GPL thoughts

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> However, this version isn't the final. Maybe close, but definitly not the > version I'll be buying in the store shorty (I hope!). I did notice a few cars > "spinning" in the air after an accident more than a few times (The damn things > where just*** in the air spinning, very odd to see when your trying to > concentrate on the Curve Grande :) Also the engines didn't seem to smoke or > catch fire. I crashed really hard many times, and unlike the demo, i've yet to > see a car catch fire. All, in all, this isn't the final version, so i'll bet > this is fixed.

Maybe you had damage off... hmmm...

Today I saw a german videofilm with over 100 crashes from the Ring, made by a amateur-filmer in the 70s. He had been filming tha same sharp left bend every saturday in almost 10 year. On sundays the public could probably try the track themself, because every car I saw was a standard car! (No racecars!) That bend was as you described, a 1st gear corner on a small crest and probalbly blind to. Most of the drivers came to fast and flipped over in the sandtrap, or spun on the road. So I understand you, when you say that the track can be tricky. On the worst sunday, there was five crashed cars left at the corner when the track closed! Many of the "racedrivers" seemed to be tourists. How I know that? Well, there was bags, jackets, beercans and a lot of other stuff flying out of the windows when the cars rolled. And often there where three passengers in the car too! And without seatbelts......(The 70s you remember.) It was rather funny to see what kind of cars they where driving: Volkswagen (Beetle), Renault Gordini, BMC Cooper, Opel Kadett Rally, Porche 911 and 914, Mercedes Benz, Hillman Imperial (I think), Ford Capri and a lot of other cars I dont remember right now. / Masse PS. No one was seriously hurt and excuse my english.

It is more than likely the corner that you are talking about is called Adenauer Forst, which is approached from Fuchsrohre very quickly. The reason everyone was crashing was/is because the instinctive line for the 'chicane' tightens so much more than expected. I should know... I had to jump the kerbing when I went round the Nordschleife a bit too enthusiastically for the first time in my stock Toyota Starlet a couple of months ago!! <g> I can't wait for GPL to re-live a lap of the ring. Even in a crappy 1.2 Starlet, 50hp and with 3 people in the car, the track is faster, steeper, tighter and more insane than you can possibly imagine. The fact that people have raced F1 cars there just blows my mind! The track is quite simply awe-inspiring, and I drove around the newer circuit that they flattened out a bit in 1972 to remove a lot of the jumps! And I'm still waiting for Alison's report of the Papyrus Cup Race at the 'ring..... :) Pete Tabram

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>Today I saw a german videofilm with over 100 crashes from the Ring, made by >a amateur-filmer in the 70s. He had been filming tha same sharp left bend >every saturday in almost 10 year. On sundays the public could probably try >the track themself, because every car I saw was a standard car! (No >racecars!) >That bend was as you described, a 1st gear corner on a small crest and >probalbly blind to. Most of the drivers came to fast and flipped over in >the sandtrap, or spun on the road. So I understand you, when you say that >the track can be tricky. On the worst sunday, there was five crashed cars >left at the corner when the track closed! >Many of the "racedrivers" seemed to be tourists. How I know that? Well, >there was bags, jackets, beercans and a lot of other stuff flying out of >the windows when the cars rolled. And often there where three passengers in >the car too! And without seatbelts......(The 70s you remember.) >It was rather funny to see what kind of cars they where driving: Volkswagen >(Beetle), Renault Gordini, BMC Cooper, Opel Kadett Rally, Porche 911 and >914, Mercedes Benz, Hillman Imperial (I think), Ford Capri and a lot of >other cars I dont remember right now. >/ Masse >PS. No one was seriously hurt and excuse my english.

