OT: Rumors of XBOX Price Drop to $149

There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop the price of the XBOX down to $149. As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. Thanks :) -Larry

If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of the best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). I am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly better physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming sometime this fall as well. Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. mixdj1 "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > Thanks :) > > -Larry > >

Joe, what do you use for a wheel on the xbox? Also, I have a 50" widescreen HDTV. Do the xbox games support HD? -- Slot Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of the > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). I > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly better > physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > sometime this fall as well. > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > mixdj1 > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > Thanks :) > > > > -Larry > > > > > >

There is a pretty good rally game for the XBox as well as EA's Nascar product. My son and I mix it up from time to time with both titles. -- Brian Tate Communications Officer CART Toyota Atlantic Championship http://www.toyotaatlantic.com http://www.cart.com "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > Thanks :) > > -Larry > >

Don't have a wheel yet. That's my biggest problem with the Xbox. I use a Logitech FFB wheel on the PC and I'm stuck with a controller on the Xbox. Granted the analog triggers allow for some precise acceleration and braking but the control stick doesn't do much for steering. I am going to be getting the Thrustmaster wheel for the Xbox later this month. I'll post up a review once I get it. I don't know all the details on HDTV support (I'm stuck with composite video) but my understanding is that they support 480P. Don't hold me to that though. :) mixdj1 "GTX_SlotCar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:alavl5$1nq99g$[email hidden]... > Joe, what do you use for a wheel on the xbox? Also, I have a 50"widescreen

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> HDTV. Do the xbox games support HD? > > > -- > Slot > > Tweaks & Reviews > www.slottweak.com > > > "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of > the > > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though).

I

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> > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly > better > > physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > > sometime this fall as well. > > > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > > > mixdj1 > > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > > drop > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that

price. > > > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn'treally

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> > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > > > Thanks :) > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > >

In article <Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]>, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: >What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > >That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really >impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. Don't have an XBOX, have a PS2. From what I've read and demo'd, the following are worth considering on the XBOX: The NASCAR titles, if so inclined. Project Gotham Racing. Pretty arcadey to me. I found its predecessor, Metropolis Street Racer (Dreamcast) to be very arcade-oriented. Though I have heard positive things about the handling and physics from friends who know a fair amount about cars. Nice selection of cars and graphics. SegaGT2002. Just out today. Movie looks good. But I had the DC version from a couple of years back and found it far, far inferior in graphics, courses, and car control (not necessarily the physics, but the controller action) to the PS2's GT3. Heck, I prefered GT2 on the DC (via Bleemcast). This one has promise. But I'd wait on a few reviews. Rallisport Challenge was the rally title that a lot of fans went gaga over. Randy MaGruder (author of superb racing sim reviews) gave it a rather mediocre grade. See www.digitalsports.com Or, I'd fork over the extra $50 and get a PS2 and immediately get GT3 ($20). Ferrari 355 Challenge is due out soon. But doesn't look like it improved over the DC version. TOCA Pro Race Driver (not out in US yet) is getting some good reviews, some mediocre. There's a relative dearth of top-notch racing games (few could be called sims) on the PS2 or any console.

I'm a different Joe but I can answer your HD question. ;0) The typical game runs 480p. Most games support anamorphic widescreen as well which is really nice (my TV does anamorphic squeeze so I've seen games both 4:3 and 16:9). NFL 2K3 looks terrific 16:9 since it's even sharper and you can see more of the field. Street Hoops (bad game) is a recent *true* HD resolution title @ 720p. There will be a few games down the road that will run 1080i (Dragon's Lair 3D is one title). Even at "only" 480p the Xbox looks surprisingly good (I do have a 21" Trinitron Flat PC monitor so I'm not too easily impressed). Bottom line for me: Xbox looks brilliant on my 36" Wega XBR (far better than a PS2) so I can only imagine how sweet it will look on a 50" WS set. Oh yeah, did I mention most games support Dolby Digital 5.1? If you buy an Xbox, and have a 5.1 DD system, play Halo on your 50" WS with your subwoofer cranking and be amazed. Makes a PC start to look . . . dare I say obsolete. ;0) PS-for the other Joe: I heard the TM wheel SUCKS so be sure you can return it and please post your impressions if you do buy it. I'm so spoiled by my MOMO that I won't buy a piss poor Xbox wheel (hoping Xbox goes FF like PS2 did with the Logitech). -- Joe Marques "GTX_SlotCar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:alavl5$1nq99g$[email hidden]... > Joe, what do you use for a wheel on the xbox? Also, I have a 50" widescreen > HDTV. Do the xbox games support HD? > > > -- > Slot > > Tweaks & Reviews > www.slottweak.com > > > "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of > the > > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). I > > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly > better > > physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > > sometime this fall as well. > > > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > > > mixdj1 > > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > > drop > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > > > Thanks :) > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > >

At present Sega Sports Car GT 2002. Other good games. RallieSport challenge Project Gotham racing F1-2001. -- ==================================================== "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... : There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop : the price of the XBOX down to $149. : : As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. : : What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? : : That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really : impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. : : Thanks :) : : -Larry : :

