Wow! rFactor PCC + Nordschleife 2007

Hi! I just drove the new PCC 2007 on the new Nordschleife 2007, and I'm slowly trying to calm down again... ;) The cockpit, the FF, the brakes, the thrill of driving that Porsche on this beautiful track. There are many great mods and tracks available for rF, but IMHO this combo takes the cake! <http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=PCC%202007> <http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Nordschleife%202007> greetings ronny

"Ronald Stoehr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fba468$r5a$[email hidden]...

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> Hi! > > I just drove the new PCC 2007 on the new Nordschleife 2007, > and I'm slowly trying to calm down again... ;) > > The cockpit, the FF, the brakes, the thrill of driving that > Porsche on this beautiful track. There are many great mods > and tracks available for rF, but IMHO this combo takes the cake! > > <http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=PCC%202007> > <http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Nordschleife%202007>

Not intending to hijack this thread, I have a dumb question, somewhat related to mods and updates. What are HAT files? Why do some mods instruct you to delete old ones? And finally, are they responsible for the recent splurge of CTDs with some car mods?

Ronald Stoehr wrote: > Hi! > > I just drove the new PCC 2007 on the new Nordschleife 2007, > and I'm slowly trying to calm down again... ;) > Are we in racesim-heaven yet ? :) Regards, Mr. S.

Thanks for the tip, downloaded the mods after reading your post. Simply the best mod for rFactor so far, totally awesome. Cheers, Andre On Sat, 01 Sep 2007 00:19:42 +0200, Ronald Stoehr <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Hi! > >I just drove the new PCC 2007 on the new Nordschleife 2007, >and I'm slowly trying to calm down again... ;) > >The cockpit, the FF, the brakes, the thrill of driving that >Porsche on this beautiful track. There are many great mods >and tracks available for rF, but IMHO this combo takes the cake! > ><http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=PCC%202007> ><http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Nordschleife%202007> > >greetings >ronny

I'm enjoying the track, of course, but I'll withhold judgement on the PCC07 until I can get the nose to stop plowing. The front bar is disconnected, and the rear wing is as low as she'll go, and still no hint of neutral handling in sight. It's twitchy on trailing throttle, but that still isn't a good handling car. How are you guys getting along with the new ride? "Andre Warringa" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Thanks for the tip, downloaded the mods after reading your post. > Simply the best mod for rFactor so far, totally awesome. > > Cheers, > Andre > > On Sat, 01 Sep 2007 00:19:42 +0200, Ronald Stoehr > <[email hidden]> wrote: > >>Hi! >> >>I just drove the new PCC 2007 on the new Nordschleife 2007, >>and I'm slowly trying to calm down again... ;) >> >>The cockpit, the FF, the brakes, the thrill of driving that >>Porsche on this beautiful track. There are many great mods >>and tracks available for rF, but IMHO this combo takes the cake! >> >><http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=PCC%202007> >><http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Nordschleife%202007> >> >>greetings >>ronny >

"MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lRpCi.1122$[email hidden]... > I'm enjoying the track, of course, but I'll withhold judgement on the > PCC07 until I can get the nose to stop plowing. The front bar is > disconnected, and the rear wing is as low as she'll go, and still no hint > of neutral handling in sight. It's twitchy on trailing throttle, but that > still isn't a good handling car. How are you guys getting along with the > new ride? Hmmm. I'll have to take all of that back. I had problems the other night, and brought it to Sebring to tune it, and nothing seemed to work. Going back to a more reasonable setup, it behaved quite well just by bringing the ride height back down, to the point of riding on the packers at times. The FF settings also make a *huge* difference on perceived limits. (Duh!)

Great mod indeed, but it seems to work in testing mode only for me. As soon as I have other Porsches on the track (even during test day), I get the 1fps-problem. This is the first time I've come across this problem with all the mods I've installed (too many to mention ;-) Any ideas what could be causing this and how to fix it? Cheers, uwe -- GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Uwe Schürkamp wrote: > Great mod indeed, but it seems to work in testing mode only for me. As > soon as I have other Porsches on the track (even during test day), I get > the 1fps-problem. This is the first time I've come across this problem > with all the mods I've installed (too many to mention ;-) > > Any ideas what could be causing this and how to fix it? Hmm, no problems here with 21 AI in front of me. System: 1280x1024 on Intel Core 2 ([email hidden]), X1950Pro, 2GB Ram. Now if the AI were not so STUPID, I could enjoy the mod racing, as it is, I'm just hotlapping... l8er ronny

This production has 'marquee mod' written all over it. But are the Cup cars really this 'boaty'? I preferred, frankly, the tighter, flickable handling of the Porsches in GTR2, a game I no longer play. The problem with GMSF, one has the impression, is Fonsecker with his defensive, dig-in-the-heels reaction to any contrary points of view. He's undoubtably talented, but, for chrissakes, all the better mods have required multiple updates before hitting their stride.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> This production has 'marquee mod' written all over it. But are the Cup > cars really this 'boaty'? I preferred, frankly, the tighter, flickable > handling of the Porsches in GTR2, a game I no longer play. The problem > with GMSF, one has the impression, is Fonsecker with his defensive, > dig-in-the-heels reaction to any contrary points of view. He's > undoubtably talented, but, for chrissakes, all the better mods have > required multiple updates before hitting their stride.