Yes, the corner is called Adenauer Forst. I just didnt remember the spelling of it.... /Masse

On 9 Sep 98 22:58:20 GMT, "Masse" >Today I saw a german videofilm with over 100 crashes from the Ring, made by >a amateur-filmer in the 70s. He had been filming tha same sharp left bend >every saturday in almost 10 year. On sundays the public could probably try >the track themself, because every car I saw was a standard car! (No >racecars!) You can still do that today. It costs around DM15 (AFAI remember) to lap the Ring, and it takes about a quarter of an hour for a non-expert. It's also ***y scary because you get a lot of people in Porsches etc which have been many times, and even more complete nutters on motorbikes - both of these come up behind you REAL fast and muscle their way past. That means you have to spend a heck of a lot of time watching your mirrors when really the road ahead takes up 100% of your time. I never drove myself, not being insured for any cars there, but I was driven round and it as an amazing experience, and one which I'd recommend to anyone visiting the area. You can do the same at both Hockenheim and Spa (both of which I tried), and probably other circuits around Europe also. Cheers! John

I'd like to order 1-Spa, with a bit o' Hockenheim on the side to go, please! =) Marc > You can do the same at both > Hockenheim and Spa (both of which I tried) -- Marc J. Nelson The Sim Project - http://www.simproject.com * No animals were harmed in the making of this e-mail *

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> You can still do that today. It costs around DM15 (AFAI remember) to > lap the Ring, and it takes about a quarter of an hour for a > non-expert. It's also ***y scary because you get a lot of people in > Porsches etc which have been many times, and even more complete > nutters on motorbikes - both of these come up behind you REAL fast and > muscle their way past. That means you have to spend a heck of a lot of > time watching your mirrors when really the road ahead takes up 100% of > your time. > I never drove myself, not being insured for any cars there, but I was > driven round and it as an amazing experience, and one which I'd > recommend to anyone visiting the area. You can do the same at both > Hockenheim and Spa (both of which I tried), and probably other > circuits around Europe also.

Spa sounds fun, Hockenheim in a roadcar doesn`t, unless it`s a _really_ fast one Have you tried the "Renn-Taxi" John ? A couple of years back _I_ did, I`m still smiling Being driven around the track in a BMW M5 (mostly stock, I belive) with a driver that _knows_ the circuit, boy was that something, I mean those guys on something-RRR superbikes couldn`t get out of the way quick enough when we appeared in their mirrors, man I wish I had a Video Camera back then, it cost about 75 DM for the 3 of us, some of the best money I`ve spent :-), highly recommended for anyone who get`s a chance to visit this track Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy UncleGoy on TEN

AFAIK, you CAN NOT drive the entire Spa track.. Part of it is public roads, and part of it is track-only. I know for a fact that the main road carries you from La-Source, through Eau-Rouge.. but I believe it swings off at La Combe. I may be wrong about this.. it was probably 12 or 13 years ago when I was there. I know the section before La Source has to be public road because there were a couple of houses along it.. doktorB http://webhome.idirect.com/~drbryan/gpl For the GPL track files, FAQs (I've got them!), installation help, release date updates, poll-of-the week, pictures, and more! btw, Nurburgring is fantastic.. BEAU-T-FUL .. that's all I can say.

It cost me DM23 this July per lap. Should have cost DM18, but our german was so bad we got a motorcycle ticket by accident! Ring taxi would have been too scary, if my 1st lap round the ring was anything to go by... passenger in your own car, sitting in the back watching both the track ahead, and the motorcycles and Porsches coming up behind, while a nutter of a mate trys to do a 6min lap in a Starlet... (13min in the end!) Pete Tabram >On 9 Sep 98 22:58:20 GMT, "Masse" >>Today I saw a german videofilm with over 100 crashes from the Ring, made by

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>>a amateur-filmer in the 70s. He had been filming tha same sharp left bend >>every saturday in almost 10 year. On sundays the public could probably try >>the track themself, because every car I saw was a standard car! (No >>racecars!) >You can still do that today. It costs around DM15 (AFAI remember) to >lap the Ring, and it takes about a quarter of an hour for a >non-expert. It's also ***y scary because you get a lot of people in >Porsches etc which have been many times, and even more complete >nutters on motorbikes - both of these come up behind you REAL fast and >muscle their way past. That means you have to spend a heck of a lot of >time watching your mirrors when really the road ahead takes up 100% of >your time. >I never drove myself, not being insured for any cars there, but I was >driven round and it as an amazing experience, and one which I'd >recommend to anyone visiting the area. You can do the same at both >Hockenheim and Spa (both of which I tried), and probably other >circuits around Europe also. >Cheers! >John