Larry, I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. Of the 30-odd tracks (actually 19, but most also run in reverse), only one isn't a fantasy track (Laguna Seca), and there is a mix of driving street cars on the open road, rally cars on special stages, and race cars on ovals and natural-terrain road courses. The physics aren't totally convincing (all front-drivers feel about the same; the difference is in performance levels; ditto for mid-rear and rear-drivers), but they are all fun to drive, and some are quite challenging. GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the fabled Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a total of 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles and disc brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play is superlative: you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way up the ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race cars. The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with a built-in hard drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best of all, for $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a HDTV at 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good as XGA (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p screen, but it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000 Samsung 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but does little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC, um, "experience." The prob (as Joe Heiman points out) is controllers. Most console racers are designed for gamepad control and don't feel right even with a wheel...and many others (like the egregious Le Mans 24 Hour) don't support *any" wheels. My early gaming experience was all with joysticks for flight-sims, but I can't get a handle on the little (1-inch tall) sticks that come with console controllers. The PS2 will accept most USB wheel-and-pedal setups originally designed for PCs (I'm using a TM Ferrari wheel), but--unaccountably--the Xbox demands dedicated wheels (I've been using the TM NASCAR Pro Victory). Despite the dearth of decent racing sims for the PC, there are a ton of racing/driving games already out there for consoles, ranging from the sublime (GT3) to the ridiculous (Grand Theft Auto, Crazy Taxi, Starsky & Hutch), and several more wending their way to an Electronics Boutique by this Christmas. For my Top 10 list, I'm looking at GT3, Rallisport Challenge, Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit 2, NASCAR Heat, NASCAR Thunder, F1 2002, GP4, World Rally Championship 2 (if I can find it), Colin McRae 3, Mercedes-Benz World Racing (kinda like NfS: Porsche Unleashed, only for Benz'), Project Gotham Racing, and Pro Race Driver. I was going to try to get this in the January issue (on sale during December for some arcane reason), but late release dates have moved this back to the February issue. The next Big Thing in console racing will be online play, but astonishingly, the developers are not going to have any racing games until Spring, 2003 (Sony launched their online games--dial-up and broadband--last month; Microsoft will roll out their broadband-only Xbox Live in November). Considering how many racing games are sold for consoles (Gran Turismo has sold 15 million copies), you'd think they woulda made that a priority. Pro Race Driver for the Xbox has been delayed, ostensibly to make it one for the first online racers, and I've heard GT4 will definitely be an online game. Hey, if Papyrus is defecting to consoles, maybe we should all be heading in that direction. --Steve Smith "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > Thanks :) > > -Larry > >

In article <Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]>, "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Of the >30-odd tracks (actually 19, but most also run in reverse), only one isn't a >fantasy track (Laguna Seca), There's also "Cote d'Azur" which is actually the F1 Monte Carlo course. >Hey, if Papyrus is defecting to consoles, maybe we should all be heading in >that direction. Is that confirmed?? Is there any chance that SegaGT2002 will make it to the PS2? Or is there a gentlemen's agreement there that they won't compete with Sony's own GT series? To bad if it'll never be offered. Sony would be wise to encourage it just to avoid defections.

On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 18:26:41 GMT, Larry wrote: > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > I read on Slashdot the other day that a group of very talented hackers got SuSE Linux 8.0 to run on the Xbox, so for this price you'd get a decent computer for mail, surfing, news and what not, using a free, secure operating system not plagued by virii. Who knows, something interesting (and good) might come of this. Uwe -- mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Excellent. Thanks! -Larry BTW... Any way to get a Momo wheel working on the Xbox ? I have one, might as well use it for _something_. -Larry "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some ofthe > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). I > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightlybetter

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> physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > sometime this fall as well. > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > mixdj1 > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > Thanks :) > > > > -Larry > > > > > >

Thanks! -Larry "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:x6me9.59710$[email hidden]...

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> At present Sega Sports Car GT 2002. > > Other good games. > > RallieSport challenge > Project Gotham racing > F1-2001. > > > > -- > > > ==================================================== > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > : There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > : the price of the XBOX down to $149. > : > : As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > : > : What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > : > : That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > : impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > : > : Thanks :) > : > : -Larry > : > : > >

Steve, Thanks for all the info! -Larry "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]... > Larry, > > I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video > consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. Of the > 30-odd tracks (actually 19, but most also run in reverse), only one isn'ta > fantasy track (Laguna Seca), and there is a mix of driving street cars on > the open road, rally cars on special stages, and race cars on ovals and > natural-terrain road courses. The physics aren't totally convincing (all > front-drivers feel about the same; the difference is in performancelevels; > ditto for mid-rear and rear-drivers), but they are all fun to drive, and > some are quite challenging. GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the > number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the fabled > Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a total of > 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles and disc > brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play issuperlative: > you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way up the > ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race cars. > > The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with a built-in hard > drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best of all, for > $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a HDTVat > 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good as XGA > (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p screen,but > it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000Samsung > 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but does > little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC, um, > "experience." > > The prob (as Joe Heiman points out) is controllers. Most console racersare > designed for gamepad control and don't feel right even with a wheel...and > many others (like the egregious Le Mans 24 Hour) don't support *any"wheels. > My early gaming experience was all with joysticks for flight-sims, but I > can't get a handle on the little (1-inch tall) sticks that come withconsole > controllers. The PS2 will accept most USB wheel-and-pedal setupsoriginally

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> designed for PCs (I'm using a TM Ferrari wheel), but--unaccountably--the > Xbox demands dedicated wheels (I've been using the TM NASCAR Pro Victory). > > Despite the dearth of decent racing sims for the PC, there are a ton of > racing/driving games already out there for consoles, ranging from the > sublime (GT3) to the ridiculous (Grand Theft Auto, Crazy Taxi, Starsky & > Hutch), and several more wending their way to an Electronics Boutique by > this Christmas. For my Top 10 list, I'm looking at GT3, Rallisport > Challenge, Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit 2, NASCAR Heat, NASCAR Thunder, F1 > 2002, GP4, World Rally Championship 2 (if I can find it), Colin McRae 3, > Mercedes-Benz World Racing (kinda like NfS: Porsche Unleashed, only for > Benz'), Project Gotham Racing, and Pro Race Driver. I was going to try to > get this in the January issue (on sale during December for some arcane > reason), but late release dates have moved this back to the February

issue. > > The next Big Thing in console racing will be online play, butastonishingly, > the developers are not going to have any racing games until Spring, 2003 > (Sony launched their online games--dial-up and broadband--last month; > Microsoft will roll out their broadband-only Xbox Live in November). > Considering how many racing games are sold for consoles (Gran Turismo has > sold 15 million copies), you'd think they woulda made that a priority.Pro > Race Driver for the Xbox has been delayed, ostensibly to make it one forthe > first online racers, and I've heard GT4 will definitely be an online game. > > Hey, if Papyrus is defecting to consoles, maybe we should all be headingin

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> that direction. > > --Steve Smith > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > Thanks :) > > > > -Larry > > > > > >

