I played GP3 today...

On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 18:39:43 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >Yes, I played GP3 today. Actually, I played the preview version that >Micropose/Hasbro had at the ECTS computer games expo. I'll let you >know the full details later when I write a full report. There is good >news and there is bad news...but mostly good. Ta for now. Well, OK. there are no screenshots as I didn't take a camera but there were plenty of other people who we taking pictures with their digital cameras and camcorders. So I'd expect that there would be plenty of screenshots around on the Internet by now. I spoke to the Microprose rep there and read the printed information there. These are the pertinent details (if you've been waiting for an early release then forget it...that was the bad news!)... 1. The game is 60% complete. 2. Release date is Spring 2000. 3. Has new physics. 4. Full tumble. 5. Weather effects. 6. 3D graphics card support. plus "much, much more!". The game was running on a PIII 600MHz with steering wheel (and gear paddles) and pedals for brake and acceleration. There was only one track available and it was Monaco. The season is based on the 1997 season (I remember the guy telling me but I forgot to write it down so now I'm not too sure !). The game has all the options of different types of difficulty that GP2 had with the same type of driving aids. I started on the grid. I was in a Ferrari around about 6th position. I waited for the green lights to go out...and away I went. The graphics were excellent. The driveability was brilliant. I really enjoyed the game. I had some problems at Tabac by braking too late and I did this a few times. But I soon sorted it out. The first thing that you notice is that the steering wheel moves. And the steering wheel has a lot of indicators on it. It had... 1. Speed 2. Revs (LED indicators duplicated on the left and right on the steering wheel. 3. LCD display showing position, lap times, etc 4. At the bottom of the steering wheel there was a LED display that showed the time elapsed in seconds (however, see my later note on on-screen Race Time). 5. The driver aids that are enabled or disabled. 6. Support for force-feedback controllers. The***pit has the tradition GP2 style damage part indicator on the right and also showing when the plank bottoms. On the side of the***pit there is a small map which looks like the outline of the circuit. Don't recall seeing anything dynamic in that image. Also, you can see the nose of the car along its length from the ***pit to the nose tip (the 1997 Ferrari nose was quite high). And you could see the writing that was on the top of the nose (did it say Ferrari on it? Didn't have time to turn my head sideways to read it!). I'm sure you car livery experts could tell me what it should be! There is something called the "Race Time" at the top of the screen (and so partly obscuring the view). I did not have the opportunity to check whether this "feature" could be switched off...but I would imagine so. The Race Time was measured in seconds and thousandths of a seconds (much like lap times). However there was a discrepancy between the Race Time and the time that appears (in whole seconds) at the bottom of the steering wheel. The steering wheel "timer" was about 3-4 seconds behind the Race Time. It could be that the Race Time is started the moment that the green lights went out and that the steering wheel timer is started when the cross the start line...although I can't imagine that it took my 3-4 seconds to cross the start line from 6th position ;-) When braking it appears as if your head is thrown forward as everything seems to "move in" towards you. The frame rate was excellent. It made the car a great joy to drive. However, I did notice that a couple of buildings seemed to be jarring a bit...there wasn't a smooth progression. But I'd expect that Microprose may have sorted things out by then or that 3D cards would be a lot faster when the game is officially released. Oh, and faster PCs will be out by then too :-I The track was nicely textured showing the parts where the track was darker due to all the *** that had been laid down (ie the racing line!). I went into a tyre barrier and noticed that it was quite heavily pixelated (very block graphics) at close range. However, this wasn't the case with some of the signs I happened to come very close too. Also the tyres didn't look very real to me especially has they were all flat...there were no contours to the tyres. They looked like a wall that was painted black and white (oh yea, some tyres are painted white so you have the black and white pattern that you normally see at most races). I hope that they've got this on their "Things to Do List". The sky was all blue and cloudless. However it appeared that the sky colour had a very slight gradient as it appeared to ever so slightly turn a light shade of blue. I also have no recollection of seeing the sun or noticing any sun-glare effects...hey, the helmet has a visor so there should be some glare ;-) That's an in-joke. The tyres also move left and right when you turn the steering wheel. I have a vague recollection of the tyres also moving up and down but I could be mistaken and was concentrating a bit on racing. The tyres also rotated when the car is moving. The car I was driving (a Ferrari) had Goodyear stickers on the tyres and so these moved as the tyre rotated. When braking or turning sharply I could hear the tyres screeching. However, under heavy braking with loads of tyre screech I did not notice any signs of tyre smoke in the rear mirrors. I'm may have just missed it and if it hasn't yet been implemented I'm sure it will. I did not have an opportunity to test the "Full Tumble" feature :-( I also did not have the opportunity to test for car setups and other telemetry features. I don't know if they've been implemented yet. I just want to add that if you enjoy GP2 you're gonna love GP3. It's all familiar but new. But i think that you're gonna need a quite a powerful machine with powerful 3D graphics to run it well :-( How much of the physics they've finished I don't know. Also, I do not know if the preview game was collecting all the telemetry data, etc. This sort of thing can slow the game down. So the preview played really well but I cannot tell what the finished game will look like. I managed to pry some pricing info from the rep...he thought that it would be in the region of GBP34.99 but this was under review. What else did I notice at ECTS? Well, there was a Jordan sponsored wheel and pedals for the Nintendo and Playstation. There was also a McLaren wheel and pedal combo for the Playstation and PC. At the stands there were full-sice replicas of the Jordan and McLaren cars. The Jordan wheel and pedal combo should also be released for the PC sometime in the future. BTW, I wouldn't by these two wheels...too much plastic for me. I use the F1 SIM wheels and pedals at home and it sure is a sturdy beast. I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT version...horrible! Well, I guess that's all for now. Hope that you found this report useful. -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:49 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu

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>On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 18:39:43 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >>Yes, I played GP3 today. Actually, I played the preview version that >>Micropose/Hasbro had at the ECTS computer games expo. I'll let you >>know the full details later when I write a full report. There is good >>news and there is bad news...but mostly good. Ta for now. >Well, OK. there are no screenshots as I didn't take a camera but >there were plenty of other people who we taking pictures with their >digital cameras and camcorders. So I'd expect that there would be >plenty of screenshots around on the Internet by now.

