GPL..v1.1 patch D3D?..(specially for borut;)

Hoi, sorry borut...here goes your stress level again;) anyways...i read the readme on v1.1...looks promising. Any clues if it will do D3D? And when will it see the light of day? cheers, Dweezil

No D3D. I think we won't see it for much longer than the most of the group thinks. They ( Papy ) must still be doing something on the patch that's not in the readme.txt. Maybe it is your D3D :-) But don't get your hopes high! I buried mines a long time ago. Borut

Is funny that a game as new as GPL does not support D3D. 3Dfx does not rule the 3D world anymore.

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>Hoi, >sorry borut...here goes your stress level again;) >anyways...i read the readme on v1.1...looks promising. >Any clues if it will do D3D? >And when will it see the light of day? >cheers, >Dweezil

>Is funny that a game as new as GPL does not support D3D. 3Dfx does not rule >the 3D world anymore. ahhhh but at the time it was coded....D3d was a sad comparision to Glide efforts. D3d has made leaps and bounds, but the fact is, at the time the GPL project was in production, 2 V2 sli's were just comming out and were king of the hill. So now, to include D3d, might mean an entire code rewrite and feature set....that would be costly and time consuming....Probably better for the Eidos/Papyrus project planned in a few years... "Laura Croft is a Grand Prix Legend." two hardware accelerators will be needed.... dave henrie

Yes, glide is faster then D3D at that time. Today, it is not costly to setup a system with a celeron 300a to run at 450 MHz. With such a system running with any of the today's AGP cards--TNT, TNT2, G400, and V3 (V3 does not support AGP texturing)--and using D3D, there is little slow-down comparing with running in glide. In fact, you get better image quality using any of the above AGP cards except V3. Glide supports only 16bit color. With V3, it is 22bit filtered. I do hope Papyrus will get through with a D3D patch. Even the game Unreal first came out glide only. Now, it is fully D3D optimized.

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>>Is funny that a game as new as GPL does not support D3D. 3Dfx does not >rule >>the 3D world anymore. > ahhhh but at the time it was coded....D3d was a sad comparision to >Glide efforts. D3d has made leaps and bounds, but the fact is, at the >time the GPL project was in production, 2 V2 sli's were just comming >out and were king of the hill. > So now, to include D3d, might mean an entire code rewrite and >feature set....that would be costly and time consuming....Probably >better for the Eidos/Papyrus project planned in a few years... >"Laura Croft is a Grand Prix Legend." >two hardware accelerators will be needed.... >dave henrie

And GPL only uses 16-bit colors, hell the dashes were only 4-bit until someone did them in 16-bit (great work by the way). So how exactly would one benefit playing GPL with a card that supports 32-bit colors? Another victim of TNT2 hype. 32-bit rendering is only useful if the game supports it. Maybe next year it will be the standard but for now 32-bit colors, 256x256 textures, and 32 MB ram is TNT marketing hype especially for sim fans since most great sims don't waste valuable cpu resources on cutting 25 FPS I would chose 16-bit without a doubt. -- Joe Marques > Yes, glide is faster then D3D at that time. Today, it is not costly to > setup a system with a celeron 300a to run at 450 MHz. With such a system > running with any of the today's AGP cards--TNT, TNT2, G400, and V3 (V3 does > not support AGP texturing)--and using D3D, there is little slow-down > comparing with running in glide. In fact, you get better image quality > using any of the above AGP cards except V3. Glide supports only 16bit > color. With V3, it is 22bit filtered. I do hope Papyrus will get through > with a D3D patch. Even the game Unreal first came out glide only. Now, it > is fully D3D optimized. > >>Is funny that a game as new as GPL does not support D3D. 3Dfx does not > >rule > >>the 3D world anymore. > > ahhhh but at the time it was coded....D3d was a sad comparision to > >Glide efforts. D3d has made leaps and bounds, but the fact is, at the > >time the GPL project was in production, 2 V2 sli's were just comming > >out and were king of the hill. > > So now, to include D3d, might mean an entire code rewrite and > >feature set....that would be costly and time consuming....Probably > >better for the Eidos/Papyrus project planned in a few years... > >"Laura Croft is a Grand Prix Legend." > >two hardware accelerators will be needed.... > >dave henrie

Even though you use 16 bit color on a 32 bit supported video card, you still do get better image quality with a 16 bit supported game. I have a Voodoo 2 too and I see the difference--less of the wash-out effect. I also think that you believe in the 3Dfx excuse for not coming out with a new voodoo chip supporting 32 bit color--image quality vs performance or no games are supporting 32 bit or AGP texturing. :-) V3 is basically an overclocked Banshee.

