NR2003 Marty against the AI--update: I should have said "in traffic"

Who has a set-up and/or the driving skills that can run with the AI at 100% at Marty in a full field practise? A couple of people gave me some very nice, stable, solid set-ups that are a joy to drive ALONE on the track. I can even do decent times. But who can use that set-up in traffic/race conditions where the AI that are 3 - 6 mph faster in the turns boot you up the ass at every corner and/or the AI who can brake ridiculously late boot you up the ass at the end of every straight away. 43 cars at Marty means there's at least one car with that opportunity pretty much twice each lap. Basically, you cannot hold the inside line against the AI and therefore can never run competitive laps in traffic. So instead of a set-up, I would love to see a replay of someone who can run in concert with the AI at Marty for at least 5 laps. Be clear, I am not saying there is no one fast enough, I am saying the AI behaviour of ignoring you and bashing you out of the way combined with what seems like an unfair grip advantage (but may not be??), makes it damned close to impossible in my estimation. I know NR2003 is supposed to be realistic, which means it is going to be very hard. If I had the same problem at other similar tracks, I would be happy to blame me and go back to do some more practise. But how can I run comfortably with 100% AI after 5 minutes of practise at Bristol or Vegas and experience no problems whatsoever (because I have lots of prior experience), but Marty is just a huge mess?? Marc -- **************************************************************************** Marc Collins [email hidden] Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change to take effect. Reboot now? ****************************************************************************

Agreed Marc. I've given up driving there until something changes for the better, cause it can't get much worse. :-( -- See ya in the pits, Dean I have a terrible memory. In fact my memory's so bad I can't remember how long it's been since I've forgotten anything. "Marc Collins" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:RCrka.1343$[email hidden]... > Who has a set-up and/or the driving skills that can run with the AI at 100% > at Marty in a full field practise? A couple of people gave me some very > nice, stable, solid set-ups that are a joy to drive ALONE on the track. I > can even do decent times. But who can use that set-up in traffic/race > conditions where the AI that are 3 - 6 mph faster in the turns boot you up > the ass at every corner and/or the AI who can brake ridiculously late boot > you up the ass at the end of every straight away. 43 cars at Marty means > there's at least one car with that opportunity pretty much twice each lap. > Basically, you cannot hold the inside line against the AI and therefore can > never run competitive laps in traffic. > > So instead of a set-up, I would love to see a replay of someone who can run > in concert with the AI at Marty for at least 5 laps. Be clear, I am not > saying there is no one fast enough, I am saying the AI behaviour of ignoring > you and bashing you out of the way combined with what seems like an unfair > grip advantage (but may not be??), makes it damned close to impossible in my > estimation. > > I know NR2003 is supposed to be realistic, which means it is going to be > very hard. If I had the same problem at other similar tracks, I would be > happy to blame me and go back to do some more practise. But how can I run > comfortably with 100% AI after 5 minutes of practise at Bristol or Vegas and > experience no problems whatsoever (because I have lots of prior experience), > but Marty is just a huge mess?? > > Marc > > -- > **************************************************************************** > Marc Collins > [email hidden] > > Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change > to take effect. Reboot now? > **************************************************************************** > >

I don't know if he has done anything for NR2003 but there was a guy on the Seirra boards that went by JJ something that tweaked the AI to slow down their corner entry speeds. Might be worth a look. MadDAWG

"MadDAWG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I don't know if he has done anything for NR2003 but there was a guy on the > Seirra boards that went by JJ something that tweaked the AI to slow down > their corner entry speeds. Might be worth a look. > > MadDAWG > >

Just for reference, his website can find be found here: http://www.thegreenflag.com/ -Will

MadDAWG wrote: > I don't know if he has done anything for NR2003 but there was a guy on the > Seirra boards that went by JJ something that tweaked the AI to slow down > their corner entry speeds. Might be worth a look. > > MadDAWG The new .ini parameter "AI Inverse Slipcurve Percentage" may have something to do with this. When I dialed that down 10-20 points on a few tested tracks, the AI can't go flying around the corners with abandon anymore... John DiFool -- ============================================ Reach heaven far too high ============================================

