YANGA!!!

AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... But this one's special... because it's mine ;) And it came totally unexpected, too... I had gone negative at six tracks but was stuck at +9 for a while. But this week my old 8:29 on the Ring suddenly turned into an 8:20.07 and before I knew it I was sucked into the Dark Side ;) Never thought I'd make it before the end of this year - woohoo :) 8) Regards, Rudy (GPLrank -0.10)

Ruud Dingeman

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> Never thought I'd make it before the end of this year - woohoo :) 8) > > Regards, Rudy > > (GPLrank -0.10) > >

well done! Splendid!!

"Ruud Dingemans" wrote... > AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... > > > But this one's special... because it's mine ;) Congrats!! -Nice Ring time too! -A lot of people acchieve negativity (<-- new use of the word <g>) by going Alien on the other tracks and leaving their Ring time to lag behind, but you did it "properly". -Well done! Jan. =---

In article <3ef51e36$0$45378$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Ruud Dingemans) wrote: > But this one's special... because it's mine ;) :o) Congratulations. Andrew McP

Ruud Dingemans wrote:

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> AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... > > > But this one's special... because it's mine ;) > > > And it came totally unexpected, too... I had gone negative at six tracks > but was stuck at +9 for a while. > > But this week my old 8:29 on the Ring suddenly turned into an 8:20.07 > and before I knew it I was sucked into the Dark Side ;) > > Never thought I'd make it before the end of this year - woohoo :) 8) > > Regards, Rudy > > (GPLrank -0.10) >

Good work!

Congrats!! Another alien hatches!! ;o) "Ruud Dingemans" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3ef51e36$0$45378$[email hidden]...

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> AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... > > > But this one's special... because it's mine ;) > > > And it came totally unexpected, too... I had gone negative at six tracks > but was stuck at +9 for a while. > > But this week my old 8:29 on the Ring suddenly turned into an 8:20.07 > and before I knew it I was sucked into the Dark Side ;) > > Never thought I'd make it before the end of this year - woohoo :) 8) > > Regards, Rudy > > (GPLrank -0.10) >

Congrats!! :) "Ruud Dingemans" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3ef51e36$0$45378$[email hidden]... > AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... > > > But this one's special... because it's mine ;)

Congrats, Ruud! Brutal Ring time. Did you bother with a wheel or just use the keyboard? ;-) You du man. Any entertaining details for the proles? Jim Ruud Dingemans wrote:

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> AND it's another negative GPLrank announcement... > > > But this one's special... because it's mine ;) > > > And it came totally unexpected, too... I had gone negative at six > tracks but was stuck at +9 for a while. > > But this week my old 8:29 on the Ring suddenly turned into an 8:20.07 > and before I knew it I was sucked into the Dark Side ;) > > Never thought I'd make it before the end of this year - woohoo :) 8) > > Regards, Rudy > > (GPLrank -0.10) >

The Carvalho Family wrote: > Congrats, Ruud! Brutal Ring time. Did you bother with a wheel or just > use the keyboard? ;-) <Grin> Yeah right Jim, I wonder if even an alien could do that with a keyboard on the Ring... then again.. > Any entertaining details for the proles? Um well, I *almost* flew off the track at Hatzenbach, Aremberg, Fuchsr�hre, Kallenhard, Wehrseifen, Kesselchen, Pflanzgarten, Schwalbenschwanz, the entry to D�ttinger H�he and Antoniusbuche, but apart from that, nothing special really ;) Thanks to everyone who replied, btw - I'm fully aware this 8:20 was just one lucky lap, but I'm pretty happy about finally having had one nevertheless ;) Regards, Ruud

"Ruud Dingemans" wrote... > <snip> > Thanks to everyone who replied, btw - I'm fully aware this > 8:20 was just one lucky lap, but I'm pretty happy about > finally having had one nevertheless ;) Any Ring lap you can drive away from is a good one. ;-)) Jan. =---

>Thanks to everyone who replied, btw - I'm fully aware this 8:20 was just >one lucky lap, but I'm pretty happy about finally having had one >nevertheless ;) Yeah, I know how THAT goes. I ran a Ring lap that got me to the negative side, and haven't had a laptime close SINCE... Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP wrote:

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>>Thanks to everyone who replied, btw - I'm fully aware this 8:20 was just >>one lucky lap, but I'm pretty happy about finally having had one >>nevertheless ;) > > > Yeah, I know how THAT goes. I ran a Ring lap that got me to the negative side, > and haven't had a laptime close SINCE... > > Eldred

To negotiate 174 turns at a good pace requires more than luck. At a short track you might get a lucky lap, but not at the Ring and that's why it's a good measure of driver skill. If you can do one good lap there then there's more, just gotta keep trying to get it, and that takes time and patience. Ken

"Ken MacKay" wrote...

