Viper Racing demo setups and another first impression

I guess I have a better setup cause my best lap is in the 1:00 :o). It doesn't need any countersteering :o). Bump 40 30 Rebound 70 60 Springs 90 80 Antiroll 90 70 Toe In 0.3 0.0 Camber -1.0 -0.7 Ride Height 5.0" 5.9" Brake Bias 65 35 Wheel Lock 25 Spoilers 80 100 Final Drive 4.30 Gears default First impression of the Viper demo. It's definitely a simulation. An odd thing was as mentioned before the large track size making the cars look small and the speed sensation nonexistent. I noticed the little bars showing how the setup changes changed the car handling towards understeer or oversteer. I also noticed that the more negative front camber I had the more the little red bar increased into the oversteer area, this made me to believe that max negative front camber would give me maximum front grip. I was pleased to find that the car understeered with that amount of negative camber :o). It also seemed as if the replays were resimulated. I noticed this when viewing a race. I drove straight into a sign during the race, bent the sign and the car stopped on the sign. In the replay the sign was already bent and when my car hit it, it went straight over it into the field behind, thus I suspect the replays are resimulated, cause the car didn't do that when I drove it :o). Resimulating in replays is the way to go in my opinion, cause it means very small replay files, see GP2, which also resimulated the replays. Also see GPL, which dont resimulate the replays. /Christer -- [link lost in import: /~w-41236/] (Read all about the "Global online racing"-proposal under "For developers". Read it a couple of times, cause noone has understood it the first time they've read it yet :o))

Quoted text (8 lines)

>It also seemed as if the replays were resimulated. I noticed this when viewing a >race. I drove straight into a sign during the race, bent the sign and the car >stopped on the sign. In the replay the sign was already bent and when my car hit >it, it went straight over it into the field behind, thus I suspect the replays >are resimulated, cause the car didn't do that when I drove it :o). Resimulating >in replays is the way to go in my opinion, cause it means very small replay >files, see GP2, which also resimulated the replays. Also see GPL, which dont >resimulate the replays.

I don't think this is such a great idea. You mention the problem yourself: resimulating can give you an "alternative reality." If it only affects the way you destroyed your car, it doesn't matter too much. But it could be worse. Imagine you *almost* wrecked your car in the race, but managed to escape somehow and won the race. Now, when you watch yourself in the replay, you see yourself crashing because one of many parameters isn't exactly the same. I hate when that happens. One game that suffered a lot from this "feature" was _TIE Fighter_. The replay file there consists of your own ship's actions exclusively, whereas the AI ships are resimulated. I often saw my ship going to pieces in the replay since the enemy ships weren't exactly in the same spot they were in "reality", because of a slightly upset timing due to a HDD access or something. Annoying, to say the least. -- Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

> I guess I have a better setup cause my best lap is in the 1:00 :o). It doesn't > need any countersteering :o). that was pretty interesting to look at your setup and see the differences. first thing that it said to me was "Grant, you need to use a lot more wings to get anywhere!" so i said "ok, i'll try that" and it worked :) I still haevn't actually *tried* your setup however - was too busy experimenting with mine:) i think mine suits my driving style fine - to be honest i almost never ever actually try anyone elses setups even in all the other sims i have. But i am happy to look at other setups or discuss them to get ideas and talk about the logic behind the settings people have, etc. I'm down to 59.55s for a lap now - the car is getting even better and better to drive:) in fact, i can't tell the difference between the feel of the car in full Sim mode compared to Intermediate mode. Not sure just how much speed is left to be gained from the setup - probably just need to improve driving style now. in case you're curious, here's my latest setup. Bump 45 23 Rebound 75 45 Springs 67 53 Antiroll 75 85 Toe In 0.1 0.3 Camber -1.4 -0.3 Ride Height 5.2" 5.9" Brake Bias 75 25 Wheel Lock 16 Spoilers 100 90 Final Drive 4.00 Gears default Biggest difference now is the Spoiler settings. I've dialed out a lot of the understeer i had in my previous setup too. (ps: Roger, i don't post a setup file because I don't think there are individual setup files to use in that way. these setups are not so complicated that it won't take just a minute to enter, anyway) This is a very entertaining sim so far - well, mainly due to the real fun it is to build setups:) the car has such a responsive feel to it that you can feel the results of even the most subtle of setup alterations.

Has anyone run the benchmark in the sim to see what sort of frame rates they are getting, just curious? > > I guess I have a better setup cause my best lap is in the 1:00 :o). It doesn't > > need any countersteering :o).

i have it set to get around 35fps. that should be about enough fps to drive well. it gives surprisingly good performance on my p233mmx with Pure3D.

I got 29 fps when I ran it. Doug Doug.........Lifelong die hard Boston Bruins fan....Driving Sim racer....avid Sam Adams drinker....3 Stooges fan....Proud American !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm getting 35fps on my AMD-266 with Pure3D and all details on and at full... Not bad. Must be a decent engine...

Grant, dont you have GPL yet :o)??? /Christer

Quoted text (45 lines)

> > I guess I have a better setup cause my best lap is in the 1:00 :o). It doesn't > > need any countersteering :o). > that was pretty interesting to look at your setup and see the > differences. first thing that it said to me was "Grant, you need > to use a lot more wings to get anywhere!" so i said "ok, i'll try that" > and it worked :) I still haevn't actually *tried* your setup however - > was too busy experimenting with mine:) i think mine suits my driving > style fine - to be honest i almost never ever actually try anyone > elses setups even in all the other sims i have. But i am happy to > look at other setups or discuss them to get ideas and talk about the > logic behind the settings people have, etc. > I'm down to 59.55s for a lap now - the car is getting even better and > better to drive:) in fact, i can't tell the difference between the > feel of the car in full Sim mode compared to Intermediate mode. Not > sure just how much speed is left to be gained from the setup - probably > just need to improve driving style now. > in case you're curious, here's my latest setup. > Bump 45 23 > Rebound 75 45 > Springs 67 53 > Antiroll 75 85 > Toe In 0.1 0.3 > Camber -1.4 -0.3 > Ride Height 5.2" 5.9" > Brake Bias 75 25 > Wheel Lock 16 > Spoilers 100 90 > Final Drive 4.00 > Gears default > Biggest difference now is the Spoiler settings. I've dialed out a lot > of the understeer i had in my previous setup too. > (ps: Roger, i don't post a setup file because I don't think there > are individual setup files to use in that way. these setups are > not so complicated that it won't take just a minute to enter, > anyway) > This is a very entertaining sim so far - well, mainly due to the > real fun it is to build setups:) the car has such a responsive > feel to it that you can feel the results of even the most subtle of > setup alterations.

I gotta agree. Viper is very fun. And just for everyones info, I have received an email from a Viper programmer; the sense of speed is their number one concern right now.

> Grant, dont you have GPL yet :o)??? No, I don't. It's not out here in New Zealand yet and I don't have any warez versions either. Hence the reason I'm giving this Viper demo a good run (an hour or two a day) :) It's really quite enjoyable fiddling with the setups - you really can feel the very subtle differences to car behaviour due to any change at all. Down to 59.24s now. :) I suspect this Viper demo has pretty much been lost and buried under the GPL release. It's a shame it wasn't released even just 1 week earlier.