It does feel a bit underdamped on fast bump/rebound, and overdamped on slow. And it gets dicey after smacking the packers at the bottom of Fuchsrohe. But so what? It'll make for great racing. I even like the slippery feel of the fall and fog variants. I've given up on hotlapping for now, and just enjoying the depth the new car and the new track bring. All of it is still new and fresh enough to be enjoyable. I even found lapping it tourist style, at a brisk but sedate sightseeing pace, rewarding. It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out and finished. The car also.

On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: > It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out > and finished. Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all the damn turns.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >> and finished. > > Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all > the damn turns. > >

It's not that hard.

On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:

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> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >> and finished. > > Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all > the damn turns. > >

If you need extra motivation, read up on some f1 history from the 60s. You'll find the Nordschleife mentioned in every 2nd paragraph ;-) Cheers, uwe -- GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

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> On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote: >> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >>> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >>> and finished. >> >> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >> the damn turns.

(Weird. My news server didn't pickup your post. I saw it in Uwe's response...) I crossed that bridge long ago, back when GPL's Nurburgring was new and fresh. It *was* difficult. The track map names defied memorization until the nice folks here helped translate them to something I could relate to in English. A bit of the folklore also helps you memorize the names, and then you can label your memories of their shapes. I tried to reproduce that here, but deleted it before sending. I group the corners into sections slightly different than the track map does, and introducing it here, now, is more likely to confuse than help. Maybe someone else can help with the literal translations. I don't know how to help with the "strength of purpose" part. For me, the question was never "Why?", but "How?" ========== Here's a second try, without any attempt at continuity, with a bit of the folklore... Hatzenabach: slow chicanes leading up to... Quiddlebacher: bridge over the road to the town of Quiddelbach. Flugplatz: "airport", right after the large jump. GPL cars got airborne several feet here, but the Porsche just doesn't have the speed. It leads to the pair of very fast right handers leading onto... Schwendenkreuz: "Swedish Cross". Very fast slightly downhill straight leading to a left hand sweeper. I think the name is for the turn itself; it was said that it honors the Swedish soldiers who died here in one war or another. Or maybe simply a Swede racer who died... I don't recall clearly the story that was told. (For years, I thought the Swedish Cross referred to what I now know is Metgezfeld. In GPL, there was a huge red flag with a white cross draped on the hillside at the 2nd left hander there.) Aremberg Bridge: underpass below the bridge carrying the road to the town of Aremberg. Medium slow right hand sweeper leading onto... Fuchsrohe: "Fox Row", supposedly for the fox families that lived here during construction. Very fast downhill slalom from Aremberg Bridge, and then back uphill to Adenaur Forst. Treacherously bumpy at the natural braking points near the top, tending to upset the car. Adenaur Forst. "Adenaur forest." The town of Adenaur is close by. Increasingly slower series of 90 deg chicanes. Leads onto... Metgezfeld: farm fields belonging to somebody named Metgez, presumably. Fast section with gentle kinks leading to two increasingly slower left handlers. (In GPL, there was a huge red flag draped on the hillside to the right of the second left hander. For years, I mistakenly thought of this section as Schwendenkreuz, for the red cross.) Kallenhardt, downhill esses. In GPL, this was distinct for the row of hedges that is now depicted as armco guarding the cliff dropoff on the left. Weirseifen: first of two bridges. 2nd gear left right chicane leading onto a fast downhill straight to... Breidscheidt: second of two bridges. 3rd gear left right chicane leading to... Ex Muhle: steep uphill right hander, supposedly steeper than Laguna's corkscrew. Lauda Eck: fast left hand kink; almost but can't quite be taken flat out in 5th (PCC2007). Niki Lauda crashed here and was severely burned in the last F1GP run here. (I might have this wrong. The name might actually apply to the right hander that follows, which I think of as...) Bergwerk: long sweeping right hander opening onto a series of very fast leftward kinks, more or less taken as one huge left hand sweeper. Kesselchen: very fast very gentle series of right hand kinks. The Porsche almost reaches terminal speed before the narrow, high speed chicane leading onto... Angst Korner: aptly named. Two high speed lefts leading to a blind 4th gear right. ... I forget the names now; a 4th gear straight, 3rd gear long sweeper, and then the series of kinks leading to... Karrusel: (carousel) a hairpin with a concrete banking. Aim for the pine tree coming out the sweeper. Hohe Acht: (high point, "attention height") flat out slight uphill run through the gears to increasingly tighter left hand kinks. Marks the beginning of the back half of the course. It's downhill from here. Wipperman: a couple of 4th gear straights and high speed left-right chicanes, slightly downhill. Eschbach: big sweeping 3rd gear downhill long left hander. Right hander at the bottom leading to... Bruunchen: slight downhill run, 4th gear straights, 3rd gear sweeping 90 deg bends. Eis Kurve: "ice curve", 3rd gear 120 deg. left hand, right kink, leading to a blind downhill left-right kinks, from which it gets its name. There's very little traction here after cresting before the kinks. Pflantzgarten 1: ("plant garden", possibly named for the castle gardens that bordered here) after a short straight with a small steep drop, two 4th gear right handers, uphill to a left, and then another left, and then a sharp downhill drop to... Pflantzgarten 2: mostly blind series of long gentle esses. Two right-left series. Gas on point is apex of the second right hander once the last left hander comes into view. One last good run up through fifth leading onto... Schwalbenschwanz: "swallowtail", possibly named after it's plan view shape. Right hander leading uphill to reverse camber left. Uphill a bit more to the little carousel, another concrete banking set into the left hander. Uphill some more to a right with a blind exit. Crest for a very short straight leading onto the fast sweeping right hander which opens onto... Dottinger Hohe: flat out run to under Antoine's Bridge, Tiergarten (tea garden), and slowing back to 2nd gear for the hochensrainchicane.

