New CMR3 Video w/ 6DOF POV

http://www.nlgaming.com/media/Xbox/2293/1.WMV Looks promising. The music is lame in this vid' and it looks like an XBox preview. Isn't this a Codemasters title? The physics look a lot like Rally Trophy. I'm looking forward to this. Another one that I may have to buy for the console as it seems almost everyone is doing first these days. What do you think? - Dave Cook

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.. This game only looks good in screenshots!! (and I love looking at CMR3 screenshots). This video only seems to prove my point. I'm sure I'm not the most qualified to make judgements on physics, since I haven't studied it or tried to make my own sim like some people in here. However, having played most rally games under the sun (Mobil 1, Rally Masters, CMR2, VRally (hated it), Rally Trophy, LFS dirt track, etc..) Cars in most of those other games look like they have basic physical formulas applied to them (some better than others). Where the cars move in a logical sort of way, and an expected way. In all the CMR3 videos I've watched (I got a decent amount on the HD) it just looks like "Something is up". Does anyone get the same feeling? Meaning, there's "extra" formulas at work (not trying to mimic physics). For example the car seems to get held into a powerslide or something. And coming out of a powerslide, there seems to be a strange force that pushes the car into the inside of the corner while exiting. There's also the strange problem I have with the wheels seemingly having nothing to do with what is actually happening. It seems like forces aren't being calculated at the wheels, and only calculated in the center of the car. Sort of like the old game "Super Sprint". Like, if the programming wouldn't explicitly prevent it, when standing still turning the wheel would make the car literally turn on a dime around it's center point. There's one section on the video where a car goes off and seems to scrub off some speed, but some mysterious force seems to immediatly give them back momentum once it goes on the 'fast surface' again. These are the exact same problems I have with CMR2. So it seems like they spent a LOT of time on some amazing car models and graphics and weird pit sequences instead of some sort of physics. Tracks look amazing though and well-detailed. I'm sure the clip of the snow rally looked a bit too wide for most people in here though. But still awesome. Now, won't someone PLEAAAAAAAAASE Figure out a way to take those tracks and those car models and import them into the final version of LFS? I'll gladly pay lots of money. In defense of the video though.. I do think the video is from Xbox and the controller being used seems to be an analog stick or maybe even a D-Pad.. with a really bad driver. And I'm probably biased and possibly attempting to show off by trying to be an auto sim elitist. :) Time for bed.. Mike http://mikebeauchamp.com "Dave Cook" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:w8Rh9.1407$[email hidden]... > http://www.nlgaming.com/media/Xbox/2293/1.WMV > > Looks promising. The music is lame in this vid' and it looks like an XBox > preview. Isn't this a Codemasters title? The physics look a lot likeRally > Trophy. I'm looking forward to this. Another one that I may have to buyfor > the console as it seems almost everyone is doing first these days. Whatdo you > think? > > - Dave Cook > >

Hi, I agree that the video doesn't look very promising from a physics realism perspective. Rally Trophy is much more realistic than this. One of the first things I notice is that the focus acts more like a tail happy 1970s RWD escort than a modern 4WD rally car. Have at look at the turn in, especially on the tarmac stage at the start. The car instantly and smoothly oversteers with no push from the front at all. This is bullshit! The 4WD rally cars are prone to massive understeer unless pushed really hard. What happens in reality is that you see a lot of positive lock (understeer) on initial turn in, then as the power is applied after the car starts turning in, the driver can evoke power oversteer, resulting in a four wheel drift. Above all, the real rally cars are quite twitchy. The car in the video appears to be doing nothing more than a smooth pendulum. Its only on the snow these days where you seen the spectaclar and graceful big drifts that the Focus seems to be doing around every corner on CMR3. If the physics were realistic, it should be possible for the driver to choose her mode of driving. She could just turn in with no throttle and understeer around the curve, or unblance the car and throw it sideways. I'll give you 10-1 that in CMR3, the car is going to oversteer around the curves no matter what the driver does. Very dissapointed. Tim

why dont we wait untill it comes out at least , then crap all over it Staf "Tim Epstein" <eppy@no)spam.pobox.com> wrote in message news:EnXh9.631$[email hidden]...

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> Hi, > > I agree that the video doesn't look very promising from a physics realism > perspective. Rally Trophy is much more realistic than this. > > One of the first things I notice is that the focus acts more like a tail > happy 1970s RWD escort than a modern 4WD rally car. Have at look at the

turn > in, especially on the tarmac stage at the start. The car instantly and > smoothly oversteers with no push from the front at all. This is bullshit! > The 4WD rally cars are prone to massive understeer unless pushed really > hard. What happens in reality is that you see a lot of positive lock > (understeer) on initial turn in, then as the power is applied after thecar > starts turning in, the driver can evoke power oversteer, resulting in afour

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> wheel drift. Above all, the real rally cars are quite twitchy. The car in > the video appears to be doing nothing more than a smooth pendulum. > > Its only on the snow these days where you seen the spectaclar and graceful > big drifts that the Focus seems to be doing around every corner on CMR3. > > If the physics were realistic, it should be possible for the driver to > choose her mode of driving. She could just turn in with no throttle and > understeer around the curve, or unblance the car and throw it sideways.

