RASCAR: Ginger squeaks into the points lead.

Ginger and Neil both encountered varying degrees of misfortune during todays Atlanta race but in the end Ginger out lasted Neil even though Ginger had engine damage. At the end of the day Ginger steps into the championship lead by a very slim 2 points. Atlanta wasnt a perfect race 8 cautions for 33 laps but it wasnt all that bad either. From what I saw we had a few questionable moves but for the most part it was just hard racin. WTG Huggins great win. Mitch NASCAR Racing 2003 Season EXPORTED STANDINGS Track: ATLANTA MOTOR SPEEDWAY Date: 10/25/03 Session: Practice P # DRIVER TIME 1 27 BOster 29.103 2 97 Don_Wilshe 29.229 3 0 29.273 4 325 Dick-Trickle 29.324 5 33 Coorzman 29.335 6 83 grubbat 29.336 7 98 LTB-Racer 29.341 8 48 YellowJacketT 29.356 9 42 bluestringer 29.357 10 322 Fernando Deutsch 29.373 11 327 DaveGF 29.384 12 320 Mitch_A 29.402 13 00 seery 29.404 14 3 TNA Loan 29.426 15 170 joonjoonli 29.475 16 24 frederickson 29.509 17 96 Neil__C 29.509 18 66 s_brunt 29.514 19 17 j_verschue_RAS 29.655 20 2 tpaullin 29.662 21 49 ZZBusch 29.774 22 92 steve whitty 29.792 23 99 Elrikk 29.885 24 67 UweSchuerkamp 29.997 25 0 30.028 Weather: Clear, 70 �F, North 0 mph Session: Qualifying P # DRIVER TIME 1 98 LTB-Racer 29.308 2 3 TNA Loan 29.309 3 27 BOster 29.386 4 17 j_verschue_RAS 29.402 5 322 Fernando Deutsch 29.458 6 48 YellowJacketT 29.496 7 83 grubbat 29.500 8 170 joonjoonli 29.585 9 00 seery 29.632 10 67 UweSchuerkamp 29.643 11 33 Coorzman 29.643 12 327 DaveGF 29.659 13 42 bluestringer 29.671 14 96 Neil__C 29.688 15 320 Mitch_A 29.726 16 49 ZZBusch 30.011 17 66 s_brunt 30.036 18 2 tpaullin 30.073 19 92 steve whitty 30.995 20 325 Dick-Trickle -- 21 99 Elrikk -- 22 0 -- 23 24 frederickson -- 24 97 Don_Wilshe -- 25 0 -- 26 177 Dick-Trickle -- 27 0 -- 28 0 -- 29 0 -- 30 0 -- Weather: Clear, 70 �F, North 0 mph Session: Happy Hour P # DRIVER TIME 1 96 Neil__C 29.397 2 98 LTB-Racer 29.470 3 33 Coorzman 29.478 4 48 YellowJacketT 29.505 5 170 joonjoonli 29.543 6 00 seery 29.555 7 327 DaveGF 29.618 8 42 bluestringer 29.622 9 92 steve whitty 29.732 10 99 Elrikk 29.771 11 83 grubbat 29.859 12 320 Mitch_A 29.877 13 322 Fernando Deutsch 29.905 14 2 tpaullin 30.012 15 325 Dick-Trickle 30.265 16 67 UweSchuerkamp 34.953 17 27 BOster 43.316 18 49 ZZBusch 1:10.508 Weather: Clear, 70 �F, North 0 mph Session: Race OFFICIAL STANDINGS F S # DRIVER INTERVAL LAPS LED POINTS STATUS 1 2 3 TNA Loan 125.600 130 46 180 Running 2 11 33 Coorzman -1.88 130 2 175 Running 3 4 17 j_verschue_RAS -5.80 130 9 170 Running 4 1 98 LTB-Racer -6.94 130 6 165 Running 5 19 92 steve