Yes, you CAN. (So there) :-) A lot of Spa is public roads, but they close the circuit for some race weekends and it is closed off for ONE weekend per year to allow anyone to drive the circuit. You get everything from minis to Jags blasting round and it's great fun! Cheers! John

John Wallace wrote Hmm Spa, how interesting it would be.... There is a trick at Montreal to sneak up into the Montreal Formula 1 track... Let me say that racing there in a Volvo 850 T at the small hours of the night is just incredible. You have around 80% of the track to race since the last part is the entrance to the *** (but still there is a possible "loop track" and the 20% is just the boring hairpin at the east of the track. There is also a way to sneak up at Mt-Tremblant raceway (old F1 track, incredible but too dangerous for F1) at night, on a little dirt road heh. Oh, and you just can't imagine the numbers of spins I did there when racing in a track covered by snow ;) - Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> Good race at the Brickyard! - Official Mentally retarded guy of r.a.s. - Excuse me for my English (I'm French speaking) - Sponsored by http://www.awpss.com/ - "People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."--

Cool.. sounds like a fun day.. doktorB (just for you John... no URL advertising my web site!!) If you want to visit my GPL page.. you'll have to look at one of my messages elsewhere!! >A lot of Spa is public roads, but they close the circuit for some race >weekends and it is closed off for ONE weekend per year to allow anyone >to drive the circuit. You get everything from minis to Jags blasting >round and it's great fun!

Down here, the Mount Panorama circuit at Bathurst (site of the 1000 km race each year) is also public road. However, there is no charge to drive around it.

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> I'd like to order 1-Spa, with a bit o' Hockenheim on the side to go, > please! =) > Marc > > You can do the same at both > > Hockenheim and Spa (both of which I tried) > -- > Marc J. Nelson > The Sim Project - http://www.simproject.com > * No animals were harmed in the making of this e-mail *

-- Regards, Bruce. ---------- The GP Legends Historic Motor Racing Club is located at:- http://www.netspeed.com.au/brucek/legends/

Yes pete, I seem to recall nearly doing the same the lap before when i was driving your car, I did warn you to slow down...:o) Robin.

where can you get hold of this vid? Robin

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>On 9 Sep 98 22:58:20 GMT, "Masse" >>Today I saw a german videofilm with over 100 crashes from the Ring, made by >>a amateur-filmer in the 70s. He had been filming tha same sharp left bend >>every saturday in almost 10 year. On sundays the public could probably try >>the track themself, because every car I saw was a standard car! (No >>racecars!) >You can still do that today. It costs around DM15 (AFAI remember) to >lap the Ring, and it takes about a quarter of an hour for a >non-expert.

That was my aim, too. Didn't quite make it, though... I believe some car and tire companies do some of their test driving there, too. I remember seeing a (then about to be released) 928 S4 sweeping through the Adenauer Forst after I had my car crashed there. The guy in the Porsche was fast... It's amazing what adrenaline can do to your memory - I still have the most vivid pictures of that day in my mind. No matter how much upgrades my computer will need to run GPL properly, it will be cheaper than *that* experience. ;) Neither is there an insurance for the guard rails. But they are reasonably priced: 40 meters go for DM 800,- (back in '86, that is.) -- Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

>It is more than likely the corner that you are talking about is called >Adenauer Forst, which is approached from Fuchsrohre very quickly. The reason >everyone was crashing was/is because the instinctive line for the 'chicane' >tightens so much more than expected. I should know... I had to jump the >kerbing when I went round the Nordschleife a bit too enthusiastically for >the first time in my stock Toyota Starlet a couple of months ago!! <g> This sounds so familiar. Replace "months" with "years", "Starlet" with "Celica" and "jump the kerbing" with "hit the guard rails", and you got my story. :) Ditto. -- Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

