GP3: Also a console version? Read this......

God I hope not! Would Geoff allow that? -- Cheers! Graeme Nash http://www.karisma1.demon.co.uk ICQ# 11257824 ________________________________________________________________________________ "There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" (Calvin & Hobbes)

Could be that like SCGT someone else is doing the console versions of GP3.

Why on Earth would you hope that? More of this elitist *** ***by any chance? As long as there's no dilution of effort then how can it be bad? If anything it increases the chances of a GP4. M

"Allow"??? He develops the initial PC version and it is then ported/converted to other platforms by others. "Allow" doesn't even enter the equation unless his contract with Hasbro defines the platforms on which the end result of his development work can be displayed. -- Best regards, Bruce. ====== The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet =============================================== >>multi-format >God I hope not! Would Geoff allow that? >-- >Cheers! >Graeme Nash >http://www.karisma1.demon.co.uk >ICQ# 11257824 >___________________________________________________________________________ _____ > "There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" > (Calvin & Hobbes)

Imagine GP2 ported to a Playstation: - Controls based on digital joypads - Low-res graphics - Max. 8 computer opponents - Maybe six to ten tracks at best - No advanced physics modelling (lesser setup options) If GP2 is almost impossible to port to PSX, how hard will GP3 be if it is nearly as much an improvement as promised? I mean as a *** realistic sim.

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>>Why on Earth would you hope that? More of this elitist *** ***by any >>chance? As long as there's no dilution of effort then how can it be bad? If >>anything it increases the chances of a GP4. >Imagine GP2 ported to a Playstation: >- Controls based on digital joypads >- Low-res graphics >- Max. 8 computer opponents >- Maybe six to ten tracks at best >- No advanced physics modelling (lesser setup options)

But, wasn't GP2 quite playable via the keyboard? GP2 sold over a million, and I would strongly suspect that less than 10% ever went NSA with a wheel (that was so hard!) and I wonder how few even got as far as turning off all the driving aids. It was a fun arcade game at simple levels with auto gears and SA. That would have translated well to a console, especially with even just better default car setups - didn't every track start with 10/10 wings? Wasn't it because it was written mostly in assembler? I hope that GP3 is in C or C++ with the graphics engine isolated (GC *cannot* write better graphics code than the might of 3dfx, Riva and Matrox combined) then a PSX, Dreamcast, etc, port becomes much easier. I think GPL has proved that *** sims don't sell, sadly :-( One of GP1/2's mass-market strengths is that you can hop into the car with the keyboard and drive round real modern tracks reasonably competently. Ken

What are they chances you'll see something like the following scenario. Crammond completes work on GP2 Gold. (I know you call it GP3 but it sounds more like an update than a re-write) Hasbro takes the completed sim and hands off the porting to other platforms to a crack team of fakers. They put out something that looks and maybe sounds like Gp2 gold and then swamp the other platforms with the rip-off. and example of this might be how EA handled SCGT. the playstation version was coded by a completly different group than the pc version. dave henrie -- On May 17, 1999 A Whale was killed off the coast of Washington State. The Whale was killed in the name of Tradition.....I say.... %&#& Tradition! >> >If GP2 is almost impossible to port to PSX, >> Wasn't it because it was written mostly in assembler? I hope that GP3 >> is in C or C++ with the graphics engine isolated (GC *cannot* write >> better graphics code than the might of 3dfx, Riva and Matrox combined) >> then a PSX, Dreamcast, etc, port becomes much easier. >Ive read a quote from Geoff about his assembler core, went something like >"ive spend 8 years of my life building on that base im not about to throw it >out and start again". I cant say im disapointed though.

Ive read a quote from Geoff about his assembler core, went something like "ive spend 8 years of my life building on that base im not about to throw it out and start again". I cant say im disapointed though.

If it was written in assembler, then why the hell is it so damn slow??? Maybe not anymore with hi-end computers, but anyway.. And don't blame the AI, the framerate is not much higher in practice either.. Tuffe

He's 'allowed' it before... remember this *really* old game on c64, spectrum, amiga, atari st? it was called stuntcar racer or something like that, about a race on a rollercoaster- type circuit only without the loops :( anyway, it was a geoff cramond-game more platforms means more money, so it'd be stupid not to go for that... Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

> If [GP2] was written in assembler, then why the hell is it so damn > slow??? Maybe not anymore with hi-end computers, but anyway.. > And don't blame the AI, the framerate is not much higher in practice > either.. GP2 has software-only 3D rendering: given that, it's really pretty fast! You've just been spoilt by 3D graphics cards! ;-)

>Imagine GP2 ported to a Playstation: >- Controls based on digital joypads Like a keyboard...? GP2 ran in low-res, and modern consoles have pretty good res (N64, PSX, PSX2). Why should that be? Most racers I've seen on consoles have more. Again, why? F1'97 had all of them. Probably most of the people who bought GP2 didn't even half of the setup options anyway. It might not push my buttons but I don't see why we should look down our noses at it. How dare they try to make money eh? The scoundrels! Cheers! John

