Spa then and now

Looking at a circuit map of the modern Spa course (where they're running this weekend), I have a lot of trouble relating it to the old course of GPL. The turns in the starting line area are obviously the same (La Source, Eau Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old course. Did they just carry some of the names to the new track? What I'd really like to see is an overlay showing both courses so that I could figure this out. -- Doug Gordon (remove "nospam" from e-mail address)

:)

On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:32:22 -0400, "Doug Gordon" >Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened >considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but >it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old course. They just called turns of the new circuit with names related to the old ones. The present circuit is the same as the old one from the exit of the new Stavelot turn, to the end of the Kemmel straight, just before Les Combes (after Blanchimont the Bus Stop chicane was inserted). From Les Combes to Stavelot again, the track is completely different, and the total length is about the half of the old track. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Home-page : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7917 Il sito di ISF1mod : http://www.blissett.com/isf1/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------

An excellent way of seeing both the old and the new. Thanks for the URL, Bill. > >Looking at a circuit map of the modern Spa course (where they're running > >this weekend), I have a lot of trouble relating it to the old course of GPL. > >The turns in the starting line area are obviously the same (La Source, Eau > >Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened > >considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but > >it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old course. > >Did they just carry some of the names to the new track? What I'd really like > >to see is an overlay showing both courses so that I could figure this out. > This should answer any questions you have. http://terraserver.microsoft.com/GetPageByXY.asp?XId=8927&YId=13481&S... ImgDate=05/19/1992&ImgSize=1&DSize=2 > -- > | "Instead of letting the moon be the > Bill Mette | gateway to our future, we have let > Enteract, Chicago | it become a brief chapter in our -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

I was just thinkin the same thing! You saved me alot of typing... *g* Warlock!

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> Looking at a circuit map of the modern Spa course (where they're running > this weekend), I have a lot of trouble relating it to the old course of GPL. > The turns in the starting line area are obviously the same (La Source, Eau > Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened > considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but > it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old course. > Did they just carry some of the names to the new track? What I'd really like > to see is an overlay showing both courses so that I could figure this out. > -- > Doug Gordon > (remove "nospam" from e-mail address)

This is amazing! I want to see more! :) -- Rob Swindells 3rd equal in Goldline Bearing FFord Championship (18 Points); 9 points behind Championship Leader (as of round 4 of 6) "If you're a great driver, you will get through. It's not harder than any time before." ~Martin Brundle "If we could do this every week, we would be more consistent..." ~Bryan Robson (I think)

Cool, thanx! I just imagine the old track being driven by today's F1 cars. Now, that would be tension: Who survives the Masta kink entered with 370kph and who doesn't? :-) Peter Vienna, Austria http://terraserver.microsoft.com/GetPageByXY.asp?XId=8926&YId=13480&S...

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> ImgDate=05/19/1992&ImgSize=1&DSize=2 > > Looking at a circuit map of the modern Spa course (where they're running > > this weekend), I have a lot of trouble relating it to the old course of > GPL. > > The turns in the starting line area are obviously the same (La Source,

Eau > > Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened > > considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but > > it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old > course. > > Did they just carry some of the names to the new track? What I'd really > like > > to see is an overlay showing both courses so that I could figure this out. > > -- > > Doug Gordon > > (remove "nospam" from e-mail address)

I certainly can't take credit for the photo, but for a magnificent view from La Source, down to Eau Rouge and beyond, (taken in 1961), go to:- http://big.business.8m.com/Retro/Formula_1.htm#1.5 litre period The photo is split into a left and right hand side. Click on the thumbnails to see the full view. BK > On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:32:22 -0400, "Doug Gordon" > >Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened > >considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, but > >it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old course.

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> They just called turns of the new circuit with names related to the > old ones. The present circuit is the same as the old one from the exit > of the new Stavelot turn, to the end of the Kemmel straight, just > before Les Combes (after Blanchimont the Bus Stop chicane was > inserted). From Les Combes to Stavelot again, the track is completely > different, and the total length is about the half of the old track. > -- > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Home-page : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7917 > Il sito di ISF1mod : http://www.blissett.com/isf1/index.html > ---------------------------------------------------------------------

