NASCAR 2002: Are we crazy... Not Really..!!!

Something to ponder! Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been caught, but we idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the lowest form of pond scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not really you see that in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts its interest information to ponder! PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game more realistic!

Pauly Milum wrote:

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> > Something to ponder! > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > caught, but we > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the > lowest form of pond > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > really you see that > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts its > interest > information to ponder! > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > more realistic!

Cool, a philosophical discussion about cheating, ethics, moral, idolizing and the connection between real life ethics and sim life ethics, can't wait to see where this one will end up :-) Personally I think cheaters should burn in whatever hell their religious beliefs has in store for them, I actually equate cheaters to lawyers and bankers, luckily I have no religious beliefs so I wont go to hell if I cheat, which I don't, as aside from the ethics side of it, I've never wanted to win bad enough to even consider cheating, but that's me I'm not more honest/righteous than the next guy, but if I'm to abandon my principles, I'm not doing it over some petty things like winning in an online computer game, now if I was to get my sweaty hands on a "few" million dollars with an exceptionally good chance of getting away with it, I might do it, but not for this Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

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> Something to ponder! > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > caught, but we > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the > lowest form of pond > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > really you see that > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts its > interest > information to ponder! > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > more realistic!

Cool, a philosophical discussion about cheating, ethics, moral, idolizing and the connection between real life ethics and sim life ethics, can't wait to see where this one will end up :-) Personally I think cheaters should burn in whatever hell their religious beliefs has in store for them, I actually equate cheaters to lawyers and bankers, luckily I have no religious beliefs so I wont go to hell if I cheat, which I don't, as aside from the ethics side of it, I've never wanted to win bad enough to even consider cheating, but that's me I'm not more honest/righteous than the next guy, but if I'm to abandon my principles, I'm not doing it over some petty things like winning in an online computer game, now if I was to get my sweaty hands on a "few" million dollars with an exceptionally good chance of getting away with it, I might do it, but not for this Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

So Goy, Than you wont support more cheating in sim racing to make the game more realistic.. lol "Goy Larsen" <" nbso"@nic.br> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > Pauly Milum wrote: > > > > Something to ponder! > > > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > > caught, but we > > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as

the > > lowest form of pond > > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > > really you see that > > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Butsits

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> > interest > > information to ponder! > > > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > > more realistic! > > Cool, a philosophical discussion about cheating, ethics, moral, > idolizing and the connection between real life ethics and sim life > ethics, can't wait to see where this one will end up :-) > > Personally I think cheaters should burn in whatever hell their religious > beliefs has in store for them, I actually equate cheaters to lawyers and > bankers, luckily I have no religious beliefs so I wont go to hell if I > cheat, which I don't, as aside from the ethics side of it, I've never > wanted to win bad enough to even consider cheating, but that's me > > I'm not more honest/righteous than the next guy, but if I'm to abandon > my principles, I'm not doing it over some petty things like winning in > an online computer game, now if I was to get my sweaty hands on a "few" > million dollars with an exceptionally good chance of getting away with > it, I might do it, but not for this > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > > http://www.theuspits.com > > "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" > --Groucho Marx--

>"Goy Larsen" <" nbso"@nic.br> wrote > Cool, a philosophical discussion about cheating, ethics, moral, > idolizing and the connection between real life ethics and sim life > ethics, can't wait to see where this one will end up :-) We should move this to general.discussion. Ok, perhaps not ;) The fact is, NASCAR had it's past, while we also have our own past and future also. Nobody, not even Papyrus, has said that they want a complete replica of real-life Winston Cup racing, or any NASCAR division. Papyrus has created their own division, their own different and virtual world therefore it needs to apply different kind of values compared to other motorsports. In this different virtual world, cheating has always been considered as something wrong (that world being gaming in general). Of course, the role of each driver is to push it's car to it's limit, therefore he can do it with whatever tool the developer gives him. When he goes beyond that (and often the line is blurred), it can be considered as cheating. Is it a bad thing? Well, I think so. If we were racing in real-life, it would be different. But we aren't. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

What, you get busted ? <g> John "Pauly Milum" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:23pn9.7084$[email hidden]...

