Ubisoft are complete idiots!!!

They are seting aa world record of patched patches. If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another job. I'm normally not the kind of guy who is always irritated by every sinlge byte. But If I pay more then $45 for a game, I want it to work after 1 or two patches. Ubisofts' own forum is full of complaints.... Patch 1.08 is the slowest of them all. Ubisoft: you are complete idiots.....and I want some explaining on this newsgroup!!!! Greetings, Any angry Bart

I can see no difference between any of the patches in terms of frame rate - all are smooth as hell!

Slower framerate wise? Lucky for me I still have V1.05 :-) -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

I agree. The 'best' version is the original one on the CD. V1.05 added jerky steering, version 1.07 got much slower on my PC, version 1.08 is 3dfx only. At this rate, somewhere around version 1.24 should be good, especially if the pathetic grass slowdown is removed. I run 1.05 now just so I can have working mirrors in ghost mode. Otherwise, the original CD version is the best for race simulation. Keith. -- !!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

<<I'm normally not the kind of guy who is always irritated by every single byte. But If I pay more then $45 for a game, I want it to work after 1 or two patches.>> Hope you didn't buy CPR. Bart Brown

Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job of responding to customer requests. All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is!

Sure they do, but not everybody owns a pII !!! My p200 with 3dfx is superd for 99% of the games around, but not for F1RS. Sounds like terrible bad coding :-( Bart

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> I can see no difference between any of the patches in terms of frame rate - > all are smooth as hell! > >They are seting aa world record of patched patches. > >If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another > >job. > >I'm normally not the kind of guy who is always irritated by every sinlge > >byte. But If I pay more then $45 for a game, I want it to work after 1 > >or two patches. Ubisofts' own forum is full of complaints.... > >Patch 1.08 is the slowest of them all. > >Ubisoft: you are complete idiots.....and I want some explaining on this > >newsgroup!!!! > >Greetings, > >Any angry Bart

Ha!! Fixing a minor bug and creating a major one!!! Framerate on average systems is much more important then working mirrors in Ghost mode You don't have anyone behind you in gohst-mode :-)) Bart

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> Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job > of responding to customer requests. > All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! > If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself > lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is! > >I agree. The 'best' version is the original one on the CD. V1.05 added > jerky > >steering, version 1.07 got much slower on my PC, version 1.08 is 3dfx only. > >At this rate, somewhere around version 1.24 should be good, especially if > >the pathetic grass slowdown is removed. I run 1.05 now just so I can have > >working mirrors in ghost mode. Otherwise, the original CD version is the > >best for race simulation. > >Keith. > >-- > >!!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

My P166 with 32MB and 3dFX has run silky smooth with all patches...

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>Sure they do, but not everybody owns a pII !!! >My p200 with 3dfx is superd for 99% of the games around, but not for >F1RS. >Sounds like terrible bad coding :-( >Bart >> I can see no difference between any of the patches in terms of frame

rate -

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>> all are smooth as hell! >> >They are seting aa world record of patched patches. >> >If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another >> >job. >> >I'm normally not the kind of guy who is always irritated by every sinlge >> >byte. But If I pay more then $45 for a game, I want it to work after 1 >> >or two patches. Ubisofts' own forum is full of complaints.... >> >Patch 1.08 is the slowest of them all. >> >Ubisoft: you are complete idiots.....and I want some explaining on this >> >newsgroup!!!! >> >Greetings, >> >Any angry Bart

When F1 was first released and I heard of the bugs which were in the game, I posted on r.a.s. that this would be a major issue with the sim and was criticized for it. How did I know? Because a year ago I was burnt out on the available sims and decided to try POD which was bundled with my new computer. It blew me away for many reasons, I was hooked for a long time, competed and did fairly well in the 10,000 contest, became one of the top drivers, but absolutely drove me nuts with the bugs. So many hours were waisted screwing around with them. F1 is not an all new or original game. It is actually POD 2. POD was the base which F1 was built on and is the reason given by Ubi Soft for creating an F1 sim in the first place. All the bugs I have heard mentioned were in POD. Go through the list of them and they are all the same. As much as I liked what they did with POD and now F1, it's hard to defend them in this situation. Their message boards were filled with complaints of these bugs in POD, and the F1 board is the same. Black sky, driver compatibility problems, patches that don't work? It's a rerun of a year ago. Like I said, I like F1 but it makes me wonder why CPR (completely original) is criticized so harshly. I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird MS hatred. Dave Fisher >They are seting aa world record of patched patches. >If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another >job.

