Build or Buy a new Race Rig- Opinions?

Hi all I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare bones unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC before and would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for a pretty high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I wonder if as a newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never Oc'd either but kinda interested in that too! Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it could is another question? Thanks Andrew

Andrew Smith wrote:

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> > Hi all > > I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to > decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare bones > unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC before and > would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for a pretty > high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I wonder if as a > newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never Oc'd either but > kinda interested in that too! > > Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could > put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it could > is another question?

Ok, even if you want a "built" PC rather than a "brand" PC and you don't want to do it yourself, you always have the option of having a local shop build it for you to your specs Anyways, if you feel you have the skills to do it yourself, then there's no question I'd advice you to build your own, even if you never enter the BIOS setup and just run with *absolutely* stock, it will most likely perform very well, it may not set new speed records, but it will perform The big problem however is not actually assembling it, just about anyone with a bit of common sense and a tiny bit of knowledge can do that bit, don't wear nylon clothing and stuff like that, the mechanics bit isn't difficult, just remember not to attach the mainboard directly to the backplate in the cabinet and things like that The difficult bit comes when something *isn't* working properly and you have to troubleshoot....that's when the fun starts, basically you're on your own and have to rely on your own skills or the dubious help you get from "friends with computer knowledge", if you have a local shop assemble it for you, it's their responsibility to make sure the thing is in basic working order before you take delivery of it, not saying they will test every game they know under the sun to make sure it works, but most likely they will do a "burn in" test to make sure the thing is in basic working order, and if stops working, you can just drop it off at their place and tell them to bloody fix it Overclocking....if you're a "newbie" and you're building a high end computer, why would you want to Overclock it ? :-) Don't get me wrong, OCing is fun and I do it all the time, but OC'ing a high end computer doesn't really make much "sense" since you already have a PC capable of performing most tasks, it makes much more sense to OC a 2.4 than a 3.0 since it's likely to be more responsive to OC'ing in the first place, my 2.4 will run at 3.1 if I ask nicely, my 2.8 runs at 3.5, but at the time of purchase the 2.8 cost more than 50% more than the 2.4 and it doesn't make a huge difference in performance, but hey, it's fun :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Build your own. If you don't know how to do it, there are tons of articles online to do it. You'll save tons, and you'll actually know a bit about computers when you're done. Mike http://mikebeauchamp.com "Andrew Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Hi all > > I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to > decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare bones > unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC before and > would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for a pretty > high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I wonder if as a > newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never Oc'd either but > kinda interested in that too! > > Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could > put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it could > is another question? > > > Thanks > > Andrew

that is where I was going on the whole build it buy it thing thanks for your opinions. Any more??