[snip] >The frame rate was excellent. It made the car a great joy to drive. >However, I did notice that a couple of buildings seemed to be jarring >a bit...there wasn't a smooth progression. But I'd expect that >Microprose may have sorted things out by then or that 3D cards would >be a lot faster when the game is officially released. Oh, and faster >PCs will be out by then too :-I [snip] I've just discovered that the GP3 preview was rendering the screen through software only...they haven't done the 3D stuff yet. But, I have to say that the software mode look very good. I find that with 3D cards that the games can look like polygons with great textures. Have you seen some of the "curves" that are represented in some 3D games? I suppose that's why I liked the GP3 graphics...they just seemed more realistic..."un-arcady" look, if you know what I mean. It would be interesting to see what Microprose can do with 3D hardware...perhaps you can get away with a sub 600MHz machine! -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:49 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too >much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were >other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT >version...horrible! Umm, what Ubisoft game? I thought there won't be a new F1 sim from them anytime soon... They surely didn't come with MGPRS to ECTS, that was last year. --Tel

On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:49 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu <snip> Okay, most of this can be seen on the few shots we already have, or can be expected from a modern sim anyway - apart from maybe the track map. But the real question is - How does it 'feel'? I mean, is there still that massive amount of grip like in GP2 and what about the AI (I guess there were enough other cars around if you started from sixth position). Also, is some kind of damage model already implemented? --Tel

That's as good news as the GP3 report, I know they are still continuing with the bad POD game engine unfortunately from all the reports I was told by the fellow employees I know here in Montreal. ;-) How could we NOT found it useful ? :) I mean it's been 4years almost since Gp2! I always found the SVGA Graphics much more realistic than what some stuff in 3d-acceleration shows us. It's grainy, it looks more real for certain effects at mid-distance. Too close it's too pixelated, too far you can't see the details, but in the middle it really looks incredible. Anybody go download user-made 1999 F1 tracks for GP2, they look much more realistic graphic-wise (the palette was always great for Gp2) than other F1 sims, IMHO. -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... "People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Nice report. Did they mention anything about internet play? That's the big one for me. You'd think internet play would be a must for any game these days, but it's suprising how many new games don't have it at all. Keepin my fingers crossed. And what about different cars? Will they drive differently or all the same?