whitty -10.87 130 0 155 Running 6 15 320 Mitch_A -15.31 130 0 150 Running 7 20 325 Dick-Trickle -25.91 130 0 146 Running 8 9 00 seery -28.89 130 3 147 Running 9 6 48 YellowJacketT -1L 129 0 138 Running 10 5 322 Fernando Deutsch -1L 129 16 139 Running 11 18 2 tpaullin -1L 129 0 130 Running 12 3 27 BOster -38L 92 48* 137 Accident 13 8 170 joonjoonli -44L 86 0 124 Accident 14 14 96 Neil__C -45L 85 0 121 Accident 15 17 66 s_brunt -47L 83 0 118 Retired 16 10 67 UweSchuerkamp -52L 78 0 115 Accident 17 7 83 grubbat -97L 33 0 112 Valve 18 21 99 Elrikk -111L 19 0 109 Retired 19 16 49 ZZBusch -111L 19 0 106 Wheel 20 13 42 bluestringer -117L 13 0 103 Valve 21 12 327 DaveGF -120L 10 0 100 Accident Caution Flags: 8 (33 laps) Lead Changes: 10 (7 drivers) Weather: Clear, 70 �F, North 0 mph Pitstop Frequency: 1x PENALTIES LAP # INFRACTION PENALTY 9 98 Passing on the inside Stop and go 11 49 Entering closed pits Go to end of longest line 12 42 Speeding in pits Go to end of longest line 15 67 Passing on the inside Stop and go 20 67 Entering closed pits Go to end of longest line 20 49 Passing under yellow Held for 1 seconds 32 96 Dropping Debris Pit for repairs 73 322 Unsafe pit entrance Go to end of longest line 74 322 Unsafe pit entrance Go to end of longest line 87 170 Entering closed pits Go to end of longest line 95 48 Dropping Debris Pit for repairs 95 17 Speeding in pits Go to end of longest line ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- RASCAR Point standings ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Point Standings Results after 34 events Pos Driver Points Interval Bonus Events Wins Poles Laps Led Led% Top 5 Top 10 Prov DNS DNF 1 Dick-Trickle 4,895 -- 155 30 5 4 3,274 629 15.11% 23 27 1 0 2 2 Neil__C 4,893 -2 90 33 4 5 3,212 375 9.01% 17 24 0 0 11 3 LTB-Racer 4,403 -492 45 30 2 2 3,014 110 2.64% 12 21 1 0 7 4 j_verschue_RAS 4,014 -881 10 29 0 0 2,830 16 0.38% 4 18 2 0 7 5 BOster 3,508 -1,387 110 22 4 1 2,335 518 12.45% 17 17 2 0 5 6 DaveGF 3,264 -1,631 25 24 0 1 2,204 35 0.84% 5 13 1 0 9 7 JurjenvanderLelij 3,138 -1,757 10 22 0 0 2,364 7 0.17% 10 14 1 0 2 8 86_k_roberts 3,085 -1,810 10 24 0 0 1,691 19 0.46% 4 7 0 0 14 9 Mitch_A 3,084 -1,811 35 22 2 0 1,778 62 1.49% 8 12 0 0 9 10 s_brunt 2,918 -1,977 15 23 0 0 1,499 15 0.36% 3 9 1 0 13 11 jsimmons 2,604 -2,291 35 19 0 0 1,331 99 2.38% 4 9 0 1 8 12 grubbat 2,483 -2,412 20 17 1 1 1,748 120 2.88% 7 11 1 0 5 13 joonjoonli 2,443 -2,452 10 18 1 0 1,816 24 0.58% 2 11 4 0 8 14 Ed Solheim 2,430 -2,465 20 18 0 1 1,837 110 2.64% 3 9 2 0 10 15 bamadano 2,337 -2,558 20 18 0 0 1,260 78 1.87% 3 9 0 0 10 16 Elrikk 2,262 -2,633 5 