Game cards....PCI ?

So, do they exist ? I've seen the question posted in here a few times but I don't think I've ever seen a positive answer, at least not a positive yes :-) The reason I'm looking for one is that I'm an OverClocker, I can't help myself, and I just feel that the response I'm getting from my car is changing with the FSB speed It might be my imagination of course, but since I've been around the block a few times I kinda doubt it, and now I've changed MoBo in my racing PC, again, which again runs at another FSB compared to my previous one, currently running at 215 Mhz vs 148 Mhz a few days ago Having a known constant here would help, not OC'ing would solve that I suppose but those of you who dabble in this knows how difficult that is :-), I have an old Thrustmaster ACM card on the shelf here but no ISA slot to drop it into Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Yes, on most PCI sound cards. ;o) "Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > So, do they exist ? >

Haqsau wrote: > > Yes, on most PCI sound cards. ;o) Smartass.....:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote:

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> > On Sun, 01 Jun 2003 02:39:08 +0200, Goy Larsen > <[email hidden]> reckoned: > > >Smartass.....:-) > > Yea, but you must admit he is right. Both a PCI soundcard with > gameport and PCI gamecard run at 33.3mhz on the PCI bus. > You don't have a soundcard with a gameport?

Yes I do, and yes, they both run on the speed of the PCI bus, however, unlike a soundcard, a gamecard has the ability to adjust the speed setting on the game port (probably not the best technical explanation), meaning that no matter what kind of speed your MoBo is running, or for that matter what kind of MoBo you are running, the values can be adjusted to be identical from one Comp to the next Like I said, I could be imagining things here, but I seem to notice a difference and it's annoying when you put that much effrt into creating a setup and then have to readjust those same setups when you rebuild your PC, which I do at least a couple of times a year Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3ED9E846.C5AFE620@int- resources.com: > [...] > difference and it's annoying when you put that much effrt into creating > a setup and then have to readjust those same setups when you rebuild > your PC, which I do at least a couple of times a year So shouldn't you have a new USB FF steering wheel by now?

resources.com: So shouldn't you have a new USB FF steering wheel by now?

None wrote:

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> > Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3ED9E846.C5AFE620@int- > resources.com: > > [...] > > difference and it's annoying when you put that much effrt into creating > > a setup and then have to readjust those same setups when you rebuild > > your PC, which I do at least a couple of times a year > > So shouldn't you have a new USB FF steering wheel by now?

No, I have a very good wheel, as well as probably the best pedals money can buy Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Have you ever tried one of those gameport to USB converters? USB would get you out of the speed sensitivity thing entirely. "Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > No, I have a very good wheel, as well as probably the best pedals money > can buy > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > "goyl at nettx dot no" > > http://www.theuspits.com > > "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" > --Groucho Marx--

Haqsau wrote: > > Have you ever tried one of those gameport to USB converters? USB would get > you out of the speed sensitivity thing entirely. No I haven't, tried a generic one that didn't work, those other ones I've never found over here......I'm actually considering rewiring my wheel and pedals using a cheap USB wheel's electronics, but that's one for the long winter evenings, now I'm looking for a quick and easy solution :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Ok, perhaps you need a newer motherboard, one that has a locked pci speed, like the abit nf7-s. I use a Santacruz with a T2 gameport wheel, and love the precise wheel response I get with a fast system. rms

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote: > > I used to have a CH gamecard that was speed adjustable but I don't > think they all are/were. I beliive there where ISA aswell, just like the Thrustmaster cards... Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Roger Squires wrote: > > Ok, perhaps you need a newer motherboard, one that has a locked pci speed, > like the abit nf7-s. I use a Santacruz with a T2 gameport wheel, and love > the precise wheel response I get with a fast system. My current MoBo has that, ASUS P4C800 :-), but even so my setups "feel" different, I can't put my finger on it and describe it, but they just don't have the same feel and my laptimes seems to reflect this, could be psychological of course... Anyways, it's probably a moot point since nobody seems to know of a PCI game card, this lot usually responds quickly to requests like this :-), so I'll assume that I need to look at other ways Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote:

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> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:06:39 +0200, Goy Larsen > <[email hidden]> reckoned: > > >Anyways, it's probably a moot point since nobody seems to know of a PCI > >game card, > > There is/was one and it is called PDPI Lightning L4 gamecard. I know > they made an ISA one but I thought they later came out with a PCI > version. Maybe my memory is faulty too though. :-)

Right......PDPI it is then Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote:

