F1RS: Ensoniq AudioPCI 3D thoughts.

Well I got an AudioPCI. It is the Creative Audio PCI, and it will work with 2 or 4 speakers for 3D. I spent the whole afternoon messing with the card. All in all it does sound much clearer and briter than my old Ensoniq Soundscape. But I had some pretty bad problems in W95 games. The worst was Formula 1 Racing Simulation (F1RS). If I used the drivers off of the Ensoniq PCI CD the sound was fine except for no 3D. If I used the latest driver from Ensoniq the sound was really crap. 3D was enabled but trying to run the 3D version of F1RS caused allot of stuttering. The best solution was the Creative SB64PCI drivers. Everything worked fine, except the car would jitter and the Jstick would spike. I use a TM-ACM gamecard and this was some how having a problem with the AudioPCI. Then I used the Jstick port on the AudioPCI and the spiking went away. However every time I pressed the brake, there was quite a bit of static popping. But the 3D effects of F1RS is quite good! I avoided many wrecks just by hearing that there was another car right next to me. I mean just off my shoulder not just in one speaker. The 3D positioning was pretty darn neat. All in all this card just wouldn't work 100% in F1RS. So I went back to the old Soundscape and TM-ACM game port. I'll probably try another 3D soundcard. Also, the second set of (rear) speakers connects to the Line-In jack, which is activated via the driver. Also does anyone know how to tell if your system really is setup for DirectSound3D? The DXSETUP (directX setup) did not show anything about DirectSound3D. And the only drivers for this card which were close to working properly were the Creative SB64PCI drivers. The drivers which I got with my card, and the latest ones from Ensoniq were crap. IMHO :-) -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

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>Well I got an AudioPCI. It is the Creative Audio PCI, and it will >work with 2 or 4 speakers for 3D. I spent the whole >afternoon messing with the card. All in all it does sound >much clearer and briter than my old Ensoniq Soundscape. >But I had some pretty bad problems in W95 games. >The worst was Formula 1 Racing Simulation (F1RS). >If I used the drivers off of the Ensoniq PCI CD the sound >was fine except for no 3D. If I used the latest driver from >Ensoniq the sound was really crap. 3D was enabled but >trying to run the 3D version of F1RS caused allot of stuttering. >The best solution was the Creative SB64PCI drivers. Everything >worked fine, except the car would jitter and the Jstick would >spike. I use a TM-ACM gamecard and this was some how >having a problem with the AudioPCI. Then I used the Jstick >port on the AudioPCI and the spiking went away.

I also tried the Creative PCI64 3D card, both with and without the 3D soundpatch for F1RS (both in conjunction with F1RS patch 1.09), and with and without a CH GameCard 3 Automatic dedicated gameport. No matter what the combination, I always saw *a lot* of spiking with my TSW wheel/pedal combo when the PCI soundcard was installed...so much so that I felt F1RS was undriveable. I never saw any spiking from just my Creative AWE64 Value, even when I was using the gameport on it. So, I returned the PCI64 card and put the AWE64 back in. Spiking problems are now gone. I agree that the 3D sound effects in F1RS were very good, but not worth the problems with controller-spiking IMO. I now have the Turtle Beach Montego PCI 3D soundcard on order from Chips&Bits ($119 U.S.) . It got a very positive review here: http://www.combatsim.com/montego.htm You can also see their review of several PCI 3D soundcards at: http://www.combatsim.com/pcisound.htm They mentioned in their review that they did not see any of the digital gameport spiking problems with the TB Montego that apparently many Monster M80 3D soundcard users have reported. The TB card should be arriving this week. I'll post any results here, and at: http://www.paradise-web.com/powerforum/pwrforum.exe?who=f1racingsim if that site is still up (hopefully it will be). Cheers, Dave ============================ Dave Mack (remove "nospamfor_" for correspondence)