I think I missed the start of this thread, but here's my two cents worth. Note: if the person does not think they can handle this, then they should find a friend to help them. I honestly feel that this is _so_ worth it it's ok to swaller your pride for 2 hours and trade the next-door-kid some pizza for their help :) First, save up until you can buy the best possible. Then build the thing yourself. Period. The experience gained by building your own PC simply cannot be overstated. You'll have insite into the machine that will pay dividends for years to come, and it will also make learning 'new' things as time goes on much easier because you will have a baseline of knowledge to work from. Will it be cheaper than buying pre-built? Probably not. But that's not really the point. And keep this in mind. While building your own machine may not be cheaper, there is one benifit that cannot be overlooked. You will have absolute, total control of _every_ component that goes into that machine. No worries about shitty WinModems, third-rate NIC cards, 5400 RPM hard drives, Motherboards with brain-dead BIOS's, etc... Now, if _I_ were building a machine today, and I actually might start on this in January to replace my current 2.5Ghz P4 system, this is what I would assemble: 1. ABIT IT7-Max3 Motherboard. 2. 1GB of the best RAM I could find. 3. Intel Pentium 4 3.2Ghz Extreme. 4. The new Plextor CDRW/DVD Recorder (I forget the model number). 5. A Second CDRW Drive only Drive rated for the best burn and ripping times (I would need to research this). 6. Antec 500+ watt TruePower Power Supply. 7. Lian-Li PC70 series case. 8. Intel 10/100/1000 NIC Card. 9. Floppy Drive, of course. 10.Western Digital 250GB SATA Hard Drive. My Mitsubishi DiamandPro 2060u 22" Monitor would transfer over. Now, as for the Sound Card, that's a tough one for me right now. I still feel the Turtle Beach Santa Cruz is one of the best, most trouble-free sound cards ever sold, but Turtle Beach seems to be losing interest in Sound Cards these days. The latest drivers, which suck (really, especially for NR2003), are Release Candidates that haven't been updated since June. The "61s" drivers are the best for NR2003 right now. Though I have a personal, deep disdain for Creative, at this point I may just have to cross back over the fence and get a new Audigy 2. I just can't shake the feeling that I would be sorry if I did because of some lame engineering short-cut they took, or something about thier drivers pissing me off again. I would also have to research out the latest Hercules Theater-XP box before making a decision, but Hercules pissed me off over the whole Windows XP driver thing a few years ago and I haven't quite forgiven them yet either :) As for the keyboard, well, IMHO a truly great keyboard hasn't been made in about 8 years so I'd probably just stick with the MS Office Keyboard for now. Mouse - No contest. Logitec MX-700 until something better comes along. After it's all built, I'd replace one of my older servers with the current system's guts (keeping the servers Lian-Li PC-70 case, of course). That's what I'd do, yes sir... :) -Larry "Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > Andrew Smith wrote: > > > > Hi all > > > > I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to > > decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare bones > > unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC before and > > would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for a pretty > > high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I wonder if as a > > newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never Oc'd either but > > kinda interested in that too! > > > > Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could > > put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it could > > is another question? > > Ok, even if you want a "built" PC rather than a "brand" PC and you don't > want to do it yourself, you always have the option of having a local > shop build it for you to your specs > > Anyways, if you feel you have the skills to do it yourself, then there's > no question I'd advice you to build your own, even if you never enter > the BIOS setup and just run with *absolutely* stock, it will most likely > perform very well, it may not set new speed records, but it will perform > > The big problem however is not actually assembling it, just about anyone > with a bit of common sense and a tiny bit of knowledge can do that bit, > don't wear nylon clothing and stuff like that, the mechanics bit isn't > difficult, just remember not to attach the mainboard directly to the > backplate in the cabinet and things like that > > The difficult bit comes when something *isn't* working properly and you > have to troubleshoot....that's when the fun starts, basically you're on > your own and have to rely on your own skills or the dubious help you get > from "friends with computer knowledge", if you have a local shop > assemble it for you, it's their responsibility to make sure the thing is > in basic working order before you take delivery of it, not saying they > will test every game they know under the sun to make sure it works, but > most likely they will do a "burn in" test to make sure the thing is in > basic working order, and if stops working, you can just drop it off at > their place and tell them to bloody fix it > > Overclocking....if you're a "newbie" and you're building a high end > computer, why would you want to Overclock it ? :-) > > Don't get me wrong, OCing is fun and I do it all the time, but OC'ing a > high end computer doesn't really make much "sense" since you already > have a PC capable of performing most tasks, it makes much more sense to > OC a 2.4 than a 3.0 since it's likely to be more responsive to OC'ing in > the first place, my 2.4 will run at 3.1 if I ask nicely, my 2.8 runs at > 3.5, but at the time of purchase the 2.8 cost more than 50% more than > the 2.4 and it doesn't make a huge difference in performance, but hey, > it's fun :-) > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > "goyl at nettx dot no" > > http://www.theuspits.com > > "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" > --Groucho Marx--

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 14:42:30 -0500, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: >As for the keyboard, well, IMHO a truly great keyboard hasn't been made in >about 8 years so I'd probably just stick with the MS Office Keyboard for >now. > >Mouse - No contest. Logitec MX-700 until something better comes along. I just bought the wireless Elite keyboard and MX700mouse combo. I like it.