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>And GPL only uses 16-bit colors, hell the dashes were only 4-bit until >someone did them in 16-bit (great work by the way). So how exactly would >one benefit playing GPL with a card that supports 32-bit colors? Another >victim of TNT2 hype. 32-bit rendering is only useful if the game supports >it. Maybe next year it will be the standard but for now 32-bit colors, >256x256 textures, and 32 MB ram is TNT marketing hype especially for sim >fans since most great sims don't waste valuable cpu resources on cutting >25 FPS I would chose 16-bit without a doubt. >-- >Joe Marques >> Yes, glide is faster then D3D at that time. Today, it is not costly to >> setup a system with a celeron 300a to run at 450 MHz. With such a system >> running with any of the today's AGP cards--TNT, TNT2, G400, and V3 (V3 >does >> not support AGP texturing)--and using D3D, there is little slow-down >> comparing with running in glide. In fact, you get better image quality >> using any of the above AGP cards except V3. Glide supports only 16bit >> color. With V3, it is 22bit filtered. I do hope Papyrus will get

through

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>> with a D3D patch. Even the game Unreal first came out glide only. Now, >it >> is fully D3D optimized. >> >>Is funny that a game as new as GPL does not support D3D. 3Dfx does not >> >rule >> >>the 3D world anymore. >> > ahhhh but at the time it was coded....D3d was a sad comparision to >> >Glide efforts. D3d has made leaps and bounds, but the fact is, at the >> >time the GPL project was in production, 2 V2 sli's were just comming >> >out and were king of the hill. >> > So now, to include D3d, might mean an entire code rewrite and >> >feature set....that would be costly and time consuming....Probably >> >better for the Eidos/Papyrus project planned in a few years... >> >"Laura Croft is a Grand Prix Legend." >> >two hardware accelerators will be needed.... >> >dave henrie

This is all true, but I can play GPL on my Voodoo3, you can't play GPL on your TNT2. I'll take playing GPL, over 32 bit color in QuakeIII anyday. The image quality on the Voodoo3 is better than the Voodoo2. I've had both.

does not rule Thats why GPL supports rendition also. Jesse

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>>Hoi, >>sorry borut...here goes your stress level again;) >>anyways...i read the readme on v1.1...looks promising. >>Any clues if it will do D3D? >>And when will it see the light of day? >>cheers, >>Dweezil

Creative Lab Unified driver? Or the glide wrapper? <G>

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>says... >>This is all true, but I can play GPL on my Voodoo3, you can't play >>GPL on your TNT2. >Uhhhh, wrong. >-- >========================================================= >Redneck Techno-Biker (Zerex12) > http://www.members.home.net/jms1/index.html >Barbarian Diecast Collector (370+ cars and counting) > http://members.home.net/jsimm/diecast_index.html >Internet Grand Prix Series Season 2 > http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html >North American Stockcar Racing Online Competition > http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html >Super X Philes > http://members.home.net/kap/superx/superx.html >If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown >above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame. >=========================================================

Sure. Downloaded already but a bit skeptical about the performance on a full race. I have a PII350 overclocked to 490 MHz with 192 MB of RAM and I do expect MOST games to run very smoothly on this system. My local computer store is selling the game for $19. A great buy.

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>>>says... >>>>This is all true, but I can play GPL on my Voodoo3, you can't play >>>>GPL on your TNT2. >>>Uhhhh, wrong. >>Creative Lab Unified driver? Or the glide wrapper? <G> >No. You ever heard of the OpenGL patch for GPL? >-- >========================================================= >Redneck Techno-Biker (Zerex12) > http://www.members.home.net/jms1/index.html >Barbarian Diecast Collector (370+ cars and counting) > http://members.home.net/jsimm/diecast_index.html >Internet Grand Prix Series Season 2 > http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html >North American Stockcar Racing Online Competition > http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html >Super X Philes > http://members.home.net/kap/superx/superx.html >If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown >above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame. >=========================================================

says... Uhhhh, wrong. -- ========================================================= Redneck Techno-Biker (Zerex12) http://www.members.home.net/jms1/index.html Barbarian Diecast Collector (370+ cars and counting) http://members.home.net/jsimm/diecast_index.html Internet Grand Prix Series Season 2 http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html North American Stockcar Racing Online Competition http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html Super X Philes http://members.home.net/kap/superx/superx.html If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame. =========================================================

I had a TNT card which supported 32-bit color (CL Riva TNT) and the 16-bit quality of that card is the same as the V3 3000 I currently own. At least 3dfx doesn't charge us an extra $75 for all these "must have" features that ironically aren't used by the large majority of game developers YET, and when they are the rage both the V3 and TNT2 will be old news. Pissing away cash for features that MAY be used in the next year or so is not my style. I bought a board that USES every ounce of horsepower it has today and my card is a waste of $ and power until V4 or TNT3 on a PIII 750.