MikeWhy wrote:

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>> On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote: >>> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >>>> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >>>> and finished. >>> >>> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >>> the damn turns. > > (Weird. My news server didn't pickup your post. I saw it in Uwe's > response...) > > I crossed that bridge long ago, back when GPL's Nurburgring was new and > fresh. It *was* difficult. The track map names defied memorization until > the nice folks here helped translate them to something I could relate to > in English. A bit of the folklore also helps you memorize the names, and > then you can label your memories of their shapes.

How does knowing the names (in whatever language) help you getting through all the turns as fast as possible? I can drive a few dozen tracks in my mind, but I don't know more than 2 turns by name... =8^O l8er ronny

"Ronald Stoehr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fbk1v3$ehd$[email hidden]...

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> MikeWhy wrote: >>> On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote: >>>> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >>>>> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >>>>> and finished. >>>> >>>> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >>>> the damn turns. >> >> (Weird. My news server didn't pickup your post. I saw it in Uwe's >> response...) >> >> I crossed that bridge long ago, back when GPL's Nurburgring was new and >> fresh. It *was* difficult. The track map names defied memorization until >> the nice folks here helped translate them to something I could relate to >> in English. A bit of the folklore also helps you memorize the names, and >> then you can label your memories of their shapes. > > How does knowing the names (in whatever language) help you getting through > all the turns as fast as possible? I can drive a few dozen tracks in my > mind, but I don't know more than 2 turns by name... =8^O >

Knowing the names would serve as a common point of reference I you wanted to discuss the track with someone.

"Ronald Stoehr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fbk1v3$ehd$[email hidden]...

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> MikeWhy wrote: >>> On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote: >>>> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >>>>> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >>>>> and finished. >>>> >>>> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >>>> the damn turns. >> >> (Weird. My news server didn't pickup your post. I saw it in Uwe's >> response...) >> >> I crossed that bridge long ago, back when GPL's Nurburgring was new and >> fresh. It *was* difficult. The track map names defied memorization until >> the nice folks here helped translate them to something I could relate to >> in English. A bit of the folklore also helps you memorize the names, and >> then you can label your memories of their shapes. > > How does knowing the names (in whatever language) help you getting through > all the turns as fast as possible? I can drive a few dozen tracks in my > mind, but I don't know more than 2 turns by name... =8^O

It's a fair question. Many tracks have fewer corners total than some sections of the north loop. The names help to anchor things. Estoril versus Barcelona, for example, or Kallenhardt versus Bergwerk. Or Esses, Carousel, and Keyhole at Mid-America. You might categorize things differently. I can't imagine *not* putting a label on it, even something made up. "The 2nd gear hairpin leading opening onto the 4th gear left-right chicane." (But "Bit Kurve" already sums that up for me.)