On 22 Nov 2003 02:49:05 -0800, [email hidden] (Andrew Smith) wrote: >that is where I was going on the whole build it buy it thing thanks >for your opinions. > >Any more?? The mb manuals tell you how to put it all together and it's really not all that hard at all. Only a couple of hours work.

Andrew Smith wrote:

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> Hi all > > I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to > decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare bones > unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC before and > would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for a pretty > high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I wonder if as a > newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never Oc'd either but > kinda interested in that too! > > Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could > put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it could > is another question? > > > Thanks > > Andrew

Imho, Build is the only way to go. I have built and upgraded my own pc's for years now. Nice thing about it, you get exactly what you want - upgrade individual components as you see fit, etc. Seems like I am constantly upgrading something, I just don't seem happy unless I am replacing something every 6 months or so :). I will be dropping a new Athlon XP2600+ Barton core processer with SLK900 heat sink in my current Nforce2 mb hopefully sometime today, at a cost to me of app 120 bucks for both. If you've ever replaced a hard drive, pci card, power supply - building won't be that difficult for you. Just take your time on the first build, read all info carefully, and you will be successfull. And the satisfying feeling when you boot that puppy up the first time - well, it is great! -- Don Burnette

Goy Larsen wrote:

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> Andrew Smith wrote: >> >> Hi all >> >> I am looking to have a new rig for Sim Racing and I am trying to >> decide whether to build it or buy it, or possibly go with a bare >> bones unit (I guess a half way house).I have never built a PC >> before and would like to give it a try but as I am looking to go for >> a pretty high spec. P4 3.0 800, with corresponding components I >> wonder if as a newbie I will be able to build a good machine? Never >> Oc'd either but kinda interested in that too! >> >> Any thoughts on the best way to go? i am prettty confident UI could >> put all the bits together but whether it would run as well as it >> could is another question? > > Ok, even if you want a "built" PC rather than a "brand" PC and you > don't want to do it yourself, you always have the option of having a > local shop build it for you to your specs > > Anyways, if you feel you have the skills to do it yourself, then > there's no question I'd advice you to build your own, even if you > never enter the BIOS setup and just run with *absolutely* stock, it > will most likely perform very well, it may not set new speed records, > but it will perform > > The big problem however is not actually assembling it, just about > anyone with a bit of common sense and a tiny bit of knowledge can do > that bit, don't wear nylon clothing and stuff like that, the > mechanics bit isn't difficult, just remember not to attach the > mainboard directly to the backplate in the cabinet and things like > that > > The difficult bit comes when something *isn't* working properly and > you have to troubleshoot....that's when the fun starts, basically > you're on your own and have to rely on your own skills or the dubious > help you get from "friends with computer knowledge", if you have a > local shop assemble it for you, it's their responsibility to make > sure the thing is in basic working order before you take delivery of > it, not saying they will test every game they know under the sun to > make sure it works, but most likely they will do a "burn in" test to > make sure the thing is in basic working order, and if stops working, > you can just drop it off at their place and tell them to bloody fix it > > Overclocking....if you're a "newbie" and you're building a high end > computer, why would you want to Overclock it ? :-) > > Don't get me wrong, OCing is fun and I do it all the time, but OC'ing > a high end computer doesn't really make much "sense" since you already > have a PC capable of performing most tasks, it makes much more sense > to OC a 2.4 than a 3.0 since it's likely to be more responsive to > OC'ing in the first place, my 2.4 will run at 3.1 if I ask nicely, my > 2.8 runs at > 3.5, but at the time of purchase the 2.8 cost more than 50% more than > the 2.4 and it doesn't make a huge difference in performance, but hey, > it's fun :-) >

Man, I love overclocking - just something about getting that little extra umph - guess it goes back to my muscle car days :). I've been overclocking cpu's and video cards since the days of the celeron 300a... But your right, overclocking a high end system certainly is not necessary for the little gain - more for the hobbyist than anything. -- Don Burnette