Wow! Oh no! Ah well, I guess I'll just have to get over it and try to move on with my life... Cheers! John

I think the bikers must have been cursing me for the amount of sand I deposited on the track; still at least it was'nt oil and metal shards hey Wolfgang ;-) Pete Tabram >>It is more than likely the corner that you are talking about is called >>Adenauer Forst, which is approached from Fuchsrohre very quickly. The reason >>everyone was crashing was/is because the instinctive line for the 'chicane'

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>>tightens so much more than expected. I should know... I had to jump the >>kerbing when I went round the Nordschleife a bit too enthusiastically for >>the first time in my stock Toyota Starlet a couple of months ago!! <g> >This sounds so familiar. Replace "months" with "years", "Starlet" with >"Celica" and "jump the kerbing" with "hit the guard rails", and you >got my story. :) >>I can't wait for GPL to re-live a lap of the ring. Even in a crappy 1.2 >>Starlet, 50hp and with 3 people in the car, the track is faster, steeper, >>tighter and more insane than you can possibly imagine. The fact that

people >>have raced F1 cars there just blows my mind! The track is quite simply >>awe-inspiring, and I drove around the newer circuit that they flattened out

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>>a bit in 1972 to remove a lot of the jumps! >>And I'm still waiting for Alison's report of the Papyrus Cup Race at the >>'ring..... :) >Ditto. >-- >Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

cancellation warned.

Er... I DID slow down. Just not enough.... Pete

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>Yes pete, I seem to recall nearly doing the same the lap before when i was >driving your car, I did warn you to slow down...:o) >Robin. >> It is more than likely the corner that you are talking about is called >> Adenauer Forst, which is approached from Fuchsrohre very quickly. The >reason >> everyone was crashing was/is because the instinctive line for the >'chicane' >> tightens so much more than expected. I should know... I had to jump the >> kerbing when I went round the Nordschleife a bit too enthusiastically for >> the first time in my stock Toyota Starlet a couple of months ago!! <g> >> I can't wait for GPL to re-live a lap of the ring. Even in a crappy 1.2 >> Starlet, 50hp and with 3 people in the car, the track is faster, >steeper, >> tighter and more insane than you can possibly imagine. The fact that >people >> have raced F1 cars there just blows my mind! The track is quite simply >> awe-inspiring, and I drove around the newer circuit that they flattened >out >> a bit in 1972 to remove a lot of the jumps! >> And I'm still waiting for Alison's report of the Papyrus Cup Race at the >> 'ring..... :) >> Pete Tabram

>I think the bikers must have been cursing me for the amount of sand I >deposited on the track; still at least it was'nt oil and metal shards hey >Wolfgang ;-) Oh, it was glass and some plastic pieces from the grille, mainly. I collected most bits - I left there basically only some part of the front bumper that got stuck inseperably in between two guard rail segments. The car was still in running condition, altough it felt like only three wheels reached to the ground at any one time. The left front corner of the chassis was bent five centimeters to the left and one centimeter up, as I later found out. ;) -- Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

>You can still do that today. It costs around DM15 (AFAI remember) to >lap the Ring, and it takes about a quarter of an hour for a DM30 this summer ... did three laps .... worth every penny ... You don't mean me, do you? :-) 11:30 for the third lap ... Hena

It was YOU!!! Very irresponsible of you ... I almost fell of my bike this summer at the ring ... :-) Hena

I dont know, but the name of the video is "Symphony im blech". I am not certain on the spelling thou. A have notes of the exact name and the producer of the vid at work. I will post it here at monday, when I get acess to them. /Masse

Oooooppps! Sorry... <g> Pete

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>>I think the bikers must have been cursing me for the amount of sand I >>deposited on the track; still at least it was'nt oil and metal shards hey >>Wolfgang ;-) >It was YOU!!! Very irresponsible of you ... I almost fell of my bike this >summer at the ring ... >:-) >Hena