Greg, some of that stuttering sounds like what I told you about when I had my M80 plugged into a 200mmx. Haven't had any of that with it plugged into a 400. You may just need to cut back on some of the bells and whistles a little. I guess you did install the 3D audio patch for F1RS? And folks, I have an M80 Monster 3d and HAVE NOT EXPERIENCED ANY GAMEPORT SPIKING! I have to conclude from my experiences with the M80 that those reports of the gameport not being any good (i.e., "spiking") were based either on early, early models of the card that indeed may have had this problem, overloading the card and port on "slower" machines, or joysticks and other controllers that had problems that may have been "masked" by other ports. At any rate F1RS, F-22 ADF, Longbow 2, and F-15 all work just fine plugged into the M80. FWIW, though, if I were buying a 3D sound card tonight, I think I'd have to try the Turtle Beach Card. Jerry Morelock

>I now have the Turtle Beach Montego PCI 3D soundcard on order from >Chips&Bits ($119 U.S.) . .. >The TB card should be arriving this week. Saw the Montego at CompUSA this Sunday. I think their price was $129.

Cancel that order, I had the exact same problems you described with my TB Montego, now it is sitting here collecting dust... In addition, the Nascar 2 (most likely any dos game) sounded horrible. Same as you, I went back to SB 64 ISA. >I now have the Turtle Beach Montego PCI 3D soundcard on order from >Chips&Bits ($119 U.S.) .

>Cancel that order, I had the exact same problems you described with my TB >Montego, now it is sitting here collecting dust... In addition, the Nascar 2 Oh boy... It is sounding like the AudioPCI may not be that horrible after all :-) I guess the only game I am really looking for a good 3D soundcard for is F1RS. At least the sound was not ***with the SB64CPI drivers. The only problem was some static while pressing on the brake, when the T2 was connected to the Audio PCI game port. Otherwise the 3D effect in F1RS is quite awesome. Thanks much for the info I guess the Montego is off my list. I thought the Montego was SB Pro compatable in DOS? Do you need to load a TSR or something??? How do you need to set it up for DOS games? Thanks -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. >64 ISA. >>I now have the Turtle Beach Montego PCI 3D soundcard on order from >>Chips&Bits ($119 U.S.) .

>Cancel that order, I had the exact same problems you described with my TB >Montego, now it is sitting here collecting dust... In addition, the Nascar 2 >(most likely any dos game) sounded horrible. Same as you, I went back to SB >64 ISA. Yow! Just cancelled it a few minutes ago. Thanks for the heads-up. Wouldn't want to get stuck with an unreturnable $120 card. I still might try it via CompUSA, if their return policy is "no stocking charge" (which I think it might be). Or, might try the Monster M80, based on this post:

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>Greg, some of that stuttering sounds like what I told you about when I had >my M80 plugged into a 200mmx. Haven't had any of that with it plugged into >a 400. You may just need to cut back on some of the bells and whistles a >little. I guess you did install the 3D audio patch for F1RS? And folks, I >have an M80 Monster 3d and HAVE NOT EXPERIENCED ANY GAMEPORT SPIKING! I >have to conclude from my experiences with the M80 that those reports of the >gameport not being any good (i.e., "spiking") were based either on early, >early models of the card that indeed may have had this problem, overloading >the card and port on "slower" machines, or joysticks and other controllers >that had problems that may have been "masked" by other ports. >At any rate F1RS, F-22 ADF, Longbow 2, and F-15 all work just fine plugged >into the M80. FWIW, though, if I were buying a 3D sound card tonight, I >think I'd have to try the Turtle Beach Card.

