Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them
shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City called for
clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't gonna
stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race??
dave henrie
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02
> Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them
> shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City calledfor
> clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn'tgonna
> stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race??
I would have done the same thing - counted on the drivers having a little
more patience and driving to the conditions.
Having said that, the rain was absolutely pounding down. The TV coverage
didn't do justice to how heavy it was. While I was driving home in it, I
couldn't get above 70kph (45mph) without aqua-planing on the freeway. A lot
of people on the road had pulled over, but I figured, heck, I've got brand
new tires which are supposedly pretty good in the wet, I'll soldier
on....scary stuff! ;-)
>"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote
> Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them
> shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City calledfor
> clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn'tgonna
> stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race??
Just race the darn track. The racing conditions, while pretty poor, weren't
really that bad. I've seen much worse rain races, even in CART (I remember
a crazy race at Mid-Ohio with pouring rain about 4 years ago). They just
went around the track like 20 times under the yellow, while they without a
problem could have raced. Sure some would have wreck (as this is racing,
no?), but hey it's part of the game. Just be more careful. CART was too
politically correct.
--
-- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard>
-- http://ymenard.cjb.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
Racing is like any other outdoor sport, you take your chances. CART could
however offer a 50% discount to next years race to all who attended.
"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:%4mv9.3608$[email hidden]...
weren't
> really that bad. I've seen much worse rain races, even in CART (Iremember
Quoted text (10 lines)
> >"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote > > Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City called > for > > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't > gonna > > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > > Just race the darn track. The racing conditions, while pretty poor,Quoted text (17 lines)
> a crazy race at Mid-Ohio with pouring rain about 4 years ago). They just > went around the track like 20 times under the yellow, while they without a > problem could have raced. Sure some would have wreck (as this is racing, > no?), but hey it's part of the game. Just be more careful. CART was too > politically correct. > > > > > > -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- http://ymenard.cjb.net/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > >They should not have worried about the stinkin' tv contract and they should
have finished the race. They have this history of not being prepared (anyone
remember Texas) and they made another last minute decision just like when
they were there and that let a guy who made 4 pitstops win a race, when the
guy ran in the back the whole race. I mean, what else did SpeedTv have to
show at 2am?
LOL
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:S1kv9.149507$%d2.52405@sccrnsc01...
> Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them
> shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City calledfor
> clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn'tgonna
Quoted text (11 lines)
> stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > dave henrie > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 > >Seeing as its in my home town, and i work in the center of the city and also
race, i say that they dont bother with the street race and build a more
exciting, slightly safer and in the long run far far cheaper permanant
circuit. If you cant race on a track because of the weather then it should
not be allowed to race on ever.
Cool Hand Luke
-=87=-
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:S1kv9.149507$%d2.52405@sccrnsc01...
> Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them
> shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City calledfor
> clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn'tgonna
Quoted text (11 lines)
> stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > dave henrie > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 > >
"Luke Phillips" <(NOSPM)[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Z4rv9.12550$[email hidden]...
> If you cant race on a track because of the weather then it should
> not be allowed to race on ever.
Including Ovals then?
Doug
Ok, a if you cannot race on a CIRCUIT because of the weather then it should
not be allowed to race on ever. :)
Luke
-=87=-
"Doug Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:aplmmi$2n2c7$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > "Luke Phillips" <(NOSPM)[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Z4rv9.12550$[email hidden]... > > If you cant race on a track because of the weather then it should > > not be allowed to race on ever. > > Including Ovals then? > > Doug > >What did the TV contract have to do with anything??? They showed the whole
fekkin' "race"... til 4am or thereabouts. There were 3 choices, given that the
streets had to be opened for Monday morning traffic:
1) Let 'em race... if they wreck, they wreck. This is big-time motorsport
2) Run 'em like they did. Keep 'em under yellow, hoping and praying the rain
will dissipate enough to make the track safe enough for racing
3) F*ck 'em (the fans, sponsors, drivers). We tried, but Mother Nature wasn't
cooperating. We're going back home to prepare for Fontana.