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> Something to ponder! > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > caught, but we > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the > lowest form of pond > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > really you see that > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts

its

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> interest > information to ponder! > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > more realistic! > > >

Pauly Milum wrote: > > So Goy, Than you wont support more cheating in sim racing to make the game > more realistic.. lol Only if I can bring in a couple of friends of mine as the "anti cheat squad" and a free hand to deal with cheaters as I see fit, *then* I'm all for it Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ "A man is only as old as the woman he feels" --Groucho Marx--

In article <23pn9.7084$[email hidden]>, "Pauly Milum" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>Something to ponder! > >Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been >caught, but we >idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the >lowest form of pond >scum and worst!

Something ELSE to ponder! Not everyone shares your views... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:+8.03 N2002 Rank:+20.124 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Pauly Milum wrote:

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> Something to ponder! > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > caught, but we > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the > lowest form of pond > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > really you see that > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts its > interest > information to ponder! > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > more realistic!

One is a business, the other is an amateur sport. cheating is generally frowned on in sport, and the incentive is less.

you mean like the olympics...lol "Matthew V. Jessick" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Pauly Milum wrote: > > Something to ponder! > > > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > > caught, but we > > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest asthe > > lowest form of pond > > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > > really you see that > > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Butsits

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> > interest > > information to ponder! > > > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > > more realistic! > > One is a business, the other is an amateur sport. > cheating is generally frowned on in sport, and the incentive is less. > >

The way I see it, the Nascar teams are usually just pushing the envelope or the rules. Sometimes they go too far. Nascar is a multi-billion dollar organization and there's a lot more at stake than a pat on the back in the chat room. The people using software cheats to give themselves advantages are not pushing the rules. They are outright cheating and are the scum of the earth. That's just my opinion. -Larry "Pauly Milum" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:23pn9.7084$[email hidden]...

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> Something to ponder! > > Our hero's that race NASCAR are big time cheaters as they have all been > caught, but we > idiolize them. But the sim racers that allegedly cheat we detest as the > lowest form of pond > scum and worst! Think its a double standard not warped thinking. Not > really you see that > in one case we are a spectator and othe other we are a competitor. Buts

its

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> interest > information to ponder! > > PS. If nascar is cheating, than is cheating online just making the game > more realistic! > > >

I can't help but think that if we were still Nascar sanctioned (NROS) this issue would have been stamped out immediately... -Larry "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:knqn9.31$[email hidden]...

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> >"Goy Larsen" <" nbso"@nic.br> wrote > > Cool, a philosophical discussion about cheating, ethics, moral, > > idolizing and the connection between real life ethics and sim life > > ethics, can't wait to see where this one will end up :-) > > We should move this to general.discussion. Ok, perhaps not ;) > > > The fact is, NASCAR had it's past, while we also have our own past and > future also. Nobody, not even Papyrus, has said that they want a complete > replica of real-life Winston Cup racing, or any NASCAR division. Papyrus > has created their own division, their own different and virtual world > therefore it needs to apply different kind of values compared to other > motorsports. > > > In this different virtual world, cheating has always been considered as > something wrong (that world being gaming in general). Of course, the role > of each driver is to push it's car to it's limit, therefore he can do it > with whatever tool the developer gives him. When he goes beyond that (and > often the line is blurred), it can be considered as cheating. Is it a bad > thing? Well, I think so. If we were racing in real-life, it would be > different. > > But we aren't. > > > > > > > -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > >

Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7rOn9.79869$[email hidden]... > I can't help but think that if we were still Nascar sanctioned (NROS) this > issue would have been stamped out immediately... > > -Larry > 1) Were we ever "Nascar sanctioned?"... I don't think so. 2) To stamp out the cheating problem would put this cyber-sport out of the financial reach of a large percent of the target audience. Running off the shelf hardware, Microsoft OS, over the internet, in the privacy of your home opens up so many security holes that it's impossible to stamp out cheating.