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> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:06:39 +0200, Goy Larsen > <[email hidden]> reckoned: > > >Anyways, it's probably a moot point since nobody seems to know of a PCI > >game card, > > There is/was one and it is called PDPI Lightning L4 gamecard. I know > they made an ISA one but I thought they later came out with a PCI > version. Maybe my memory is faulty too though. :-)

Says "discontiued" on the Act Labs site....pic looks like an ISA card though, oh well, at least we tried :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Goy Larsen wrote:

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> > > My current MoBo has that, ASUS P4C800 :-), but even so my setups "feel" > different, I can't put my finger on it and describe it, but they just > don't have the same feel and my laptimes seems to reflect this, could be > psychological of course... > >

Have you tested your setup using something that gives raw values, like DXtweak2 or the GPL cal menu. Check the axis ranges and see if the pointer is smoother (less jitters). That would give you some numbers to compare to tell if its your system or just you. ;-) BTW, you do recalibrate your wheel & pedals after making changes to your system, right? Ken

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote:

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> > P.S. Here's a review of the L4 (ISA) just for kicks. Gordon got > lambasted over this review because of his claims of massive frame rate > increases by using L4. Yea sure, standard gameport takes up 50% cpu > utilization according to him. > > http://www.combatsim.com/archive/htm/htm_arc3/l4-new.htm

LOL, yeah, I remember reading similar claims Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Ken MacKay wrote: > > Have you tested your setup using something that gives raw values, like DXtweak2 > or the GPL cal menu. Check the axis ranges and see if the pointer is smoother > (less jitters). That would give you some numbers to compare to tell if its your > system or just you. ;-) Yes....and there are some minor differences, can't remember the numbers right now of course, but there wan't a massive difference > BTW, you do recalibrate your wheel & pedals after making changes to your system, > right? I recalibrate my wheel after every reboot....:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

> So, do they exist ? Yes here is the link http://www.act-labs.com/pdpi_buy.htm I'm sure lots of people have these laying around as they were state of the art 4-5 yrs ago (Not exactly sure on that time frame LOL) What driving game are you referring to and what kind of wheel do you have. I know for sure in N2003 framerate seems to affect the car setup as far as speed and handling. Steve Paradise

Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]: > [...] > No, I have a very good wheel, as well as probably the best pedals > money can buy > [...] But if it uses the gameport, it's analog and uses a potentiometer. You will definitly get better control from a digital wheel. Heck if you combine an inexpensive MS Sidewinder FF wheel with your pedals, you'll see it'll be much better.

None wrote: > > But if it uses the gameport, it's analog and uses a potentiometer. You > will definitly get better control from a digital wheel. Heck if you > combine an inexpensive MS Sidewinder FF wheel with your pedals, you'll see > it'll be much better. I've only tried their non FF wheels, I've got no interest of FF wheels, and I'm considering buying a new one and scrapping it for the wiring/pots, but actually using one of those plastic wheels, no thx mate :-), the sturdiness of my wheel brings with it a higher level of precision in my opinion However, rewiring and experimenting are for those looooong cold winter night, which around this place starts late August if you ask me :-), so I was looking for a quick fix that could possibly be turned into a permanent one should it turn out good, replacing the mechanics of my wheel and pedals is not an option I'm afraid Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

StP wrote: > > > So, do they exist ? > Yes here is the link http://www.act-labs.com/pdpi_buy.htm I'm sure > lots of people have these laying around as they were state of the art > 4-5 yrs ago (Not exactly sure on that time frame LOL) By the looks of things, they are ISA, not PCI, even so I tried to order one from Act Labs to see if they gave me a choice of ISA or PCI, but all I got was "discontinued" and looking further it seems like PDPI is out of business..... > What driving game are you referring to and what kind of wheel do > you have. I know for sure in N2003 framerate seems to affect the car > setup as far as speed and handling. Steve Paradise Good point, I mostly race N2003 when I race and I try to lower my detail to make sure I have a continuous high FPS, I try to aim at 75 or so in the midst of things This is one feature I miss from most (all ?) games, the ability to set a maximum FPS, personally I feel that a constant 50 FPS is better then one that varies from 50-100, then it would just be a matter of dropping eye candy until it was pegged at 50 FPS no matter what, or whatever your Comp allows Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

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> "Jürgen Schroeder" wrote: > > > > P.S. Here's a review of the L4 (ISA) just for kicks. Gordon got > > lambasted over this review because of his claims of massive frame rate > > increases by using L4. Yea sure, standard gameport takes up 50% cpu > > utilization according to him. > > > > http://www.combatsim.com/archive/htm/htm_arc3/l4-new.htm > > LOL, yeah, I remember reading similar claims