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>On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 18:39:43 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >>Yes, I played GP3 today. Actually, I played the preview version that >>Micropose/Hasbro had at the ECTS computer games expo. I'll let you >>know the full details later when I write a full report. There is good >>news and there is bad news...but mostly good. Ta for now. >Well, OK. there are no screenshots as I didn't take a camera but >there were plenty of other people who we taking pictures with their >digital cameras and camcorders. So I'd expect that there would be >plenty of screenshots around on the Internet by now. >I spoke to the Microprose rep there and read the printed information >there. These are the pertinent details (if you've been waiting for an >early release then forget it...that was the bad news!)... >1. The game is 60% complete. >2. Release date is Spring 2000. >3. Has new physics. >4. Full tumble. >5. Weather effects. >6. 3D graphics card support. >plus "much, much more!". >The game was running on a PIII 600MHz with steering wheel (and gear >paddles) and pedals for brake and acceleration. There was only one >track available and it was Monaco. The season is based on the 1997 >season (I remember the guy telling me but I forgot to write it down >so now I'm not too sure !). The game has all the options of different >types of difficulty that GP2 had with the same type of driving aids. >I started on the grid. I was in a Ferrari around about 6th position. >I waited for the green lights to go out...and away I went. The >graphics were excellent. The driveability was brilliant. I really >enjoyed the game. I had some problems at Tabac by braking too late >and I did this a few times. But I soon sorted it out. >The first thing that you notice is that the steering wheel moves. And >the steering wheel has a lot of indicators on it. It had... >1. Speed >2. Revs (LED indicators duplicated on the left and right on the >steering wheel. >3. LCD display showing position, lap times, etc >4. At the bottom of the steering wheel there was a LED display that >showed the time elapsed in seconds (however, see my later note on >on-screen Race Time). >5. The driver aids that are enabled or disabled. >6. Support for force-feedback controllers. >The***pit has the tradition GP2 style damage part indicator on the >right and also showing when the plank bottoms. >On the side of the***pit there is a small map which looks like the >outline of the circuit. Don't recall seeing anything dynamic in that >image. >Also, you can see the nose of the car along its length from the >cockpit to the nose tip (the 1997 Ferrari nose was quite high). And >you could see the writing that was on the top of the nose (did it say >Ferrari on it? Didn't have time to turn my head sideways to read >it!). I'm sure you car livery experts could tell me what it should >be! >There is something called the "Race Time" at the top of the screen >(and so partly obscuring the view). I did not have the opportunity to >check whether this "feature" could be switched off...but I would >imagine so. The Race Time was measured in seconds and thousandths of >a seconds (much like lap times). However there was a discrepancy >between the Race Time and the time that appears (in whole seconds) at >the bottom of the steering wheel. The steering wheel "timer" was >about 3-4 seconds behind the Race Time. It could be that the Race >Time is started the moment that the green lights went out and that >the steering wheel timer is started when the cross the start >line...although I can't imagine that it took my 3-4 seconds to cross >the start line from 6th position ;-) >When braking it appears as if your head is thrown forward as >everything seems to "move in" towards you. >The frame rate was excellent. It made the car a great joy to drive. >However, I did notice that a couple of buildings seemed to be jarring >a bit...there wasn't a smooth progression. But I'd expect that >Microprose may have sorted things out by then or that 3D cards would >be a lot faster when the game is officially released. Oh, and faster >PCs will be out by then too :-I >The track was nicely textured showing the parts where the track was >darker due to all the *** that had been laid down (ie the racing >line!). >I went into a tyre barrier and noticed that it was quite heavily >pixelated (very block graphics) at close range. However, this wasn't >the case with some of the signs I happened to come very close too. >Also the tyres didn't look very real to me especially has they were >all flat...there were no contours to the tyres. They looked like a >wall that was painted black and white (oh yea, some tyres are painted >white so you have the black and white pattern that you normally see >at most races). I hope that they've got this on their "Things to Do >List". >The sky was all blue and cloudless. However it appeared that the sky >colour had a very slight gradient as it appeared to ever so slightly >turn a light shade of blue. I also have no recollection of seeing the >sun or noticing any sun-glare effects...hey, the helmet has a visor >so there should be some glare ;-) That's an in-joke. >The tyres also move left and right when you turn the steering wheel. >I have a vague recollection of the tyres also moving up and down but >I could be mistaken and was concentrating a bit on racing. The tyres >also rotated when the car is moving. The car I was driving (a >Ferrari) had Goodyear stickers on the tyres and so these moved as the >tyre rotated. >When braking or turning sharply I could hear the tyres screeching. >However, under heavy braking with loads of tyre screech I did not >notice any signs of tyre smoke in the rear mirrors. I'm may have just >missed it and if it hasn't yet been implemented I'm sure it will. >I did not have an opportunity to test the "Full Tumble" feature :-( >I also did not have the opportunity to test for car setups and other >telemetry features. I don't know if they've been implemented yet. >I just want to add that if you enjoy GP2 you're gonna love GP3. It's >all familiar but new. But i think that you're gonna need a quite a >powerful machine with powerful 3D graphics to run it well :-( >How much of the physics they've finished I don't know. Also, I do not >know if the preview game was collecting all the telemetry data, etc. >This sort of thing can slow the game down. So the preview played >really well but I cannot tell what the finished game will look like. >I managed to pry some pricing info from the rep...he thought that it >would be in the region of GBP34.99 but this was under review. >What else did I notice at ECTS? Well, there was a Jordan sponsored >wheel and pedals for the Nintendo and Playstation. There was also a >McLaren wheel and pedal combo for the Playstation and PC. At the >stands there were full-sice replicas of the Jordan and McLaren cars. >The Jordan wheel and pedal combo should also be released for the PC >sometime in the future. BTW, I wouldn't by these two wheels...too >much plastic for me. I use the F1 SIM wheels and pedals at home and >it sure is a sturdy beast. >I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too >much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were >other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT >version...horrible! >Well, I guess that's all for now. Hope that you found this report >useful. >-- >Kulvinder Singh Matharu >Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk >(note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

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>> I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too >> much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were >> other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT >> version...horrible! >That's as good news as the GP3 report, I know they are still continuing with >the bad POD game engine unfortunately from all the reports I was told by the >fellow employees I know here in Montreal. ;-) >> Well, I guess that's all for now. Hope that you found this report >> useful. >How could we NOT found it useful ? :) I mean it's been 4years almost since >Gp2!

But most importantly..... Is Murray Walker doing commentary? It just wouldn't be F1 with out Murray. :) Andy Backa The only skills I have the patience to learn are those that have no real application in life. - Calvin and Hobbes Chewey Pages: http://home.istar.ca/~chewey

>Andy Backa >The only skills I have the patience to learn are those that have no real application in life. Thank god, someone else appreciates Calvin. "Weekends don't count unless you spend them doing something completely pointless"

WOW! Many thanks for the detailed post! Great review -- I'm glad to hear about the "moving***pit" feature, but the part about the PIII-600 REALLY has me worried. Sounds to me like GP3 is going to turn out to be like GP2 for me -- I liked GP2 a lot (Suzuka was great!), but my hardware could handle ICR2 *much* better, so GP2 didn't get played all that much. We'll see when it arrives, I guess. -- JB

