OT: F1

Wow, what a wacky F1 race. Larry

Best one I have seen in the past few years. And btw it wasn't the rules changes that made it exciting, it was the full course cautions that bunched up the field and made it exciting. IMO. "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:josba.150241$[email hidden]... > Wow, what a wacky F1 race. > > Larry > >

and the cars starting on a damp track running dry weather settings on intermediate tyres. pez "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4lpfh$20q6am$[email hidden]... > Best one I have seen in the past few years. And btw it wasn't the rules > changes that made it exciting, it was the full course cautions thatbunched

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> up the field and made it exciting. IMO. > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:josba.150241$[email hidden]... > > Wow, what a wacky F1 race. > > > > Larry > > > > > >

...and all the black flags. "Alex 'pez' Porazinski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4lsrd$fh$[email hidden]...

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> and the cars starting on a damp track running dry weather settings on > intermediate tyres. > > pez > > "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:b4lpfh$20q6am$[email hidden]... > > Best one I have seen in the past few years. And btw it wasn't the rules > > changes that made it exciting, it was the full course cautions that > bunched > > up the field and made it exciting. IMO. > > > > > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:josba.150241$[email hidden]... > > > Wow, what a wacky F1 race. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > > > > > > > >

... and different levels of fuel ... I actually enjoyed most of it! Jim JTBurn wrote:

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>...and all the black flags. > >"Alex 'pez' Porazinski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:b4lsrd$fh$[email hidden]... > > >>and the cars starting on a damp track running dry weather settings on >>intermediate tyres. >> >>pez >> >>"Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>news:b4lpfh$20q6am$[email hidden]... >> >> >>>Best one I have seen in the past few years. And btw it wasn't the rules >>>changes that made it exciting, it was the full course cautions that >>> >>> >>bunched >> >> >>>up the field and made it exciting. IMO. >>> >>> >>>"Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>news:josba.150241$[email hidden]... >>> >>> >>>>Wow, what a wacky F1 race. >>>> >>>>Larry >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> > > > >

On Tue, 11 Mar 2003 21:18:07 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote something like this: >Wow, what a wacky F1 race. Yup, it was nice to see Schumi on the grass ;) -- - JKo -

something like this: Yup, it was nice to see Schumi on the grass ;) -- - JKo -

"Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4lpfh$20q6am$[email hidden]... > Best one I have seen in the past few years. And btw it wasn't the rules > changes that made it exciting, it was the full course cautions thatbunched > up the field and made it exciting. IMO. > Or more frustrating, depending on your perspective. As someone who still appreciates the skill and effort required to build up a huge lead, either through driver skill or team strategy, I really hate seeing it eroded by a safety car phase. But that's just one opinion. But I agree that the variable fuel loads and different tire choices made the first laps exciting... S.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > ...and all the black flags. which black flags? Nobody got one afaik. Michael Schumacher got a black *& orange* flag, which isn't the same thing at all. -- AG Remove removes from address to remove anti-spam measures. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Alan Gauton E-Mail agauton @ postmaster.co.uk Never for me the lowered banner, never the last endeavour! (Damon Hill - 16th June 1999)

Kimi got one for speeding in the pits. At least I think that was a black flag. "Alan Gauton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > which black flags? Nobody got one afaik. Michael Schumacher got a black > *& orange* flag, which isn't the same thing at all. >

Not a NASCAR fan then, I take it? I watch races to see people race against each other. Races that are essentially over after the first lap aren't much fun to watch, and races that are essentially over after the last round of pit stops aren't much better. IMO. "Stephen F." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > Or more frustrating, depending on your perspective. As someone who still > appreciates the skill and effort required to build up a huge lead, either > through driver skill or team strategy, I really hate seeing it eroded by a > safety car phase. But that's just one opinion. But I agree that the > variable fuel loads and different tire choices made the first laps > exciting... > > S. > >

On Tue, 11 Mar 2003 21:18:07 GMT, Larry wrote: > Wow, what a wacky F1 race. > > Larry yup, and no BAR grenades for the race.

the great galooga <"the great galooga "@home.com> wrote in news:JHKba.454169$[email hidden]:

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> On Tue, 11 Mar 2003 21:18:07 GMT, Larry wrote: > >> Wow, what a wacky F1 race. >> >> Larry > > yup, and no BAR grenades for the race. >

But no BAR speed either...WHat has happened to Honda? They used to be the power kings. They are taking almost as long as Toyota did in CART to get up to speed. dave henrie

It's pretty damn close to the same thing! "Alan Gauton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > ...and all the black flags. > > which black flags? Nobody got one afaik. Michael Schumacher got a black > *& orange* flag, which isn't the same thing at all. > > -- > AG > > Remove removes from address to remove anti-spam measures. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Alan Gauton E-Mail agauton @ postmaster.co.uk > > Never for me the lowered banner, never the last endeavour! > (Damon Hill - 16th June 1999)

"Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4nopg$22b55k$[email hidden]... > Not a NASCAR fan then, I take it? I watch races to see people race against > each other. Races that are essentially over after the first lap aren't much > fun to watch, and races that are essentially over after the last round of > pit stops aren't much better. IMO. Races that essentially start after the last (of many) yellow flags aren't much fun for me....... Paul

"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > But no BAR speed either...WHat has happened to Honda? They used to be the > power kings. They are taking almost as long as Toyota did in CART to get > up to speed. > dave henrie I'd like to see them finish a few races first, then they can try to get more HP out of their motors. Lets face it, at full-gp length races especially, even the RA300 in GPL likes to destroy itself more times than not, so not much has changed in close to 30 years ;)

"Biz"

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> > I'd like to see them finish a few races first, then they can try to > get more HP out of their motors. Lets face it, at full-gp length races > especially, even the RA300 in GPL likes to destroy itself more times > than not, so not much has changed in close to 30 years ;) > > >

I'm trying to remember how many Honda Mills Senna and Prost blew up.... ..... ..... ..... ..... ..... ......... ... anyone? dave henrie

"Biz" I'm trying to remember how many Honda Mills Senna and Prost blew up.... ..... ..... ..... ..... ..... ......... ... anyone? dave henrie

Well of course this is very much a matter of opinion, but I like to see people actually racing for position on the track, and NASCAR does that better than anybody else. Admittedly, it does sometimes seem like it is not so much one long race as it is a series of short sprint races separated by yellows, but in its own way that is still exciting. It's not like they reform in the same order every time, after all. Each sprint from one yellow to the next is different. And the yellow flags are what allow people to come back from an accident and still finish on the lead lap. Many times I have seen races won by people who started in the back. That's rare in other forms of racing, although you will occasionally see it in CART also. But the full course caution is the key thing that equalizes the playing field, that makes starting position less important, makes track position more important, and makes it possible to recover from a bad shunt. That's why I would really like to see more use of the full course caution in F1, I think it would make for better races. "Paul Laidlaw" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4oium$21csm8$[email hidden]... Races that essentially start after the last (of many) yellow flags aren't much fun for me....... Paul

>And the yellow flags are what allow people to >come back from an accident and still finish on the lead lap. And that sucks. If you screw up, you should be OUT. None of this "the yellow flag allows me to stay on the same lap with drivers who actually kept it ON THE TRACK..." That shit pisses me off in online races, too. What good does it do to stay in control of your car when the hotshoes can crash, get back on the track, and get the gift to let them keep up? That's why I like full-damage races - if you screw up and crash, grab some bench and watch the rest of the race from the stands... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.680 MonsterRank: +334.169 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

It's not always the fault of the guy who took the damage. More often than not one guy screws up and ten guys end up getting damaged. If somebody takes you out through their carelessness, wouldn't you like to have the chance to repair and come back in? "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > And that sucks. If you screw up, you should be OUT. None of this "theyellow > flag allows me to stay on the same lap with drivers who actually kept itON THE > TRACK..." That shit pisses me off in online races, too. What good doesit do > to stay in control of your car when the hotshoes can crash, get back onthe > track, and get the gift to let them keep up? That's why I likefull-damage > races - if you screw up and crash, grab some bench and watch the rest ofthe

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> race from the stands... > > Eldred > -- > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank:-1.680 > MonsterRank: +334.169 > N2002 Rank:+17.59 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

> Well of course this is very much a matter of opinion, but I like to see Indeed. >> come back from an accident and still finish on the lead lap. Many times I > have seen races won by people who started in the back. That's rare in other > forms of racing, although you will occasionally see it in CART also. But It's the one thing I really don't like much about CART, far too many full course yellows when a local yellow would do just fine and they are far too slow at removing the cars too. Of course you can only have a full course yellow at the oval races. Paul

"Paul Laidlaw"

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> It's the one thing I really don't like much about CART, far too many > full course yellows when a local yellow would do just fine and they > are far too slow at removing the cars too. Of course you can only have > a full course yellow at the oval races. > > > > Paul > >

This has been covered here years ago..they have tried to limit the full course yellows...but the short version is: Mario Andretti twice hit cars under local yellows...Yes the same World Champion, the Same candidate for All Around best driver...the same guy who's won everything but LeMans. He hit a car that had been parked under local yellow after lapping past it about 6 times....then at a another track: when the emergency crew was trying to extricate his son from a wall...he plowed into the safety truck..also while a local yellow was flying. After that, the safety crew guys said NO MORE! (well thats what the translation was at least) dave henrie

"Paul Laidlaw" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:b4oium$21csm8$[email hidden]:

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> "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:b4nopg$22b55k$[email hidden]... >> Not a NASCAR fan then, I take it? I watch races to see people race >> against each other. Races that are essentially over after the first >> lap aren't much fun to watch, and races that are essentially over >> after the last round of pit stops aren't much better. IMO. > > Races that essentially start after the last (of many) yellow flags > aren't much fun for me.......

