More on NASCAR 2000 and GPL Engine

Jeff Downey's racing column, In the High Groove, deals with why NASCAR 2000 won't be using the GPL engine and why he feels it is a good thing. Here's the URL straight to the article: http://www.ga-sports.com/high_groove/052599/ Enjoy! -- Tony Wyss, Editor-in-Chief Gamers Alliance Sports www.ga-sports.com ------------------------------- Network Developer Gamers Alliance, Inc. www.gagames.com ------------------------------- "I'm not an athlete, I'm a baseball player" - John Kruk

I think he's wide of the mark but I can appreciate Sierras reasoning. However, I must say that even though I have bought every Papyrus racing sim since they came out with the one that started it all, I could not revert to a physics engine that is "less" than that in GPL. In other words, if Papyrus produce another NASCAR or CART, or even F1, simulation that is based on the N2 engine, then they have lost a customer. Not that the loss of my custom would send them into a hissy-fit, but my "driving enjoyment" benchmark is now GPL. Anything less would be pap. -- Best regards, Bruce. ====== The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet =============================================== >Jeff Downey's racing column, In the High Groove, deals with why NASCAR 2000 >won't be using the GPL engine and why he feels it is a good thing. Here's >the URL straight to the article: >http://www.ga-sports.com/high_groove/052599/ >Enjoy! >-- >Tony Wyss, Editor-in-Chief >Gamers Alliance Sports >www.ga-sports.com >------------------------------- >Network Developer >Gamers Alliance, Inc. >www.gagames.com >------------------------------- >"I'm not an athlete, I'm a baseball player" - John Kruk

Too bad he continually harps on the engine beneath GPL like its the cause of all the problems with being able to "jump in" and race in GPL. Yes, some of its the engine..but a lot of it is those damn lovable cars. So, maybe I'm still asleep this morning, but I hardly saw anything of substance in the article about WHY he feels its a good thing. Part of one paragraph doesn't do much for wanting to read the column more.

how about an option " enable GPL-like " on the Nascar2000 ? then you get both the arcade drivers as well as the hard core. The software is already there,,, just add the cherry on top, paint them with some of the god-awful colours and whaA-la, NASCAR2000 | Too bad he continually harps on the engine beneath GPL like its the cause of | all the problems with being able to "jump in" and race in GPL. Yes, some of | its the engine..but a lot of it is those damn lovable cars. | | So, maybe I'm still asleep this morning, but I hardly saw anything of | substance in the article about WHY he feels its a good thing. Part of one | paragraph doesn't do much for wanting to read the column more. | | > Jeff Downey's racing column, In the High Groove, deals with why NASCAR | 2000 | > won't be using the GPL engine and why he feels it is a good thing. Here's

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| > the URL straight to the article: | > http://www.ga-sports.com/high_groove/052599/ | > | > Enjoy! | | | |

Bruce make that three of us on what you said about GPL. Steve!

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> Make that two of us.... > I totally agree with all your points here Bruce. > I have tried to go back to Nascar2, ICR2, GP2, etc. all of which i used > to enjoy and spend too many hours on, but the only sim i now have on my > computer is GPL, the rest, as far as i am conerned, just don't cut it > anymore. > So i guess Papy will go bust now without my continued support on their > new non-gpl physics based sims. :) > Cheers, > Ron > > I think he's wide of the mark but I can appreciate Sierras reasoning. > > However, I must say that even though I have bought every Papyrus > racing sim > > since they came out with the one that started it all, I could not > revert to > > a physics engine that is "less" than that in GPL. > > In other words, if Papyrus produce another NASCAR or CART, or even > F1, > > simulation that is based on the N2 engine, then they have lost a > customer. > > Not that the loss of my custom would send them into a hissy-fit, but > my > > "driving enjoyment" benchmark is now GPL. Anything less would be > pap. > > -- > > Best regards, > > Bruce. > > ====== > > The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! > > http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet

I couldn't agree more. I own EVERY Papy sim ever made! I raced those sims off and on daily for years after I bought them. I have not raced ONE since getting GPL. I just have no interest what-so-ever in driving old, worn out, unrealistic sims. As far as I'm concerned they will not get another dollar of mine until they produce something that builds upon the last program I purchased. The internet and computers are a totally unique business where people are fascinated by the NEW things they see and learn and purchase EVERYDAY. Papy will lose big time if they start offering old technology. What a total bummer Chris