Sorry, but my point remains the same. I notice absolutely no change in the frame rate. One is as smooth as the next one! Correcting the mirrors bug was only one of the many that were fixed.

That's strange. Patch 1.08 sped up the game with my Voodoo 2 by about 20% and removed the pink lines. It works great on my system. What kind of system and video card are you using? Ken The Game Pad http://gamepad.org/

Or perhaps it is because many of us, myself included, have had no problems with F1RS and find it the best racing SIM available, with very good AI, whereas CPR has such bad AI, no yellows....it is more a game than a sim and it ruins the experience for many of us. Not all of us have time or are interested in multiplayer, which is really about all CPR is good for, IMHO. Ken The Gamer Pad http://gamepad.org/

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> When F1 was first released and I heard of the bugs which were in the game, I > posted on r.a.s. that this would be a major issue with the sim and was > criticized for it. How did I know? Because a year ago I was burnt out on the > available sims and decided to try POD which was bundled with my new > computer. It blew me away for many reasons, I was hooked for a long time, > competed and did fairly well in the 10,000 contest, became one of the top > drivers, but absolutely drove me nuts with the bugs. So many hours were > waisted screwing around with them. > F1 is not an all new or original game. It is actually POD 2. POD was the > base which F1 was built on and is the reason given by Ubi Soft for creating > an F1 sim in the first place. All the bugs I have heard mentioned were in > POD. Go through the list of them and they are all the same. As much as I > liked what they did with POD and now F1, it's hard to defend them in this > situation. Their message boards were filled with complaints of these bugs in > POD, and the F1 board is the same. Black sky, driver compatibility problems, > patches that don't work? It's a rerun of a year ago. Like I said, I like F1 > but it makes me wonder why CPR (completely original) is criticized so > harshly. I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR > criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird MS > hatred. > Dave Fisher >> When F1 was first released and I heard of the bugs which were in the game, I >> posted on r.a.s. that this would be a major issue with the sim and was >> criticized for it. How did I know? Because a year ago I was burnt out on the >> available sims and decided to try POD which was bundled with my new >> computer. It blew me away for many reasons, I was hooked for a long time, >> competed and did fairly well in the 10,000 contest, became one of the top >> drivers, but absolutely drove me nuts with the bugs. So many hours were >> waisted screwing around with them. >> F1 is not an all new or original game. It is actually POD 2. POD was the >> base which F1 was built on and is the reason given by Ubi Soft for creating >> an F1 sim in the first place. All the bugs I have heard mentioned were in >> POD. Go through the list of them and they are all the same. As much as I >> liked what they did with POD and now F1, it's hard to defend them in this >> situation. Their message boards were filled with complaints of these bugs in >> POD, and the F1 board is the same. Black sky, driver compatibility problems, >> patches that don't work? It's a rerun of a year ago. Like I said, I like F1 >> but it makes me wonder why CPR (completely original) is criticized so >> harshly. I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR >> criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird MS >> hatred. >> Dave Fisher >> >They are seting aa world record of patched patches. >> >If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another >> >job.

> Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job > of responding to customer requests. > All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! Ian, What is this black sky thing I keep hearing? When does it happen and what does it look like, I've had F1RS for a long time and have yet to experience it. Trev

FWIW, CPR had more (I think double) the number of patches for CPR than Ubi's F1RS...The biggest difference is that most of the patches for CPR weren't public (because they were mostly burned onto CD's). The problem is not so much having to deal with patches, as it's whether the game/sim is worth patching. If it has a "sole," then it's most certainly worth patching (if something's wrong), and I'll happily accept the fix. Problem is when the mentioned game/sim lacks sole, then it's of to the closet for the flame-thrower and matches! Quite a number of products released reciently lack anything close - NFS2, Carmeggedon, and CPR. Unfortunately, this intangeble item doesn't really sell titles, as exampled by the lack-luster sales and acceptance of SODA. Ubi has a fine product - not perfect, mind you - but it's a clear indication that Ubi Soft's in this for the long haul. One I'll gladly patch if needed. Cheers! Marc > but it makes me wonder why CPR (completely original) is criticized so > harshly. I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR > criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird > MS hatred. -- Marc J. Nelson Sim Racing News - http://www.simnews.com <remove '_*_' before replying>