It's pretty much correct however, 50% may be too much, I think on average it is more like 20%. If you take a game which is cpu limited and measure frame rates with the analogue joystick enabled and disabled you will see a significant difference in frame rate, try it yourself. The gameport is a pretty nasty design that relies on the cpu timing how long it takes a capacitor to discharge, basically you are using you cpu as an analogue to digital converter instead of a proper ADC which does the conversion pretty much instantly (and is cheaper than a pentuim 4!) Paul

"J�rgen Schroeder" wrote:

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> > On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 22:44:39 +0200, Goy Larsen > <[email hidden]> reckoned: > > >This is one feature I miss from most (all ?) games, the ability to set a > >maximum FPS, > > Microsoft's FS2002 has that feature, I believe their CFS 2 and 3 > series does too.

Then they've got *something* right at least :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Goy said: This is one feature I miss from most (all ?) games, the ability to set a maximum FPS, personally I feel that a constant 50 FPS is better then one that varies from 50-100, then it would just be a matter of dropping eye candy until it was pegged at 50 FPS no matter what, or whatever your Comp allows Totally agree.... I wish there was a way to limit the framerate in N2003 to whatever max you wanted it to be. Then you could set it at a level that your system could handle in all situations and in effect would allow you to maintain a constant framerate. The variance in framerate on my system is plus or minus 30-35 fps. If you are a league racer you will notice that you can have a setup in practice that handles great and not the least bit loose and then on the start when your framerate drops due to many cars being drawn you'll loop it on the first lap. Note we run a pre-designated temp so there is no change in temp once the race starts which also could affect handling. Other than turning off aids for league races and eliminating wall glue the framerate thing is right up there as an issue for me. Steve Paradise

Sorry bout the PDPI reference , I do know the dif between isa and pci, had a brainfart. What about buying a Rockfire USB gameport which gives better response anyway,would have to change pots. I think I asked you in a previous post what kinda wheel you have,it must be analog.Steve Paradise

StP wrote:

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> > Sorry bout the PDPI reference , I do know the dif between isa and pci, > had a brainfart. > What about buying a Rockfire USB gameport which gives better > response anyway,would have to change pots. I think I asked you in a > previous post what kinda wheel you have,it must be analog.Steve > Paradise

Home made with Redline Pedals, Nigel Nichols for president !!, and yes, the Rockfire adapter does look like the way to go even though they are impossible to find here in my little corner of the world, time to break out the CC and order from overseas perhaps Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (StP) writes: >> So, do they exist ? > Yes here is the link http://www.act-labs.com/pdpi_buy.htm I'm sure >lots of people have these laying around as they were state of the art >4-5 yrs ago (Not exactly sure on that time frame LOL) Not PCI, but ISA. And I still *use* mine...<g> Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.950 MonsterRank: +305.145 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP wrote:

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> > In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] > (StP) writes: > > >> So, do they exist ? > > Yes here is the link http://www.act-labs.com/pdpi_buy.htm I'm sure > >lots of people have these laying around as they were state of the art > >4-5 yrs ago (Not exactly sure on that time frame LOL) > > Not PCI, but ISA. And I still *use* mine...<g>

Right, guess a game card isn't such a good idea after all.....:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

In article <[email hidden]>, elmana@int- resources.com says...

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> > > EldredP wrote: > > Not PCI, but ISA. And I still *use* mine...<g> > > Right, guess a game card isn't such a good idea after all.....:-) > >

ooooooooohhhhhh, BURN! :) MRSisson -- LOAD "GPL",8,1 RUN

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (StP) writes: >If you are a league >racer you will notice that you can have a setup in practice that >handles great and not the least bit loose and then on the start when >your framerate drops due to many cars being drawn you'll loop it on >the first lap. That might have been what got me a couple of races ago... :-( Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:-1.950 MonsterRank: +305.145 N2002 Rank:+17.59 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP wrote:

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> In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (StP) writes: > >> If you are a league >> racer you will notice that you can have a setup in practice that >> handles great and not the least bit loose and then on the start when >> your framerate drops due to many cars being drawn you'll loop it on >> the first lap. > > That might have been what got me a couple of races ago... :-( > > Eldred

That *must* have been what happened to me in Saturdays RASCAR race, It couldn't *possibly* have been my bad driving ! LOL -- Ian P (The idiot who looped it on Lap 1) <email invalid due to spammers>