Andrew Smith wrote: > that is where I was going on the whole build it buy it thing thanks > for your opinions. > > Any more?? If you elect the build it option , check out Newegg.com I buy pretty much all my hardware from those folks, decent pricing, excellent delivery, and great support. Next big decision would be Athlon verus Pentium based system. I have been running Athlon for a while now, and have been quite happy with the bang for the buck. I currently run an Athlon XP processor on an Nforce2 motherboard ( Asus A7N8X Deluxe), rock solid and great performance. In my opinion, there are only 2 really great Nforce 2 motherboards, the Asus board, and the Abit NF7. Both are very stable, and offer many bios options should you need them - as well as good onboard sound if you don't want the added expense of a good sound card. I run an Audigy2 ZS soundcard, but I hear the onboard AC97 sound is fairly close in quality - but it does put a little more load on the cpu. Unless you have a really good speaker system, you would probably be very happy with the onboard sound. I also run an ATI 9700 Pro video card, excellent card - runs aa and as very well with little performance hit. Although I believe they are probably hard to find now as the 9800 Pro has pretty much displaced it at this point, and even better card - but not by a lot. If you don't want to go to the expense of a 9800 Pro, the 9600 is getting good reviews as well, and can be overclocked some. Currrently ATI has the leg up on Nvidia though. Main thing - if you build your own - buy quality components - the little extra up front will pay off in the long run. Don't skimp on memory quality, and don't skimp on power supply - nothing can create more grief than a cheap power supply, or low quality ram. My current system: Asus A7N8X Deluxe mb Antec True Power 430w power supply Athlon XP2400+ processor ( have a 2600+ Athlon Barton core with Thermalrite SLK900 hs waiting to be dropped in) Thermalrite SLK 800 heatsink with 80mm Delta fan 1gb Corsair Low Latency matched ( 2x512) ddr ram. ATI 9700 Pro 128 mb vid card 2 ea WD 7200 rpm 120 gb hard drives 1 ea Buslink 80gb external usb2 hard drive ( for backup imaging) Lite On 52X CDRW Sony 52X CD rom Audigy2 ZS soundcard Klipsch Pro Media 5.1 Speaker system D Link 4 port powered ubs 2.0 hub ( all my periphs are usb now) - having the powered hub helps relieve power requirements put on the mb. Granted , I didn't spend the money to put all this together at one time, it was done over time, so the expense came gradually. -- Don Burnette

Larry : > 9. Floppy Drive, of course. ?? Why? I took out my FD. This only use resources (and can produce possible mess). -- Mario

Larry : ?? Why? I took out my FD. This only use resources (and can produce possible mess). -- Mario

thanks for your opinions, I have done quite a bot of research and have been on newegg freqently!! Wish lists are great!!! A few other q.s, I am becoming more and more atracted to the small form factor, Shuttle Biostar and perhaps the Monarch Hornet, any one using any of these out there? As far as CPU more peope are sayimg go with the Athlon64 (can't or will not stretch to the 64FX!) even though OS aren't optimised for 64 yet, any opinions or thoughts? Finally is it worth going for 1 gig ram as opposed to 512?

[email hidden] (Andrew Smith) wrote in news:[email hidden]: > A few other q.s, I am becoming more and more atracted to the small > form factor, Shuttle Biostar and perhaps the Monarch Hornet, any one > using any of these out there? I don't have the Hornet, but I have purchased two motherboard/cpu combos from Monarch this past fall. No complaints as far as price/shipping and getting what I ordered. THe motherboards arrived with the AMD cpu/heatsink already installed and tested. So I didn't have to sweat the 'too little- too much' thermal paste application. dave henrie

On Tue, 25 Nov 2003 07:35:08 -0600, Dave Henrie <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> I don't have the Hornet, but I have purchased two motherboard/cpu combos >from Monarch this past fall. No complaints as far as price/shipping and >getting what I ordered. THe motherboards arrived with the AMD cpu/heatsink >already installed and tested. So I didn't have to sweat the 'too little- >too much' thermal paste application. > >dave henrie

You can fit a 9800pro in one of those small PC's?

"Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:iSOvb.11771$yM6.1553@lakeread06... > > No worries > about shitty WinModems, third-rate NIC cards, 5400 RPM hard drives, > Motherboards with brain-dead BIOS's, etc... > Don't forget non-existant cooling. Come on Gateway, surely you could afford to put a fan in the computers you build...

Cobblers! <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]: > You can fit a 9800pro in one of those small PC's? I honestly don't know, but I'm assuming they have the room since the boxes are aimed at Gamers. Wouldn't do much good to target gamers then tell them they had to use 'onboard' video and shared memory. dave henrie

Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" picture might be on the cards as well : http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306 �eon Andrew Smith wrote:

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> thanks for your opinions, I have done quite a bot of research and have > been on newegg freqently!! Wish lists are great!!! > > A few other q.s, I am becoming more and more atracted to the small > form factor, Shuttle Biostar and perhaps the Monarch Hornet, any one > using any of these out there? > > As far as CPU more peope are sayimg go with the Athlon64 (can't or > will not stretch to the 64FX!) even though OS aren't optimised for 64 > yet, any opinions or thoughts? > > Finally is it worth going for 1 gig ram as opposed to 512?

Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" picture might be on the cards as well : http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306 Deon

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> thanks for your opinions, I have done quite a bot of research and have > been on newegg freqently!! Wish lists are great!!! > A few other q.s, I am becoming more and more atracted to the small > form factor, Shuttle Biostar and perhaps the Monarch Hornet, any one > using any of these out there? > As far as CPU more peope are sayimg go with the Athlon64 (can't or > will not stretch to the 64FX!) even though OS aren't optimised for 64 > yet, any opinions or thoughts? > Finally is it worth going for 1 gig ram as opposed to 512?

"Cobblers!" wrote:

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> > On Tue, 25 Nov 2003 07:35:08 -0600, Dave Henrie > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > I don't have the Hornet, but I have purchased two motherboard/cpu combos > >from Monarch this past fall. No complaints as far as price/shipping and > >getting what I ordered. THe motherboards arrived with the AMD cpu/heatsink > >already installed and tested. So I didn't have to sweat the 'too little- > >too much' thermal paste application. > > > >dave henrie > > You can fit a 9800pro in one of those small PC's?

If you're talking about SFF computers, then yes, most of them will accept a R9x00 card, the GeForce FX5800/5900 on the other hand will use the only available PCI slot as well due to the large HS/Fan, but if you don't need that PCI slot for anything, then that shouldn't be a problem either Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "goyl at nettx dot no" http://www.theuspits.com "A man is only as old as the woman he feels........" --Groucho Marx--

Don't ya just HATE it when you can't even READ a page without 'logging in' first ? -Larry "�eon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bq2qeg$1t2uan$[email hidden]... > Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" picture > might be on the cards as well : > http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306

Sorry, have registered so long ago, I actually forgot about it. At that time, I think you could browse w/o registering �eon Larry wrote:

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> Don't ya just HATE it when you can't even READ a page without > 'logging in' first ? > > -Larry > > "�eon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:bq2qeg$1t2uan$[email hidden]... >> Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" >> picture might be on the cards as well : >> http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306

Sorry, have registered so long ago, I actually forgot about it. At that time, I think you could browse w/o registering Deon

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> Don't ya just HATE it when you can't even READ a page without > 'logging in' first ? > -Larry >> Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" >> picture might be on the cards as well : >> http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306

No need to be sorry :) I was just commenting on one of my pet peeve's :) -Larry "�eon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bq48kg$1tc1t8$[email hidden]...

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> Sorry, have registered so long ago, I actually forgot about it. At that > time, I think you could browse w/o registering > > �eon > > Larry wrote: > > Don't ya just HATE it when you can't even READ a page without > > 'logging in' first ? > > > > -Larry > > > > "�eon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:bq2qeg$1t2uan$[email hidden]... > >> Once you've sorted out your pc hardware, a look at the "bigger" > >> picture might be on the cards as well : > >> http://www.saitekforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4306 >