Thanks! -Larry "DM" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jlae9.8189$[email hidden]... > In article <Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]>, "Larry"<[email hidden]> wrote: > >What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > >That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > >impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > Don't have an XBOX, have a PS2. From what I've read and demo'd, thefollowing > are worth considering on the XBOX: > > The NASCAR titles, if so inclined. > > Project Gotham Racing. Pretty arcadey to me. I found its predecessor, > Metropolis Street Racer (Dreamcast) to be very arcade-oriented. Though Ihave > heard positive things about the handling and physics from friends who knowa > fair amount about cars. Nice selection of cars and graphics. > > SegaGT2002. Just out today. Movie looks good. But I had the DC versionfrom > a couple of years back and found it far, far inferior in graphics,courses, > and car control (not necessarily the physics, but the controller action)to > the PS2's GT3. Heck, I prefered GT2 on the DC (via Bleemcast). This onehas > promise. But I'd wait on a few reviews. > > Rallisport Challenge was the rally title that a lot of fans went gagaover. > Randy MaGruder (author of superb racing sim reviews) gave it a rathermediocre > grade. See www.digitalsports.com > > Or, I'd fork over the extra $50 and get a PS2 and immediately get GT3($20). > Ferrari 355 Challenge is due out soon. But doesn't look like it > improved over the DC version. TOCA Pro Race Driver (not out in US yet) is > getting some good reviews, some mediocre. There's a relative dearth of > top-notch racing games (few could be called sims) on the PS2 or anyconsole.

yep, you have to buy a mod chip though to be able to read a non-xbox disc "Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 18:26:41 GMT, Larry wrote: > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > I read on Slashdot the other day that a group of very talented > hackers got SuSE Linux 8.0 to run on the Xbox, so for this > price you'd get a decent computer for mail, surfing, news and > what not, using a free, secure operating system not plagued by > virii. > > Who knows, something interesting (and good) might come of this. > > > Uwe > > -- > mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) > Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ > Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) > GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Nope. ==================================================== "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:xwqe9.53089$[email hidden]... : Excellent. Thanks! : : -Larry : : BTW... Any way to get a Momo wheel working on the Xbox ? I have one, might : as well use it for _something_. : : -Larry

On Sat, 07 Sep 2002 17:21:39 GMT, Larry wrote: > Steve, > > Thanks for all the info! > > -Larry > Thanks to Steve! Thanks to Larry for quoting 130 lines of text for a line of follow-up! ;-) cheers, uwe -- mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

On Sat, 7 Sep 2002 13:39:25 -0400, Phillip Malphrus, Jr. wrote: > yep, you have to buy a mod chip though to be able to read a non-xbox disc > Another "bail" is out for the first Linux to run on a non-modded X-Box, so there... who knows ;-) Cheers, uwe -- mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Me too! Jason On Sat, 7 Sep 2002 23:18:41 +0200, Uwe Schuerkamp <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Sat, 07 Sep 2002 17:21:39 GMT, Larry wrote: >> Steve, >> >> Thanks for all the info! >> >> -Larry >> > >Thanks to Steve! Thanks to Larry for quoting 130 lines of text >for a line of follow-up! ;-) > >cheers, > >uwe > >-- >mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) >Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ >Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) >GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

Until Microsoft shuts it down under the DMCA, that is. I smell it coming. The worst technology law ever conceived by politicians who have no friggin' idea what they are doing. -Larry "Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 18:26:41 GMT, Larry wrote: > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > I read on Slashdot the other day that a group of very talented > hackers got SuSE Linux 8.0 to run on the Xbox, so for this > price you'd get a decent computer for mail, surfing, news and > what not, using a free, secure operating system not plagued by > virii. > > Who knows, something interesting (and good) might come of this. > > > Uwe > > -- > mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) > Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ > Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) > GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Thanks other Joe ;) Ya, I got a pretty nice HT setup. The subwoofer is powered by a PS Audio amp and will literally shake the couch and rattle the pictures on the wall. If the price does go down to $149, I'll pick one up for sure (for the kids, of course) and will probably just forget about any racing games for it until a nice wheel is available. This kind of input about the graphics and sound, plus another price break, is just what I was waiting for. I'm kind of looking.... I mean, the kids are kind of looking forward to it. -- Slot Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:g%ge9.226145$[email hidden]... > I'm a different Joe but I can answer your HD question. ;0) > > The typical game runs 480p. Most games support anamorphic widescreen as > well which is really nice (my TV does anamorphic squeeze so I've seen games > both 4:3 and 16:9). NFL 2K3 looks terrific 16:9 since it's even sharper and > you can see more of the field. Street Hoops (bad game) is a recent *true* > HD resolution title @ 720p. There will be a few games down the road that > will run 1080i (Dragon's Lair 3D is one title). Even at "only" 480p the > Xbox looks surprisingly good (I do have a 21" Trinitron Flat PC monitor so > I'm not too easily impressed). > > Bottom line for me: Xbox looks brilliant on my 36" Wega XBR (far better than > a PS2) so I can only imagine how sweet it will look on a 50" WS set. Oh > yeah, did I mention most games support Dolby Digital 5.1? If you buy an > Xbox, and have a 5.1 DD system, play Halo on your 50" WS with your subwoofer > cranking and be amazed. Makes a PC start to look . . . dare I say obsolete. > ;0) > > PS-for the other Joe: I heard the TM wheel SUCKS so be sure you can return > it and please post your impressions if you do buy it. I'm so spoiled by my > MOMO that I won't buy a piss poor Xbox wheel (hoping Xbox goes FF like PS2 > did with the Logitech). > > -- > Joe Marques > > > "GTX_SlotCar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:alavl5$1nq99g$[email hidden]... > > Joe, what do you use for a wheel on the xbox? Also, I have a 50" > widescreen > > HDTV. Do the xbox games support HD? > > > > > > -- > > Slot > > > > Tweaks & Reviews > > www.slottweak.com > > > > > > "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of > > the > > > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). > I > > > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly > > better > > > physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > > > sometime this fall as well. > > > > > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > > > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > > > > > mixdj1 > > > > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > > > drop > > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that > price. > > > > > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't > really > > > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > > > > > Thanks :) > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Ya know, Larry, if MS could make a decent wheel, they'd probably make one for the Xbox ;-) -- Slot (it was too tempting to resist) Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:xwqe9.53089$[email hidden]... > Excellent. Thanks! > > -Larry > > BTW... Any way to get a Momo wheel working on the Xbox ? I have one, might > as well use it for _something_. > > -Larry > > "Joe Heiman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > If you're talking "most sim like" then NASCAR Heat 2002. It has some of > the > > best physics seen on a console (not up to F355 Challenge level though). I > > am actually enjoying Sega GT 2002 right now. Think GT3 with slightly > better > > physics and AI (they actually try to avoid you). Grand Prix 4 is coming > > sometime this fall as well. > > > > Hopefully that helps. You're not going to find a GPL or N2002 on the > > consoles but there is still plenty fun to be had. > > > > mixdj1 > > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > > drop > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > > > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > > > > > Thanks :) > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > >

Rallisport is awesome... I can play that for hours it seems. I liked Gotham though, ? Russ "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Br6e9.47624$[email hidden]... > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > That "Midtown Madness" clone (I forget the name right now) didn't really > impress me. Gotham racing or something like that. > > Thanks :) > > -Larry > >

Just one of many many ridiculous laws passed by retarded politicians. "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:pxze9.55117$[email hidden]... > Until Microsoft shuts it down under the DMCA, that is. I smell it coming. > > The worst technology law ever conceived by politicians who have nofriggin'

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> idea what they are doing. > > -Larry > > "Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 18:26:41 GMT, Larry wrote: > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > > I read on Slashdot the other day that a group of very talented > > hackers got SuSE Linux 8.0 to run on the Xbox, so for this > > price you'd get a decent computer for mail, surfing, news and > > what not, using a free, secure operating system not plagued by > > virii. > > > > Who knows, something interesting (and good) might come of this. > > > > > > Uwe > > > > -- > > mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) > > Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ > > Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) > > GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61 > >

On Sun, 08 Sep 2002 03:32:37 GMT, Larry wrote: > Until Microsoft shuts it down under the DMCA, that is. I smell it coming. > > The worst technology law ever conceived by politicians who have no friggin' > idea what they are doing. > Agreed... some good came of the former administration, but this one was just ridiculous. It's reason enough to become an active supporter of the EFF. Cheers, uwe -- mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Steve, Just a comment and question: 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but the woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on the track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off the track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then that alone makes it a winner for racing fans. 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiar with 720p and 1080i. FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with anamorphic squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly good considering I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. -- Joe Marques "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]... > Larry, > > I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video > consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. <snipped> >GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the > number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the fabled > Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a total of > 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles and disc > brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play is superlative: > you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way up the > ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race cars. > > The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with a built-in hard > drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best of all, for > $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a HDTV at > 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good as XGA > (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p screen, but > it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000 Samsung > 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but does > little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC, um, > "experience." > <snipped>

"Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zpBe9.201$[email hidden]... > Just one of many many ridiculous laws passed by retarded politicians. Retarded politicians is redundant. ;0) -- Joe Marques

Just got Sega GT 2002 a couple of days ago, and haven't had a chance to get deep into it yet, but based on early impressions the AI is quite good. You really do have to race them, and they do try to avoid hitting you for the most part. My only gripes so far are that it supports a maximum of two players and that the four controller schemes offered are all significantly different from the other driving games I have. Other than that it is a lot of fun, with more vehicles than any other Xbox game currently. Also the career mode is pretty cool, you have to earn money to buy, upgrade, and repair your cars. "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:NIKe9.257398$[email hidden]... > Steve, > > Just a comment and question: > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game butthe > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're onthe > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me offthe > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) thenthat > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. >....

Joe, 1. GT3's AI is hyped as "adaptive," meaning it tries to mold itself to yer driving profile. Like GPL's (and unlike NfS'), it doesn't work very well. I agree that it would be atrocious...if this was an open-wheel game, but it's not. If you ain't rubbin' you ain't racin'. I can give as good as I get...in the lower classes (I haven't been up against the big boys). 1a. Sega GT isn't anything like driving a real car (my criterion for whether or not it gets in the MT story). My notes say it's a Project Gotham Racing wannabe. It recognized my TM NASCAR Pro Victory wheel...but not the pedals, so I had to drive using hand controls, like a paraplegic. Pretty graphics, tho. 2. Sorry, got it wrong. It's 720p and 1080i (or whatever the American standards are). This is where the Xbox shines. The image on a 27-in. HDTV is as good as anything I've seen on *my* 21-in. Sony Trinitron monitor. --Steve "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:NIKe9.257398$[email hidden]...

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> Steve, > > Just a comment and question: > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but the > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on the > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off the > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then that > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiar with > 720p and 1080i. > > FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with

anamorphic > squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly goodconsidering

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> I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. > > -- > Joe Marques > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]... > > Larry, > > > > I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video > > consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. > <snipped> > > >GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the > > number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the

fabled > > Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a totalof > > 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles anddisc > > brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play is > superlative: > > you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way upthe > > ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race cars. > > > > The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with a built-inhard > > drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best of all,for

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> > $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a HDTV > at > > 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good as XGA > > (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p screen, > but > > it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000 > Samsung > > 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but

does > > little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC, um, > > "experience." > > > <snipped> > >

"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ydOe9.223267$[email hidden]...

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> Joe, > > 1. GT3's AI is hyped as "adaptive," meaning it tries to mold itself to yer > driving profile. Like GPL's (and unlike NfS'), it doesn't work very well. > I agree that it would be atrocious...if this was an open-wheel game, but > it's not. If you ain't rubbin' you ain't racin'. I can give as good as I > get...in the lower classes (I haven't been up against the big boys).