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> <snip> > To negotiate 174 turns at a good pace requires more > than luck. At a short track you might get a lucky lap, > but not at the Ring and that's why it's a good measure > of driver skill. If you can do one good lap there then > there's more, just gotta keep trying to get it, and > that takes time and patience.

Agree, to a certain extend... once you know the layout of the place I think it's too frustrating to keep practising there. Mess up and you gotta go all the way around again to have another go (RingTrainer only teaches you about cold tyres). I like to practise and learn things that shave a few 1/10ths off at a track where blowing a lap is not a big problem, then apply that knowledge to the Ring and knock 3 seconds off my previous best (though the gains are starting to get smaller for me now). Another way of establishing a rythm there is to start a GP from the back against the AI. Just bobbing along picking off the odd few that really get in your way and, seeing as the car gets so much more performant every lap and the AI get in the way of overstretching yourself, you can get some quite nice laptimes in before the race is over. Jan. =---

"Ken MacKay" wrote: > > To negotiate 174 turns at a good pace requires more than luck. At a shorttrack > you might get a lucky lap, but not at the Ring and that's why it's a good > measure of driver skill. If you can do one good lap there then there'smore, > just gotta keep trying to get it, and that takes time and patience. I associate 174 turns with a series that involves a co-driver calling the notes... I've seriously thought about meeting up with my old rally co-driver from years back and then showing him GPL just to get my GPLRank down! I am not sure it is such a measure of driver skill any more than any other track, more of dedication and patience <ducks for cover> Cheers Tony --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.488 / Virus Database: 287 - Release Date: 05/06/2003

"Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:LgJJa.64323$[email hidden]: > Agree, to a certain extend... once you know the layout of the place I > think it's too frustrating to keep practising there. Mess up and you > gotta go all the way around again to have another goWhy wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative contained 4(!) spins. One would think that as you go faster it would make harder to set PB after messing up, but it's not always true. Only yesterday I set new BRM PB at 8:13, after half spinning in one place and going off track somewhere else. Must have lost couple of seconds. Grrr... Alex.

EldredP wrote: > Yeah, I know how THAT goes. I ran a Ring lap that got me to the negative side, > and haven't had a laptime close SINCE... I guess you'd have to stop 'thinking positive' while racing Eldred, it's the only method I can think of ;) Regards, Rudy PS. Apart from having several large whiskeys and Juzzzt Nott Caeerrring how many times you crash, that is.

Tony Rickard wrote: > I associate 174 turns with a series that involves a co-driver calling the > notes... > I am not sure it is such a measure of driver skill any more than any other > track, more of dedication and patience <ducks for cover> Not to mention an excercise in Buttklenchen Over An Exceedingly Long Period <grin> ;) Regards, Ruud

alexti wrote: > Why wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where > you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative > contained 4(!) spins. <Euargh> In accordance with Eldred's Law, now *I* think I'm gonna be sick (sigh) Regards, Ruud

Ruud Dingemans <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3ef7bb4d$0$76758 $[email hidden]:

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>> Why wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where >> you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative >> contained 4(!) spins. > > ><Euargh> In accordance with Eldred's Law, now *I* think I'm gonna be > sick (sigh)

LOL - I hear you, mate! But don't let it take away from enjoying your accomplishment. Going negative at the Ring is a big deal no matter what, I say. When I went negative at the Ring, I was absolutely over the moon. Probably more so than when I went negative in GPLRank overall, just a few days prior!

alexti wrote:

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> "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in > news:LgJJa.64323$[email hidden]: > > >> Agree, to a certain extend... once you know the layout of the place I think >> it's too frustrating to keep practising there. Mess up and you gotta go all >> the way around again to have another go > > Why wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where you can set > new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative contained 4(!) > spins. One would think that as you go faster it would make harder to set PB > after messing up, but it's not always true. Only yesterday I set new BRM PB > at 8:13, after half spinning in one place and going off track somewhere else. > Must have lost couple of seconds. Grrr... > > Alex. >