I would have done the same thing CART chose to do, which was #2 above. I'd
rather go to a track and see the cars *try* to squeeze out a few racing laps (as
they did... 6 to be exact), rather than seeing another racing death (possible in
#1 above) or being told the race is canceled as in #3 above.
Warlock!
"Phillip Malphrus, Jr." wrote:
Quoted text (27 lines)
> They should not have worried about the stinkin' tv contract and they should > have finished the race. They have this history of not being prepared (anyone > remember Texas) and they made another last minute decision just like when > they were there and that let a guy who made 4 pitstops win a race, when the > guy ran in the back the whole race. I mean, what else did SpeedTv have to > show at 2am? > > LOL > > "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:S1kv9.149507$%d2.52405@sccrnsc01... > > Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City called > for > > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't > gonna > > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > > > dave henrie > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 > > > >>....what would YOU have done about that dang race??
>
> dave henrie
Given the situation of this past weekend I really doubt anything really
different could have been done other than cancel the race altogether. On the
other hand I think this past weekend is perfect example of just how bad CART
is hurting. IMO they should never put themselves in the position to have to
run a race in those conditions. After seeing the in car view of Michael's
where he couldn't even see the car in front until he was under just shows
how bad the conditions really were. No person in their right mind should
expect drivers to run in that. Even when they were running they were not
racing. At best they were driving around trying not to wreck. Kind of like
me in GPL lol. This past weekend was just another nail in CART's coffin.
MadDAWG
"Warlock" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> What did the TV contract have to do with anything??? They showed the whole
> fekkin' "race"... til 4am or thereabouts. There were 3 choices, given thatthe
> streets had to be opened for Monday morning traffic:
>
> 1) Let 'em race... if they wreck, they wreck. This is big-time motorsport
> 2) Run 'em like they did. Keep 'em under yellow, hoping and praying therain
> will dissipate enough to make the track safe enough for racing
> 3) F*ck 'em (the fans, sponsors, drivers). We tried, but Mother Naturewasn't
> cooperating. We're going back home to prepare for Fontana.
>
> I would have done the same thing CART chose to do, which was #2 above. I'd
> rather go to a track and see the cars *try* to squeeze out a few racinglaps (as
> they did... 6 to be exact), rather than seeing another racing death(possible in
> #1 above) or being told the race is canceled as in #3 above.
>
> Warlock!
>
I wonder why CART doesn't have an out clause that allows a possible monetary
penalty to keep the street course in place just in case there is a "mother
nature" type of problem? I have no idea what the cost would be but it should
be considered in the future. I have attended almost every race in Vancouver
and I'm shocked nothing like this has ever happened there. This Aussie race
could be a little fore-shadowing of a possible situation in Van since they
moved the date for that race from the Labour Day weekend to the end of
July... which is a much worse date for good racing weather (or, at least a
much greater chance of rain anyway).
Robin
Dave Henrie wrote:
I think running under caution was the right thing to do. The drivers
sure didn't seem to want to run in those conditions. I think CART
dropped the ball when they changed the race distance from 36 laps to 41
laps. I know they did it so that everyone had to make two pit stops, but
still...
In the end, this is not what CART needed these days. I'm rooting for
CART to pull through and squash IRL, but I suspect I'm supporting the
losing team :-((((((
Gary
Quoted text (12 lines)
> > Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City called for > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't gonna > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > dave henrie > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02Quoted text (11 lines)
> Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City called for > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't gonna > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > dave henrie > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02Whatever the decision was or should have been about the race, the real question
is -
How in the world, after running a series of this nature for 20 and some odd
years, did CART ever allow themselves to get into such a mess in the first
place?
Why isnt the race run on Saturday, so that they have an extra day in case of
the weather? Any race run outside the North American Continent, where team
travel plans are so complicated, should be planned accordingly.
Oh well...
Michael
A. They shortened the thing by 30 laps. From ESPN, "The event was stopped on
the 40th lap because of a two-hour time
limit.", http://espn.go.com/rpm/cart/2002/1026/1451668.html . That was a tv
time contract, even though Speed wasnt under that obligation.