(Jerry, BTW, are you using the default engine sound or one of the user-contributed sounds? I'm using actually a combination of a couple different soundfiles...can't remember which. I won't go back to the standard engine/gearshift sounds, no matter what!) I'll post results here if I do try either or both of these cards. If anyone else has had success with *any* 3D PCI card and F1RS, please reply. It'd also be helpful if David Greene (don't know if you're reading this) of "The Unofficial F1RS FAQ" fame was able to collect more results of 3D soundcard testing and add that to the FAQ...wherever that may wind up, if Rick's great f1racingsim.com site does close down. ============================ Dave Mack (remove "nospamfor_" for correspondence)

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>Ifanyone else has had success with *any* 3D PCI card and F1RS, please >reply. >It'd also be helpful if David Greene (don't know if you're reading >this) of "The Unofficial F1RS FAQ" fame was able to collect more >results of 3D soundcard testing and add that to the FAQ...wherever >that may wind up, if Rick's great f1racingsim.com site does close >down. >============================

I am using a Xitel Storm VX and it works great with 3D sound in F1RS.It uses an Aureal Vortex chipset like many other A3D cards.The trick to getting them to work with F1rs 3D sound is to use the original 3D sound patch not the latest one from Ubisofts site. Dos support with this card is fantastic,in a Dos box or even under 6.22 .I have had no problems at all.The gameport is accelerated and my controllers are smoother and they eat less CPU time.The gameport works under Dos and if you have to use an older program in Windows you just select the standard gameport in the controller tab and away you go.No problems with Nascar and none of the problems people have been getting with other PCI sound cards.

I'm using a Multiwave PCI card that uses the Vortex chip as well. The lastest Ubi 3D sound didn't do it for me either, but where can I get the original 3D sound patch. Would it be too much trouble for you to mail it to me? Thanks, Stanley Chan

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> I am using a Xitel Storm VX and it works great with 3D sound in > F1RS.It uses an Aureal Vortex chipset like many other A3D cards.The > trick to getting them to work with F1rs 3D sound is to use the > original 3D sound patch not the latest one from Ubisofts site. > Dos support with this card is fantastic,in a Dos box or even > under 6.22 .I have had no problems at all.The gameport is accelerated > and my controllers are smoother and they eat less CPU time.The > gameport works under Dos and if you have to use an older program in > Windows you just select the standard gameport in the controller tab > and away you go.No problems with Nascar and none of the problems > people have been getting with other PCI sound cards.

Well the 3D sound works great on an Ensoniq Audio PCI with the Creative SBPCI64 drivers. Totally awesome :-) -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes. >I'm using a Multiwave PCI card that uses the Vortex chip as well. The >lastest Ubi 3D sound didn't do it for me either, but where can I get the >original 3D sound patch. Would it be too much trouble for you to mail it >to me? >Thanks, >Stanley Chan >> I am using a Xitel Storm VX and it works great with 3D sound in >> F1RS.It uses an Aureal Vortex chipset like many other A3D cards.The >> trick to getting them to work with F1rs 3D sound is to use the >> original 3D sound patch not the latest one from Ubisofts site. >> Dos support with this card is fantastic,in a Dos box or even >> under 6.22 .I have had no problems at all.The gameport is accelerated >> and my controllers are smoother and they eat less CPU time.The >> gameport works under Dos and if you have to use an older program in >> Windows you just select the standard gameport in the controller tab >> and away you go.No problems with Nascar and none of the problems >> people have been getting with other PCI sound cards.

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>>Ifanyone else has had success with *any* 3D PCI card and F1RS, please >>reply. >>It'd also be helpful if David Greene (don't know if you're reading >>this) of "The Unofficial F1RS FAQ" fame was able to collect more >>results of 3D soundcard testing and add that to the FAQ...wherever >>that may wind up, if Rick's great f1racingsim.com site does close >>down. >>============================

I'm currently trying to get these details - another reason the update is delayed. btw has anyone got a turtle beach soundcard working with F1RS?

>I'm currently trying to get these details - another reason the update is >delayed. >btw has anyone got a turtle beach soundcard working with F1RS? One guy posted that the DirectSound3D with the Montego was crap. The AudioPCI works fine though. -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

Actually, all the vortex-based PCI sound cards (montego included) will work with the first Direct3D Sound patch from Ubi, not the current one, Can be had from the Sim ***World F1RS site. Stanley

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> >I'm currently trying to get these details - another reason the update > is > >delayed. > >btw has anyone got a turtle beach soundcard working with F1RS? > One guy posted that the DirectSound3D with the Montego was crap. > The AudioPCI works fine though. > -- > Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming > hordes.