NROS was indeed a Nascar sanctioned event. -Larry "Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eoPn9.11032$[email hidden]... > > Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7rOn9.79869$[email hidden]... > > I can't help but think that if we were still Nascar sanctioned (NROS)this

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> > issue would have been stamped out immediately... > > > > -Larry > > > > 1) Were we ever "Nascar sanctioned?"... I don't think so. > 2) To stamp out the cheating problem would put this cyber-sport out of the > financial reach of a large percent of the target audience. > > Running off the shelf hardware, Microsoft OS, over the internet, in the > privacy of your home opens up so many security holes that it's impossible

to > stamp out cheating. > > > >

Is there any reliable documentation to backup your claim? An official press release from Nascar to that effect? I know Nascar was paid a licensing fee, but that doesn't make it a Nascar sanctioned event. Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ni6o9.84400$[email hidden]...

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> NROS was indeed a Nascar sanctioned event. > > -Larry > > "Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eoPn9.11032$[email hidden]... > > > > Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:7rOn9.79869$[email hidden]... > > > I can't help but think that if we were still Nascar sanctioned (NROS) > this > > > issue would have been stamped out immediately... > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > 1) Were we ever "Nascar sanctioned?"... I don't think so. > > 2) To stamp out the cheating problem would put this cyber-sport out of

the > > financial reach of a large percent of the target audience. > > > > Running off the shelf hardware, Microsoft OS, over the internet, in the > > privacy of your home opens up so many security holes that it'simpossible

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> to > > stamp out cheating. > > > > > > > > > > >

"Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:f8ao9.13138$[email hidden]...

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> Is there any reliable documentation to backup your claim? > > An official press release from Nascar to that effect? > > I know Nascar was paid a licensing fee, but that doesn't make it a Nascar > sanctioned event. >

I seem to remember several statements by Nascar that NROS was something like the 13th official racing division. Below ASA and ARCA and the Winston West and Super Mods etc. But do I have any proof? nope. dave henrie

>"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote > I seem to remember several statements by Nascar that NROS was something > like the 13th official racing division. Below ASA and ARCA and theWinston > West and Super Mods etc. But do I have any proof? nope. Anyway, while the term was used by NASCAR, it was nothing more then a failed PR move. NASCAR just licensed their name and usage, nothing more. It held no administrative power, nothing... -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Mike White wrote:

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> > Is there any reliable documentation to backup your claim? > > An official press release from Nascar to that effect? > > I know Nascar was paid a licensing fee, but that doesn't make it a Nascar > sanctioned event.

Of course we have documentation on this, our Nascar licenses, and as soon as mine is delivered I'll scan it and post it for everyone to DL.... Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Just the old NROS page. I doubt it's there any more. It's all gone so it hardly matters. What a terrible loss. -Larry "Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:f8ao9.13138$[email hidden]...

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> Is there any reliable documentation to backup your claim? > > An official press release from Nascar to that effect? > > I know Nascar was paid a licensing fee, but that doesn't make it a Nascar > sanctioned event. > > > Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ni6o9.84400$[email hidden]... > > NROS was indeed a Nascar sanctioned event. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:eoPn9.11032$[email hidden]... > > > > > > Larry <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:7rOn9.79869$[email hidden]... > > > > I can't help but think that if we were still Nascar sanctioned

(NROS)

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> > this > > > > issue would have been stamped out immediately... > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > 1) Were we ever "Nascar sanctioned?"... I don't think so. > > > 2) To stamp out the cheating problem would put this cyber-sport out of > the > > > financial reach of a large percent of the target audience. > > > > > > Running off the shelf hardware, Microsoft OS, over the internet, in

the

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> > > privacy of your home opens up so many security holes that it's > impossible > > to > > > stamp out cheating. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Yep. Unfortunately they only had one 'season' before TEN went under :( -Larry "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:xkao9.68112$DN4.10120@sccrnsc01...

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> > "Mike White" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:f8ao9.13138$[email hidden]... > > Is there any reliable documentation to backup your claim? > > > > An official press release from Nascar to that effect? > > > > I know Nascar was paid a licensing fee, but that doesn't make it a

Nascar > > sanctioned event. > > > I seem to remember several statements by Nascar that NROS was something > like the 13th official racing division. Below ASA and ARCA and theWinston > West and Super Mods etc. But do I have any proof? nope. > dave henrie > >