy it if it's based on the Nascar 2/1999 engine. It would have
>been so much better based on the GPL engine..."

>On the other side of the story, Papyrus told us that the N2 game engine
>would be highly modified. What if it was so modified as to present a
>totally new game? One example comes to mind: Quake II and Half-Life. I
>was no big fan of Quake or FPS, but once I received Half-Life has a
>gift, I was hooked. How could a game based on an old (relatively
>speaking) be so good? Because Valve (the makers og HL), took the
>existing Quake II code, changed it, added new features (like other
>colors beside brown and shades of brown and even more brown) and better
>gameplay (namely in game puzzles). What if Papyrus does the same with
>the N2 engine. Well, I'm willing to try it out.

>Philster

by **Nigel Nichol** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Thats a fare point Philster and I agree that Papy have said
they will be doing lots of modifications to make N2000/3
better than N2 but, they have not mentioned
anything about improving the physics engine specifically.
After reloading the Viper demo I would be happy if that
physics engine was used in N2000. In that game (Viper) the car
feels as though it has weight and drives accordingly.

But the proof will be in the tasting of the pudding I guess.
--

Redline Race Controls

http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/System/9045/

Nigel of Lakewood Motorsports
Hamilton
New Zealand

by **Philste** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

> That's not a good comparison. The "Quake 2 engine" used by Half-Life is
> a graphics engine, not a physics engine. Nascar 3 is going to have all new
> graphics and sounds, but the physics are still going to be the same old 2
> dimensional ***which we all thought was great a few years ago when Nascar
> Racing came out. All of that changed when GPL was released. It's going to be
> real hard for some of us to spend money to go backwards.
> I said the same thing though about GPL, I didn't want to go backwards in
> time to 1967. The only reason I bought it was to get a good look at the
> Nascar 3 engine. I just wish we could get Papy to make one sim with the GPL
> engine but modern cars, preferably Nascar but F1 or CART would do fine.

> Philster wrote
> >What if it was so modified as to present a
> >totally new game? One example comes to mind: Quake II and Half-Life.

I think you did not get my point: the changes made in Nascar 3 will not
be of the same nature as the changes made to the Quake II engine for
Half-Life. I was just pointing the fact that it's possible to make an
entirely new game from an existing and somewhat old game engine.

Philster

by **Tracey A Mille** » Tue, 29 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Philster wrote

I got the point, but no amount of translucent smoke is going to hide the
fact that we are still driving the same less than realistic cars. They can
add a couple of setup options but it will still be the same game. It will be
better, just as N2 was better than N1, but at it's core it will be the same
game. The free internet play will definitely make it a big seller though,
which is why Sierra made the smart business decision to do it this way. They
will get our money twice, once for this "patch" to N99 and again when they
FINALLY release N4 with the GPL engine. The added bonus is that Papy gets to
use all these goodies they are working on for N3 (force-feedback, improved
internet play, etc.) for their love-child, GPL. Nascar is their cash-cow,
open wheel is where their hearts are.

by **Marko Viitane** » Wed, 30 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I read somwhere that it's more difficult to enter turns in Nascar3, like
more difficult to keep it in the limit. Like if you enter the corner too
fast, you can't correct it by "just easing the throttle".
also that Daytona track will not be with it(something to do with not having
llicense)

by **Don Hanco** » Wed, 30 Jun 1999 04:00:00

On Mon, 28 Jun 1999 23:50:56 -0500, "Tracey A Miller"

>Philster wrote
>>I think you did not get my point:

> I got the point, but no amount of translucent smoke is going to hide the
>fact that we are still driving the same less than realistic cars. They can
>add a couple of setup options but it will still be the same game. It will be
>better, just as N2 was better than N1, but at it's core it will be the same
>game. The free internet play will definitely make it a big seller though,
>which is why Sierra made the smart business decision to do it this way. They
>will get our money twice, once for this "patch" to N99 and again when they
>FINALLY release N4 with the GPL engine. The added bonus is that Papy gets to
>use all these goodies they are working on for N3 (force-feedback, improved
>internet play, etc.) for their love-child, GPL. Nascar is their cash-cow,
>open wheel is where their hearts are.

It'll be interesting to see just how much of my cash they end
up with: NR99 didn't cost me a DIME (eventually)! Besides - free
internet play, smoke, new setup options (which will alter how the car
performs and handles) will make it so that I don't CARE what the CORE
is: I care about what makes it PLAY different.
Besides - you can go to the movies and dinner on a Friday
night and spend more than what it'll cost ya (let's not get into
details about "fringe benefits...").
I plan on being first in line.

Gunner
CFM Van Halen #55 ACOR Busch Series.

by **Don Hanco** » Wed, 30 Jun 1999 04:00:00

On Tue, 29 Jun 1999 10:15:30 +0300, "Marko Viitanen"

>I read somwhere that it's more difficult to enter turns in Nascar3, like
>more difficult to keep it in the limit. Like if you enter the corner too
>fast, you can't correct it by "just easing the throttle".
>also that Daytona track will not be with it(something to do with not having
>llicense)

Having just made a post about being the first in line to buy
it when it comes out; you've just reminded me of a reservation I had
about it a while back: what will we LOSE? In THEORY we should be able
to continue to use our cars and tracks.... but just HOW heavily will
this engine be modified?....

Gunner
CFM Van Halen #55 ACOR Busch Series

by **John Simmo** » Wed, 30 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I wouldn't count on being able to use your cars OR tracks in the next
version. The cars are probably going to use more polygons and have more
paintable surfaces (can you say "decklid"?), so don't count on being able
to use your old ones.

As far as tracks are concerned, I wouldn't count on that either. The
only real damn shame is that Papy hasn't ever seen fit to include tracks
that are no longer included on the cup/busch/truck schedules, or tracks
that have their new *AND* old configurations.

--
=========================================================
Redneck Techno-Biker (Zerex12)
http://www.members.home.net/jms1/index.html
Barbarian Diecast Collector (370+ cars and counting)
http://members.home.net/jsimm/diecast_index.html
Internet Grand Prix Series Season 2
http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html
North American Stockcar Racing Online Competition
http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html
Super X Philes
http://members.home.net/kap/superx/superx.html

If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown
above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame.
=========================================================

by **Tracey A Mille** » Wed, 30 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Don Hancock wrote

Thank you for helping to make my point. The reason Sierra decided to release
another game with the N2 engine is that people will buy it. Period. All this
***about "GPL engine can't run 43 cars on current CPUs" is a smokescreen,
much like those screen shots on their web page. They could re-release N99
with internet play and people would buy it. Instead they are adding some
graphic capability, 3d sound, and force feedback. Then afterwards they will
be able to re-release the Craftsman Truck add-on with the supped-up smoke
also. One rule in business: don't give customers more than they ask for, you
can sell the rest to them later.

rec.autos.simulators

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3

All those things about Nascar3