LOL, my PB contains 1 quick spin at foxhole losing about 3s, but was pushing hard before, and even harder after from being annoyed at myself for screwing up and more than made up for the spin. Agree about the place being frustrating, just spent a few weeks there working on a monster rank. Sometimes couldn't get a single clean lap in during a 30 minute session, maybe only 1 or 2 in an hour, but if I didn't push then the lap times were about 10-15s slower. Luckily did the Ring first, the other tracks seem so short now that I don't mind throwing away a few laps by pushing too hard. Take pride in that negative Ring time Ruud. Ken

>LOL - I hear you, mate! But don't let it take away from enjoying your >accomplishment. Going negative at the Ring is a big deal no matter what, I >say. When I went negative at the Ring, I was absolutely over the moon. >Probably more so than when I went negative in GPLRank overall, just a few >days prior! > I still need another 2 seconds at the Ring to go negative there. I don't know where I can find those seconds, either. I haven't gotten close to my PB in over 6 months! Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Ped Xing <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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> Ruud Dingemans <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3ef7bb4d$0$76758 > $[email hidden]: > >>> Why wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where >>> you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative >>> contained 4(!) spins. >> >> >><Euargh> In accordance with Eldred's Law, now *I* think I'm gonna be >>sick (sigh) > > LOL - I hear you, mate! But don't let it take away from enjoying your > accomplishment. Going negative at the Ring is a big deal no matter > what, I say.

Right! It doesn't matter how many times you spun in the process, it's the lap time that counts. I don't know if aliens can run mistake-free laps, but I don't see myself being able to make mistake-free lap at the 'Ring. Though GPLRally experience definitely helps to recover from minor mistakes with minimal time loss ;-> Alex.

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>Right! It doesn't matter how many times you spun in the process, >it's the lap time that counts. I don't know if aliens can run >mistake-free laps, but I don't see myself being able to make >mistake-free lap at the 'Ring. Though GPLRally experience >definitely helps to recover from minor mistakes with minimal >time loss ;-> >

My 8:23 PB was a clean lap. That's why I don't see how I can get a lower laptime... I'm already on the edge as IS... Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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>>Right! It doesn't matter how many times you spun in the process, >>it's the lap time that counts. I don't know if aliens can run >>mistake-free laps, but I don't see myself being able to make >>mistake-free lap at the 'Ring. Though GPLRally experience >>definitely helps to recover from minor mistakes with minimal >>time loss ;-> >> > > My 8:23 PB was a clean lap. That's why I don't see how I can get a lower > laptime... I'm already on the edge as IS... > > Eldred

Push harder, I have plenty 8:2x clean laps too, and often I can not understand why my lap time is 8:2x when I thought I had nice clean lap. Also observe your driving. Sometimes I notice new things about old familiar corner. For example, I've recently discovered that the apex in the final right of Kesslechen sequence is much later than I always thought, nearly past the crest, and the whole corner is faster. Alex.

EldredP wrote: > I still need another 2 seconds at the Ring to go negative there. I don't know > where I can find those seconds, either. I haven't gotten close to my PB in > over 6 months! Ever tried ditching more fuel? Prior to getting my PB I seem to remember I dumped *all* the liquid but for 2 laps, saving me about 18 kilograms, and maybe 1/20th of a second every corner... Hey, with 174 curves, it starts to count I guess ;) (Also, what helped as well is remembering to aim for getting thru "sets of corners" fast, keeping up a good average, not trying to enter & exit every corner as fast as possible and ending up in the wrong place for the next one... I suspect this is sooooo easy to forget and sooo important for a place like the Ring...) Regards, Ruud

alexti wrote:

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>>>>you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative >>>>contained 4(!) spins. >> Going negative at the Ring is a big deal no matter >>what, I say. > > > Right! It doesn't matter how many times you spun in the process, > it's the lap time that counts. I don't know if aliens can run > mistake-free laps, but I don't see myself being able to make > mistake-free lap at the 'Ring.