I have the Turtle Beach Montego and it doesn't work very well with it either, the engine sounds cut in and out and just doesn't sound very good in general. Hope someone can fix it.

Same here... I called a UBI tech and he told me to come here for answers. I hope that someone here is smarter than them. And if we are all waiting for a savior pach to help us... forget it. The tech told me that there will be no new patch to fix this. He claimed that they dont have TBS equipment to test a patch and that I could maybe askk all of you for a way to make it work. Sounds like a load of ***to me... anyone here got a clue?

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>>I'm currently trying to get these details - another reason the update is >>delayed. >>btw has anyone got a turtle beach soundcard working with F1RS? >I have the Turtle Beach Montego and it doesn't work very well with it >either, the engine sounds cut in and out and just doesn't sound very good

in >general. Hope someone can fix it.

Maybe Ubisoft can save up the $120 or so and get a Montego! There are a lot of sound cards coming out with the Aureal A3D chip, and all the ones I have tried are ***with the latest F1RS sound patch. Ubisoft need to get F1RS working properly with the A3D chip - no excuses. Keith. !!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

Thanks Keith. The same tech wrote me a letter repeating that he does not have anything new on this and that I should check the website and here for public posts from fellow users. Now how the hell are we supposed to write a driver for their damn game???? of sound cards coming out with the Aureal A3D chip, and all the ones I have tried are ***with the latest F1RS sound patch.

For what its worth... I'm having basically the same "choppy" audio problems with a Diamond MonsterSound M80, which does 3D sound acceleration and A3D... I don;t think that UBI is using A3D, probably DirectHex... I set my driver to display the A3D logo/sound (similar to 3DFX Glide logo), but I never see or hear it... Anyone have any ideas??? It seems to be in Ubi's code, as I've seen many 3D sound users reporting similar symptoms. Ed

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> Thanks Keith. > The same tech wrote me a letter repeating that he does not have anything new > on this and that I should check the website and here for public posts from > fellow users. > Now how the hell are we supposed to write a driver for their damn game???? > >> Same here... I called a UBI tech and he told me to come here for answers. > I > >> hope that someone here is smarter than them. And if we are all waiting > for a > >> savior pach to help us... forget it. The tech told me that there will be > no > >> new patch to fix this. He claimed that they dont have TBS equipment to > test > >> a patch and that I could maybe askk all of you for a way to make it work. > >> Sounds like a load of ***to me... anyone here got a clue? > >Maybe Ubisoft can save up the $120 or so and get a Montego! There are a lot > of sound cards coming out with the Aureal A3D chip, and all the ones I have > tried are ***with the latest F1RS sound patch. > >Ubisoft need to get F1RS working properly with the A3D chip - no excuses. > >Keith. > >!!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

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>For what its worth... >I'm having basically the same "choppy" audio problems with a Diamond >MonsterSound M80, which does 3D sound acceleration and A3D... I don;t think >that UBI is using A3D, probably DirectHex... I set my driver to display the A3D >logo/sound (similar to 3DFX Glide logo), but I never see or hear it... >Ed >> >> Same here... I called a UBI tech and he told me to come here for answers. >> I >> >> hope that someone here is smarter than them. And if we are all waiting >> for a >> >> savior pach to help us... forget it. The tech told me that there will be >> no >> >> new patch to fix this. He claimed that they dont have TBS equipment to >> test >> >> a patch and that I could maybe askk all of you for a way to make it work. >> >> Sounds like a load of ***to me... anyone here got a clue?

Same problems here, Xitel Storm VX and it sounds awful, the engine sounds like there's a booger caught in the air valves or somthing.... FWIW, I never got the A3D logo either....