>What is this black sky thing I keep hearing? When does it happen and >what does it look like, I've had F1RS for a long time and have yet to >experience it. F1RS looks normal except the sky is black. I had it happen once. Only when loading a saved game though. -- Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

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>That's strange. Patch 1.08 sped up the game with my Voodoo 2 by about 20%<BR> >and removed the pink lines. It works great on my system. What kind of >system<BR> >and video card are you using?<BR> > Ken<BR> >The Game Pad<BR> >http://gamepad.org/<BR> ><BR> ><BR> >> They are seting aa world record of patched patches.<BR> >> If the v1.08 still doesn't run like it should be, it's time for another<BR> >> job.<BR> >><BR> >> I'm normally not the kind of guy who is always irritated by every >sinlge<BR> >> byte. But If I pay more then $45 for a game, I want it to work after 1<BR> >> or two patches. Ubisofts' own forum is full of complaints....<BR> >><BR> >> Patch 1.08 is the slowest of them all.<BR> >><BR> >> Ubisoft: you are complete idiots.....and I want some explaining on this<BR> >> newsgroup!!!!<BR> >><BR> >> Greetings,<BR> >><BR> >> Any angry Bart<BR> ><BR>

Ubisoft is to be thanked for their continuing support of a fine product. The 1.08 patch cured the dead spot in my steering, and seemed to really do nothing adverse to the game, no framerate drop that I could see, no black skys, it just runs like a champ! P233, 64mg,Pure 3D. don

On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 17:49:48 +0100, "Iain Mackenzie" >Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job >of responding to customer requests. >All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! >If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself >lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is! The "grass problem" is not a bug, just takes away from the realism. When going full speed then having a couple wheels touching grass, the car almost comes to a complete screaching halt. There is not gradual deceleration of speed, it slows down way too much, too soon. I love F1RS, but I wish they can adjust the realism with regard to driving on grass. Marc. -------- To replay via e-mail, remove "spam." from the beginning of my e-mail address (Tyring to avoid junk mail)

Sounds like a dodgy computer then Friend with PPro200 runs fine with Pure 3D I run a 200MMX with a Voodoo Rush (which is inherently 4-5% slower than Voodoo Graphics) and it runs fine too. Maybe you need to change the virtual memory or vcache settings to get it to run right? -- Nathan Wong http://www.nectar.com.au/~alfacors - Super Touring - Alfa Romeo - - V8Supercars - CART -

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> On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 17:49:48 +0100, "Iain Mackenzie" > >Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job > >of responding to customer requests. > >All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! > >If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself > >lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is! > The "grass problem" is not a bug, just takes away from the realism. > When going full speed then having a couple wheels touching grass, the > car almost comes to a complete screaching halt. There is not gradual > deceleration of speed, it slows down way too much, too soon. > I love F1RS, but I wish they can adjust the realism with regard to > driving on grass.

Yep, if they'd fix that and get the thing right for leagues (ie a way to know everyone is running under the same conditions) it would be the sim that finally pulled me away from ICR2. Looks like I'll just have to wait for GPL. I'm glad in a way that I didn't get ICR2 till the middle of last year - not quite sick of it yet :)

> F1RS looks normal except the sky is black. I had it happen once. > Only when loading a saved game though. > -- Greg, maybe it happens only on certain machines, vid cards? Trev

On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 13:44:03 -0500, "David G Fisher" >but it makes me wonder why CPR (completely original) is criticized so >harshly. I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR >criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird MS >hatred. Ubisoft's message board is clogged up because F1RS has had some problems. CPR is criticised because it has problem - you need to do a gap analysis of the problem to answer your question. The world does not hate MS, no matter how much easier that is for you to believe. Cheers! John

Greetings: Where would I find the Ubisoft message board? Checked their home page but didn't see it mentioned. Thanks, Joe.