Albert Ross wrote:

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> > "Ronald Stoehr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:fbk1v3$ehd$[email hidden]... >> MikeWhy wrote: >>>> On Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:59:24 -0700, [email hidden] wrote: >>>>> On Sep 2, 4:56 pm, "MikeWhy" <[email hidden]> wrote: >>>>>> It's a great track, very thoughtfully laid out >>>>>> and finished. >>>>> >>>>> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >>>>> the damn turns. >>> >>> (Weird. My news server didn't pickup your post. I saw it in Uwe's >>> response...) >>> >>> I crossed that bridge long ago, back when GPL's Nurburgring was new >>> and fresh. It *was* difficult. The track map names defied >>> memorization until the nice folks here helped translate them to >>> something I could relate to in English. A bit of the folklore also >>> helps you memorize the names, and then you can label your memories of >>> their shapes. >> >> How does knowing the names (in whatever language) help you getting >> through >> all the turns as fast as possible? I can drive a few dozen tracks in my >> mind, but I don't know more than 2 turns by name... =8^O >> > Knowing the names would serve as a common point of reference I you > wanted to discuss the track with someone.

Agreed, but that's "something completely different" to >>>>> Yea, if you have the energy and strength of purpose to memorize all >>>>> the damn turns. Just curious ronny

> Knowing the names would serve as a common point of reference I you wanted to > discuss the track with someone. ISI (or any developer) really needs to include the track graphic with named corners, accessible from the race menu, in the next version. A small, doable and meaningful enhancement. I'm still a bit murky about the Lesmos.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> >> Knowing the names would serve as a common point of reference I you wanted >> to >> discuss the track with someone. > > ISI (or any developer) really needs to include the track graphic with > named corners, accessible from the race menu, in the next version. A > small, doable and meaningful enhancement. I'm still a bit murky about > the Lesmos.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autodromo_Nazionale_Monza

(ADVANCE WARNING: what follows is an anal-retentive correction to an otherwise excellent post by Mike, but we need to straighten out the local place names ;-) On Tue, 4 Sep 2007 05:05:56 -0500, MikeWhy wrote: > > Hatzenabach: slow chicanes leading up to... > "Hatzenbach" is the name, and they say you can only lose, but not gain time here. Take things slowly, concentrate on the correct line and above all, avoid throwing the hotlap away that you only just started (not as big a problem as it was in GPL due to the "Kurzanbindung" and the much shorter warmup lap you can do on the VLN / 24h layout). > Quiddlebacher: bridge over the road to the town of Quiddelbach. > Name is "Quiddelbacher Hoehe", it's fun keeping the car straight in the air by modulating the engine torque using the throttle and engine revs. > Schwendenkreuz: "Swedish Cross". Very fast slightly downhill straight "Schwedenkreuz". I think it stems from the 30-year-war or something. > > Fuchsrohe: "Fox Row", supposedly for the fox families that lived here during "Fuchsroehre" (Fox tunnel / pipe) > Adenaur Forst. "Adenaur forest." The town of Adenaur is close by. > Increasingly slower series of 90 deg chicanes. Leads onto... "Adenauer Forst" Adenau is the town next to the section. > > Metgezfeld: farm fields belonging to somebody named Metgez, presumably. Fast "Metzgesfeld". > Weirseifen: first of two bridges. 2nd gear left right chicane leading onto a > fast downhill straight to... > "Wehrseifen": a "Wehr" is an artificial waterfall these days, but also used to mean town defensive walls in the old days.

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> Breidscheidt: second of two bridges. 3rd gear left right chicane leading > to... > > Ex Muhle: steep uphill right hander, supposedly steeper than Laguna's > corkscrew. > > Lauda Eck: fast left hand kink; almost but can't quite be taken flat out in > 5th (PCC2007). Niki Lauda crashed here and was severely burned in the last > F1GP run here. (I might have this wrong. The name might actually apply to > the right hander that follows, which I think of as...) >

Also aptly named as "Grillkurve" (BBQ corner), a term which Laude himself coined after the accident. > Wipperman: a couple of 4th gear straights and high speed left-right > chicanes, slightly downhill. Wippermann ("mann" == "man" in German) > Bruunchen: slight downhill run, 4th gear straights, 3rd gear sweeping 90 deg > bends. > Bruennchen ("little well")

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> Pflantzgarten 1: ("plant garden", possibly named for the castle gardens that > bordered here) after a short straight with a small steep drop, two 4th gear > right handers, uphill to a left, and then another left, and then a sharp > downhill drop to... > > Pflantzgarten 2: mostly blind series of long gentle esses. Two right-left > series. Gas on point is apex of the second right hander once the last left > hander comes into view. One last good run up through fifth leading onto...

"Pflanzgarten" > Dottinger Hohe: flat out run to under Antoine's Bridge, Tiergarten (tea > garden), and slowing back to 2nd gear for the hochensrainchicane. "Doettinger Hoehe", "Antoniousbuche" ("Buche" is a tree), and "Tiergarten" means "Zoo" (tea garden would be "Teegarten" ;-) All the best, Uwe -- GPG Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61