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>>says... >>>This is all true, but I can play GPL on my Voodoo3, you can't play >>>GPL on your TNT2. >>Uhhhh, wrong. >Creative Lab Unified driver? Or the glide wrapper? <G>

No. You ever heard of the OpenGL patch for GPL? -- ========================================================= Redneck Techno-Biker (Zerex12) http://www.members.home.net/jms1/index.html Barbarian Diecast Collector (370+ cars and counting) http://members.home.net/jsimm/diecast_index.html Internet Grand Prix Series Season 2 http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html North American Stockcar Racing Online Competition http://www.paddedwall.org/igps2/igps2.html Super X Philes http://members.home.net/kap/superx/superx.html If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame. =========================================================

Want to make a bet? :) I CAN play GPL at 36fps at 1024x768 with most options turned on, detail setting just over half and with 15 or so cars with both the Hercules TNT2 Ultra and the Diamond Viper V770 (TNT2 Ultras). The OpenGL beta patch works just fine. Please, before you make statements like "you can't play GPL on your TNT2", make sure you actually are 100% positive you can not. Why of course, but 32 bit color with 32 bit textures and at 1024x768 Quake3 is a joy to behold even in the tech test state. And its damn fun blowing up friends and co-workers in. both. And the image quality is higher on the TNT2 Ultra than either, and I've have a 2 Voodoo2 in SLI, TNT, TNT2 Ultra and even for awhile a Voodoo3.

Uh what? I highly doubt that was Papyrus' thinking. I'd suspect they did rendition support because all they had experience with it and knew some of their client base would have rendition accelerators because of that.

No, sorry. TNT2/V3 probably wont be old news for at least 6 months or perhaps longer. Nvidia's next generation part has been pushed back til the spring of 2000 suposedly. Of course since it has T&L transforms in hardware which is completely new ground, there may be teething problems. 3dfx has to get up to par with the TNT2s and other chips in being able to support the standards such as AGP2x at the very least. Not to mention there are all sorts of games starting to come out that use the latest features. UT, Q3, Rage's new game that I can't remember the name of, etc. I'll try to remember that when I'm playing Q3 at 1024x768 in 32bit color and 32bit textures. Good thing we can all have our own opinions.

I had a TNT for awhile, I could only get GPL to work at 640x480 with the Open GL patch. Oh and by the way, have you tried that TNT2 with MGPRS2? MGPRS2 would not work at all with my TNT.

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> > Want to make a bet? :) I CAN play GPL at 36fps at 1024x768 with most > > options turned on, detail setting just over half and with 15 or so cars > with > > both the Hercules TNT2 Ultra and the Diamond Viper V770 (TNT2 Ultras). > The > > OpenGL beta patch works just fine. > I had a TNT for awhile, I could only get GPL to work at 640x480 with the > Open GL patch. > Oh and by the way, have you tried that TNT2 with MGPRS2? > MGPRS2 would not work at all with my TNT.

I have a Diamond Viper V330 4Mb PCI graphics card and Pentium II 233Mhz prosessor. Before the opengl patch I could play the game at 640x480 about 20fps when driving around alone. I had to turn literally all textures off for the game to be playable. In races fps dropped down a couple of fps. I also had the minimum number of trackside objects and only cars in mirrors. After I installed the opengl patch I could drive smoothly, because now I have 36fps on the straights. Fps drops a for some amount in turns, but not that much it would affect my driving. I can also do some racing now, but not with full field that is too much for the processor. Before the patch it was completely unplayble in races. I can also have some graphics turned on: for example tire textures, walls, the middle setting in trackside objects, in car graphics, some other I don't remember now, when I am driving alone. I have to turn off some grapchics, when I go to race, but it don't bother me, because I am so used driving in that detail. Anyway it is not the graphics why I am playin the game. Also I have to mention that now the sky isn't full of blocks (probably not the right word, but I am sure you know what I meaning of). Now it really looks like a sky. I can also use higher resolutions, but I prefer 640x480, because it is faster. It is like a totally new game for me now. I have now improved my times in all tracks. I am still not even close to the fastest guys out there (and probably will never be), but I enjoy a lot playing this game. If someone wants to know how fast I have driven here is my best Watkins Glen time, where I have driven the most, in Lotus 1.06.3. In Ferrari I have driven the track around in 1.06.4 thanks to Alison's wonderfull setup. I also want to mention that I drove all my fast laps with the basic setups that came with the game, because I don't have enough time and knowledge to create my own. Now I have beaten all my previos records driving with Ferrari except Watkins Glen and Monza. Previously I drove with Lotus, but Alison's setups changed that. When Alison gives setups for Lotus I probably start driving with it again. But for now on it is all Ferrari for me. I hope I didn't write too long message :-)

You can drive in other resolutions with TNT using the nVidia reference drivers 0.48.