? Well I wouldn't say my lap was anything near mistake-free, bit too much throttle here,bit too little there, bit off the right line just about every other corner, but I *do* know I *need* to get a spin-free lap without any little fly-offs to get anywhere near a decent time... (That's why it took 2345 tries to get to that one clean lap ;) Regards, Rudy

Ruud Dingemans <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3ef90d12$0$76749$[email hidden]: > Well I wouldn't say my lap was anything near mistake-free, > ... <snip> > bit off the right line just about every other corner,about 0.5s times 174/2 = 43 seconds. Well you're looking at WR if you hook everything right ;-> Alex.

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in news:[email hidden]: > I still need another 2 seconds at the Ring to go negative there. I > don't know where I can find those seconds, either. I haven't gotten > close to my PB in over 6 months! Get the Ringtrainer and set it to dump you on the long straight. Voila, no out-lap required! I was sitting at 8:37 and thought it was a good lap and didn't see how I could get lower. Then I got a 32. Then a 29. Then 25 and then 20.. so just keep lapping it, you're bound to get that extra time.

> >Ever tried ditching more fuel? Prior to getting my PB I seem to remember >I dumped *all* the liquid but for 2 laps, saving me about 18 kilograms, >and maybe 1/20th of a second every corner... Hey, with 174 curves, it >starts to count I guess ;) Yeah, I''ve tried that. I've even used the RingTrainer, started from the long straight near the end with just enough for 1 lap, and couldn't do it. My PB is something like 8:23, set in December. I've only broken 8:30 once since then. >(Also, what helped as well is remembering to aim for getting thru "sets >of corners" fast, keeping up a good average, not trying to enter & exit >every corner as fast as possible and ending up in the wrong place for >the next one... I suspect this is sooooo easy to forget and sooo >important for a place like the Ring...) I guess I don't know what combos make a 'set'. If I push anywhere, I'm off the track. I watch replays of fast guys(and their 'tail lights' in races), and I'm just in awe of the speeds they can carry in the turns. I've crashed more than once trying to follow in the tire tracks of someone else. Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

>Get the Ringtrainer and set it to dump you on the long straight. Voila, no >out-lap required! >Hehe...I just replied to Ruud about my use of RingTrainer... :-) >I was sitting at 8:37 and thought it was a good lap and didn't see how I >could get lower. Then I got a 32. Then a 29. Then 25 and then 20.. so >just keep lapping it, you're bound to get that extra time. When I have to brake at the same spots all the time just to stay on the track, I run about the same laptimes. My average is from about 8:37 - 8:45. Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP wrote: > straight near the end with just enough for 1 lap, and couldn't do it. My PB is > something like 8:23, set in December. I've only broken 8:30 once since then. Well I haven't broken that 8:20 either but I'm sure it's possible if I put enough laps in - that's what got me there in the first place ;) > I guess I don't know what combos make a 'set'. If I push anywhere, I'm off the > track. I watch replays of fast guys(and their 'tail lights' in races), and I'm > just in awe of the speeds they can carry in the turns. I've crashed more than > once trying to follow in the tire tracks of someone else. Join the club mate ;) I can't do a Huttu either (the aliens always seem to be able to accelerate without wheelspin, wonder how they do *that*). But to just keep on lapping, practising for the fun of it, and not concentrating on braking very late (too crash-prone) but good medium-curve speed and good smooth exits may give better times without too much angst, I suspect. That's what did it for me, at least in part... Regards, Rudy PS. Besides, if I remember correctly I once read in an old 1999-ish Usenet post you'd probably have multiple heart attacks if you ever went negative, so just be glad you're alive and cherish the glory now that you're finally there - don't worry, be happy ;)

Ruud Dingemans <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3efb862f$0$45373$[email hidden]:

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> EldredP wrote: > >> straight near the end with just enough for 1 lap, and couldn't do it. >> My PB is something like 8:23, set in December. I've only broken 8:30 >> once since then. > > Well I haven't broken that 8:20 either but I'm sure it's possible if I > put enough laps in - that's what got me there in the first place ;) > >> I guess I don't know what combos make a 'set'. If I push anywhere, >> I'm off the track. I watch replays of fast guys(and their 'tail >> lights' in races), and I'm just in awe of the speeds they can carry in >> the turns. I've crashed more than once trying to follow in the tire >> tracks of someone else. > > > Join the club mate ;) I can't do a Huttu either (the aliens always > seem to be able to accelerate without wheelspin, wonder how they do > *that*). But to just keep on lapping, practising for the fun of it, and > not concentrating on braking very late (too crash-prone) but good > medium-curve speed and good smooth exits may give better times without > too much angst, I suspect. That's what did it for me, at least in > part... > > Regards, Rudy > > PS. Besides, if I remember correctly I once read in an old 1999-ish > Usenet post you'd probably have multiple heart attacks if you ever went > negative, so just be glad you're alive and cherish the glory now that > you're finally there - don't worry, be happy ;)