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>I think he's wide of the mark but I can appreciate Sierras reasoning. >However, I must say that even though I have bought every Papyrus racing sim >since they came out with the one that started it all, I could not revert to >a physics engine that is "less" than that in GPL. >In other words, if Papyrus produce another NASCAR or CART, or even F1, >simulation that is based on the N2 engine, then they have lost a customer. >Not that the loss of my custom would send them into a hissy-fit, but my >"driving enjoyment" benchmark is now GPL. Anything less would be pap. >-- >Best regards, >Bruce. >====== >The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! >http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet >=============================================== >>Jeff Downey's racing column, In the High Groove, deals with why NASCAR

2000

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>>won't be using the GPL engine and why he feels it is a good thing. Here's >>the URL straight to the article: >>http://www.ga-sports.com/high_groove/052599/ >>Enjoy! >>-- >>Tony Wyss, Editor-in-Chief >>Gamers Alliance Sports >>www.ga-sports.com >>------------------------------- >>Network Developer >>Gamers Alliance, Inc. >>www.gagames.com >>------------------------------- >>"I'm not an athlete, I'm a baseball player" - John Kruk

Well, I think I was misrepresented here a bit. I don't think Papy reverting to the tired NASCAR 2 engine is a good thing. If you read my column again you'll notice that I never stated such. My point with the entire article was that this was not merely a computer horsepower issue, this was a sales based decision. I'll agree that the "loveable" cars in GPL do contribute to them being a bit more difficult to drive, but the physics engine has a lot more influence. My daily columns are my opinions based upon facts as I know them. I know that I'm not always right. In this case, perhaps my speculation is dead wrong. But, my job is to provide an entertaining column that hopefully, sparks some thought every now and then. I thank you all for reading the column, and appreciate all of the feedback. Feel freee to contact me at any time. I love a healthy debate. Thanks, Jeff Downey **** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****

Make that two of us.... I totally agree with all your points here Bruce. I have tried to go back to Nascar2, ICR2, GP2, etc. all of which i used to enjoy and spend too many hours on, but the only sim i now have on my computer is GPL, the rest, as far as i am conerned, just don't cut it anymore. So i guess Papy will go bust now without my continued support on their new non-gpl physics based sims. :) Cheers, Ron

> I couldn't agree more. I own EVERY Papy sim ever made! I raced those sims > off and on daily for years after I bought them. I have not raced ONE since > getting GPL. I just have no interest what-so-ever in driving old, worn out, > unrealistic sims. Agree, and so do I..:) (heck, even got N1, track pack on disks + N1 with track pack on Cd..lol!) I am holding out, if they release N2000 in Norway I will probably get it to support them, racing it depends on how good it is! Agree again, but I see no point in even trying to run N3 on my current 6-month old config (PII333, Banshee 16MB..etc)..and I can't yet afford an upgrade. Unless Papy sends a free PIV or whatever 1000 MHZ chip with N3 :-) So...why don't they give us something "less" CPU demanding in the meantime...CanAM legends, 1971 Sportscars... <vbg> Matt -- Matthew Birger Knutsen Cheek Racing Cars http://www.cheekracing.electra.no

Jeff, My criticism was not aimed at you, but simply at Sierra **IF** they proceed with the decision. I would be willing to queue for a good NASCAR, CART or F1 simulation (by Papyrus, of course) if a physics engine derived from that in GPL is used. All I was stating was that I could not take a step backwards and buy a new product based on an old "core" if that is the decision made by Sierra. -- Best regards, Bruce. ====== The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet =============================================== >Well, I think I was misrepresented here a bit. I don't think Papy reverting >to the tired NASCAR 2 engine is a good thing. If you read my column again >you'll notice that I never stated such. >My point with the entire article was that this was not merely a computer >horsepower issue, this was a sales based decision. >I'll agree that the "loveable" cars in GPL do contribute to them being a bit >more difficult to drive, but the physics engine has a lot more influence. >My daily columns are my opinions based upon facts as I know them. I know >that I'm not always right. In this case, perhaps my speculation is dead >wrong. But, my job is to provide an entertaining column that hopefully, >sparks some thought every now and then. >I thank you all for reading the column, and appreciate all of the feedback. >Feel freee to contact me at any time. I love a healthy debate. >Thanks, >Jeff Downey >**** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****