Please tell us more. Marc "John DiFool" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > MadDAWG wrote: > > > I don't know if he has done anything for NR2003 but there was a guy onthe

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> > Seirra boards that went by JJ something that tweaked the AI to slow down > > their corner entry speeds. Might be worth a look. > > > > MadDAWG > > The new .ini parameter "AI Inverse Slipcurve Percentage" may have > something to do with this. When I dialed that down 10-20 points on > a few tested tracks, the AI can't go flying around the corners with > abandon anymore... > > John DiFool > > -- > ============================================ > Reach heaven far too high > ============================================ > >

His tweaks are generally great. He has done one for Marty, but it doesn't address the speed of the AI at 100%. Marc "MadDAWG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I don't know if he has done anything for NR2003 but there was a guy on the > Seirra boards that went by JJ something that tweaked the AI to slow down > their corner entry speeds. Might be worth a look. > > MadDAWG > >

Glad it's not just me... Marc "Dean Purdy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:rczka.2270$[email hidden]...

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> Agreed Marc. I've given up driving there until something changes for the > better, cause it can't get much worse. :-( > > -- > See ya in the pits, > Dean > > I have a terrible memory. In fact my memory's so bad I can't remember how > long it's been since I've forgotten anything. > > "Marc Collins" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:RCrka.1343$[email hidden]... > > Who has a set-up and/or the driving skills that can run with the AI at > 100% > > at Marty in a full field practise? A couple of people gave me some very > > nice, stable, solid set-ups that are a joy to drive ALONE on the track.

I > > can even do decent times. But who can use that set-up in traffic/race > > conditions where the AI that are 3 - 6 mph faster in the turns boot youup > > the ass at every corner and/or the AI who can brake ridiculously lateboot > > you up the ass at the end of every straight away. 43 cars at Martymeans > > there's at least one car with that opportunity pretty much twice eachlap.

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> > Basically, you cannot hold the inside line against the AI and therefore > can > > never run competitive laps in traffic. > > > > So instead of a set-up, I would love to see a replay of someone who can > run > > in concert with the AI at Marty for at least 5 laps. Be clear, I am not > > saying there is no one fast enough, I am saying the AI behaviour of > ignoring > > you and bashing you out of the way combined with what seems like an

unfair > > grip advantage (but may not be??), makes it damned close to impossiblein > my > > estimation. > > > > I know NR2003 is supposed to be realistic, which means it is going to be > > very hard. If I had the same problem at other similar tracks, I wouldbe > > happy to blame me and go back to do some more practise. But how can Irun

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> > comfortably with 100% AI after 5 minutes of practise at Bristol or Vegas > and > > experience no problems whatsoever (because I have lots of prior > experience), > > but Marty is just a huge mess?? > > > > Marc > > > > -- > > >

****************************************************************************

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> > Marc Collins > > [email hidden] > > > > Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change > > to take effect. Reboot now? > > >

**************************************************************************** > > > > > >

I'm not convinced the AI is the problem. I have been reading messages in different threads and it doesn't sound like anybody is running less than mid 20's, but the real life track record is in the 19's. So it seems to me what you need to do is not slow down the AI but rather give the humans some more traction. I just checked the track.ini, and the grip numbers are already pretty high, but the track_tire_heat value is much higher than the other tracks I compared it to. In fact I think it's a typo, it was 1.00 in NR2002 and it's 1.87 in NR2003. I suggest setting track_tire_heat to 0.87 (assuming the 1 was a typo) and seeing if the lap times get more realistic. "Marc Collins" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ECLka.3994$[email hidden]... > His tweaks are generally great. He has done one for Marty, but it doesn't > address the speed of the AI at 100%. > > Marc >