19 0 0 1,192 5 0.12% 0 3 13 0 12 17 bluestringer 2,175 -2,720 20 16 0 0 1,664 35 0.84% 3 9 0 0 3 18 epickett 2,034 -2,861 15 16 0 0 1,014 3 0.07% 0 5 0 0 8 19 seery 2,024 -2,871 10 15 1 1 1,447 10 0.24% 1 8 0 0 3 20 UweSchuerkamp 1,843 -3,052 5 15 0 0 1,069 5 0.12% 0 5 1 0 8 21 bfarmer 1,823 -3,072 5 14 0 0 972 1 0.02% 4 7 3 0 5 22 ian_parker 1,764 -3,131 15 13 1 0 857 25 0.60% 4 7 0 0 7 23 49RAS_ZZBusch 1,717 -3,178 5 15 0 0 484 2 0.05% 0 1 4 0 13 24 mcfadds 1,679 -3,216 0 14 0 0 733 0 0.00% 0 3 2 1 7 25 T_White 1,633 -3,262 60 10 4 8 1,154 479 11.51% 7 8 0 0 3 26 jsterner 1,563 -3,332 5 13 0 0 828 1 0.02% 0 4 0 0 5 27 (LNB)_3 1,516 -3,379 70 9 4 6 1,014 695 16.70% 7 7 0 0 1 28 steve whitty 1,449 -3,446 10 11 0 0 1,099 14 0.34% 1 5 1 0 1 29 boyk7808 1,250 -3,645 0 10 0 0 451 0 0.00% 1 2 1 0 8 30 frederickson 1,195 -3,700 0 9 0 0 801 0 0.00% 2 5 1 0 2 31 ZZBusch 1,182 -3,713 0 10 0 0 690 0 0.00% 0 2 5 0 5 32 tpaullin 1,160 -3,735 5 9 0 0 631 1 0.02% 0 3 0 0 5 33 yad revilo 977 -3,918 10 7 0 0 538 14 0.34% 3 5 0 0 1 34 DDodge 930 -3,965 5 8 0 0 497 4 0.10% 0 2 0 0 5 35 KnektR 773 -4,122 0 5 0 0 395 0 0.00% 3 5 1 0 0 36 Mike Grandy 742 -4,153 25 5 0 1 311 58 1.39% 2 4 0 0 3 37 Pete_Reston 719 -4,176 10 5 0 0 536 65 1.56% 1 5 0 0 2 38 Coorzman 600 -4,295 5 4 0 0 435 2 0.05% 2 3 0 0 0 39 Punisher6 593 -4,302 0 5 0 0 219 0 0.00% 0 0 0 0 5 40 John Bayes 580 -4,315 20 4 1 1 408 176 4.23% 2 2 0 0 2 41 TMcDaniel 418 -4,477 0 3 0 0 390 0 0.00% 0 2 3 0 0 42 Michael Shouler 405 -4,490 15 3 1 2 135 18 0.43% 1 1 1 0 1 43 Don_Wilshe 402 -4,493 15 3 1 0 288 107 2.57% 1 1 0 0 2 44 Michael Loos 379 -4,516 0 3 0 0 237 0 0.00% 0 1 0 0 2 45 RDressler 373 -4,522 0 3 0 0 161 0 0.00% 0 1 2 0 2 46 TNA Loan 350 -4,545 10 2 1 0 289 67 1.61% 2 2 0 0 0 47 studmonkey 339 -4,556 0 3 0 0 198 0 0.00% 0 0 0 0 3 48 MKnutsen 293 -4,602 5 2 0 0 246 22 0.53% 0 2 0 0 1 49 brucek 288 -4,607 0 2 0 0 86 0 0.00% 0 2 0 0 0 50 YellowJacketT 262 -4,633 0 2 0 0 234 0 0.00% 0 1 1 0 0 51 guido mielekamp 229 -4,666 5 2 0 0 71 7 0.17% 0 0 0 0 2 52 ColinHarris 185 -4,710 10 1 1 0 160 105 2.52% 1 1 0 0 0 53 D_Burnette 150 -4,745 0 1 0 0 158 0 0.00% 0 1 0 0 0 54 RobertMSmith 139 -4,756 5 1 0 0 125 8 0.19% 0 1 0 0 1 55 Fernando Deutsch 139 -4,756 5 1 0 0 129 16 0.38% 0 1 0 0 0 56 plowboy 138 -4,757 0 1 0 0 35 0 0.00% 0 1 1 0 0 57 Marco64 138 -4,757 0 1 0 0 38 0 0.00% 0 1 0 0 1 58 DapperDan 115 -4,780 0 1 0 0 28 0 0.00% 0 0 0 0 1 59 Phasor2K3 109 -4,786 0 1 0 0 31 0 0.00% 0 0 0 0 1 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Points and scoring generated by Points Calculator v1.06.09 Copyright 1999-2002 by Robert Rathbone

"Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ECHmb.3903$[email hidden]... > Ginger and Neil both encountered varying degrees of misfortune duringtodays > Atlanta race but in the end Ginger out lasted Neil even though Ginger had > engine damage. At the end of the day Ginger steps into the championship > lead by a very slim 2 points. Gonna be fun :) > Atlanta wasnt a perfect race 8 cautions for 33 laps but it wasnt all that > bad either. From what I saw we had a few questionable moves but for the > most part it was just hard racin. > I am so seriously annoyed by the quality of some of the driving out there I'm going to make no further comment except to say that the occasional 'sorry' would help. Regards

"Neil Charlton" wrote: > I am so seriously annoyed by the quality of some of the driving out there > I'm going to make no further comment except to say that the occasional > 'sorry' would help. Whilst it is nice to be polite and makes the victim feel a bit better it doesn't really help the quality of the racing as Mr. Nice Guy profusely apologises to the field as he wipes them out... Then again I am not too keen on in race chat of any sort. I know drivers manage to communicate by hand signals to the guy on his rear bumper but beyond that chatting between drivers seems unrealistic and I find downright distracting. Cheers Tony --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

"Tony Rickard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:w%Omb.1958$[email hidden]... > "Neil Charlton" wrote: > > > I am so seriously annoyed by the quality of some of the driving outthere > > I'm going to make no further comment except to say that the occasional > > 'sorry' would help. > > Whilst it is nice to be polite and makes the victim feel a bit better it > doesn't really help the quality of the racing as Mr. Nice Guy profusely > apologises to the field as he wipes them out... Fair point but I don't claim to be logical ;) Some expression of remorse makes it feel a little better for sone reason. Perhaps I just need one of those group hugs ;) > Then again I am not too keen on in race chat of any sort. I know drivers > manage to communicate by hand signals to the guy on his rear bumper but > beyond that chatting between drivers seems unrealistic and I finddownright > distracting. > That's right enough where 'sorry' is concerned but pit warning and lane change messages are a definite bonus in an online sim with no real radio contact. Regards

On Sun, 26 Oct 2003 11:36:29 +0000 (UTC), "Neil Charlton" <[email hidden]> wrote: > >I am so seriously annoyed by the quality of some of the driving out there >I'm going to make no further comment except to say that the occasional >'sorry' would help. > I'll take it further. When I get turned around on the front stretch and the replay clearly shows me holding my line (actually I was slowly moving higher) and the car on my inside drives from the low line all the way up into my lane and nails me in the left rear quarter panel (again on the STRAIGHTAWAY) and drives right through my spinning car and then never appoligizes I can only conclude 2 things: Either he can't drive or it was done on purpose. Also, I would prefer that lap down cars that are way off the pace would move out of the racing line when the leaders are coming, but failing that, at least pick a friggin' line and hold it. I usually don't get too upset about being wrecked. Further more I really don't get too upset when I get wrecked and it was just a product of good hard racing or simply a racing deal or a simple honest mistake (we all make them). However, I have zero tollarance for pure stupidity and even more so for deliberate actions to take another guy out, especially when I see it week after week. Brian Oster

I agree Neil. When I see a sry I can officially put the incident behind me. If I don't then I spend the next xx:mins wondering if it was my fault or why no explanations. "Neil Charlton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bngbjt$i62$[email hidden]...