I love rubbin' and racing, particularly in NASCAR but I still think the AI has no awareness of my presence on the track. They're running the same line with or without me in the path. I also didn't find the AI very challenging. I was running the higher class races and winning every one of them with little trouble. BTW, I'm not a great driver as far as guys in this ng but on GT3 I'm Wolfgang Woeger. :0) > > 1a. Sega GT isn't anything like driving a real car (my criterion forwhether > or not it gets in the MT story). My notes say it's a Project GothamRacing > wannabe. It recognized my TM NASCAR Pro Victory wheel...but not thepedals, > so I had to drive using hand controls, like a paraplegic. Pretty graphics, > tho. I'm not too disappointed since I won't use the Xbox for racing without a good wheel. Heard the TM is pretty poor, what do you think? What Xbox racer do you like? I'm thinking Rallisport as a first purchase if the TM wheel is any good. > > 2. Sorry, got it wrong. It's 720p and 1080i (or whatever the American > standards are). This is where the Xbox shines. The image on a 27-in.HDTV > is as good as anything I've seen on *my* 21-in. Sony Trinitron monitor. > > --Steve Thanks for the comments Steve. -- Joe Marques > > "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:NIKe9.257398$[email hidden]... > > Steve, > > > > Just a comment and question: > > > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but the > > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on the > > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off the > > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then that > > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > > > 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiar with > > 720p and 1080i. > > > > FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with > anamorphic > > squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly good > considering > > I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. > > > > -- > > Joe Marques > > > > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]... > > > Larry, > > > > > > I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video > > > consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. > > <snipped> > > > > >GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the > > > number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the > fabled > > > Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a total > of > > > 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles and > disc > > > brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play is > > superlative: > > > you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way up > the > > > ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race cars. > > > > > > The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with a built-in > hard > > > drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best of all, > for > > > $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a HDTV > > at > > > 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good as XGA > > > (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p screen, > > but > > > it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000 > > Samsung > > > 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but > does > > > little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC, um, > > > "experience." > > > > > <snipped> > > > > > >

Haqsau, What do you race with? I can't imagine the hand controller is any good and I've heard all the wheels are poor as well. -- Joe Marques "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:alfutn$1p1t5d$[email hidden]... > Just got Sega GT 2002 a couple of days ago, and haven't had a chance to > get deep into it yet, but based on early impressions the AI is quite > good. You really do have to race them, and they do try to avoid hitting > you for the most part. My only gripes so far are that it supports a > maximum of two players and that the four controller schemes offered are > all significantly different from the other driving games I have. Other > than that it is a lot of fun, with more vehicles than any other Xbox > game currently. Also the career mode is pretty cool, you have to earn > money to buy, upgrade, and repair your cars. > > > "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:NIKe9.257398$[email hidden]... > > Steve, > > > > Just a comment and question: > > > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but > the > > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on > the > > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off > the > > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then > that > > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > > .... >

"Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> writes:

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> Steve, > > Just a comment and question: > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but the > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on the > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off the > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then that > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiar with > 720p and 1080i.

Is there such thing as European HDTV ? I thought it was only in NTSC so far. > FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with anamorphic > squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly good considering > I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. Does it support true RGB on the SCART ? Wonder how that would look my my 32"WS Philips :) -- Olav Malmin remove .spam when replying

Just the standard controller. I won't buy a wheel because for the most part I don't play these games single player, and I don't want to either a) buy 4 wheels or b) try and play while the other three guys are glaring at me for being the only guy with a wheel. ;o) The only game for which I was not able to get used to steering with the standard controller was F1 2001, which I eventually sold for that reason alone. PGR, Rallisport, and NASCAR Heat all work fine if you practice enough. The annoying thing with PGR and Rallisport though is that they don't feel like they model engine inertia correctly, because they just zoom right up to the redline as soon as you get on the gas, making manual shifting a real workout. I have been playing those with auto shifting since I can't seem to get used to how fast you have to shift them in manual mode. Sega GT does feel a bit more realistic in this regard, but I can't get used to any of the stupid control layouts they came up with, so I am now playing that with auto shift also. Really other than that the game is quite good though. "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:yBOe9.523870$[email hidden]... > Haqsau, > > What do you race with? I can't imagine the hand controller is anygood and > I've heard all the wheels are poor as well. > > -- > Joe Marques >

FWIW Rallisport is very playable on the standard controller. "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:HAOe9.260788$[email hidden]... > > I'm not too disappointed since I won't use the Xbox for racing withouta > good wheel. Heard the TM is pretty poor, what do you think? WhatXbox > racer do you like? I'm thinking Rallisport as a first purchase if theTM > wheel is any good. >

"Larry" <[email hidden]> writes: > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? afaik the Xbox doesn't have force feedback (or at least noone to my knowledge have relased an FF-wheel for it), so racing games are right out on that box, imho. I'd advice getting a PS2 and WRC instead. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 FJ�SE!

Uwe Schuerkamp <[email hidden]> writes:

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> On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 18:26:41 GMT, Larry wrote: > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to drop > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > I read on Slashdot the other day that a group of very talented > hackers got SuSE Linux 8.0 to run on the Xbox, so for this > price you'd get a decent computer for mail, surfing, news and > what not, using a free, secure operating system not plagued by > virii. > > Who knows, something interesting (and good) might come of this.

Linux has been on the PS2 for quite a while now. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 "Det er nok ingen ovn, men fartsm�leren v�r."

Rallisport is pretty good for now, altho the stages are over all to quickly (particularly in relation to Mobil 1 RC). There's lotta stuff in the pipeline: GP4, a coupla NASCAR titles, Need for Speed, MB World Racing, Pro Race Driver, plus whatever Papy brings to the table...when, as, and if. "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:HAOe9.260788$[email hidden]... > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ydOe9.223267$[email hidden]... > > Joe, > > > > 1. GT3's AI is hyped as "adaptive," meaning it tries to mold itself toyer > > driving profile. Like GPL's (and unlike NfS'), it doesn't work verywell. > > I agree that it would be atrocious...if this was an open-wheel game, but > > it's not. If you ain't rubbin' you ain't racin'. I can give as good asI > > get...in the lower classes (I haven't been up against the big boys). > > I love rubbin' and racing, particularly in NASCAR but I still think the AI > has no awareness of my presence on the track. They're running the sameline > with or without me in the path. > > I also didn't find the AI very challenging. I was running the higherclass

