MS FF <> MOMO

Hi. I have now a Microsoft FF wheel (the USB-model), and it is getting loose in the axel, so I might buy a new wheel shortly. Which wheel is best, the MS or the MOMO? I'm used to MS-wheel, but have read a lot of good things about the MOMO. Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? -- Mvh Sven

>Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? > That's exactly the switch that I made. I bought the MOMO Racing and to me there is no comparision. Momo blows the MS away in all aspects. Just my opinion Dan

The red momo is a much better wheel than the MS FF, but the pedals are quite bad. If you wan't to use your MS pedals with the red momo. check out this link: http://tytlandsvik.no/momo/ -- Jone Tytlandsvik http://tytlandsvik.no

Just in case you might be interested, I've gone back to my non-FF wheel (TSW), and am selling my slightly used MOMO (red body) on Ebay. It's in excellent condition. Despite what the listing says, I will ship to Canada and Europe. Checked rates for a current bidder, and parcel post is $32.30, no insurance avaiable with this type of service. http://tinyurl.com/oyxn Bob "Sven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bl76bv$22a$[email hidden]... > Hi. > I have now a Microsoft FF wheel (the USB-model), and it is getting loosein > the axel, so I might buy a new wheel shortly. Which wheel is best, the MSor > the MOMO? I'm used to MS-wheel, but have read a lot of good things aboutthe

Quoted text (10 lines)

> MOMO. > Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? > > -- > > Mvh > Sven > > >

Meant to say the $32.30 rate was to Germany. "Bob G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:daHdb.5112$[email hidden]... > Just in case you might be interested, I've gone back to my non-FF wheel > (TSW), and am selling my slightly used MOMO (red body) on Ebay. It's in > excellent condition. Despite what the listing says, I will ship to Canada > and Europe. Checked rates for a current bidder, and parcel post is$32.30,

Quoted text (13 lines)

> no insurance avaiable with this type of service. > > http://tinyurl.com/oyxn > > Bob > > > "Sven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:bl76bv$22a$[email hidden]... > > Hi. > > I have now a Microsoft FF wheel (the USB-model), and it is getting loose > in > > the axel, so I might buy a new wheel shortly. Which wheel is best, the

MS

Quoted text (15 lines)

> or > > the MOMO? I'm used to MS-wheel, but have read a lot of good things about > the > > MOMO. > > Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? > > > > -- > > > > Mvh > > Sven > > > > > > > >

I just went from a non FF MS wheel to the MOMO (black body) and so far I sort of love it--so far. It is fabulous in NR 02 and 03 much better than before. But, having some troubles in seeting it up in good old SCGT so far... Kevin (aka tlgtr) **** "A GOOD friend will come bail you out of jail... but, a TRUE friend will be sitting next to you saying, "Damn we screwed up!!!!."

On 28 Sep 2003 18:15:33 GMT, [email hidden] (Bamadano) wrote: >>Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? >> > >That's exactly the switch that I made. I bought the MOMO Racing and to me there >is no comparision. Momo blows the MS away in all aspects. Just my opinion >Dan Me too-and precisely because the dead zone is much smaller in the Red MOMO. JD

I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the box. That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not stand to use them. The wheel is ok. The newer, cheaper Momo has better pedals from what I understand but the wheel is much cheaper instruction. Logitech, IMHO, never has been able to get it all right at the same time. It's a shame :( If you want a new MSFFW you need to get it now. They have been discontinued. Microsoft has abandoned ALL of it's SideWinder customers and discontinued all SideWinder products. Larry "Sven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bl76bv$22a$[email hidden]... > Hi. > I have now a Microsoft FF wheel (the USB-model), and it is getting loosein > the axel, so I might buy a new wheel shortly. Which wheel is best, the MSor > the MOMO? I'm used to MS-wheel, but have read a lot of good things aboutthe

Quoted text (10 lines)

> MOMO. > Has anybody made that switch before (from MS to MOMO)? > > -- > > Mvh > Sven > > >

"Larry" <[email hidden]> kirjoitti viestiss� news:tJNdb.23575$a16.1542@lakeread01... > I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still > working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into thebox. > That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could notstand > to use them. > > The wheel is ok. Then why not use the MS pedals with the Momo wheel? - Igor -