Yeah, I wonder if anybody believes Eldred's tales these days ;-> Only few days ago in the league race he was harassing me for good 20 laps, consistently running 2 seconds below the benchmark time until he had finally got through :-( Alex.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (alexti) writes: >Also observe your driving. Sometimes I notice new things about >old familiar corner. For example, I've recently discovered that >the apex in the final right of Kesslechen sequence is much later >than I always thought, nearly past the crest, and the whole corner >is faster. Ack...I don't eve know what corner you're referring to... Gotta find my track map. Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (alexti) writes:

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>Why wait for the next lap? 'Ring is one of the few tracks where >you can set new PB after messing up. My first PB when I went negative >contained 4(!) spins. One would think that as you go faster it would >make harder to set PB after messing up, but it's not always true. >Only yesterday I set new BRM PB at 8:13, after half spinning in >one place and going off track somewhere else. Must have lost >couple of seconds. Grrr...

But you're an alien, Alex...<g> Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Ken MacKay <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> Yeah, I know how THAT goes. I ran a Ring lap that got me to the negative >side, >> and haven't had a laptime close SINCE... >> >> Eldred > >To negotiate 174 turns at a good pace requires more than luck. At a short >track >you might get a lucky lap, but not at the Ring and that's why it's a good >measure of driver skill. If you can do one good lap there then there's more, >just gotta keep trying to get it, and that takes time and patience.

Patience? What's THAT? :-) Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <LgJJa.64323$[email hidden]>, "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> writes: >Another way of establishing a rythm there is to start a GP from the back >against the AI. Just bobbing along picking off the odd few that really get >in your way and, seeing as the car gets so much more performant every lap >and the AI get in the way of overstretching yourself, you can get some quite >nice laptimes in before the race is over. > And where the heck can you pass at the Ring? The only places I can do it are on the 3 straights. So, I end up stuck(and frustrated) behind the AI for about 90% of the lap. Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <bd4ijo$p1gub$[email hidden]>, "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> writes: >Congrats!! Another alien hatches!! ;o) > Just because you go negative doesn't mean you're an alien. I wish it DID...<g> Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > And where the heck can you pass at the Ring? The only places I can do itare > on the 3 straights. So, I end up stuck(and frustrated) behind the AI forabout > 90% of the lap. Yup, that sounds about right. Fortunately it's not too hard to put pressure on the driver in front, and mistakes are common. I think I've only ever had to follow one car round a complete lap once, although I've defended for a complete lap on a couple of occasions. The 'ring is hard enough to get round alone, when you have to check your mirrors too it starts to get very complicated ;-) Malc.

"EldredP" wrote... > <snip> > And where the heck can you pass at the Ring? The only places I > can do it are on the 3 straights. So, I end up stuck (and > frustrated) behind the AI for about 90% of the lap. The object of the exercise is not to charge to the front and beat the AI. Because the AI keep you below what *you* think you can do, you are "free" to play around with your line in order to find a way around them, see how you can drive sections faster to get a run, etc... Besides, there's a couple more places where you can pass at the Ring. Aremberg, out of Bergwerk if you set them up right, into Carroussel, into the right hander after Wipperman, etc... just make sure you adjust your line to be where you need to be to make your move and to adjust your braking so you don't overshoot on an outbraking attempt. Jan. =---

Bah! What makes you think you aren't? ;o) "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > Just because you go negative doesn't mean you're an alien. I wish itDID...<g> > > Eldred > -- > Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info onmy > homepage) > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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> In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (alexti) writes: > >>Also observe your driving. Sometimes I notice new things about >>old familiar corner. For example, I've recently discovered that >>the apex in the final right of Kesslechen sequence is much later >>than I always thought, nearly past the crest, and the whole corner is >>faster. > > Ack...I don't eve know what corner you're referring to... Gotta find > my track map. > > Eldred

Don't bother, I rarely remember corner names correctly, it might be entry into Klostertal. After you exit Ex-Muhle, the long fast and twisty section starts. The nearest blind over-the-crest right hander is the corner I'm talking about. After making it you run toward slow right hand 180 which leads toward Karussell. Alex.