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>On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 18:39:43 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >>Yes, I played GP3 today. Actually, I played the preview version that >>Micropose/Hasbro had at the ECTS computer games expo. I'll let you >>know the full details later when I write a full report. There is good >>news and there is bad news...but mostly good. Ta for now. >Well, OK. there are no screenshots as I didn't take a camera but >there were plenty of other people who we taking pictures with their >digital cameras and camcorders. So I'd expect that there would be >plenty of screenshots around on the Internet by now. >I spoke to the Microprose rep there and read the printed information >there. These are the pertinent details (if you've been waiting for an >early release then forget it...that was the bad news!)... >1. The game is 60% complete. >2. Release date is Spring 2000. >3. Has new physics. >4. Full tumble. >5. Weather effects. >6. 3D graphics card support. >plus "much, much more!". >The game was running on a PIII 600MHz with steering wheel (and gear >paddles) and pedals for brake and acceleration. There was only one >track available and it was Monaco. The season is based on the 1997 >season (I remember the guy telling me but I forgot to write it down >so now I'm not too sure !). The game has all the options of different >types of difficulty that GP2 had with the same type of driving aids. >I started on the grid. I was in a Ferrari around about 6th position. >I waited for the green lights to go out...and away I went. The >graphics were excellent. The driveability was brilliant. I really >enjoyed the game. I had some problems at Tabac by braking too late >and I did this a few times. But I soon sorted it out. >The first thing that you notice is that the steering wheel moves. And >the steering wheel has a lot of indicators on it. It had... >1. Speed >2. Revs (LED indicators duplicated on the left and right on the >steering wheel. >3. LCD display showing position, lap times, etc >4. At the bottom of the steering wheel there was a LED display that >showed the time elapsed in seconds (however, see my later note on >on-screen Race Time). >5. The driver aids that are enabled or disabled. >6. Support for force-feedback controllers. >The***pit has the tradition GP2 style damage part indicator on the >right and also showing when the plank bottoms. >On the side of the***pit there is a small map which looks like the >outline of the circuit. Don't recall seeing anything dynamic in that >image. >Also, you can see the nose of the car along its length from the >cockpit to the nose tip (the 1997 Ferrari nose was quite high). And >you could see the writing that was on the top of the nose (did it say >Ferrari on it? Didn't have time to turn my head sideways to read >it!). I'm sure you car livery experts could tell me what it should >be! >There is something called the "Race Time" at the top of the screen >(and so partly obscuring the view). I did not have the opportunity to >check whether this "feature" could be switched off...but I would >imagine so. The Race Time was measured in seconds and thousandths of >a seconds (much like lap times). However there was a discrepancy >between the Race Time and the time that appears (in whole seconds) at >the bottom of the steering wheel. The steering wheel "timer" was >about 3-4 seconds behind the Race Time. It could be that the Race >Time is started the moment that the green lights went out and that >the steering wheel timer is started when the cross the start >line...although I can't imagine that it took my 3-4 seconds to cross >the start line from 6th position ;-) >When braking it appears as if your head is thrown forward as >everything seems to "move in" towards you. >The frame rate was excellent. It made the car a great joy to drive. >However, I did notice that a couple of buildings seemed to be jarring >a bit...there wasn't a smooth progression. But I'd expect that >Microprose may have sorted things out by then or that 3D cards would >be a lot faster when the game is officially released. Oh, and faster >PCs will be out by then too :-I >The track was nicely textured showing the parts where the track was >darker due to all the *** that had been laid down (ie the racing >line!). >I went into a tyre barrier and noticed that it was quite heavily >pixelated (very block graphics) at close range. However, this wasn't >the case with some of the signs I happened to come very close too. >Also the tyres didn't look very real to me especially has they were >all flat...there were no contours to the tyres. They looked like a >wall that was painted black and white (oh yea, some tyres are painted >white so you have the black and white pattern that you normally see >at most races). I hope that they've got this on their "Things to Do >List". >The sky was all blue and cloudless. However it appeared that the sky >colour had a very slight gradient as it appeared to ever so slightly >turn a light shade of blue. I also have no recollection of seeing the >sun or noticing any sun-glare effects...hey, the helmet has a visor >so there should be some glare ;-) That's an in-joke. >The tyres also move left and right when you turn the steering wheel. >I have a vague recollection of the tyres also moving up and down but >I could be mistaken and was concentrating a bit on racing. The tyres >also rotated when the car is moving. The car I was driving (a >Ferrari) had Goodyear stickers on the tyres and so these moved as the >tyre rotated. >When braking or turning sharply I could hear the tyres screeching. >However, under heavy braking with loads of tyre screech I did not >notice any signs of tyre smoke in the rear mirrors. I'm may have just >missed it and if it hasn't yet been implemented I'm sure it will. >I did not have an opportunity to test the "Full Tumble" feature :-( >I also did not have the opportunity to test for car setups and other >telemetry features. I don't know if they've been implemented yet. >I just want to add that if you enjoy GP2 you're gonna love GP3. It's >all familiar but new. But i think that you're gonna need a quite a >powerful machine with powerful 3D graphics to run it well :-( >How much of the physics they've finished I don't know. Also, I do not >know if the preview game was collecting all the telemetry data, etc. >This sort of thing can slow the game down. So the preview played >really well but I cannot tell what the finished game will look like. >I managed to pry some pricing info from the rep...he thought that it >would be in the region of GBP34.99 but this was under review. >What else did I notice at ECTS? Well, there was a Jordan sponsored >wheel and pedals for the Nintendo and Playstation. There was also a >McLaren wheel and pedal combo for the Playstation and PC. At the >stands there were full-sice replicas of the Jordan and McLaren cars. >The Jordan wheel and pedal combo should also be released for the PC >sometime in the future. BTW, I wouldn't by these two wheels...too >much plastic for me. I use the F1 SIM wheels and pedals at home and >it sure is a sturdy beast. >I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too >much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were >other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT >version...horrible! >Well, I guess that's all for now. Hope that you found this report >useful. >-- >Kulvinder Singh Matharu >Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk >(note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

Must not be realistic then. Real F1 cars are nearly undriveable if you listen to the drivers! <G> no hands... Randy