There is a sound 3D patch for F1RS at many pages. Look out..maybe it solves your problems. Regards Chrid Ed Reynolds schrieb:

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> For what its worth... > I'm having basically the same "choppy" audio problems with a Diamond > MonsterSound M80, which does 3D sound acceleration and A3D... I don;t think > that UBI is using A3D, probably DirectHex... I set my driver to display the A3D > logo/sound (similar to 3DFX Glide logo), but I never see or hear it... > Anyone have any ideas??? It seems to be in Ubi's code, as I've seen many 3D > sound users reporting similar symptoms. > Ed > > Thanks Keith. > > The same tech wrote me a letter repeating that he does not have anything new > > on this and that I should check the website and here for public posts from > > fellow users. > > Now how the hell are we supposed to write a driver for their damn game???? > > >> Same here... I called a UBI tech and he told me to come here for answers. > > I > > >> hope that someone here is smarter than them. And if we are all waiting > > for a > > >> savior pach to help us... forget it. The tech told me that there will be > > no > > >> new patch to fix this. He claimed that they dont have TBS equipment to > > test > > >> a patch and that I could maybe askk all of you for a way to make it work. > > >> Sounds like a load of ***to me... anyone here got a clue? > > >Maybe Ubisoft can save up the $120 or so and get a Montego! There are a lot > > of sound cards coming out with the Aureal A3D chip, and all the ones I have > > tried are ***with the latest F1RS sound patch. > > >Ubisoft need to get F1RS working properly with the A3D chip - no excuses. > > >Keith. > > >!!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

I'm late to this thread. This 3D sound may take some CPU horsepower. Is anybody with a fast P2 having these problems? Larry

> There is a sound 3D patch for F1RS at many pages. > Look out..maybe it solves your problems. This patch doesn't patch 3D sound, it introduces it. So the current state of 3D sound is buggy (in my case on a Terratec XLerate). For some people it works, for some it doesn't... ;^) Strange: in any view but the F2 views the sound is clear and quite good. l8er ronny -- Toys'R'Us '99: "So, would you like a hand gun with that action figure, kiddo?" |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

On Wed, 08 Jul 1998 16:41:57 GMT, I have the same card and it works fine with A3D,but as with most of these A3D cards use the first sound patch called SOUND3D.EXE 82.0kB (73.4KB as SOUND3D.ZIP) not the Directsound patch which is called SOUNDPATCH2.EXE.90.3kb.I don't get the splash screen,but it is definitely running with 3D sound.BTW there are new drivers up for the Storm VX at www.xitel.com.

: >For what its worth... : > : >I'm having basically the same "choppy" audio problems with a Diamond : >MonsterSound M80, which does 3D sound acceleration and A3D... I don;t think : >that UBI is using A3D, probably DirectHex... I set my driver to display the A3D : >logo/sound (similar to 3DFX Glide logo), but I never see or hear it... : > : >Ed : > : Same problems here, Xitel Storm VX and it sounds awful, the engine : sounds like there's a booger caught in the air valves or somthing.... : FWIW, I never got the A3D logo either.... I'm pretty sure that F1RS is using DirectSound via the DirectX package and they are NOT using A3D... what a pity. DirectX ceases to amaze me as ever, assuming it is realted to DirectX... Lord knows other DirectX features have performed poorly when compared with competing approachs (GLIDE anyone) Ed -- Ed Reynolds

: There is a sound 3D patch for F1RS at many pages. : Look out..maybe it solves your problems. : Regards : Chrid I have downloaded the latest patch fron UbiSoft (level 2)... it doesn't work!!! Ed -- Ed Reynolds

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>: There is a sound 3D patch for F1RS at many pages. >: Look out..maybe it solves your problems. >: Regards >: Chrid >I have downloaded the latest patch fron UbiSoft (level 2)... it doesn't work!!! >Ed

Try the first one.....email me and I will send it your way. It works, them pass overhead.... Jeff