The problem is that people who can run laps at the same speed as the AI -- or even Q on pole consistently -- cannot race with them. They have too much (relative) grip in the corner, can brake later than you going into the corner and, most importantly, ignore your presence as a slightly slower/hobbled entity and knock you out of the way as though you weren't there. Even if the AI had an advantage, it would be hard for them to get ahead of you if you qualified ahead of them, were faster than them on each lap and held the inside line, but they don't see either of those as any reason to delay their progress. So the first time they brake "too late" into the corner, you are knocked to the outside and/or into the wall and that's it. Unfortunately, it appears that that's the extent of Marty... I wish it wasn't so and that's why I wanted to see what others were experiencing. Try it first yourself. Then tell us what you think. Marc "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b71sou$a2h6i$[email hidden]... > I'm not convinced the AI is the problem. I have been reading messages in > different threads and it doesn't sound like anybody is running less thanmid > 20's, but the real life track record is in the 19's. So it seems to mewhat > you need to do is not slow down the AI but rather give the humans somemore > traction. I just checked the track.ini, and the grip numbers are already > pretty high, but the track_tire_heat value is much higher than the other > tracks I compared it to. In fact I think it's a typo, it was 1.00 inNR2002 > and it's 1.87 in NR2003. I suggest setting track_tire_heat to 0.87 > (assuming the 1 was a typo) and seeing if the lap times get morerealistic. > > > "Marc Collins" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ECLka.3994$[email hidden]... > > His tweaks are generally great. He has done one for Marty, but itdoesn't > > address the speed of the AI at 100%. > > > > Marc > > > >

In article <b71sou$a2h6i$[email hidden]>, "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> writes: >I just checked the track.ini, and the grip numbers are already >pretty high, but the track_tire_heat value is much higher than the other >tracks I compared it to. In fact I think it's a typo, it was 1.00 in NR2002 >and it's 1.87 in NR2003. I suggest setting track_tire_heat to 0.87 >(assuming the 1 was a typo) and seeing if the lap times get more realistic. Good grief - if it's *that* easy to give yourself better traction, what good are the hotlap sites/offline leagues? I'll 'assume' that you can't get away with that online... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.680 MonsterRank: +334.169 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

As I understand it when you are online if your track.ini differs from the servers the server will download its track.ini to you, so no, it shouldn't cause any effect online. Unless the server changes it, in which case everybody gets it. As far as the hotlap sites go, even if you don't mess with the track.ini I question how fair the sites are. Try changing your track conditions to 40 degrees and cloudy and see how much your lap times improve. And you don't even have to mess with any files to do that. How do I know, when looking at a hot lap site, whether that 1:10 at the Glen was done with the default weather conditions or whether the guy changed them to give himself a better time? I don't know if there is any way to check that. "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > Good grief - if it's *that* easy to give yourself better traction, whatgood > are the hotlap sites/offline leagues? I'll 'assume' that you can't getaway

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> with that online... > > Eldred > -- > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank:-1.680 > MonsterRank: +334.169 > N2002 Rank:+17.59 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

That's why it's only races that really count for anything.... Marc "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:b72lfn$anttg$[email hidden]...

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> As I understand it when you are online if your track.ini differs from the > servers the server will download its track.ini to you, so no, it shouldn't > cause any effect online. Unless the server changes it, in which case > everybody gets it. > > As far as the hotlap sites go, even if you don't mess with the track.ini I > question how fair the sites are. Try changing your track conditions to 40 > degrees and cloudy and see how much your lap times improve. And you don't > even have to mess with any files to do that. How do I know, when looking

at > a hot lap site, whether that 1:10 at the Glen was done with the default > weather conditions or whether the guy changed them to give himself abetter

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> time? I don't know if there is any way to check that. > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > Good grief - if it's *that* easy to give yourself better traction, what > good > > are the hotlap sites/offline leagues? I'll 'assume' that you can't get > away > > with that online... > > > > Eldred > > -- > > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > > GPLRank:-1.680 > > MonsterRank: +334.169 > > N2002 Rank:+17.59 > > > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats > you > > with experience... > > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply. > >