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> > I am so seriously annoyed by the quality of some of the driving out there > I'm going to make no further comment except to say that the occasional > 'sorry' would help. > > Regards > >

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> > I'll take it further. When I get turned around on the front stretch > and the replay clearly shows me holding my line (actually I was slowly > moving higher) and the car on my inside drives from the low line all > the way up into my lane and nails me in the left rear quarter panel > (again on the STRAIGHTAWAY) and drives right through my spinning car > and then never appoligizes I can only conclude 2 things: Either he > can't drive or it was done on purpose.

Brian. It was me who caused the incident, but I can assure you that it was neither because I can't drive (my 1 win, pole position, top 5 qualifying spots and top 10 finishes bear this out), or through malicious intent. I was aware that you was faster off the corner and on the outside of me somewhere. However, take a look at the replay again from my cockpit view. You will see that there is a period of around three seconds where you was totally invisible to me, neither in my mirrors or visible to the side. As far as my line went, I cut the apex of the tri-oval lower than you (obviously) and came back up some ways. I hasten to add that I was running a much lower line on the straight, in view of you being somewhere to my right. As far as the impact goes, and I've seen the replay, I misjudged things and caught you a glancing blow. If I was a foot further to the left and we would not have made contact. The first time I saw you as you came back into view left me with maybe a 1/2 second to react and this was not enough time to do anything. As far as driving through your car goes, as soon as I realised what was going on, I got right out of the gas. I did not drive through you at all. I would have been more than happy to make an apology (as I did to Ginger when we had our coming together), had it not been for the fact that you decided to react by making inflamatory remarks in the chat window. I simply decided to keep quiet in view of this. >deliberate actions to take another guy > out, especially when I see it week after week. Your interpretation, Brian. I'll leave it to you to believe what you will. I try to conduct myself as a gentleman on track, but concede that as a newcomer to NASCAR and in my rookie year in RASCAR I make mistakes from time to time. I'm showing improvement from race to race and I intend this trend to continue. ... MS

"Mark Seery" wrote... > > <snip> I was right behind this incident and I saw it coming a mile away. I've been trying to figure out why I knew it would end in tears (said "No Brian, no... don't do it" out loud at the time), but I can't. I don't know if I recognised the situation as dangerous or because I'm very familiar with the way Mark drives, it was (and is) just a gut feeling. I have a theory (yep, another one of my theories <g>) about this sort of incident (where the incident looks braindead to the other participant) and why they happen more frequently in the NR200x series than GPL, but I'll post about that seperately. Jan. =---

On Sun, 26 Oct 2003 19:50:43 GMT, "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>"Mark Seery" wrote... >> > <snip> > >I was right behind this incident and I saw it coming a mile away. I've been >trying to figure out why I knew it would end in tears (said "No Brian, no... >don't do it" out loud at the time), but I can't. I don't know if I >recognised the situation as dangerous or because I'm very familiar with the >way Mark drives, it was (and is) just a gut feeling.

"dont do it"???? Do what??? pass someone??? You make it sound like it was MY fault. My pass was not risky at or agressive at all. Where the hell am I supposed to pass people???? And, I got spun out on THE FRONT STRETCH... after I had all but cleared. Brian Oster