B. They did screw the fans over big time at the track. They got to see 6
green laps of the scheduled 70, of which the last 31 were under yellow.
LMAO. What they should have done was cancel/reschedule the event for the day
later in the year. Nobody that paid for those tickets are happy today,
nobody. So, they basically did all 3 of the choices you referred to below.
They did let em wreck (at the start), kept them under yellow for 34 of the
40 laps, and then said: Screw you folks at Surfers, we have a race to get
ready for next week and you just lost every cent you spent on a ticket,
cause we're outta here!
I guess they wanted to prove to Ecclestone that they could be a good feeder
for F1: No passing for 40 laps except through pitting, and all the racing
occuring during the first 10 laps of the race.
"Warlock" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> What did the TV contract have to do with anything??? They showed the whole
> fekkin' "race"... til 4am or thereabouts. There were 3 choices, given thatthe
> streets had to be opened for Monday morning traffic:
>
> 1) Let 'em race... if they wreck, they wreck. This is big-time motorsport
> 2) Run 'em like they did. Keep 'em under yellow, hoping and praying therain
> will dissipate enough to make the track safe enough for racing
> 3) F*ck 'em (the fans, sponsors, drivers). We tried, but Mother Naturewasn't
> cooperating. We're going back home to prepare for Fontana.
>
> I would have done the same thing CART chose to do, which was #2 above. I'd
> rather go to a track and see the cars *try* to squeeze out a few racinglaps (as
> they did... 6 to be exact), rather than seeing another racing death(possible in
should
> > have finished the race. They have this history of not being prepared(anyone
> > remember Texas) and they made another last minute decision just likewhen
> > they were there and that let a guy who made 4 pitstops win a race, whenthe
> > guy ran in the back the whole race. I mean, what else did SpeedTv haveto
called
Quoted text (7 lines)
> #1 above) or being told the race is canceled as in #3 above. > > Warlock! > > "Phillip Malphrus, Jr." wrote: > > > They should not have worried about the stinkin' tv contract and theyQuoted text (8 lines)
> > show at 2am? > > > > LOL > > > > "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:S1kv9.149507$%d2.52405@sccrnsc01... > > > Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > > > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the CityQuoted text (15 lines)
> > for > > > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't > > gonna > > > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > > > > > dave henrie > > > > > > > > > --- > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 > > > > > > >In article <[email hidden]>, "Phillip Malphrus, Jr."
<[email hidden]> writes:
>B. They did screw the fans over big time at the track. They got to see 6
>green laps of the scheduled 70, of which the last 31 were under yellow.
>LMAO. What they should have done was cancel/reschedule the event for the day
>later in the year.
It's a no-win situation. Cancelling/rescheduling would have screwed over
EVERYONE who flew to Australia for the race. It also could have screwed people
from the other side of the continent...
Nobody that paid for those tickets are happy today,
Ok, now THAT'S funny! :-)
Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank:+6.21
N2002 Rank:+18.91
Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
Quoted text (9 lines)
>nobody. So, they basically did all 3 of the choices you referred to below. >They did let em wreck (at the start), kept them under yellow for 34 of the >40 laps, and then said: Screw you folks at Surfers, we have a race to get >ready for next week and you just lost every cent you spent on a ticket, >cause we're outta here! > >I guess they wanted to prove to Ecclestone that they could be a good feeder >for F1: No passing for 40 laps except through pitting, and all the racing >occuring during the first 10 laps of the race.You obviously didn't see the race. It was an "official" race after 36 laps. They
continued and stopped at 40 laps because of darkness. Check out this pic and
tell me they should have "raced" longer in these conditions...
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/cart/2002/sur/cart-2002-sur-tm-0401.jpg
The ESPN article was just an AP release. The AP isn't exactly on top of the
world of motorsport. There is usually a 2 to 2-1/2 hour time limit, but CART
went waaaaaaaaaay beyond that for the folks of Oz.
If you did watch, I apologize for saying you didn't. You just didn't pay much
attention. I'd like to know how you could have gotten yourself out of the
predicament in a way that would have looked more professional or would have paid
better dividends to the fans. Remember, CART spoke with the city officials about
the prospects of extending the race weekend thru Monday, and the city said that
wasn't an option. Lemme know what you come up with... I'll e-mail your
suggestion to CART and give you full credit :roll eyes:
Warlock!