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> Ubisoft's message board is clogged up because F1RS has had some > problems. CPR is criticised because it has problem - you need to do a > gap analysis of the problem to answer your question. > The world does not hate MS, no matter how much easier that is for you > to believe. > Cheers! > John

>The "grass problem" is not a bug, just takes away from the realism. They could fix that bug/feature by changing the color of the grass to beige, so people could pretend it is sand or gravel. When driving for example on Monza track, I usually take one of the S-shaped chicanes full speed driving two tires on the grass almost without any turning, and I lose very little speed in the process. It appears to me that there is a little lag like one second or so before the "sticky grass" comes into effect. *** http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

My P233MMX with 3Dfx Voodoo runs F1RS 1.08 very nicely. Funny how much difference that 33Mhz or MMX can make. ;-) I'm using full graphics except that the drawing distance is one notch down from full, this gives no visible pop up. And maximum number of cars of course. With "nicely" I mean something like 30 fps most of the time with several cars in view, and slowing down to maybe 15-20 fps in extreme situations like seeing all the racing cars in view (doesn't happen that often). Those are estimations as there is no frame rate counter. Anyway the gameplay remains smooth 99% of the time. Considering the level of graphics, I wouldn't say so. They have done very good job. *** http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

Same here. Quite odd. I have yet to see the black sky phenomenom in F1RS. Maybe it is just like that garbled***pit thing, some people encounter it while others don't? *** http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

Did I say the world hated Microsoft? Hardly. Apparently most of the world likes it quite a bit. You, and the others who responded to my post, have chosen to ignore the main point I made which is that the bugs in POD are now in F1. If Microsoft was the publisher of F1 and had repeated the same bugs in a sequel, they, judging from some of the CPR bashing, wouldn't have been treated nearly so kindly here at r.a.s. You're flat out lying if you say you aren't aware of the existence of (insecure) people who have a dislike of MS and Bill Gates simply because they are overwhelmingly successful. It's an issue that is mentioned regularly in the computer world. It's very clear there are a few of those people here at r.a.s. Dave

Many of us, myself included, have had no problems with CPR either. It's a sim, not a game. The AI criticism is way overblown. How much time did you actually spend with CPR. I'm curious as to why you don't like multi-player racing. It takes only a few minutes to get a race going at the Zone so I don't understand the comment that it takes too much time. There are a number of incredible drivers at the Zone to race, and the races are far more exciting to participate in than any computer AI could give you. The satisfaction you get from beating a top driver is worth 20 wins against AI opponents. Sims are supposed to recreate reality. There's nothing more real than racing human opponents. Dave >Or perhaps it is because many of us, myself included, have had no problems with >F1RS and find it the best racing SIM available, with very good AI, whereas CPR >has such bad AI, no yellows....it is more a game than a sim and it ruins the >experience for many of us. Not all of us have time or are interested in >multiplayer, which is really about all CPR is good for, IMHO. > Ken >The Gamer Pad >http://gamepad.org/

It happens on many configurations. It only happens with a save game in a full season when the weather is VARIABLE AND 5% HUMIDITY, and you reload it more than once! Does that help? I have been in communication with Ubi for 3-4 months on this, and still they can't fix it!

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>> F1RS looks normal except the sky is black. I had it happen once. >> Only when loading a saved game though. >> -- > Greg, maybe it happens only on certain machines, vid cards? >Trev

It's on www.ubisoft.fr/f1racing/f1racing.html OK?