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> races and winning every one of them with little trouble. BTW, I'm not a > great driver as far as guys in this ng but on GT3 I'm Wolfgang Woeger. :0) > > > > > 1a. Sega GT isn't anything like driving a real car (my criterion for > whether > > or not it gets in the MT story). My notes say it's a Project Gotham > Racing > > wannabe. It recognized my TM NASCAR Pro Victory wheel...but not the > pedals, > > so I had to drive using hand controls, like a paraplegic. Pretty

graphics,

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> > tho. > > I'm not too disappointed since I won't use the Xbox for racing without a > good wheel. Heard the TM is pretty poor, what do you think? What Xbox > racer do you like? I'm thinking Rallisport as a first purchase if the TM > wheel is any good. > > > > > 2. Sorry, got it wrong. It's 720p and 1080i (or whatever the American > > standards are). This is where the Xbox shines. The image on a 27-in. > HDTV > > is as good as anything I've seen on *my* 21-in. Sony Trinitron monitor. > > > > --Steve > > Thanks for the comments Steve. > > -- > Joe Marques > > > > > > > > "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:NIKe9.257398$[email hidden]... > > > Steve, > > > > > > Just a comment and question: > > > > > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but > the > > > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on

the > > > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me offthe > > > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) then > that > > > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > > > > > 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiarwith

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> > > 720p and 1080i. > > > > > > FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with > > anamorphic > > > squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly good > > considering > > > I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. > > > > > > -- > > > Joe Marques > > > > > > > > > "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:Z3ne9.214185$[email hidden]... > > > > Larry, > > > > > > > > I'm working on a story for Motor Trend abt. driving games for video > > > > consoles, and thus far, Grand Turismo 3 is the hands-down winner. > > > <snipped> > > > > > > >GT3 has two enormous advantages: one, the > > > > number of licensed cars is staggering (Ford GT40, Shelby Cobra, the > > fabled > > > > Nissan Skyline, Jaguar XJ220, the Dome-like Toyota GT-1, etc.), a > total > > of > > > > 150 cars, and each is lovingly detailed down to the door handles and > > disc > > > > brakes that glow red under braking. And two, the game play is > > > superlative: > > > > you get drawn in right away, and remain hooked on climbing your way

up > > the > > > > ladder from competing in little shit-boxes to million-dollar race > cars. > > > > > > > > The Xbox has a definite technical advantage: it comes with abuilt-in > > hard > > > > drive and Ethernet port (these are add-ons for the PS2). Best ofall, > > for > > > > $19.95, you can get an adapter cable that allows you to jack into a > HDTV > > > at > > > > 820p or 1020i, which gives you a fantastic image - it's as good asXGA

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> > > > (1024x768) on a computer monitor. The PS2 can output to an 820p > screen, > > > but > > > > it's not quite as good. I've been testing both consoles on a $1000 > > > Samsung > > > > 27-inch HDTV that includes a line-doubler (which transforms DVDs but > > does > > > > little for videotapes) which yields nothing--visually--to the PC,

um,

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> > > > "experience." > > > > > > > <snipped> > > > > > > > > > > > >

Agree. Get a PS2 for racing (GT3 and WRC for now, and GT4 and WRC2 for later), and/or an Xbox for show...if you've gotta HDTV. "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "Larry" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going todrop

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> > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > afaik the Xbox doesn't have force feedback (or at least noone to my > knowledge have relased an FF-wheel for it), so racing games are right > out on that box, imho. > > I'd advice getting a PS2 and WRC instead. > > -- > Gunnar > #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 > FJ�SE!

Eurpeens don't need no stinkeen HDTV; PAL/SECAM/whatever's already got 800 lines of rez. "Olav Malmin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > Steve, > > > > Just a comment and question: > > > > 1) The RACING in GT3 is atrocious. It's a terrific DRIVING game but

the > > woefully inept AI killed it for me (they do not even know you're on the > > track). I raced to get AWAY from them so they wouldn't drive me off the > > track. ;0) If Sega GT 2002 has good AI (as I've heard it does) thenthat

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> > alone makes it a winner for racing fans. > > > > 2) Are 820p and 1020i European HDTV resolutions? I'm only familiar with > > 720p and 1080i. > > Is there such thing as European HDTV ? I thought it was only in NTSC > so far. > > > FWIW, the Xbox looks phenomenal on my 36" Digital Sony Wega (with

anamorphic > > squeeze which most Xbox games support). It's surprisingly goodconsidering

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> > I play games on a 21" Trinitron PC monitor which is hard to beat. > > Does it support true RGB on the SCART ? Wonder how that would look my > my 32"WS Philips :) > > -- > Olav Malmin > remove .spam when replying

"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> writes:

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> "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > There are rumors floating around indicating that Microsoft is going to > drop > > > the price of the XBOX down to $149. > > > > > > As much as I hate consoles, I just might have to get one at that price. > > > > > > What is the BEST racing game available on the XBOX ? > > > > afaik the Xbox doesn't have force feedback (or at least noone to my > > knowledge have relased an FF-wheel for it), so racing games are right > > out on that box, imho. > > > > I'd advice getting a PS2 and WRC instead. > > Agree. Get a PS2 for racing (GT3 and WRC for now, and GT4 and WRC2 for > later), and/or an Xbox for show...if you've gotta HDTV.

me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still were stuff is happening. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 myk, trygg og god.

The Xbox's not even out a year and people are saying it's dead. The lack of patience in this instant gratification world is incredible. How well was the Sony's offering doing after 1 year? IMO, no one has made an original game for years. I kinda think this is somewhat original though. It's a 4D game. The added dimension being time. It's an Xbox exclusive. http://www.xbox.com/blinx/default.htm?cs_catalog=cat%2dus Japanese developed too. -- ==================================================== "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote one time from band camp this in message news:[email hidden]... : me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever : sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by : one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with : everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is : inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still : were stuff is happening. :

> me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever > sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by > one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with > everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is > inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still > were stuff is happening. 12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all available for it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any more for eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the PS2, it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can assure you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas.....

On Tue, 10 Sep 2002 12:32:30 +1000, "Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote: >12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all available for >it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The >Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any more for >eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the PS2, >it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can assure >you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas..... I dunno, Sony has to be smiling pretty broadly knowing that they already have exclusive rights to what will without a doubt be the best selling game of the year. Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

> I dunno, Sony has to be smiling pretty broadly knowing that they > already have exclusive rights to what will without a doubt be the best > selling game of the year. and that would be... ?

"Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> writes:

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> > me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever > > sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by > > one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with > > everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is > > inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still > > were stuff is happening. > > 12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all available for > it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The > Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any more for > eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the PS2, > it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can assure > you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas.....

so you are saying that Xbox has plenty of games that aren't just ports from other platforms? -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 to err is human -- to forgive is bovine.

Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. You really need to define "port". If the game comes out at exactly the same time as the PS/2's and GC's then it's not a port. If the game has been enhanced, it may be a "port", but it's better then the original, so being a "port" isn't a bad thing. ==================================================== "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... : "Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> writes: : : > > me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever : > > sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by : > > one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with : > > everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is : > > inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still : > > were stuff is happening. : > : > 12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all available for : > it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The : > Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any more for : > eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the PS2, : > it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can assure : > you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas..... : : so you are saying that Xbox has plenty of games that aren't just ports : from other platforms? : : -- : Gunnar : #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 : to err is human -- to forgive is bovine.

I think the issue is that multi-platform development suffers from the lowest common denominator syndrome: develop it for the PS2 and "port" it to the other 2 more powerful systems. Games that come out on all three should look the best on the Xbox but don't because it's too expensive/time consuming to upgrade the look just for the Xbox. Xbox exclusives usually look terrific because they maximize the hardware of the Xbox. Compare Halo to Turok as an example. Also look at DOA3 and Enclave for what the Xbox CAN do vs. what developers actually deliver in multi-platform development. In the pipeline some Xbox exclusives that should impress include: Panzer Dragoon Orta, Star Wars: KOTOR, Blinx, Toejam & Earl, Whacked!, Unreal Championship, Brute Force, and MechAssault. -- Joe Marques "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UEnf9.66933$[email hidden]... > Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. > > You really need to define "port". > If the game comes out at exactly the same time as the PS/2's and GC's then > it's not a port. > If the game has been enhanced, it may be a "port", but it's better then the > original, so being a "port" isn't a bad thing. > > > > > ==================================================== > > > "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > : "Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> writes: > : > : > > me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever > : > > sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by > : > > one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting with > : > > everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is > : > > inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still > : > > were stuff is happening. > : > > : > 12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all available > for > : > it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The > : > Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any more > for > : > eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the > PS2, > : > it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can > assure > : > you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas..... > : > : so you are saying that Xbox has plenty of games that aren't just ports > : from other platforms? > : > : -- > : Gunnar > : #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 > : to err is human -- to forgive is bovine. > >

On Tue, 10 Sep 2002 11:50:24 -0300, "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. So Doom 3 isn't coming out for the PC? Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

We're talking about consoles aren't we? Will DOOM3 be on the PS/2 NO, will it be on the GC, NO. Will it be on the PC, hell yes. In terms of all three consoles, only XBox will have this game, that's somewhat exclusive. -- ==================================================== "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... : On Tue, 10 Sep 2002 11:50:24 -0300, "PositiveG" : <[email hidden]> wrote: : : >Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. : : So Doom 3 isn't coming out for the PC? : : Jason : : ----- : GPLRank 24.50 : N2002Rank -12.995

I agree, somewhat. However, some so called ports, do include additional items, gameplay, features, etc.. I believe Genima Onishima (sp) does as well as Spiderman. Also, have you noticed on TV ads when they show in game play, what consoles logo is displayed? Xbox. Street Hoops for example. Anyhow, it's a good time to be a gamer, some quality stuff coming our way. ==================================================== "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jLsf9.303918$[email hidden]... : I think the issue is that multi-platform development suffers from the lowest : common denominator syndrome: develop it for the PS2 and "port" it to the : other 2 more powerful systems. Games that come out on all three should look : the best on the Xbox but don't because it's too expensive/time consuming to : upgrade the look just for the Xbox. Xbox exclusives usually look terrific : because they maximize the hardware of the Xbox. Compare Halo to Turok as an : example. Also look at DOA3 and Enclave for what the Xbox CAN do vs. what : developers actually deliver in multi-platform development. : : In the pipeline some Xbox exclusives that should impress include: Panzer : Dragoon Orta, Star Wars: KOTOR, Blinx, Toejam & Earl, Whacked!, Unreal : Championship, Brute Force, and MechAssault. : : -- : Joe Marques : : : "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message : news:UEnf9.66933$[email hidden]... : > Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. : > : > You really need to define "port". : > If the game comes out at exactly the same time as the PS/2's and GC's then : > it's not a port. : > If the game has been enhanced, it may be a "port", but it's better then : the : > original, so being a "port" isn't a bad thing. : > : > : > : > : > ==================================================== : > : > : > "Gunnar Horrigmo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message : > news:[email hidden]... : > : "Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> writes: : > : : > : > > me an a couple of friends have just about every gaming console ever : > : > > sold, and I don't think I've ever been so thoroughly disappointed by : > : > > one as much as the XBox. sure, the hardware is up there fighting : with : > : > > everyone, but there are almost NO original games! the box is : > : > > inarguably better than the ps2 technology-wise, but the ps2 is still : > : > > were stuff is happening. : > : > : > : > 12 months after the PS2 was released, there was still jack-all : available : > for : > : > it. At least the Xbox had some decent games when it launched. The : > : > Dreamcast proved that you don't necessarily need beefy hardware any : more : > for : > : > eye-popping visuals. Although the Xbox is technically superior to the : > PS2, : > : > it's still going to come down to the skill of the game makers. I can : > assure : > : > you though, it's going to be an Xbox Christmas..... : > : : > : so you are saying that Xbox has plenty of games that aren't just ports : > : from other platforms? : > : : > : -- : > : Gunnar : > : #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: : 2 : > : to err is human -- to forgive is bovine. : > : > : :