"Phillip Malphrus, Jr." wrote:
Quoted text (79 lines)
> A. They shortened the thing by 30 laps. From ESPN, "The event was stopped on > the 40th lap because of a two-hour time > limit.", http://espn.go.com/rpm/cart/2002/1026/1451668.html . That was a tv > time contract, even though Speed wasnt under that obligation. > > B. They did screw the fans over big time at the track. They got to see 6 > green laps of the scheduled 70, of which the last 31 were under yellow. > LMAO. What they should have done was cancel/reschedule the event for the day > later in the year. Nobody that paid for those tickets are happy today, > nobody. So, they basically did all 3 of the choices you referred to below. > They did let em wreck (at the start), kept them under yellow for 34 of the > 40 laps, and then said: Screw you folks at Surfers, we have a race to get > ready for next week and you just lost every cent you spent on a ticket, > cause we're outta here! > > I guess they wanted to prove to Ecclestone that they could be a good feeder > for F1: No passing for 40 laps except through pitting, and all the racing > occuring during the first 10 laps of the race. > > "Warlock" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > What did the TV contract have to do with anything??? They showed the whole > > fekkin' "race"... til 4am or thereabouts. There were 3 choices, given that > the > > streets had to be opened for Monday morning traffic: > > > > 1) Let 'em race... if they wreck, they wreck. This is big-time motorsport > > 2) Run 'em like they did. Keep 'em under yellow, hoping and praying the > rain > > will dissipate enough to make the track safe enough for racing > > 3) F*ck 'em (the fans, sponsors, drivers). We tried, but Mother Nature > wasn't > > cooperating. We're going back home to prepare for Fontana. > > > > I would have done the same thing CART chose to do, which was #2 above. I'd > > rather go to a track and see the cars *try* to squeeze out a few racing > laps (as > > they did... 6 to be exact), rather than seeing another racing death > (possible in > > #1 above) or being told the race is canceled as in #3 above. > > > > Warlock! > > > > "Phillip Malphrus, Jr." wrote: > > > > > They should not have worried about the stinkin' tv contract and they > should > > > have finished the race. They have this history of not being prepared > (anyone > > > remember Texas) and they made another last minute decision just like > when > > > they were there and that let a guy who made 4 pitstops win a race, when > the > > > guy ran in the back the whole race. I mean, what else did SpeedTv have > to > > > show at 2am? > > > > > > LOL > > > > > > "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:S1kv9.149507$%d2.52405@sccrnsc01... > > > > Knowing that you had to load up the cars/teams/gear ASAP to get them > > > > shipped back to America, knowing that the contract with the City > called > > > for > > > > clearing the streets before Monday, knowing that the Rain just wasn't > > > gonna > > > > stop....what would YOU have done about that dang race?? > > > > > > > > dave henrie > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/02 > > > > > > > > > >> around trying not to wreck. Kind of like me in GPL lol. This past
> weekend was just another nail in CART's coffin.
It is quite plain and simple. CART ran those laps under caution and called
it an official race so they wouldn't have to refund anyone any money. If
they had cancelled the race, which is what they should have done, they would
have been in a position to refund. Their little farce enabled them to say
that the fans got to see the cars on the track for more than half the race,
so we're keeping the money.
--
Dave Casey, REALTOR
Looking to buy or sell in Vegas?
Visit my site and contact me.
www.lasvegashomesdirect.com
---
www.lvkc.com - Las Vegas Kart Club
www.buycoolcrap.com - Your Debt Free Future
Dave Casey <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> It is quite plain and simple. CART ran those laps under caution and called
> it an official race so they wouldn't have to refund anyone any money. If
> they had cancelled the race, which is what they should have done, they would
> have been in a position to refund. Their little farce enabled them to say
> that the fans got to see the cars on the track for more than half the race,
> so we're keeping the money.
Or maybe it was aliens again. Been watching the X-Files lately?