Kulvinder Singh Matharu [n/a] -> rec.autos.sport.f1: [ good review of GP3 ] Thanks for the great report, Kulvinder! Keep us informed if you get to know anything more (about graphics support, Direct3D, OpenGL, and system support, Win98, NT4, Win2000, etc). Best regards, m a r t i n | n -- Martin Nisshagen PGP 6.0: 0x45D423AC K R A F T W E R K :-) d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se home2.sbbs2.com/mn home2.sbbs2.com/mn/kw

>WOW! Many thanks for the detailed post! Great review -- I'm glad to hear >about the "moving***pit" feature, but the part about the PIII-600 REALLY >has me worried. Do we see a pattern here? 60% finished <===> needs a PIII/600 MHz 100% finished <===> needs a PV /1 GHz fear the worst, and start filling that piggy bank now... 8-P Uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany (52.0N/8h30mE) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

>Nice report. Did they mention anything about internet play? That's the big >one for me. You'd think internet play would be a must for any game these >days, but it's suprising how many new games don't have it at all. Keepin my >fingers crossed. And what about different cars? Will they drive >differently or all the same? [snip] The rep mentioned that the game has "improved" multi-player compared to GP2. He said that it would allow several people to play...no details on number of players, servers, serial cable links, or IPX play. Sorry, but that was all I could ply from him...perhaps I got a non GP3 Hasbro rep! Perhaps someone else got lucky with more info? I did have a conversation with someone from higher up in the company (Senior Producer - Microprose) but it was a bit one sided as I was trying to explain what kind of work I was involved in and when I started asking detailed questions he said that he couldn't hear me properly through all the noise and that I should call him back! He gave me his business card but I'm not sure that I'll be able to extract any further information from him! -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

>>I started on the grid. I was in a Ferrari around about 6th position. >>I waited for the green lights to go out...and away I went. The >>graphics were excellent. The driveability was brilliant. >Must not be realistic then. Real F1 cars are nearly undriveable if >you listen to the drivers! <G> Well, OK. The driver aids were on. I've played GP2 ever since it came out and would say that I'm pretty good on it with all driver aids off. So driving around in GP3 with the driver aids turned on was a doddle. I'd imagine that with the driver aids turned off the GP3 would still be a good drive for those that have played GP2 without driver aids...but I'm only guessing. I've seen the hands in the screenshots for that "other" sim and I'm not impressed... -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

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>On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:49 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu ><snip> >Okay, most of this can be seen on the few shots we already have, or >can be expected from a modern sim anyway - apart from maybe the track >map. But the real question is - How does it 'feel'? I mean, is there >still that massive amount of grip like in GP2 and what about the AI (I >guess there were enough other cars around if you started from sixth >position). Also, is some kind of damage model already implemented? >--Tel

Hi Tel, I've posted another message stating that the game had diver aids turned on so am not able to give a definitive answer on how the GP3 "feel" is compared to GP2....but with the driver modes on it appeared to play just like the equivalent in GP2. But like I said I kept hitting the wall at Tabac (braking too late) as I've got so used to hitting the brakes at the same place in GP2 so SOMETHING has changed...perhaps it's the less downforce or less grippy tyres. Don't really know but the blurb does say that the game has "new physics" programmed by Geoff Crammond. My initial impressions are that it is like a higher resolution version of GP2...familiar but new! Oh yes, there was instant response to the car's handling and with the higher graphics and frame rate the movement was smooth and the car was SO easy to drive. -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

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>On Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:49 +0100, Kulvinder Singh Matharu >>I also tried the UBISOFT F1 game and I didn't like it...it felt too >>much like an arcade game rather than a full blown sim. there were >>other F1 games there too but they were all like the UBISOFT >>version...horrible! >Umm, what Ubisoft game? I thought there won't be a new F1 sim from >them anytime soon... They surely didn't come with MGPRS to ECTS, that >was last year. >--Tel

There was an F1 game at UBISOFT...didn't know what it was called...or have I got confused with the Guillemot stand where they were demonstrating their force feedback wheels and pedals? -- Kulvinder Singh Matharu Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk (note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

Well.... should be interesting to see since the FIA was very adamant about NOT allowing Internet play of ANY official F1 Sim during the time Ubi was approaching them. Reliable sources tell me that's the MAIN reason MGPRS2 didn't have the "Official" flavour to it. However, there's always VPN :) Will be interesting to see if Internet Play will ship standard, or if Geoff will just leave the code floating in the wind for those dedicated individuals to start tweaking for such a feature (You listening Allison? hehe...) Cheers, Shumi >>Nice report. Did they mention anything about internet play? That's the big >>one for me. You'd think internet play would be a must for any game these >>days, but it's suprising how many new games don't have it at all. Keepin my

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>>fingers crossed. And what about different cars? Will they drive >>differently or all the same? >[snip] >The rep mentioned that the game has "improved" multi-player compared >to GP2. He said that it would allow several people to play...no >details on number of players, servers, serial cable links, or IPX >play. Sorry, but that was all I could ply from him...perhaps I got a >non GP3 Hasbro rep! Perhaps someone else got lucky with more info? I >did have a conversation with someone from higher up in the company >(Senior Producer - Microprose) but it was a bit one sided as I was >trying to explain what kind of work I was involved in and when I >started asking detailed questions he said that he couldn't hear me >properly through all the noise and that I should call him back! He >gave me his business card but I'm not sure that I'll be able to >extract any further information from him! >-- >Kulvinder Singh Matharu >Website: http://www.matharu.demon.co.uk >(note : e-mail header address deliberately mangled)