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>Greetings: >Where would I find the Ubisoft message board? >Checked their home page but didn't see it mentioned. >Thanks, >Joe. >> Ubisoft's message board is clogged up because F1RS has had some >> problems. CPR is criticised because it has problem - you need to do a >> gap analysis of the problem to answer your question. >> The world does not hate MS, no matter how much easier that is for you >> to believe. >> Cheers! >> John

The AI criticisms are not overblown in CPR at all. It has very poor AI, and that is not even a debatable issue. The reasons I don't have the time or desire for multiplayer are my own and are irrelevant. I purchased CPR expecting it to be a good single player sim and instead find it to be a weak single player GAME. It doesn't hold a candle in single player mode to GP2, ICR2, Nascar 2, or F1RS, which are all sims. The AI and realism in those games runs circles around F1RS in single player. Ken The Game Pad http://gamepad.org/

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> Many of us, myself included, have had no problems with CPR either. It's a > sim, not a game. The AI criticism is way overblown. How much time did you > actually spend with CPR. I'm curious as to why you don't like multi-player > racing. It takes only a few minutes to get a race going at the Zone so I > don't understand the comment that it takes too much time. There are a number > of incredible drivers at the Zone to race, and the races are far more > exciting to participate in than any computer AI could give you. The > satisfaction you get from beating a top driver is worth 20 wins against AI > opponents. Sims are supposed to recreate reality. There's nothing more real > than racing human opponents. > Dave > >Or perhaps it is because many of us, myself included, have had no problems > with > >F1RS and find it the best racing SIM available, with very good AI, whereas > CPR > >has such bad AI, no yellows....it is more a game than a sim and it ruins > the > >experience for many of us. Not all of us have time or are interested in > >multiplayer, which is really about all CPR is good for, IMHO. > > Ken > >The Gamer Pad > >[link lost in import]

I can think of a few people who would debate CPR has "very poor" AI. It's not great but also not very poor. I've said earlier that I do like F1 a lot, so this is not a CPR vs F1 (silly) debate. I don't know about how you compare to the AI in F1, but it's not that hard to beat. Most AI in the sims I've tried aren't very hard to defeat with just a normal amount of practice. I don't claim to be the best driver around either. I can name a number of drivers who can beat me probably 9 out of 10 times. I'm sure they can easily beat the AI in the sims you mention. Racing sims have a few more years to go before anyone can claim great AI. It's just not possible, yet. That's why the multi-player option is so important for serious sim drivers. Car physics, track detail, graphics, sound, setups, and the overall feel of the game are more important to me than AI. I want to feel like I'm driving a CART car, and CPR does an excellent job of this. The main problem I have with F1 is the sense of speed is just not there. It feels like I'm going slow which makes it seem too easy. CPR definitely has a better sense of speed. F1 feels like I'm playing POD with Formula 1 cars. I've never driven an F1 or Champ car, but I'd guess that I would feel a little scared of the speed that comes with these cars, and in F1, that fear is missing. Dave >The AI criticisms are not overblown in CPR at all. It has very poor AI, and that >is not even a debatable issue. The reasons I don't have the time or desire for >multiplayer are my own and are irrelevant. I purchased CPR expecting it to be a >good single player sim and instead find it to be a weak single player GAME. It >doesn't hold a candle in single player mode to GP2, ICR2, Nascar 2, or F1RS, >which are all sims. The AI and realism in those games runs circles around F1RS >in single player. > Ken >The Game Pad >http://gamepad.org/

Um, yes you did: "I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird MS hatred." Frankly, this is an attitude beneath your normally level-headed posts. People don't like CPR because it's generally a pretty lousy game. It's as simple as that. And there as just as many - if not more - people who reflexively defend MS and anything with their name on it. Most people, though, just say what they do or do not like about a particular computer program, regardless of the publisher. Certainly 99% of the CPR criticism on this forum has been perfectly reasonable. Joe

> Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job > of responding to customer requests. > All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! > If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself > lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is! I have to wonder about your powers of observation if you have not noticed the totally unrealistic car performance when just one wheel goes on the grass. The S in F1RS says it all, this is supposed to be a simulation. Some do report that version 1.07 is not slower than previous versions, but that seems to be a minority opinion. And yes, I can run the CD version all day with no fatal problems on my system. Keith. -- !!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

<<You're flat out lying if you say you aren't aware of the existence of (insecure) people who have a dislike of MS and Bill Gates simply because they are overwhelmingly successful.>> So true! I've ALWAYS wanted to be a nerdy little dweeb with a Napoleon complex. Michael Millken was overwhelmingly successful, too... Bart Brown

