You people are freakin morons!

On Tue, 15 Feb 2000 21:47:27 GMT, Randy Wilson Randy, I don't consider myself a moron let alone a freakin moron. I think you miss the irony here that the one track that means the most to Nascar and the racers is being given away with an ISC program but cannot be sold within the context of a racing package by Papyrus. Kind of nice for ISC to reward the faithful customers of their products (and everyone who has purchased a Nascar game from Papyrus has helped fill the coffers of ISC). I don't believe anyone asked for a freebee; all anyone has ever asked is that it be included in the GAME. I sure won't pay ISC for a DEMO of a game I already own. Jeff

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>Subject: You people are freakin morons! >Date: 02/15/2000 4:47 PM Eastern Standard Time >Well... at least the ones that are so pissed off that Papyrus isn't >releasing the Daytona demo ISC contracted them to do.

snippity snip snip snip.... oooooooooOOOOOhhhhHHHHh you're gonna be off a lot of Christmas card lists.......... I am sure you have just shattered the delicate feelings of hundreds maybe even thousands of NASCAR simm fans around the world............ oh me oh my what will everyone do now????? (Don't use NO***in E-mail) You think in the storm we've found the eye of the calm.....Bill Mallonnee, Vigilantes Of Love

I think Daytona should be sold by ISC to whomever wants it. If it's really about them making $ from their license, they could reap some more profit by selling the CD or selling a download of the track to all existing N3/Legends owners. Unless they do that, they are really just missing out on some profits. I agree with someone else in this series of threads who noted that the way to prevent piracy is NOT to make something unavailable! ~daxe (who also wants this dang thing)

How many NASCAR fans who paid the admission to the Daytona 500 and even bought a program AND own a computer good enough to run the program have never heard of N3? Probably not too many. ~daxe

process was very shortsighted and simply put, not smart business. For the life of me I cannot understand what everyone is ***ing about. The folks at Papyrus are a bright bunch of people. They knew that within a matter of days (hours?) after the Daytona souvenir programs went on sale that copies of the Daytona track would be all over the internet, and that they would be almost powerless to stop it. So why would they do it? To get in the good graces of ISC? Get real! Papyrus did it as a free gift to all the dedicated buyers of Papyrus software and as a brilliant, strategic marketing move. Did Papyrus lose money on the potential sales of the Daytona track? In the short run, yes. But think of all of the people that received a copy of the CD that have not yet played the N3 sim. These are literally thousands of untapped customers that may have never even heard of N3 before. How much money will Papy make off of these sales of N3 and future sales of N4? A LOT more than they would on a single Daytona expansion pack. You may be griping about not having the files today, but within a week someone in your circle of friends will have a copy, and you'll eventually have your own to pass on to other friends. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. -Koz

I doubt that anybody who is informed about the racing business have anything against Papyrus/Sierra. The only people who have problems against them are simple-minded people who are clueless. It's more ISC some people might have problem with. I really praise what they have done. Long we have said bad things about the lack of publicity they do on the mass market. Simple sponsorship, adds, etc.. Now they are able to promote their line of software via an agreement with the DIS people. It's really great for them I say. -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

WELL SAID!!!!!

You would be surprised at how many. Most of the exposure that the casual NASCAR fan has to sim racing is the commercials they see about EA Sports, not Papyrus products. A few years ago most of the seats at any given track were purchased by hard core NASCAR fans. Today, especially at Daytona, much of the seating is purchased in corporate blocks and tickets given away as gifts to employees, vendors, and customers. Many of these people have little prior exposure to NASCAR, but they go because it is a unique event. Hence the marketing strategy used by Papyrus at this event. -Koz

Good points. I see your logic, now. Thanks. ~daxe

I think you misunderstood the point I was trying to make. I meant that Papyrus was shortsighted in not anticipating that the loyal customers would be frustrated by the lack of accesibility to the tracks. My proposal was a way that ISC and Papyrus could both acheive their marketing goals without current Papyrus customers feeling abandoned. At the very least, I'm sure Papyrus could have arranged for a link to the Daytona USA website and a notification that the CD contained a demo with Daytona on it. As far as it being a brilliant marketing strategy, I think only time will tell. There does remain the possibility that many fans either don't care about the sims, don't have the hardware to run it, or are already loyal Papyrus consumers. I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth at all, I'm extremely pleased Papy put it on the CD and I've placed my order for the Speedweeks 2000 program.

Hey, I'm not mad at anybody. Just thankful Daytona was released and that a nice fella emailed it to me!!

I agree Shwan. Who's to say that Papy weren't even intending to include the Daytona track as part of the next "official" patch for N3... Wayne Hutchison

Jeffrey Haas wrote:

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> > On Tue, 15 Feb 2000 21:47:27 GMT, Randy Wilson > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > Randy, > > I don't consider myself a moron let alone a freakin moron. I think you > miss the irony here that the one track that means the most to Nascar > and the racers is being given away with an ISC program but cannot be > sold > within the context of a racing package by Papyrus. Kind of nice for > ISC to reward the faithful customers of their products (and everyone > who has purchased a Nascar game from Papyrus has helped fill the > coffers of ISC). > > I don't believe anyone asked for a freebee; all anyone has ever asked > is that it be included in the GAME. > > I sure won't pay ISC for a DEMO of a game I already own. > > Jeff

It's available for stand-alone purchase for $15.00 from the speedway's mail order shop. (800) 748-7467 They have tens of thousands available, or did Monday when my brother got them.

Err... Papyrus employees have said that it would be included with the upcoming Expansion pack for Nascar Racing 3. Sorry for that :) -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

speak for yourself you idiot

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> >But think of all of the people that received a copy of the > > CD that have not yet played the N3 sim. These are literally thousands of > > untapped customers that may have never even heard of N3 before. > How many NASCAR fans who paid the admission to the Daytona 500 and even > bought a program AND own a computer good enough to run the program have > never heard of N3? > Probably not too many. > ~daxe

writes:

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>speak for yourself you idiot >> >But think of all of the people that received a copy of the >> > CD that have not yet played the N3 sim. These are literally thousands of >> > untapped customers that may have never even heard of N3 before. >> How many NASCAR fans who paid the admission to the Daytona 500 and even >> bought a program AND own a computer good enough to run the program have >> never heard of N3? >> Probably not too many. >> ~daxe

Why is he an idiot? He simply stated that there are 5 variable that come into play here. 1. Nascar fan 2. Admission to Daytona 500 3. Bought a program 4. Own a powerful computer 5. Heard of N3 If any of those variables aren't present, the current distribution method doesn't help. Example:1,4,&5 apply to me. I didn't go to Daytona(2), so I couldn't buy a program(3). Now, the track has been posted to several places, so the argument is lessened, but the original point Daxe was making is valid. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.