Its bad enough having to listen to Murray when watching the GP's on televison, and now that Martin Brundle is there, he spends most of his time correcting him. No, Murray DETRACTS from F1 now. He used to be tolerable, but now he is just damned annoying. Time to retire Murray...... Cheers.....Ken

Kulvinder Singh Matharu [n/a] -> rec.autos.sport.f1: ? >Well.... should be interesting to see since the FIA was very adamant about ? >NOT allowing Internet play of ANY official F1 Sim during the time Ubi was ? [snip] ? ? Official GP3 site says 4 player LAN support (what I sometimes ? incorrectly call IPX support). No talk of Internet play. I hope it's TCP/IP for LAN at least (IPX sucks and should die ASAP IMO), but I'm really amazed that they in this years release a game without good Internet support. Shame on them if true (half the potential of the game will be lost)! Best regards, m a r t i n | n -- Martin Nisshagen PGP 6.0: 0x45D423AC K R A F T W E R K :-) d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se home2.sbbs2.com/mn home2.sbbs2.com/mn/kw

I can understand wanting internet play for some games but how on earth do you expect to be able to run a real time racing simulation over the net when the data transfer speed is so unreliable for most people. Please explain. Ken M

> I can understand wanting internet play for some games but how on earth do > you expect to be able to run a real time racing simulation over the net when > the data transfer speed is so unreliable for most people. Please explain. Well, It can race Grand Prix Legends online with 19 other people on my 28.8 modem with no problems. Of course that is on a high bandwith server. I've hosted races on my modem with 3 other racers with no problems too. That's a good enough explanation for me :) And in modern F1 there is no side by side racing anyway, so warping won't be a problem :P -- Olav K. Malmin remove spam when replying

> > I can understand wanting internet play for some games but how on earth do > > you expect to be able to run a real time racing simulation over the net when > > the data transfer speed is so unreliable for most people. Please explain. The way to do it is predictive algorithms. For example, suppose one of the drivers (A) is lagging at one moment (ie, his Inet conection is slow), then the host 'drives' his machine in a logical way during some miliseconds. When A machine recovers, the situation is updated according to real data (how A has been driving from home). It can happen, though, that while A is driving isolated, he spins, for example, and when the situation is updated there's a big change. The rest of the drivers would see A already spun without having seen the actual spinning. But in most situations, the differences between the prediction and reality are small, thus unnoticeable. The only problems are accidents and very close manouvres, like overtaking. Obviously, if the server is very slow, the game might be unplayable (miracles don't exist), but with medium-to-high speed servers it looks like if it were better than it really is under a non-predictive algorithm in which you collect all the data and one lagging computer stalls the whole game. Regards

I agree F1 wouldn't be the same without him, but I also agree he's well past his sell by date. I'd love to see him doing, say, fill-in features (visiting team bases/whatever) or maybe even doing the pit commentary, as teams might be reluctant to tell him to *** off and stop asking daft questions :-) But it really is time to dish out the gold-plated carriage clock I'm afraid. Andrew McP

:> No, Murray DETRACTS from F1 now. He used to be tolerable, :> but now he is just damned annoying. : I agree F1 wouldn't be the same without him, but I also agree he's well : past his sell by date. Andrew - I really think you should go back and watch some tapes of old races. Murray has ALWAYS been like that. Some people love it (including me) and some people don't. If he's past his sell by date then he has been since 1970s where he was making the same mistakes with the same frequency. -- Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York. www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Ah, that explains it then. I didn't start taking an interest in F1 until the late 80's, and it's only in recent years I've watched most of the races. Guess in my old age I'm just less tolerant of people who get paid well for doing a job they love, yet constantly annoy me with their often loose grip of their specialist subject :-) I still agree it wouldn't be the same without him, but I think his thought processes are best suited to live cricket commentary. Andrew McP

HAHAHAHAAAAAAA!! Lovely comment, Andrew!! I've had to tolerate Murray since the GPs were telecast here in Oz from 1980 and his comments back then were as irksome as they are today. I really think that he should retire before ITV do it for him. -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

Re. Murray's commentary. I challenge anyone on this n/s to have more knowledge of F1 than Mr Walker. Its that simple. So he makes mistakes. Big deal. Has anyone here tried commentating in an entertaining and informaive way for 78 laps? * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!

> Re. Murray's commentary. I challenge anyone on this n/s to have more knowledge of F1 than Mr Walker. Its that simple. So he makes mistakes. Big deal. Has anyone here tried commentating in an entertaining and informaive way for 78 laps? Right - so it is pretty similar to cricket commentary after all - if nothing much is happening, start talking about the pigeons that just landed in the outfield etc. Personally I think it worked better with James Hunt there to gently correct Murray when he got it wrong...

DON'T FIRE MURRAY !!!! IMHO, Murray has helped make F1 accessible to the mass market. Ok he makes a few errors along the way but he is very enthusiastic about F1and it shows through his commentary which makes him very "listenable" maybe a little excitable. It all adds together to make F1 races more enjoyable for the non-enthusiasts and possibly convert them into enthusiasts. Murray has said himself that he will know when he is unable to carry on commentating and that time can't be far away due to his advancing years, but if ITV force him to leave they will likely be doing themselves a disservice. A viewer poll was carried out last year and the vote to keep Murray was IIRC about 70%. Who could take the place of Murray Walker ? :) Ian Parker > HAHAHAHAAAAAAA!! Lovely comment, Andrew!! > I've had to tolerate Murray since the GPs were telecast here in Oz from 1980