> > The newer, cheaper Momo has better pedals from what I understand but the > wheel is much cheaper instruction. > Erm, this is new to me. You are saying, that the new MOMO is not as good as the "old" one? I guess, the new is the black, and the "old" is the red one, is that correct? And that the red is better quality than the black? I have not been able to find a red one, here the shops only have the black one with the short gear-shifter at the right side, so I can't compare them. Hmmm, why is Logitech begin to make a wheel in a lower quality? > > If you want a new MSFFW you need to get it now. They have been > discontinued. Microsoft has abandoned ALL of it's SideWinder customersand > discontinued all SideWinder products. >This I did know, and that's why I was looking for something else, to try to ensure future support. -- Mvh Sven

> Hmmm, why is Logitech begin to make a wheel in a lower quality? I can't tell you why, but it does seem to be Logitech's way for doing things. First there was the Logitech Wingman Formula Force, often referred to as LWFF. Then they came out with the red and yellow wheeled cheap versions. The Momo with its ball bearing shaft was next, and then back down the Momo Racing that's out now. Who knows maybe the next version will be better, that's the trend. MadDAWG

Just to clairfy for me the new 'slightly better' wheel is the new black one? How would I use my old MS pedals with the MOMO? (MS non FF so it may not be possible?) Kevin (aka tlgtr) **** "A GOOD friend will come bail you out of jail... but, a TRUE friend will be sitting next to you saying, "Damn we screwed up!!!!."

> How would I use my old MS pedals with the MOMO? (MS non FF so it may notbe > possible?) > Kevin (aka tlgtr) http://tytlandsvik.no/momo/ I have not tried it myself since I don't have a set of MS pedals. MadDAWG

On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:40:57 -0400, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (8 lines)

>I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still >working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the box. >That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > >The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not stand >to use them. > >The wheel is ok.

What is it about the pedals which you dislike? Mine have the metal corrugated base, and the swiveling metal pedals (which I was initially skeptical of but have grown quite used to). Is it a feel issue or something? John DiFool

Thanks for the link...unfortunatley I have the newer wheel and it's not compatiable.. Kevin (aka tlgtr) **** "A GOOD friend will come bail you out of jail... but, a TRUE friend will be sitting next to you saying, "Damn we screwed up!!!!."

"John DiFool" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:40:57 -0400, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still > >working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into thebox. > >That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > > >The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could notstand

Quoted text (11 lines)

> >to use them. > > > >The wheel is ok. > > What is it about the pedals which you dislike? Mine have the metal > corrugated base, and the swiveling metal pedals (which I was > initially skeptical of but have grown quite used to). Is it a feel > issue or something? > > John DiFool >

If they're like my old 'red' LWFF then the pedal travel was terrible. I seem to remember only having about an inch of travel on both pedals. Made it hard to keep from locking up the brakes in deep braking scenarios and harder still to feather the gas with such little travel to work with. I ended up getting a TSW with their nearly relaistic long travel pedals to remedy the problem. The much better pedals offset any apprecitation I ever had for the phoney baloney feeling FF that the Logitech had.

When I first tried the pedals, I absolutely hated them. I was used to pedals with heaps of travel. I found it very hard to adjust to the accuracy needed, particularly with braking. After a few days I got used to them. I now feel that the short travel is beneficial, and in fact faster than the old pedals. I would now find it hard to go back to the others. My advice is to persevere with the new pedals, you will reap the benefits. Darf "SimRacer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:RHYdb.10312$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (25 lines)

> > "John DiFool" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:40:57 -0400, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > >I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still > > >working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the > box. > > >That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > > > > >The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not > stand > > >to use them. > > > > > >The wheel is ok. > > > > What is it about the pedals which you dislike? Mine have the metal > > corrugated base, and the swiveling metal pedals (which I was > > initially skeptical of but have grown quite used to). Is it a feel > > issue or something? > > > > John DiFool > > > > If they're like my old 'red' LWFF then the pedal travel was terrible. I

seem > to remember only having about an inch of travel on both pedals. Made ithard > to keep from locking up the brakes in deep braking scenarios and harder > still to feather the gas with such little travel to work with. I ended up > getting a TSW with their nearly relaistic long travel pedals to remedy the > problem. The much better pedals offset any apprecitation I ever had forthe > phoney baloney feeling FF that the Logitech had. > >