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Check out Microsofts Terraserver for a satellite view of Spa. You can clearly see the outline of the old and new circuits. http://terraserver.microsoft.com/GetPageByXY.asp?XId=8927&YId=13481&S... ImgDate=05/19/1992&ImgSize=2&DSize=2 don [|]-(_)-[|] >I certainly can't take credit for the photo, but for a magnificent view from >La Source, down to Eau Rouge and beyond, (taken in 1961), go to:- >http://big.business.8m.com/Retro/Formula_1.htm#1.5 litre period >The photo is split into a left and right hand side. Click on the thumbnails

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>to see the full view. >BK >> On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:32:22 -0400, "Doug Gordon" >> >Rouge, up to Les Combes). However, the course has been shortened >> >considerably. There are still turns there called Malmedy and Stavelot, >but >> >it sure seems like they can't be the same ones that were on the old >course. >> They just called turns of the new circuit with names related to the >> old ones. The present circuit is the same as the old one from the exit >> of the new Stavelot turn, to the end of the Kemmel straight, just >> before Les Combes (after Blanchimont the Bus Stop chicane was >> inserted). From Les Combes to Stavelot again, the track is completely >> different, and the total length is about the half of the old track. >> -- >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Home-page : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7917 >> Il sito di ISF1mod : http://www.blissett.com/isf1/index.html >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News

==---------- > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! >------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==-----

It's a slightly different thing to what you were asking, but I thought I'd just tell of one bit of GPL-and-now I saw this weekend.. I was lucky enough to be have tickets for Eau Rouge at Spa this weekend and I was in the "lower" grandstand near the bottom of the hill. Next to me was a stand enclosed by a brick wall. Looking at the shape I saw that this was the exact same enclosure as in GPL - I've hit it so many times :-) -- Cheers! Graeme Nash http://www.karisma1.demon.co.uk ICQ# 11257824 "Keyboard error or no keyboard attached. Press F1 for help"

Could you spot where the track used to turned sharp left at Eau Rouge into a hairpin? This should feature in 'Spirit of Speed's sim. Steve snip.. Looking at the shape I saw that

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>this was the exact same enclosure as in GPL - I've hit it so many times >:-) >-- >Cheers! >Graeme Nash >http://www.karisma1.demon.co.uk >ICQ# 11257824 >"Keyboard error or no keyboard attached. Press F1 for help"

On Mon, 30 Aug 1999 22:38:23 +0100, "Stephen Barnett" >Could you spot where the track used to turned sharp left at Eau Rouge into a >hairpin? This should feature in 'Spirit of Speed's sim. The original road is/was a U-turn serpentine corner which was or is called "virage du ancien douane" (old customs) or something. In an attempt to make the race track even faster, the uphill short cut of Eau Rouge was build AFAIK in the 1930s. Nowadays, the public road is split there: the uphill lane is like in the modern race track. But the downhill lane turns right on top of Eau Rouge (just where Zonta crashed), and passes behind the gravel trap and grandstands, then turns left and rejoins the race track in the bottom of Eau Rouge. Camera views showed the layout clearly during the race weekend. While driving through Eau Rouge when it's a public road, one can not enter Eau Rouge like a race driver, because the left side of the track is for the oncoming traffic rejoining the race track. In order to prevent amateur racers cutting the corner and causing severe head-on crashes, there are obstacles set up to separate the two lanes. But this even enhances the fun of driving through Eau Rouge in public traffic, as it makes the turn tighter, and more interesting at low speed. -- Matthias Flatt

If I've got this right, Burnville, Malmedy, Masta, and Stavelot are all names of the towns that the old Spa circuit linked. Sam Posey remarked on the Speedvision coverage Sunday that the track still has that feel of "going from place to place". But the new corners just use the familiar names from the old track. Looking at the satellite photo it's obvious they are quite some way from the actual towns now. Now if only someone would run real race cars there. -- Mark Jeangerard www.soundchaserweb.com New Mexico USA

: the Speedvision coverage Sunday that the track still has that feel of "going : from place to place". But the new corners just use the familiar names from : the old track. Looking at the satellite photo it's obvious they are quite : some way from the actual towns now. the obvious solution is to put up some cardboard and foam farmhouses around the circuit in little village-like clusters. Stephen

On Thu, 2 Sep 1999 03:49:15 -0600, "mark jeangerard" >Now if only someone would run real race cars there. I think the old track is too dangerous for today's cars, especially for that very long straights. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Home-page : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7917 Il sito di ISF1mod : http://www.blissett.com/isf1/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------