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> and his comments back then were as irksome as they are today. > I really think that he should retire before ITV do it for him. > > > If he's past his sell by date > > > then he has been since 1970s > > Ah, that explains it then. I didn't start taking an interest in F1 until > > the late 80's, and it's only in recent years I've watched most of the > > races. > > Guess in my old age I'm just less tolerant of people who get paid well

for > > doing a job they love, yet constantly annoy me with their often loose grip > > of their specialist subject :-) > > I still agree it wouldn't be the same without him, but I think his thought > > processes are best suited to live cricket commentary. > > Andrew McP

I don't want him fired... just strategically singed. A large wooden object would frequently be an improvement IMO. I'd suggest James Hunt's coffin, but I suspect that'd be in poor taste. Andrew McP

Yes, I have. Unfortunately, it usually degrades into expletives followed by a quick trip to the bathroom. I doubt many listeners/viewers would appreciate 'bathroom noises' along with their commentary. S. knowledge of F1 than Mr Walker. Its that simple. So he makes mistakes. Big deal. Has anyone here tried commentating in an entertaining and informaive way for 78 laps?

Hey Andrew, maybe we can work out a trade, we'll take Murray off your hands if you take Sam (Ludicrous Verbosity) Posey and Derek (well, well, well...) Daly off ours<g>. don [|]-(_)-[|]

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>> If he's past his sell by date >> then he has been since 1970s >Ah, that explains it then. I didn't start taking an interest in F1 until >the late 80's, and it's only in recent years I've watched most of the >races. >Guess in my old age I'm just less tolerant of people who get paid well for >doing a job they love, yet constantly annoy me with their often loose grip >of their specialist subject :-) >I still agree it wouldn't be the same without him, but I think his thought >processes are best suited to live cricket commentary. >Andrew McP

I just love Murray because he is 100 % wrong . It is almost super natural his ability. As soon as he says that a driver is doing badly you might as well turn the TV off because you know the winner immediately. And it must be the drivers nightmare to know that Murray says that they have the race in the bag. They must be immediately wondering what part is about to blow! -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

(snip) (unsnip) Nobody, thank God! Ian, we are all enthusiasts at something and we all do our best but there does come a time when enthusiasm doesn't quite overpower the downgrading of ability! Murray was tolerable up until he lost his best asset.....James Hunt. > DON'T FIRE MURRAY !!!! > IMHO, Murray has helped make F1 accessible to the mass market. Ok he makes a > few errors along the way but he is very enthusiastic about F1and it shows > through his commentary which makes him very "listenable" maybe a little > excitable. > It all adds together to make F1 races more enjoyable for the non-enthusiasts > and possibly convert them into enthusiasts. > Murray has said himself that he will know when he is unable to carry on > commentating and that time can't be far away due to his advancing years, but > if ITV force him to leave they will likely be doing themselves a disservice. > A viewer poll was carried out last year and the vote to keep Murray was IIRC

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> about 70%. > Who could take the place of Murray Walker ? :) > Ian Parker > > HAHAHAHAAAAAAA!! Lovely comment, Andrew!! > > I've had to tolerate Murray since the GPs were telecast here in Oz from > 1980 > > and his comments back then were as irksome as they are today. > > I really think that he should retire before ITV do it for him. > > > > If he's past his sell by date > > > > then he has been since 1970s > > > Ah, that explains it then. I didn't start taking an interest in F1

until

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> > > the late 80's, and it's only in recent years I've watched most of the > > > races. > > > Guess in my old age I'm just less tolerant of people who get paid well > for > > > doing a job they love, yet constantly annoy me with their often loose > grip > > > of their specialist subject :-) > > > I still agree it wouldn't be the same without him, but I think his > thought > > > processes are best suited to live cricket commentary. > > > Andrew McP

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Andrew MacPherson kirjoitti viestiss? ... How about Mansell? all he does is golfing nowadays, am I right? hmmm Mansell is the type that could even start a career as popsinger too...;P PS. He was my favourite F1 driver until he couldn't match the speed with Mika H..... Such a lion for a britt he was :)

"Bring Back David Hobbes!" > Hey Andrew, maybe we can work out a trade, we'll take Murray off your hands > if you take Sam (Ludicrous Verbosity) Posey and Derek (well, well, well...)

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> Daly off ours<g>. > don > [|]-(_)-[|] > >> If he's past his sell by date > >> then he has been since 1970s > >Ah, that explains it then. I didn't start taking an interest in F1 until > >the late 80's, and it's only in recent years I've watched most of the > >races. > >Guess in my old age I'm just less tolerant of people who get paid well

for > >doing a job they love, yet constantly annoy me with their often loose grip > >of their specialist subject :-) > >I still agree it wouldn't be the same without him, but I think his thought > >processes are best suited to live cricket commentary. > >Andrew McP

The thing is with Murray, his ability hasn't downgraded much, he's always got it wrong !! :) But I still enjoy his commentary, he adds a certain air. Normally blue I guess! but I find it hard to enjoy other people commentating on races as much because they don't seem to have the e***ment in their voices that Murray does. BTW I know you have your opinion, which I would never try to change, I'm just giving mine :) -- Ian Parker UKGPL League http://www.btinternet.com/~ukgpl/index.html [address restored] --

Ben Edwards & John Watson Eurosport F1 commentators till 96 I think ... we still have Ben doing CART commentaries ... we miss you John :) I think I would change my F1 supersignal for a normal F1 coverage with those guys ... almost ... :) McKafre De La Rosa Craig Jones escribi en mensaje knowledge of F1 than Mr Walker. Its that simple. So he makes mistakes. Big deal. Has anyone here tried commentating in an entertaining and informaive way for 78 laps?