Steve, Not sure where you are coming from with the comment below. At the risk of asking a stupid question, did you find and turn off the traction control and stability aids? Granted the cars feel a tad unrealistic with them on, but when you turn them off I thought they felt pretty good. They do seem to be biased towards heavy understeer, but that can easily be cured in the garage menu. Also with regards to the pedals not working, again I have to ask the stupid question: did you look at the control layout in the options menu? The default (A) has accelerator and brake on buttons rather than on the triggers, hence your pedals wouldn't do what you expected. If you switch to control layout B or D the gas and brake should be where you expect them to be. There is no reason that I know of for the TM pedals not to work - all they do is send the same signals the hand controllers do. I'm pretty sure you can fix the problem by just changing the control layout as I said. Now if I am right about the above you really need to give this game another chance. I was a little miffed about a couple of things at first too, but since I took the time to set it up the way I liked and really started playing it, I have been having a blast. The tracks are much better than the tracks in PGR, and the AI is among the best I have seen in any racing game, console or otherwise. And both the Sega GT 2002 mode and the chronicle mode are quite addictive. Regards, Hal "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ydOe9.223267$[email hidden]... > > 1a. Sega GT isn't anything like driving a real car (my criterion forwhether > or not it gets in the MT story). My notes say it's a Project GothamRacing > wannabe. It recognized my TM NASCAR Pro Victory wheel...but not thepedals, > so I had to drive using hand controls, like a paraplegic. Prettygraphics, > tho. >

Only two words need be said about the Xbox's future: Ninja Gaiden!!! (And yes, that is worth three gratuitous exclamation points, check out the previews if you don't believe me) "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jLsf9.303918$[email hidden]... > > In the pipeline some Xbox exclusives that should impress include:Panzer > Dragoon Orta, Star Wars: KOTOR, Blinx, Toejam & Earl, Whacked!, Unreal > Championship, Brute Force, and MechAssault. >

That is definitely the best attitude to have. ;o) "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Omtf9.67069$[email hidden]... > > Anyhow, it's a good time to be a gamer, some quality stuff coming ourway. >

Believe you? I'm with you!!!! (4 gratuitous exclamation points - your three plus I raise you one). ;0) Who doesn't want to be a Ninja? Game looks amazing. -- Joe Marques "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:allq03$1rrkmt$[email hidden]... > Only two words need be said about the Xbox's future: Ninja Gaiden!!! > (And yes, that is worth three gratuitous exclamation points, check out > the previews if you don't believe me) > > "Joe Marques" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:jLsf9.303918$[email hidden]... > > > > In the pipeline some Xbox exclusives that should impress include: > Panzer > > Dragoon Orta, Star Wars: KOTOR, Blinx, Toejam & Earl, Whacked!, Unreal > > Championship, Brute Force, and MechAssault. > > > >

"PositiveG" <[email hidden]> writes: > Sure it will have plenty of exclusives DOOM3 for example. do you know something I don't know? last time I checked, Doom 3 was coming for the PC (too). > You really need to define "port". > If the game comes out at exactly the same time as the PS/2's and GC's then > it's not a port. I agree. > If the game has been enhanced, it may be a "port", but it's better then the > original, so being a "port" isn't a bad thing. doesn't change the fact that we've already played through it. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 "a poster is a human being or the software equivalent"

On Tue, 10 Sep 2002 18:16:00 -0300, "PositiveG" <[email hidden]> wrote: >In terms of all three consoles, only XBox will have this game, that's >somewhat exclusive. Gotcha. I usually don't think of games that come out for a console and PC as exclusive, that's all. Still, PS2 has GTA:VC which I would expect to singlehandedly outsell almost everything released for the xbox and gamecube combined for the next 3-4 months. Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

True enough, they certainly have the market share with their 2000 model console. Solitaire probably gets played more then all games combined if your really think about it (not everyone's a gamer, but most PC owners have tried Solitaire). This thought just came to mind. Toyota out sells Porsche too, but what car's on more peoples background computer wallpaper! PS - It's not the Matrix and the model number probably starts with the number 9!! :-) ==================================================== "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... : On Tue, 10 Sep 2002 18:16:00 -0300, "PositiveG" : <[email hidden]> wrote: : : >In terms of all three consoles, only XBox will have this game, that's : >somewhat exclusive. : : Gotcha. I usually don't think of games that come out for a console : and PC as exclusive, that's all. : : Still, PS2 has GTA:VC which I would expect to singlehandedly outsell : almost everything released for the xbox and gamecube combined for the : next 3-4 months. : : Jason : : ----- : GPLRank 24.50 : N2002Rank -12.995

> Only two words need be said about the Xbox's future: Ninja Gaiden!!! > (And yes, that is worth three gratuitous exclamation points, check out > the previews if you don't believe me) Ooo..I remember playing the original, arcade 'Ninja Gaiden' back in my youth, except it was called 'Shadow Warriors' here in Australia. Sure, it was rip-off of Double Dragon but it played very nicely.. : )

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> >In terms of all three consoles, only XBox will have this game, that's > >somewhat exclusive. > > Gotcha. I usually don't think of games that come out for a console > and PC as exclusive, that's all. > > Still, PS2 has GTA:VC which I would expect to singlehandedly outsell > almost everything released for the xbox and gamecube combined for the > next 3-4 months.

I played 'GTAIII' on the PC and I thought it was bog-average. I much preferred 'Driver.' It's all about marketing, and Sony are the undisputed kings of that. They're capable of convincing Eskimos that they need air-conditioners! - especially teenage Eskimos ; )

On Wed, 11 Sep 2002 21:11:39 +1000, "Damien Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I played 'GTAIII' on the PC and I thought it was bog-average. I much >preferred 'Driver.' It's all about marketing No, it's about GTAIII being an incredible game. =p The game wasn't pushed any harder than any other GTA or Rockstar game - witness the awful but heavily promoted Italian Job and State of Emergency - but it sold in piles because the gameplay was superb. I can't even think of a single game that allowed seamless driving/walking in the same engine aside from the earlier top-down GTA titles. Mafia beats it hands down, particularly in terms of character development and driving physics, but the previews of GTA:VC are incredible. Very few games, if any, offer the amount of freedom that the most recent GTA titles have offered. They're severely lacking as driving simulators, but that's hardly the appeal of the games. Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

It would have been MUCH worse if it would have come from the current administration, I think. -Larry "Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Sun, 08 Sep 2002 03:32:37 GMT, Larry wrote: > > Until Microsoft shuts it down under the DMCA, that is. I smell itcoming. > > > > The worst technology law ever conceived by politicians who have nofriggin'

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> > idea what they are doing. > > > > Agreed... some good came of the former administration, but this > one was just ridiculous. It's reason enough to become an active > supporter of the EFF. > > Cheers, > > uwe > > > -- > mail replies to Uwe at schuerkamp dot de ( yahoo address is spambox) > Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ > Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) > GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61