I'll > give you 10-1 that in CMR3, the car is going to oversteer around thecurves

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> no matter what the driver does. > > Very dissapointed. > Tim > > >

I never said "This is how the game is.". The game could come out and be amazing... But I think we are just talking about all the videos and stuff we have seen, and previous experience with CMR2. Nobody here is claiming they've played and then deemed it to be a hunk of crap. Mike http://mikebeuahcamp.com "staf" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3d8863f2$0$[email hidden]...

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> why dont we wait untill it comes out at least , then crap all over it > Staf > "Tim Epstein" <eppy@no)spam.pobox.com> wrote in message > news:EnXh9.631$[email hidden]... > > Hi, > > > > I agree that the video doesn't look very promising from a physics

realism

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> > perspective. Rally Trophy is much more realistic than this. > > > > One of the first things I notice is that the focus acts more like a tail > > happy 1970s RWD escort than a modern 4WD rally car. Have at look at the > turn > > in, especially on the tarmac stage at the start. The car instantly and > > smoothly oversteers with no push from the front at all. This is

bullshit!

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> > The 4WD rally cars are prone to massive understeer unless pushed really > > hard. What happens in reality is that you see a lot of positive lock > > (understeer) on initial turn in, then as the power is applied after the > car > > starts turning in, the driver can evoke power oversteer, resulting in a > four > > wheel drift. Above all, the real rally cars are quite twitchy. The car

in > > the video appears to be doing nothing more than a smooth pendulum. > > > > Its only on the snow these days where you seen the spectaclar andgraceful

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> > big drifts that the Focus seems to be doing around every corner on CMR3. > > > > If the physics were realistic, it should be possible for the driver to > > choose her mode of driving. She could just turn in with no throttle and > > understeer around the curve, or unblance the car and throw it sideways. > I'll > > give you 10-1 that in CMR3, the car is going to oversteer around the > curves > > no matter what the driver does. > > > > Very dissapointed. > > Tim > > > > > > > >

"Tim Epstein" <eppy@no)spam.pobox.com> writes: > I agree that the video doesn't look very promising from a physics realism > perspective. Rally Trophy is much more realistic than this.[snip] I think you're way too kind, really. obviously, I haven't tried it, but from the videos it looks to me like we haven't seen anything quite so arcadey since Need for Speed 1. imho, the videos doesn't show any resemblance to RL handling at all. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 "Det er nok ingen ovn, men fartsm�leren v�r."

"Dave Cook" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:w8Rh9.1407$[email hidden]... > http://www.nlgaming.com/media/Xbox/2293/1.WMV > Looks promising. The music is lame in this vid' and it looks like anXBox > preview. Isn't this a Codemasters title? The physics look a lot likeRally > Trophy. I'm looking forward to this. Another one that I may have tobuy for > the console as it seems almost everyone is doing first these days.What do you > think? Honestly? I can't really say. I didn't get to buy CMR2 when it was in stores. I didn't like CMR1 that much mainly because those times are a bit hard to beat when I try 4WD cars. I can win championships in 2WD but somehow the 4WD times completely eludes me. The rally school is worth less in CMR1. I have Rally Masters and I like that physics model better than the one in CMR. I have RC (M1RC to some folks) and I didn't quite like that one as much until I found RALWIZ... Even with RALWIZ, I'd say I STILL prefer RM over RC. :-) As for the video... I dunno. graphics looks good in a "game-y" sort of a way. On some scenes you can see trees POP into view. The cars look a "bit" artificial. I guess it will depend on how it "feels" when you actually get to drive them. --KC

> > I agree that the video doesn't look very promising from a physicsrealism

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> > perspective. Rally Trophy is much more realistic than this. > [snip] > > I think you're way too kind, really. obviously, I haven't tried it, > but from the videos it looks to me like we haven't seen anything quite > so arcadey since Need for Speed 1. > > imho, the videos doesn't show any resemblance to RL handling at all.

er.. that's what I thought I meant! However, I should add that this game will probably be a fantastic success commercially, and bring in millions for the companies behind it. They've done their homework, and determined what will be successful from a commercial basis. The core market (ages 12-25) will love the cool graphics, online play and ease of drving - being able to get in a have fun with a few minutes of practice. We, the simmers, are are a small minority of the market, and must accept this. If the game had what we wanted, it might fail miserably because it would be too difficult for the average gamer to master in the normal period (1-2 hours) before they give up in frustration and return the game.

hi, You can love it or hate but V-rally1 and V-rally3 have real 4wheels/suspension physics with 3 slip limited differential and all the stuff of real physcics but tyre settings are made for the game to be drivable with a pad. Sebastien TIXIER - Game Developer Dynamics and Car Physics http://www.eden-studios.fr GPLRank Normal:-44.24 Monster:-124.44