Well, I guess I shoulda checked up on my comment (all though I felt like I gave you ample time to appoligize before I made my comment) in the race and my post until I had calmed down a little. I shouldn't have accused you of taking me out on purpose and I know you can drive which is why I am a little frustrated WITH your driving. Your excuses are BS IMO, c'mon you have a spotter like the rest of us and if you drive in HC mode like I do than you know that 90% of the time you CAN'T see the car on your outside and you have to give room until you hear "clear". At the point where you hit me, you could see me for almost a full 2 seconds before you drove into me, the fact that you hit me in the rear corner alone shows that you could see me and had time to react. It wasn't your angle into the tri-oval either.. you simply drove up into me. I have watched the replay from every possible angle and that was simply a braindead move. If it had been the first time, I woulda let it go, but this isn't the first time. It seems like I have been around you on numerous occasions where you have exercised very poor judgement and driving, and some times you were aware of it but I recieved no appolgy. You put me in the wall at Mich. and never said a thing. I havn't said anything in the past, but getting spun out on the straight was just kinda the last straw and I snapped. Look, I know we all make mistakes and I am sure I will have my share of braindead moves, just seems like I have been the recipient of some of yours quite a bit in the past whether they caused an incident or not. May just be bad luck or the fact that I can't seem to have any kinda luck in RASCAR these days. Just a little frustrated is all. I am willing to forget the whole thing and move on I just hope everyone can start driving with their head in the game a little bit more. Brian Oster On Sun, 26 Oct 2003 18:31:27 +0000 (UTC), "Mark Seery" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> >> >> I'll take it further. When I get turned around on the front stretch >> and the replay clearly shows me holding my line (actually I was slowly >> moving higher) and the car on my inside drives from the low line all >> the way up into my lane and nails me in the left rear quarter panel >> (again on the STRAIGHTAWAY) and drives right through my spinning car >> and then never appoligizes I can only conclude 2 things: Either he >> can't drive or it was done on purpose. > >Brian. > >It was me who caused the incident, but I can assure you that it was neither >because I can't drive (my 1 win, pole position, top 5 qualifying spots and >top 10 finishes bear this out), or through malicious intent. I was aware >that you was faster off the corner and on the outside of me somewhere. >However, take a look at the replay again from my cockpit view. You will see >that there is a period of around three seconds where you was totally >invisible to me, neither in my mirrors or visible to the side. As far as my >line went, I cut the apex of the tri-oval lower than you (obviously) and >came back up some ways. I hasten to add that I was running a much lower line >on the straight, in view of you being somewhere to my right. As far as the >impact goes, and I've seen the replay, I misjudged things and caught you a >glancing blow. If I was a foot further to the left and we would not have >made contact. The first time I saw you as you came back into view left me >with maybe a 1/2 second to react and this was not enough time to do >anything. As far as driving through your car goes, as soon as I realised >what was going on, I got right out of the gas. I did not drive through you >at all. > >I would have been more than happy to make an apology (as I did to Ginger >when we had our coming together), had it not been for the fact that you >decided to react by making inflamatory remarks in the chat window. I simply >decided to keep quiet in view of this. > >>deliberate actions to take another guy >> out, especially when I see it week after week. > >Your interpretation, Brian. I'll leave it to you to believe what you will. I >try to conduct myself as a gentleman on track, but concede that as a >newcomer to NASCAR and in my rookie year in RASCAR I make mistakes from >time to time. I'm showing improvement from race to race and I intend this >trend to continue. ... > >MS >

"Brian Oster" wrote... > > <snip> > "dont do it"???? Do what??? pass someone??? You make > it sound like it was MY fault. My pass was not risky at > or agressive at all. Read it again: I never said passing outside along the front stretch is dangerous. I'm sure it was done safely numerous times throughout practise and the race. I said this particular situation set off every alarmbell with me as I was following behind. It annoys me I can't pinpoint why this happened, it just felt dangerous and, as usual, my gut feeling wasn't wrong. That doesn't mean you did anything reproachable, unsafe or that I blame you for the incident. Unless I find out what triggered my awareness and can explain why this situation was dangerous, it helps bugger all to avoid it in future anyway, so don't worry about it. > Where the hell am I supposed to pass people???? I prefer faking my opponent to the inside at T3, making him apex early, then squaring off the corner and cutting underneath off T4, but anywhere you feel you can do it safely is fine with me, really. You're a very able simracer, I trust your judgement as to what is a passing opportunity. > And, I got spun out on THE FRONT STRETCH... after I had > all but cleared. Yes, you held your line well, no-one can blame you for that. It just appeared to me the move was doomed from the start. Again: I don't have a logical explanation for that. It just felt wrong, but, objectively, there was nothing wrong with what you did. Jan. =---