(snip) So...why don't they give us something "less" CPU demanding in the meantime...CanAM legends, 1971 Sportscars... <vbg> (unsnip) Ooooooh YE-E-E-E-AH!!! (Said in the voice of Harry from "3rd. Rock from the Sun") -- Best regards, Bruce. ====== The Stunned Mullet........seriously satirical stuff! http://welcome.to/the_stunned_mullet ===============================================

<snipped> Jeff, A point I might disagree with you on is the fact that sales of GPL were a major disappointment. Anybody with a sense of current mainstream game buyer/player tendencies would know that sales of GPL were not going to be stellar. GPL is too sophisticated for the US market. Coopers, Gurneys, Loti?? Say what? I would have thought that the main buyer interest for that title would have been the European countries with limited *** interest in the US. I would think that Papy knew this. The only legitimate racing title (away from the need for speed genre) that is going to sell a ton in the US at least is Nascar related. Lowest common denominator, pure and simple. I rather see that GPL was a way to showcase the technology, recoup some investment and lay the foundation for future products as the hardware catches up. Eventually the hardware will handle 40 car fields and the Nascar game can be made. Graphic engines may need to be upgraded but physcis doesn't change. In the meantime, maybe they will build some other versions of GPL to keep the spark alive. Jeff

I think I could have guarenteed a few thousand more sales.....if.... If Sierra's parent company hadn't been going down the financial toilet, they could have advertised on Speedvision's premiere showing of Grand Prix. Think how many 40+ year old guys would have run out the next day to find that racing game that was "just like" their favorite racing movie? -- On May 17, 1999 A Whale was killed off the coast of Washington State. The Whale was killed in the name of Tradition.....I say.... %&#& Tradition! ><snipped> >Jeff, >A point I might disagree with you on is the fact that sales of GPL >were a major disappointment

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> I couldn't agree more. I own EVERY Papy sim ever made! I raced those sims > off and on daily for years after I bought them. I have not raced ONE since > getting GPL. I just have no interest what-so-ever in driving old, worn out, > unrealistic sims. As far as I'm concerned they will not get another dollar > of mine until they produce something that builds upon the last program I > purchased. > The internet and computers are a totally unique business where people are > fascinated by the NEW things they see and learn and purchase EVERYDAY. Papy > will lose big time if they start offering old technology. What a total > bummer > Chris

What's the point if you pc can't run it at an acceptable speed? Can you say with honesty that GPL runs max out and runs silky smooth on your pc? If it's the case, how many people can make the same claim? Certainly not the average gamer. We are are the elite of sim racing (meaning we are willing to spend time and money on this hobby (or lifestyle?)). Also, I will certainly take any game made by Papyrus, if it means I don't have to wait 2 years for any good stock car game. We know that N2 engine proved itself in the past. If they update it, I still think it's better than not having anything to play with! I certainly would not like it if the only other game I can play is another Nascar Revolution from EA Sports. Philster

tsk tsk... We all know there is more chances we see a Sierra Sports : Bull Riding adverti***t during the movie Grand Prix than this 8) Will they ever do "Bull Riding Legends" ? "Back in 1968, they changed the rules of Bull Riding because of the dangers of the sport of the previous year. Welcome to 1967" -- -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard/Nas-Frank> -- NROS Nascar sanctioned Guide http://www.nros.com/ -- SimRacing Online http://www.simracing.com/ -- Official mentally retarded guy of r.a.s. -- May the Downforce be with you... "People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

ROTF!!!!! Good one! How about this! "We give you more bull than any other software company!" buzard

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> > If Sierra's parent company hadn't been going down the > > financial toilet, they could have advertised on Speedvision's > > premiere showing of Grand Prix. Think how many 40+ year old > > guys would have run out the next day to find that racing game > > that was "just like" their favorite racing movie? > tsk tsk... > We all know there is more chances we see a Sierra Sports : Bull Riding > adverti***t during the movie Grand Prix than this 8) > Will they ever do "Bull Riding Legends" ? > "Back in 1968, they changed the rules of Bull Riding because of the dangers > of the sport of the previous year. Welcome to 1967" > -- > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard/Nas-Frank> > -- NROS Nascar sanctioned Guide http://www.nros.com/ > -- SimRacing Online http://www.simracing.com/ > -- Official mentally retarded guy of r.a.s. > -- May the Downforce be with you... > "People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise > how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."