On Wed, 2 Jun 1999 22:29:58 -0700, "ddjhenrie" > What are they chances you'll see something like the following >scenario. > Crammond completes work on GP2 Gold. >(I know you call it GP3 but it sounds more like an >update than a re-write) Wasn't GP2 not too much more than GP1 with a new GFX engine? Didn't it still have the phantom drafting, for instance? ISTR others mentioning other bugs and features that remained in the engine. I never really played too much of it as my poor computer could barely cope. I don't know what happened exactly with SCGT, but I do know that most ports are done by different teams or even totally different companies (I work with a couple of people who are ex-games company). But, do they just replace the graphics engine but only touch the core code lightly? Most games development now is in C or C++, so such action is very feasible. Ken

I think it has the best "non 3D acelerated" graphics ever made ... try GPL with software renderer :) McKafre De La Rosa

We're back to the age old problem of PC gamers thinking they're better than console gamers. Well I have a terrible shock for those of you who think like that, you're not. I play both PC and console games and I can't see any reason to cut any of the platforms out. They all offer different things and experiences I wouldn't get on the other. Would I have been able to enjoy Bushido Blade (1&2) on the PC, or Mario Kart 64 on the PC, or perhaps GoldenEye on the PC? No... these are all console only titles (lets not talk emulators here as they weren't created for emulators). Likewise, sims on the consoles are shallow so I stick to my PC. Why is there a constant need in the games "community" to insult other platforms? Hasbro are in business to make money, not to entertain us and as such I'd rather they made GP3 on every console, the Mac and the PC in order to keep the Grand Prix X line alive than make a really good game for one platform that never sells enough to warrant the expenditure again. M

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>>>Why on Earth would you hope that? More of this elitist *** ***by any >>>chance? As long as there's no dilution of effort then how can it be bad? If >>>anything it increases the chances of a GP4. >>Imagine GP2 ported to a Playstation: >>- Controls based on digital joypads >>- Low-res graphics >>- Max. 8 computer opponents >>- Maybe six to ten tracks at best >>- No advanced physics modelling (lesser setup options) >But, wasn't GP2 quite playable via the keyboard? GP2 sold over a >million, and I would strongly suspect that less than 10% ever went NSA >with a wheel (that was so hard!) and I wonder how few even got as far >as turning off all the driving aids. It was a fun arcade game at >simple levels with auto gears and SA. That would have translated well >to a console, especially with even just better default car setups - >didn't every track start with 10/10 wings?

What with GPL doing the rounds and you suggest that GP2 is difficult. I've got both and GPL makes GP2 feel like a sunday drive. Yes with all driving aids off. <snip> Yeah, but this ng is for those interested in 'real' driving sims, not arcade racers. So, for all our sakes, let's hope that GP3 is such a game otherwise its not something that's going to be top of my wish list. Whereas, if it has at least the level of realism as GP2 then I can't wait. -- Peter Ives

I don't think that's the case at all. For me, the only problem with consoles is that you can't get the 'proper' simulations that you can for the PC: Grand Prix 2, F1RS, MGP RS2, GPL etc. The best PC simulations never make it to consoles. I always assumed that this was because the game companies view console users as 'un-techy' people who would rather play something like Tekken 2... :-/ -- Richard. "Hey Jude, don't make it bad. Take a sad song and make it better."

Not down to the fact that the consoles don't have enough power? Check out the tech specs for a PSX some time and prepare to be staggered. The things they achieve with such low specs are astounding... As I said, I have access to both console and PC and use them differently. I've noticed that people who expect a console to be a PC (or vice versa) are always the ones disappointed, the people who recognise the strengths of both rarely are. M

Maybe impossible to port to PSX, but not to Dreamcast. After all Ubisoft is porting a version of MGPRS2 for Dreamcast. I'm sure thats what GP3 is being ported for.

> > For me, the only problem with consoles is that you can't get the > > 'proper' simulations that you can for the PC: Grand Prix 2, F1RS, MGP > > RS2, GPL etc. The best PC simulations never make it to consoles. > Not down to the fact that the consoles don't have enough power? No, I don't think so. Yes, but they are *built* for games, and nothing else. I expect the PSX hardware and software to be much more efficient at running games than, say, a PC. Look at TOCA 1 and TOCA 2 on the PSX. Now, 2 is a much better simulation, and has improved graphics. Surely, if, say, they didn't improve the graphics as much, they could have implemented better physics? Surely a PSX can do something like GP2? I'm not asking for something like MGP RS2, or GPL, but GP2 must be possible... Did you ever see the first version of Elite, running on a BBC Microcomputer in 1984?! -- Richard. "Love, love me do. You know I love you. I'll always be true."