GPL + Force Feedback

Hi all, Can anyone help me. I have a logitech MOMO Force wheel and am having a problem with GPL. I am happy with the force feedback when going round corners, but going down the straights it is very hard to keep the car in a straight line. It tends to veave from side to side and I am struggling to counteract it. I have tried setting a dead zone for the steering which has not made that much difference (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). Does anyone have any ideas how to correct this. Many thanks Russell

"Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht news:b176am$8it$[email hidden]... > (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). No wonder you're weaving on the straights. Try 0% instead. Make sure you have the latest drivers from Logitech Wingmanteam. Bye, Leo

Hi Leo, I started out with the dead zone at 0% and the weaving was terrible. It was then that I tried increasing it. Thanks for the reply though Russell "Leo Landman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b177o9$coh$[email hidden]...

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> > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht > news:b176am$8it$[email hidden]... > > > (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). > > No wonder you're weaving on the straights. Try 0% instead. Make sure you > have the latest drivers from Logitech Wingmanteam. > > Bye, > Leo > >

Reduce the latency (in the core.ini) to zero to cure your weaving & slowly increase it until the ff matches what the car is doing. It takes time, because you have to keep coming back to the desktop, but once it's done it's done. Malc. "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b178c4$906$[email hidden]... > Hi Leo, > > I started out with the dead zone at 0% and the weaving was terrible. Itwas

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> then that I tried increasing it. > > Thanks for the reply though > > Russell > > > "Leo Landman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:b177o9$coh$[email hidden]... > > > > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht > > news:b176am$8it$[email hidden]... > > > > > (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). > > > > No wonder you're weaving on the straights. Try 0% instead. Make sure you > > have the latest drivers from Logitech Wingmanteam. > > > > Bye, > > Leo > > > > > >

I already told him that a week or more ago, so I doubt it's that. Marc "Malc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:TTMZ9.4383$9u5.315207@wards... > Reduce the latency (in the core.ini) to zero to cure your weaving & slowly > increase it until the ff matches what the car is doing. It takes time, > because you have to keep coming back to the desktop, but once it's doneit's

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> done. > > Malc. > > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:b178c4$906$[email hidden]... > > Hi Leo, > > > > I started out with the dead zone at 0% and the weaving was terrible. It > was > > then that I tried increasing it. > > > > Thanks for the reply though > > > > Russell > > > > > > "Leo Landman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:b177o9$coh$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> schreef in

bericht > > > news:b176am$8it$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). > > > > > > No wonder you're weaving on the straights. Try 0% instead. Make sureyou

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> > > have the latest drivers from Logitech Wingmanteam. > > > > > > Bye, > > > Leo > > > > > > > > > > > >

Hi all, I have already done that, but I will drop it to zero and start again. I don't think a appreciated the relationship between the latency setting and weaving on the straights. I followed the advice of setting the latency by driving over a curb and getting the suspension movement to coincide with the "thump" from the wheel. Many Many thanks for you're help (and patience) Russell "Marc Collins" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6DRZ9.3071$[email hidden]...

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> I already told him that a week or more ago, so I doubt it's that. > > Marc > > "Malc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:TTMZ9.4383$9u5.315207@wards... > > Reduce the latency (in the core.ini) to zero to cure your weaving &

slowly

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> > increase it until the ff matches what the car is doing. It takes time, > > because you have to keep coming back to the desktop, but once it's done > it's > > done. > > > > Malc. > > > > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:b178c4$906$[email hidden]... > > > Hi Leo, > > > > > > I started out with the dead zone at 0% and the weaving was terrible.

It

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> > was > > > then that I tried increasing it. > > > > > > Thanks for the reply though > > > > > > Russell > > > > > > > > > "Leo Landman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:b177o9$coh$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> schreef in > bericht > > > > news:b176am$8it$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). > > > > > > > > No wonder you're weaving on the straights. Try 0% instead. Make sure > you > > > > have the latest drivers from Logitech Wingmanteam. > > > > > > > > Bye, > > > > Leo > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

"Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b192eb$m4u$[email hidden]... > Hi all, > > I have already done that, but I will drop it to zero and start again. I > don't think a appreciated the relationship between the latency setting and > weaving on the straights. I followed the advice of setting the latency by > driving over a curb and getting the suspension movement to coincide withthe > "thump" from the wheel. The reason why you're weaving down the straight is that gpl is predicting the force to apply to your wheel, but it's out of synch with your reactions. You see the car go to the left & steer to the right slightly. gpl reacts slowly (high latency) and sends the controller a 'car going left' force while you turn right, and this forces the wheel even further to the right. You correct & the same thing happens in reverse, getting worse & worse until you either back off the throttle or keep the wheel straight. It sounds like you've gone too far with the latency, you probably just need to lower it a little. If you can't get it to stop doing it (I couldn't in NR2002) you can increase the damping and force levels in the core.ini and decrease the overall force in your controller applet. The feeling will still be there, but it will be heavily damped, so it never gets the chance to get worse. Does it do the same thing with the latency at zero? Malc.