And what's about races when only half of the field participate in this race, because another half is thinking that there will be one more yellow? Alex.

Some of the best races I have ever seen have started with the leader storming off into the distance. As the race progressed, he couldn't keep increasing his lead, then it was gradually eroded, until there was a fantastic wheel to wheel showdown for the last 10 laps or so. Other good races I've seen are where the leader in on a 3 stop strategy, and the next man is on a 1 stopper. The leader streaks away, into a big lead, then stops, and comes out just before/behind. He then passes and streaks away again. Then second man starts getting faster and faster, and starts catching him. They race wheel to wheel for some laps, then both pit, who emerges first?!!! Finally the 3 stopper gets away and streaks off, only to have to pit again, putting them right back together, where they have a fantastic battle to the end of the race. These kind of races IMO are exciting, and interesting to watch. Throw in a safety car incident, and all that is lost. "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b4nopg$22b55k$[email hidden]... > Not a NASCAR fan then, I take it? I watch races to see people raceagainst > each other. Races that are essentially over after the first lap aren'tmuch

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> fun to watch, and races that are essentially over after the last round of > pit stops aren't much better. IMO. > > "Stephen F." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > Or more frustrating, depending on your perspective. As someone who

still > > appreciates the skill and effort required to build up a huge lead,either > > through driver skill or team strategy, I really hate seeing it eroded bya

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> > safety car phase. But that's just one opinion. But I agree that the > > variable fuel loads and different tire choices made the first laps > > exciting... > > > > S. > > > > > >

How is that different, from a spectator standpoint, than the pit stop strategy "races" that F1 has? "alexti" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > And what's about races when only half of the field participate > in this race, because another half is thinking that there will > be one more yellow? > > Alex. >

"Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:b4svs5$232t4a$1@ID- 125164.news.dfncis.de: > How is that different, from a spectator standpoint, than the pit stop > strategy "races" that F1 has?Well, even when everything settles after the first few laps spectators can entertain themselves by figuring out the best possible strategy for their favourite driver/team and them by sweating when the driver/team does something stupid instead:) It's probably a personal opinion, but I find the anticipation of pit stops very entertaining. Just imagine you're following another GPL driver for 30+ laps and you're not able to pass, because there's not much chances to pass and then pit stop time comes and then you have this feeling when you're trying to outlast him and either you need to put a flyer on the only remaing lap of fuel you got or sometimes you pit on the same lap:) Somehow I can associate myself with F1 drivers in similar situations and it makes me kind of glued to TV screen in those races. Alex.

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> > "alexti" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > >> And what's about races when only half of the field participate >> in this race, because another half is thinking that there will >> be one more yellow? >> >> Alex. >> > >

In article <[email hidden]>, Dave Henrie <[email hidden]> writes:

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> This has been covered here years ago..they have tried to limit the full >course yellows...but the short version is: Mario Andretti twice hit cars >under local yellows...Yes the same World Champion, the Same candidate for >All Around best driver...the same guy who's won everything but LeMans. He >hit a car that had been parked under local yellow after lapping past it >about 6 times....then at a another track: when the emergency crew was >trying to extricate his son from a wall...he plowed into the safety >truck..also while a local yellow was flying. After that, the safety crew >guys said NO MORE! (well thats what the translation was at least) >dave henrie

I remember that - Detroit? I thought the full course yellows were mandated after Willy T. Ribbs hit and killed a corner worker in Vancouver... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.680 MonsterRank: +334.169 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <b4qomv$236sen$[email hidden]>, "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>It's not always the fault of the guy who took the damage. More often than >not one guy screws up and ten guys end up getting damaged. If somebody >takes you out through their carelessness, wouldn't you like to have the >chance to repair and come back in? > >"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> >> And that sucks. If you screw up, you should be OUT. None of this "the >yellow >> flag allows me to stay on the same lap with drivers who actually kept it >ON THE >> TRACK..." That shit pisses me off in online races, too. What good does >it do >> to stay in control of your car when the hotshoes can crash, get back on >the >> track, and get the gift to let them keep up? That's why I like >full-damage >> races - if you screw up and crash, grab some bench and watch the rest of >the >> race from the stands...

Shit happens in REAL racing, too...<g> Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.680 MonsterRank: +334.169 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

> I remember that - Detroit? > I thought the full course yellows were mandated after Willy T. Ribbs > hit and killed a corner worker in Vancouver... > > Eldred Remember Eldred I refuse to be challenged by accurate facts. :) I think the first Mario run-in was like at Long Beach and the 2nd was indeed Detroit. Soon after this Mikey went through his anger phase and began cutting tires with his wing endplate. Jimmy Vasser and Robbie Gordon were frequent targets...but Jr and some others got mysterious flats while running ahead of Mike Andretti. dave henrie