<< Many of us, myself included, have had no problems with CPR either....The AI criticism is way overblown...the races are far more exciting to participate in than any computer AI could give you. The satisfaction you get from beating a top driver is worth 20 wins against AI opponents. Sims are supposed to recreate reality. There's nothing more real than racing human opponents.>> Well, there you have it: there are no problems with CPR, if there WERE problems with CPR, well, the AI criticism is "way overblown", and if the AI isn't exactly realistic, then you're missing the whole point -- the sim was MEANT to be played online, not as a standalone against the computer's AI... Funny, I don't recall that "feature" being part of MS advertising blitz or box blurb... I'm so embarrassed... Bart Brown

Thanks!! > It's on www.ubisoft.fr/f1racing/f1racing.html OK? > >Greetings: > >Where would I find the Ubisoft message board? > >Checked their home page but didn't see it mentioned.

I don't have problems with CPR. Sorry. At least no more than I have had, and heard of, regarding F1. You should be embarrassed. Nice editing. Completely talked your way around the subject of my post. Try actually reading the posts carefully before you respond like an emotional ***ager. There's another one I wrote in this thread. Maybe you will get a better understanding of my views on AI. Dave

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><< Many of us, myself included, have had no problems with CPR >either....The AI criticism is way overblown...the races are far more >exciting to participate in than any computer AI could give you. The >satisfaction you get from beating a top driver is worth 20 wins against >AI opponents. Sims are supposed to recreate reality. There's nothing >more real than racing human opponents.>> >Well, there you have it: there are no problems with CPR, if there WERE >problems with CPR, well, the AI criticism is "way overblown", and if the >AI isn't exactly realistic, then you're missing the whole point -- the >sim was MEANT to be played online, not as a standalone against the >computer's AI... >Funny, I don't recall that "feature" being part of MS advertising blitz >or box blurb... >I'm so embarrassed... >Bart Brown

Well, you just labeled yourself one of those described below, for the 500th time. Dave

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><<You're flat out lying if you say you aren't aware of the existence of >(insecure) people who have a dislike of MS and Bill Gates simply because >they are overwhelmingly successful.>> >So true! I've ALWAYS wanted to be a nerdy little dweeb with a Napoleon >complex. Michael Millken was overwhelmingly successful, too... >Bart Brown

> Well, you just labeled yourself one of those described below, for the 500th time. > Dave Ahh, the famous deep and complex Socratic argument of "I know you are, but what am I". Unfortunately, you left out the most important element of such a sophisticated argument: the "nyaahh nyaahh nyaahh nyaahh nyaahh nyaaaaaaaaaaahh!" UseNet is a text medium, but I'm sure it's very hard for you to resist making faces at the screen and sticking out your tongue, perhaps even blowing the occasional raspberry -- no fun wiping all that spit and drool off the screen, I'll bet! Bart Brown

I have the same system specs and mine runs smooth with everything maxed out. -- Kevin (Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

> Many of us, myself included, have had no problems with CPR either. > It's a sim, not a game. I haven't had much trouble with CPR either. My fps has always been good, everything in the menus seemed to work OK, but I'm afraid CPR is not a sim, (a very good game, yes), but since it misses some key issues, it has a ways to go to before it can reach sim-dome. Cheers! Marc -- (please remove '_*_' when replying) Sim Racing News - http://www.simnews.com The Sim Project - http://www.simproject.com * No animals were harmed in the making of this e-mail *

Good for you! You are one of the lucky few. I'm afraid to say that my car doesn't slow completely with one wheel on the grass, it realistically loses control and slows a little. Happy racing! >> Rubbish! Many bugs were fixed in the various patches, and Ubi do a great job >> of responding to customer requests. >> All that is now needed is the 'black sky' fix! >> If everything is OK with you with the original CD version, consider yourself >> lucky, although I have no idea what your 'grass slowdown' problem is! >I have to wonder about your powers of observation if you have not noticed the >totally unrealistic car performance when just one wheel goes on the grass. The S >in F1RS says it all, this is supposed to be a simulation. >Some do report that version 1.07 is not slower than previous versions, but that >seems to be a minority opinion. And yes, I can run the CD version all day with

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>no fatal problems on my system. >Keith. >-- >!!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

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> Did I say the world hated Microsoft? Hardly. Apparently most of the world > likes it quite a bit. You, and the others who responded to my post, have > chosen to ignore the main point I made which is that the bugs in POD are now > in F1. If Microsoft was the publisher of F1 and had repeated the same bugs > in a sequel, they, judging from some of the CPR bashing, wouldn't have been > treated nearly so kindly here at r.a.s. You're flat out lying if you say you > aren't aware of the existence of (insecure) people who have a dislike of MS > and Bill Gates simply because they are overwhelmingly successful. It's an > issue that is mentioned regularly in the computer world. It's very clear > there are a few of those people here at r.a.s.