[email hidden] (alexti) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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> [email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in > news:[email hidden]: > >> In article <[email hidden]>, >> [email hidden] (alexti) writes: >> >>>Also observe your driving. Sometimes I notice new things about >>>old familiar corner. For example, I've recently discovered that >>>the apex in the final right of Kesslechen sequence is much later >>>than I always thought, nearly past the crest, and the whole corner is >>>faster. >> >> Ack...I don't eve know what corner you're referring to... Gotta find >> my track map. >> >> Eldred > Don't bother, I rarely remember corner names correctly, it might be > entry into Klostertal. After you exit Ex-Muhle,

As I mentioned I rarely remember corner names correctly. Read Bergwerk instead of Ex-Muhle :) Alex.

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> the long fast and twisty > section starts. The nearest blind over-the-crest right hander is the > corner I'm talking about. After making it you run toward slow right > hand 180 which leads toward Karussell. > > Alex. > >

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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> In article <LgJJa.64323$[email hidden]>, "Jan > Verschueren" ><[email hidden]> writes: > >>Another way of establishing a rythm there is to start a GP from the >>back against the AI. Just bobbing along picking off the odd few that >>really get in your way and, seeing as the car gets so much more >>performant every lap and the AI get in the way of overstretching >>yourself, you can get some quite nice laptimes in before the race is >>over. >> > > And where the heck can you pass at the Ring?

Here's my list of passing places against AI (assuming being in slower car myself): - divebomb entering Hatzenbach (first slow left in that sequence) - exiting Flugplatz (going faster on the left side of the road) - outside line in Schwedenkreuz and then inside into Aremberg (a little bit risky move) - going toward The Tree on the left side (a bit risky too) - into the first right hander after The Tree (another risky spot) - variety of moves in Kesselchen and Klostertal (AI is just going too slowly there) - between first and second left handers after the Karussell - going into Eschbach (or rather sort of accelerating out of the previous corner) - going toward Eis Kurve or on the inside of Eis Kurve - taking inside line in Pflantzgarten (just before the jump when you need to brake) - braking into Tiergarten (works only if you manage to stay close enough on the straight, where AI tends to have insane top speed) Alex. > The only places I can do > it are on the 3 straights. So, I end up stuck(and frustrated) behind > the AI for about 90% of the lap. > > Eldred

alexti wrote: >>And where the heck can you pass at the Ring? > - divebomb entering Hatzenbach (first slow left in that sequence) Sheer suicide > - exiting Flugplatz (going faster on the left side of the road) Are you NUTS?!? ;) > - outside line in Schwedenkreuz and then inside into Aremberg ditto for the first part! > - going toward The Tree on the left side (a bit risky too) Crikey, another one for utter nutters only! > - into the first right hander after The Tree (another risky spot) <gulp> > - variety of moves in Kesselchen and Klostertal (AI is just going > too slowly there) Klostertal right-hander *might* be doable... > - between first and second left handers after the Karussell Only if you're tired of life! > - going into Eschbach (or rather sort of accelerating out > of the previous corner) > - going toward Eis Kurve or on the inside of Eis Kurve > - taking inside line in Pflantzgarten (just before the jump Means going in REALLY fast and braking REALLY late, which is not something I'd recommend if I'd want to finish the lap, and therefore.. ;) > - braking into Tiergarten (works only if you manage to stay > close enough on the straight, Yoiks! Another hi-risk manoeuvre for those with lives to spare (outgunning them going onto the D�ttinger straight might be easier!) Ok, Alex, we've established you may not be an alien but could certainly be counted among the kamikazes ;) Regards, Rudy (GPLRank -0.10)

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (alexti) writes: >Don't bother, I rarely remember corner names correctly, it might be >entry into Klostertal. After you exit Ex-Muhle, the long fast and twisty >section starts. The nearest blind over-the-crest right hander is the >corner I'm talking about. After making it you run toward slow right >hand 180 which leads toward Karussell. That's a corner that I keep hitting the fence on the left if I try to push. As a result, I usually just *crawl* over that crest... Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <bdi1ju$tia4e$[email hidden]>, "Haqsau" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>Bah! What makes you think you aren't? ;o) > >"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> >> Just because you go negative doesn't mean you're an alien. I wish it >DID...<g>