I redid the springs in mine. I found that the gas was too light and couldn't throttle it too well. I put stiffer springs in and they work great! "Darf" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3f7861a0$0$6524$[email hidden]... > When I first tried the pedals, I absolutely hated them. I was used topedals > with heaps of travel. I found it very hard to adjust to the accuracyneeded, > particularly with braking. After a few days I got used to them. I now feel > that the short travel is beneficial, and in fact faster than the oldpedals. > I would now find it hard to go back to the others. My advice is topersevere

Quoted text (12 lines)

> with the new pedals, you will reap the benefits. > > Darf > > "SimRacer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:RHYdb.10312$[email hidden]... > > > > "John DiFool" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:40:57 -0400, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > > >I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my

still > > > >working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back intothe

Quoted text (23 lines)

> > box. > > > >That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > > > > > > >The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not > > stand > > > >to use them. > > > > > > > >The wheel is ok. > > > > > > What is it about the pedals which you dislike? Mine have the metal > > > corrugated base, and the swiveling metal pedals (which I was > > > initially skeptical of but have grown quite used to). Is it a feel > > > issue or something? > > > > > > John DiFool > > > > > > > If they're like my old 'red' LWFF then the pedal travel was terrible. I > seem > > to remember only having about an inch of travel on both pedals. Made it > hard > > to keep from locking up the brakes in deep braking scenarios and harder > > still to feather the gas with such little travel to work with. I ended

up > > getting a TSW with their nearly relaistic long travel pedals to remedythe

Quoted text (7 lines)

> > problem. The much better pedals offset any apprecitation I ever had for > the > > phoney baloney feeling FF that the Logitech had. > > > > > >

[email hidden] (TlgtrProd) wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted text (7 lines)

> Thanks for the link...unfortunatley I have the newer wheel and it's > not compatiable.. > Kevin (aka tlgtr) > **** > "A GOOD friend will come bail you out of jail... but, a TRUE friend > will be sitting next to you saying, "Damn we screwed up!!!!." >

I use my MS pedals with a different wheel, simply by having both plugged in, and leaving the ms wheel sat on the floor out of the way. It doesn't work with some games that insist on one controller, but this setup works fine in GPL, NR2003, LFS, NHeat. cheers John

The red one is the MOMO Force. The black one is the MOMO Racer. They are both force feedback wheels. The MOMO Force is a little more expensive, but difficult to find other than mail-order. The MOMO Racer is a fine wheel and is available everywhere (Best Buy is where I got mine). The MOMO Force is apparently constructed of more metal components than the racer and is probably more sturdy (don't know - never tried one). You can find out more on Logitech's site. "Sven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<bl9akp$13vm$[email hidden]>... > Erm, this is new to me. You are saying, that the new MOMO is not as good as > the "old" one? I guess, the new is the black, and the "old" is the red one, > is that correct? > And that the red is better quality than the black? I have not been able to > find a red one, here the shops only have the black one with the short > gear-shifter at the right side, so I can't compare them.

Jussi 'Igor' Koukku wrote:

Quoted text (20 lines)

> "Larry" <[email hidden]> kirjoitti viestissä > news:tJNdb.23575$a16.1542@lakeread01... > >>I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still >>working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the > > box. > >>That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. >> >>The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not > > stand > >>to use them. >> >>The wheel is ok. > > > Then why not use the MS pedals with the Momo wheel?

That is a question that will be pondered by scholars for many years to come. It's also a question I was fortunate enough to ask Larry myself last year. The MS pedals, I explained, can be wired into the Momo. But he wasn't interested. The Momo pedals can be placed to one side even, thus leaving space for his faved MS ones, I informed him. But he wasn't interested. The unwanted Momo could be sold on to a third party, I suggested. But he wasn't listening. Alas, all my wonderful sage council fell upon deaf ears, and Larry preferred then, as he does now, to put the Momo back in it's box, whinge about the pedals, and the fact he had had to put the Momo back in it's box! Well, you can lead a horse to water... - Gerry Aitken ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter 6, verse 16 This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin.

"Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... Well, you can lead a horse to water... :) Maybe I should send him one of my Momo Wheel - MS Pedals adapters, no cure no pay? Do you think he would be interested? He and some other guy here at RAS (Douglas Ellison?) gave me the idea about making the adapter in the first place. -- Jone Tytlandsvik http://tytlandsvik.no

Jone Tytlandsvik wrote:

Quoted text (11 lines)

> "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > Well, you can lead a horse to water... > > :) > > Maybe I should send him one of my Momo Wheel - MS Pedals adapters, no cure > no pay? > Do you think he would be interested?

It could go either way, mate. ;) > He and some other guy here at RAS (Douglas Ellison?) gave me the idea about > making the adapter in the first place. More power to your elbow, Jone. Adaptation is the name of the game in this hobby, and not whining because some mass producer hasn't made some mass market product just the way you want it! -- Gerry Aitken ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter 6, verse 16 This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin.

While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it will not work with all of them. Frankly, I'm quite happy with the MSFFW. I may break out the Momo again the day something breaks for good on the MSFFW. -Larry "Jussi 'Igor' Koukku" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bl965s$ino$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (18 lines)

> "Larry" <[email hidden]> kirjoitti viestiss� > news:tJNdb.23575$a16.1542@lakeread01... > > I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still > > working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the > box. > > That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > > > The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not > stand > > to use them. > > > > The wheel is ok. > > Then why not use the MS pedals with the Momo wheel? > > - Igor - > >

Oh, god. Not YOU again on this Momo horseshit. Trust me. I heard EVERYTHING you said the last time. I don't need it again :) -Larry "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... Jussi 'Igor' Koukku wrote:

Quoted text (20 lines)

> "Larry" <[email hidden]> kirjoitti viestiss� > news:tJNdb.23575$a16.1542@lakeread01... > >>I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still >>working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into the > > box. > >>That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. >> >>The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could not > > stand > >>to use them. >> >>The wheel is ok. > > > Then why not use the MS pedals with the Momo wheel?

That is a question that will be pondered by scholars for many years to come. It's also a question I was fortunate enough to ask Larry myself last year. The MS pedals, I explained, can be wired into the Momo. But he wasn't interested. The Momo pedals can be placed to one side even, thus leaving space for his faved MS ones, I informed him. But he wasn't interested. The unwanted Momo could be sold on to a third party, I suggested. But he wasn't listening. Alas, all my wonderful sage council fell upon deaf ears, and Larry preferred then, as he does now, to put the Momo back in it's box, whinge about the pedals, and the fact he had had to put the Momo back in it's box! Well, you can lead a horse to water... - Gerry Aitken ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter 6, verse 16 This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin.

In fact, I am VERY interested! You have my attention... -Larry "Jone Tytlandsvik" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:blgm3o$btc0c$[email hidden]... > Maybe I should send him one of my Momo Wheel - MS Pedals adapters, no cure > no pay? > Do you think he would be interested? > He and some other guy here at RAS (Douglas Ellison?) gave me the ideaabout

Quoted text (8 lines)

> making the adapter in the first place. > > > -- > Jone Tytlandsvik > http://tytlandsvik.no > >

You're kidding, right? The 'swivel action' is positively annoying and tiring. The travel distance is about half of what it should be. The pedals stick and don't release all the way sometimes because of the poor design that allows the side of the pedal stem to rub up against the opening in the pedal base, the cord is too damned short, and... Well, that's enough anyway. -Larry "John DiFool" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:40:57 -0400, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >I bought one of the new Momo's (the expensive one) to replace my still > >working MSFFW. I used the Momo for an hour, and it went back into thebox. > >That was about 6 months ago and it's been there every since. > > > >The pedals on the expensive Momo positively SUCK. I simply could notstand

Quoted text (11 lines)

> >to use them. > > > >The wheel is ok. > > What is it about the pedals which you dislike? Mine have the metal > corrugated base, and the swiveling metal pedals (which I was > initially skeptical of but have grown quite used to). Is it a feel > issue or something? > > John DiFool >

Larry wrote: > While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it will not > work with all of them. You never did tell us which games you were having issues with, why was that? -- Gerry Aitken ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter 6, verse 16 This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin.

"Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zPYeb.42772$a16.30206@lakeread01... > While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it will not > work with all of them. > Why shouldn't it work? Do you mean if you have both wheels connected, or if the MS pedals are connected to the momo wheel? If you connect the MS pedals to the momo wheel, one axis will be reversed. But you just invert it in the wingman profiler. Or you can just swap two wires on a pot inside the pedals. Either way I can't really se why it shouldn't work with every sim/game. -- Jone Tytlandsvik http://tytlandsvik.no

"Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SRYeb.42774$a16.24529@lakeread01... > In fact, I am VERY interested! > > You have my attention... > Drop me an email then. If it works out OK, you will have to brag a lot about it in here tho... :) -- Jone Tytlandsvik http://tytlandsvik.no

Larry wrote: > You're kidding, right? > > The 'swivel action' is positively annoying and tiring. Now I've heard it all! <ROLLS EYES> -- Gerry Aitken ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter 6, verse 16 This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin.

On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 22:44:09 +0200, "Jone Tytlandsvik" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (12 lines)

> >"Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:zPYeb.42772$a16.30206@lakeread01... >> While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it will not >> work with all of them. >> > >Why shouldn't it work? Do you mean if you have both wheels connected, or if >the MS pedals are connected to the momo wheel? If you connect the MS pedals >to the momo wheel, one axis will be reversed. But you just invert it in the >wingman profiler. Or you can just swap two wires on a pot inside the pedals. >Either way I can't really se why it shouldn't work with every sim/game.

And supporting inverted axes in a game isn't exactly rocket science either. More an oversight, perhaps. Ruud van Gaal Free car sim: http://www.racer.nl/ Pencil art : http://www.marketgraph.nl/gallery/

I just emailed you :) -Larry "Jone Tytlandsvik" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bli2qv$ceivd$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (16 lines)

> > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:SRYeb.42774$a16.24529@lakeread01... > > In fact, I am VERY interested! > > > > You have my attention... > > > > Drop me an email then. > If it works out OK, you will have to brag a lot about it in here tho... :) > > -- > Jone Tytlandsvik > http://tytlandsvik.no > >

Be careful. Eye-Rolling can be tiring, and cause headache's too! -Larry "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (16 lines)

> Larry wrote: > > You're kidding, right? > > > > The 'swivel action' is positively annoying and tiring. > > Now I've heard it all! <ROLLS EYES> > > -- > > Gerry Aitken > > ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter > 6, verse 16 > > This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin. >

Because the list was too long, and all it takes is one. I don't have time to be swapping controller around when I want to switch games. We should have left that nonsense behind years ago. Larry "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Larry wrote: > > While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it willnot > > work with all of them. > > You never did tell us which games you were having issues with, why wasthat?

Quoted text (11 lines)

> > > -- > > Gerry Aitken > > ...and a friend shall lose a friend's hammer -- Book of Cyril, chapter > 6, verse 16 > > This e-mail has been scanned for all known viruses by a fish called Colin. >

Here's the simple fact. I just want my stuff to work without having to fiddle with it all the time. I have little time for my gaming, and when I do have time I don't want to waste it fussing with controllers. Just so you guys know, I don't have a damned thing against Logitech, except their lousy pedal designs. In fact, the WingMan software (while a little spread out in the preferences department), is as good as it gets. Microsoft could learn some lessons from them where it comes to controller software design. -Larry "Jone Tytlandsvik" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bli2mp$ch2pt$[email hidden]... > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:zPYeb.42772$a16.30206@lakeread01... > > While I'm sure that will work with some games, I am quite sure it willnot > > work with all of them. > > > > Why shouldn't it work? Do you mean if you have both wheels connected, orif > the MS pedals are connected to the momo wheel? If you connect the MSpedals > to the momo wheel, one axis will be reversed. But you just invert it inthe > wingman profiler. Or you can just swap two wires on a pot inside thepedals.

Quoted text (8 lines)

> Either way I can't really se why it shouldn't work with every sim/game. > > -- > Jone Tytlandsvik > http://tytlandsvik.no > > >