Bob Varsha and David Hobbs ripped gnarly curls, man! "Shinji Nakano comes in for what must be the first race pit stop of his F1 career." (Bob Varsha - in Shinji's 4th season.) "Jean Alesi has just set fastest lap of the race for the second lap in a row. No mean feat considering that he is the only car on slicks, in a torrential downpour, and must be traveling at least 1/4 mile further than anyone else to complete a lap." (Bob Varsha) "Forget the tires and fuel, I'm coming in for an underwear change." (Bob Varsha on Alex Wurtz's fishtail.) "The rain tends to equalize the cars... and has the exact opposite effect on the drivers." (Bob Varsha) "That was the stupidest thing I've ever seen anyone do. Why they let him continue to race after that is beyond me." (David Hobbs after an Alesi T-Bone.) -- Mark Jeangerard www.soundchaserweb.com New Mexico USA

> Bob Varsha and David Hobbs ripped gnarly curls, man! > "Shinji Nakano comes in for what must be the first race pit stop of his F1 > career." > (Bob Varsha - in Shinji's 4th season.) So Murray Walker is not alone after all!

> I just love Murray because he is 100 % wrong . It is almost super natural > his ability. As soon as he says that a driver is doing badly you might as > well turn the TV off because you know the winner immediately. > And it must be the drivers nightmare to know that Murray says that they have > the race > in the bag. They must be immediately wondering what part is about to blow! :-) I just watched a race from 1980 with Murray (Watkins Glen): "Bruno Giacomelli's Alfa is running with no problems at all in the lead..." A few laps later his engine blew :-)) You must be right! Lutz -- Home: http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/8059/

> Ben Edwards & John Watson > Eurosport F1 commentators till 96 I think ... > we still have Ben doing CART commentaries ... we miss you John :) Have a look at my Homepage - I`ve got tons of MP3 samples from Watson/Edwards. A John Watson Story is coming soon - have a look at it in the german part of my Page - I have to translate it... Lutz -- Home: http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/8059/

Well, considering the rest of the quotes in that message made sense, in a witty sort of way, perhaps it was a wry observation on whether or not Nakano actually was *racing* the previous three seasons! Stephen :> :> Bob Varsha and David Hobbs ripped gnarly curls, man! :> :> "Shinji Nakano comes in for what must be the first race pit stop of his F1 :> career." :> (Bob Varsha - in Shinji's 4th season.) : So Murray Walker is not alone after all!

Except Nakano had 2 seasons in F1. M

: Except Nakano had 2 seasons in F1. You missed my point... yes, he had two seasons in F1... yes he was physically on the track... but could you call it racing? :) Perhaps Varsha's true wit is wasted... Stephen :>Well, considering the rest of the quotes in that message made sense, in a :>witty sort of way, perhaps it was a wry observation on whether or not :>Nakano actually was *racing* the previous three seasons! :> :>Stephen

I think for some drivers (such as Shinji) the first valid pit stop is something on the order of a triumph . . . "I'm coming into the pits, AND I get to go back out again!" -dk > > Bob Varsha and David Hobbs ripped gnarly curls, man! > > "Shinji Nakano comes in for what must be the first race pit stop of his F1 > > career." > > (Bob Varsha - in Shinji's 4th season.) > So Murray Walker is not alone after all!

OK. That's the second time I've read that term in this group today. What is "turning the air blue"? -- Mark Jeangerard www.soundchaserweb.com New Mexico USA > The thing is with Murray, his ability hasn't downgraded much, he's always > got it wrong !! :) > But I still enjoy his commentary, he adds a certain air. Normally blue I > guess! but I find it hard to enjoy other people commentating on races as > much because they don't seem to have the e***ment in their voices that > Murray does. > BTW I know you have your opinion, which I would never try to change, I'm > just giving mine :) > -- > Ian Parker > UKGPL League > http://www.btinternet.com/~ukgpl/index.html [address restored] > -- > > (snip) > > > Who could take the place of Murray Walker ? :) > > (unsnip) > > Nobody, thank God! > > Ian, we are all enthusiasts at something and we all do our best but there > > does come a time when enthusiasm doesn't quite overpower the downgrading > of > > ability! > > Murray was tolerable up until he lost his best asset.....James Hunt.

Whoops! I was guessing on the Shinji time frame. All I remember was Shinji was no newbie and Varsha's intention was strictly mean. He meant that after 16 to 32 races, Shinji had never made it to the first pit stop. I like that hard edged wit. Derek Bell is another that I enjoy in the commentary seat. No excuses in his mind... :-) -- Mark Jeangerard www.soundchaserweb.com New Mexico USA > : Except Nakano had 2 seasons in F1. > You missed my point... yes, he had two seasons in F1... yes he was > physically on the track... but could you call it racing? > :) > Perhaps Varsha's true wit is wasted... > Stephen > :>Well, considering the rest of the quotes in that message made sense, in a > :>witty sort of way, perhaps it was a wry observation on whether or not > :>Nakano actually was *racing* the previous three seasons! > :> > :>Stephen

You haven't heard out moderation-team here in Malaysia yet. I could trash them all the time. Jens

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>Its bad enough having to listen to Murray when watching the GP's on >televison, and now that Martin Brundle is there, he spends most of >his time correcting him. >No, Murray DETRACTS from F1 now. He used to be tolerable, but now >he is just damned annoying. >Time to retire Murray...... >Cheers.....Ken

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