Because I still usually finish in the bottom half of the order in most of my races... Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (alexti) writes: >Yeah, I wonder if anybody believes Eldred's tales these days ;-> >Only few days ago in the league race he was harassing me for good >20 laps, consistently running 2 seconds below the benchmark time >until he had finally got through :-( Finish the story, Alex... Silverstone, you in a BRM, me in a Lotus... And I was only able to get by because you spun off...<g> Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

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> In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (alexti) writes: > >>Don't bother, I rarely remember corner names correctly, it might be >>entry into Klostertal. After you exit Ex-Muhle, the long fast and >>twisty section starts. The nearest blind over-the-crest right hander is >>the corner I'm talking about. After making it you run toward slow right >>hand 180 which leads toward Karussell. > > That's a corner that I keep hitting the fence on the left if I try to > push.

That's an expected result if you turn in too early. I you keep going straight further and then brake and turn-in later you can do it just nicely and carrying more speed. I usually aim my right front wheel into the fence on the right. The car understeers a bit and I can make it with left wheels just barely staying on the pavement. Of course right wheels on the grass. On the exit layout changes and now left wheels are on the grass and right ones are on the pavement. Hasn't anybody told you to use all the track ;-> Alex. > As a result, I usually just *crawl* over that crest... > > Eldred

Ruud Dingemans <[email hidden]> wrote in news:3efcf435$0$76755$[email hidden]: I said that all those moves are against AI, not against humans.

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> alexti wrote: > >>>And where the heck can you pass at the Ring? > >> - divebomb entering Hatzenbach (first slow left in that sequence) > > Sheer suicide

AI brake early there and turn-in late, taking pretty weird line which makes this pass 99% safe if you're close enough > >> - exiting Flugplatz (going faster on the left side of the road) > > Are you NUTS?!? ;)AI takes double-right after the jump and following left slowly, so if you time your approach by falling back before the jump and then catching AI at the exit of the left hander you can easily pass by taking wider line on the entry and staying on the left between left-hander and following left-hand bend

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>> - outside line in Schwedenkreuz and then inside into Aremberg > > ditto for the first part! > >> - going toward The Tree on the left side (a bit risky too) > > Crikey, another one for utter nutters only! > >> - into the first right hander after The Tree (another risky spot) > ><gulp> > >> - variety of moves in Kesselchen and Klostertal (AI is just going too >> slowly there) > > Klostertal right-hander *might* be doable... > >> - between first and second left handers after the Karussell > > Only if you're tired of life!

Again it's matter of timing. AI slows down too much for the first one, so you can easily pass if you don't run into them :) So you need to fall back a bit so you have room at the exit.

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> >> - going into Eschbach (or rather sort of accelerating out >> of the previous corner) >> - going toward Eis Kurve or on the inside of Eis Kurve >> - taking inside line in Pflantzgarten (just before the jump > > Means going in REALLY fast and braking REALLY late, which is not > something I'd recommend if I'd want to finish the lap, and therefore.. > ;)

Not really, just consider the previous corners as one sequence starting after the mini-jump. Turn-in late for the first right hander, stay tight on the exit of the second right hander and accelerate through the next left hander. This would allow you to pass AI almost completely before going into the final left of the sequence and anyway you've already taken away the good line so AI has to slow down. > >> - braking into Tiergarten (works only if you manage to stay >> close enough on the straight, > > Yoiks! Another hi-risk manoeuvre for those with lives to spare > (outgunning them going onto the D�ttinger straight might be easier!)Oh yeah, they are just disappearing in the distance. I can't stay in their slipstream even in Honda. > > Ok, Alex, we've established you may not be an alien but could > certainly be counted among the kamikazes ;)lol Alex.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (alexti) writes: >On the exit layout changes and >now left wheels are on the grass and right ones are on the pavement. >Hasn't anybody told you to use all the track ;-> Coming from someone who uses all the track and MORE... You should be sponsored by John Deere...<g> Eldred -- Help find missing child: Tatianna Ashley Chillcutt from Michigan(info on my homepage) Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

(alexti) writes: > >Don't bother, I rarely remember corner names correctly, it might be > >entry into Klostertal. I think it's because of cholesterol that I CAN'T remember the names.