Autosim Realism?

Hi All... Been reading with interest the various threads discussing the pros and cons about more "realism" in auto sims, some even to the point of advocating simulated injury, etc. I too, have been thinking about ways to make my favorite sims more "realistic" as it were... and have come up with some ideas I think I'll bounce off you guys. (After all, the old saying is: "two heads are better than one"!) Let's start with my favorite sim, Nascar2. And, let's say that I'm starting a season, and I'm headed for the first track for the first race: Daytona. Now, what happens when a "real" Nascar team arrives at a track? They unload, prep the car for practice... then hit the track. Well, let's look at the typical way I (we?) "practice". As for me, when I'm "rusty" (haven't played the sim in a loooong time), I usually dissengage "Damage" and go out and start wailing away. Even if I still have damage on... there's not too much concern for any carnage that ensues, after all, the "Shift R" keys start me all over again with a brand new car... so what's the prob Bob? Well, this is the first area that I think we can add "realism". "Real" teams do not have unlimited stables of cars at the track. From watching waaay too many Nascar races on TV, best I can tell, a team usually arrives at a track with the "Primary" car, and a "Back-up" car. (After all, you can only put so much stuff in a semi-trailer.) Thus, if a driver REALLY thumps the primary car (as oppossed to superficial fender damage)... they have to pull out the back-up car. So why can't we do the same? That is, when we arrive at the track to begin practice... we allow ourselves two cars. Should we receive superficial damage, we can switch to the backup car, or park it for repairs. (Hmmm... wonder what "they" do? Likely, I figure the crew begins*** a new fender, and that's it for practice that day. Opinions?) Now, if we REALLY tear it up (knock front end off, or back end)... then obviously, that car can't be fixed that day, or even overnight (possibly "never", in the real world). Out comes the backup car... AND THAT'S THE LAST ONE YOU'VE GOT BUDDY! Tear it up... and you scratch that race. "Scratching" a race would be easily accomplished by taking a provisional start position, starting the race, (staying back so there's zero interference with the AI cars) and once you complete a lap accelerate the time, taking the DNF... and go to the next race. What do think? See any "holes" in this? I've been thinking about taking this approach myself... but thought I'd pitch it out to r.a.s. to see what kinds of ideas others can add to it. Later... I'll share some ideas on how to simulate "injuries"... if you want to take it that far. Let me know... Have fun... Andre

Why simiulate injuries? This is a sim, not Duke Nukem 3D. Simiulating injuries would be both pointless and stupid. The reason they didn't have cars flip in N2 was because NASCAR wouldn't allow because they didn't want it to make NASCAR seem dangerous or something (I think that's the story). So do you think they would allow Papyrus to add injuries? And injuries suck. And how could you simulate them? How could you simulate racing with broken ribs or whatever? Racer X Veteran Sim Racer Victory Lane- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1423/

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> > I'll share some > >ideas on how to simulate "injuries > Why simiulate injuries? This is a sim, not Duke Nukem 3D. Simiulating > injuries would be both pointless and stupid. The reason they didn't have cars > flip in N2 was because NASCAR wouldn't allow because they didn't want it to > make NASCAR seem dangerous or something (I think that's the story). So do you > think they would allow Papyrus to add injuries? And injuries suck. And how > could you simulate them? How could you simulate racing with broken ribs or > whatever? > Racer X > Veteran Sim Racer > Victory Lane- > http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1423/

Seeing as you think it's "pointless and stupid"... forget it! Andre

"Target"? Hmmmm, what an interesting name? :))

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> Why simiulate injuries? This is a sim, not Duke Nukem 3D. Simiulating > injuries would be both pointless and stupid. The reason they didn't have cars > flip in N2 was because NASCAR wouldn't allow because they didn't want it to > make NASCAR seem dangerous or something (I think that's the story). So do you > think they would allow Papyrus to add injuries? And injuries suck. And how > could you simulate them? How could you simulate racing with broken ribs or > whatever? > Racer X > Veteran Sim Racer > Victory Lane- > http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1423/

Uh, ok, but you forgot the 12. I take it you don't watch CART. Jimmy Vasser-Target the main sponser and 12 is his car number. Racer X Veteran Sim Racer Victory Lane- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1423/

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> > I'll share some > >ideas on how to simulate "injuries > Why simiulate injuries? This is a sim, not Duke Nukem 3D. Simiulating > injuries would be both pointless and stupid. The reason they didn't have cars > flip in N2 was because NASCAR wouldn't allow because they didn't want it to > make NASCAR seem dangerous or something (I think that's the story). So do you > think they would allow Papyrus to add injuries? And injuries suck. And how > could you simulate them? How could you simulate racing with broken ribs or > whatever?

Why the dumb comparison with FPS games? It's like damage turned on! You'll drive less risky, so the realism is higher. Sitting on the starting grid, knowing the danger of hitting someone or getting hit is increasing pulse rate. So add the risk of getting injured to a season, it adds another issue to your behaviour on the race track. Some flight sims do this by having you stay in hospital, while the campaign goes on without you. l8er ronny -- Toys'R'Us '99: "So, would you like a hand gun with that action figure, kiddo?" |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

Just my two cents. But didn't the old F1 Ferrari game from Activision (I think, and hey it was an Amiga game at that.) have driver injuries during the course of the season. It did knida suck, but that's racing. I think it should have been made an option, like car damage. Driver Damage...and it could have had different levels. Yeah! Setting 1: A team Damage: Your car can flip 16 times and be hit by every car on the track and all you have is a cut finger and a smudge of dirt on each cheek. (*** not buttocks) Setting 2: Days of Thunder Damage: Same circumstance as setting one, but your driver sprains his wrist. Unless you are the "BAD GUY" in which case you have serious head truama. Setting 3: Normal Mode: Real life. DO NOT PLAY AS RICKY CRAVEN! Setting 4: Faces of DEATH Mode: uh...perhaps this isn't such a good idea. Later, Brit > > > I'll share some > > >ideas on how to simulate "injuries And injuries suck. And how . Some flight sims do

How about some graphs showing g-forces at the moment of the collision (a bit like MS flight simulator)? That wouldn't be first person shooter style or tasteless. Then you could decide yourself, whether you like to feel injuried or not.

Hmmm, Well, first, if it was a really bad wreck, blow off the next 2 - 6 races. Then, when you're back racing, raise the opponents strength level for a race or two, to simulate the effects of your recouperation period. Something like that, maybe?