You may wish to add more toe in to the front wheels in your setups (or is it less) and see if this removes the Force Feedback Induced Ocelation. SLG On Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:13:10 +0000 (UTC), "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Hi all, > >Can anyone help me. I have a logitech MOMO Force wheel and am having a >problem with GPL. >I am happy with the force feedback when going round corners, but going down >the straights it is very hard to keep the car in a straight line. It tends >to veave from side to side and I am struggling to counteract it. I have >tried setting a dead zone for the steering which has not made that much >difference (I have tried setting the dead zone up to 8%). > >Does anyone have any ideas how to correct this. > > >Many thanks > >Russell > >

Hi Malc, I have gone through the process again but this time gradually increased the latence value in smaller steps (0.0025). Last time I was going in increments of 0.01 and I think the best value fell between two settings and so I never found the sweet spot. I have now found that 0.0225 is about the best setting. Going either side of this value and the weaving starts getting worse again. With the latency set at 0.0225 the weaving is much much better and the car is now more controllable. I shall now just play with the damping, force level and controller applet to see if it can be improved any more. Hopefully I can go back to online racing on WinVroc. Its one thing weaving down the straights and taking out a few AI cars but I don't think I would have been very popular doing the same thing online. Really appreciate your help Russell "Malc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7tUZ9.4501$9u5.323900@wards... > "Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:b192eb$m4u$[email hidden]... > > Hi all, > > > > I have already done that, but I will drop it to zero and start again. I > > don't think a appreciated the relationship between the latency settingand > > weaving on the straights. I followed the advice of setting the latencyby > > driving over a curb and getting the suspension movement to coincide with > the > > "thump" from the wheel. > > The reason why you're weaving down the straight is that gpl is predicting > the force to apply to your wheel, but it's out of synch with yourreactions. > You see the car go to the left & steer to the right slightly. gpl reacts > slowly (high latency) and sends the controller a 'car going left' force > while you turn right, and this forces the wheel even further to the right. > You correct & the same thing happens in reverse, getting worse & worseuntil > you either back off the throttle or keep the wheel straight. It soundslike > you've gone too far with the latency, you probably just need to lower it a > little. > > If you can't get it to stop doing it (I couldn't in NR2002) you canincrease > the damping and force levels in the core.ini and decrease the overallforce

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> in your controller applet. The feeling will still be there, but it will be > heavily damped, so it never gets the chance to get worse. > > Does it do the same thing with the latency at zero? > > Malc. > >

"Russell Spearing" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b19lgl$hqb$[email hidden]... > Hi Malc, > > I have gone through the process again but this time gradually increasedthe > latence value in smaller steps (0.0025). Last time I was going inincrements > of 0.01 and I think the best value fell between two settings and so Inever > found the sweet spot. I have now found that 0.0225 is about the best > setting. Going either side of this value and the weaving starts getting > worse again. With the latency set at 0.0225 the weaving is much muchbetter > and the car is now more controllable. I shall now just play with the > damping, force level and controller applet to see if it can be improvedany > more. Glad you managed to make some progress. It took me about a week (2 years ago) to get mine really sorted, and I haven't had to change it since. As you've found, the latency is very much down you your personal combination of controller and PC/OS, but the other two settings (and your controller's own settings) are much more subjective. The two main paths people seem to follow are very light forces & low damping, or very high force strength with heavy damping. Partly because my controller gets the occasional spike, I prefer to have very light forces & damping (otherwise the spikes would throw me off the track). My damping is set to 10.0 in the core.ini, and steering torque is 500, although anything over about 300 is probably enough for light effects with a wheel. If you tend to hold the wheel lightly & let it guide you through the corners, try this approach. For a stiffer feel to your wheel, you could set the damping to around 60-65, with steering torque at around 100-150. If you tend to get white knuckles & lean your whole body into corners, this might work better for you so you've got something to fight with. Read the readme11.txt in your gpl folder for more info. Personally I leave my wingman settings at 100% but that's because I don't really use ff in anything but gpl. If you race another sim or game that doesn't have built in ff adjustment (eg Viper Racing), set up your controller software to work with that, then adjust your gpl settings afterwards to compensate. Don't forget to make sure you have disabled the centering spring, and use split-axis pedals if you have the option. Malc.