I remember when I first came on the net a little over 12 months ago I was suprised to see how much anti MS sentiment there was. Both sysops at my ISP bag them (and our local telephone company - Telstra) all the time. After CPR and the need for IE browsers to get on the Zone I see why. To me, comparing F1RS to CPR is just out of whack for 2 BIG reasons. Firstly, CPR was hyped to the hilt whereas F1RS was promoted more by us simmers than Ubisoft itself. Secondly, F1RS had bugs whereas CPR is simply in alpha and reportedly unusable on ovals. There really is no comparison.

> Good for you! You are one of the lucky few. > I'm afraid to say that my car doesn't slow completely with one wheel > on the > grass, it realistically loses control and slows a little. > Happy racing! I remember discussing this theme before, the on wheel-on-the-grass situation.I find most sims mess this up; Gp2 does the same; you slow down as soon as you put one wheel off, this even goes for the kerbs, but then again, the "bounce" effects of the Gp2 kerbs is extremely annoying. in N2, it's also weird. If you put your inside front onto the grass in a turn (road course), you spin towards the grass, when you actually loose traction at the front, thus inducing understeer. However, this is a bit delicate, if you were "sliding" (4-wheel drifting) at full power, not putting in much lock, this would be correct behaviour:)) Anyway, my point is, I think it is a bit irritating when such items are programmed to stop us from cutting bends a bit. In real life, some turns are a bit too narrow/sharp etc (At least for me racing through), and putting two wheels onto the kerbs/grass is quite common. Why would they put kerbs there if the grass slowed the cars down? TOCA is the best so far:)) Jump kerbs and cut corners, it's wild! Looking forward to see "off-track" behaviour in GPL!:) Matt -- Matthew Birger Knutsen Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut) "Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" -Cale Yarborough

> Did I say the world hated Microsoft? Hardly. Apparently most of the world > likes it quite a bit. You, and the others who responded to my post, have > chosen to ignore the main point I made which is that the bugs in POD are now > in F1. If Microsoft was the publisher of F1 and had repeated the same bugs > in a sequel, they, judging from some of the CPR bashing, wouldn't have been > treated nearly so kindly here at r.a.s. You're flat out lying if you say you Wrong! F1RS has a lot of little annoying (sp?) things and a few bugs (which game doesn't), CPR has several missing important features and insufficient performance. BTW, CPR was done by TRI, so actually we negative guys on r.a.s. are "bashing" them, if you like to call it that. l8er ronny -- Toys'R'Us '99: "So, would you like a hand gun with that action figure, kiddo?" |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't this deserve criticism? In case it's been forgotten, I do like F1 so I am not bashing the game but not many people seem to realize this, maybe because most of the sim drivers here on r.a.s. never tried POD since it is an arcade type game. Dave

On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 13:42:56 -0500, "David G Fisher" >Did I say the world hated Microsoft? Hardly. Apparently most of the world >likes it quite a bit. They do?! I must have missed that meeting! --- The Chrome Plated Megaphone of Destiny

> Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 > has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't > this deserve criticism? In case it's been forgotten, I do like F1 so I am > not bashing the game but not many people seem to realize this, maybe because > most of the sim drivers here on r.a.s. never tried POD since it is an arcade > type game. The only problem I had with POD was screwed up sound, but this was solved by replacing the piece of &##&$$ SoundGalaxy Pro card with a SB16. Of course, I run both games with a Voodoo1 card, so I never started the D3D version, do you? POD was fun for a week, after that just a few laps on newly released tracks. l8er ronny -- Toys'R'Us '99: "So, would you like a hand gun with that action figure, kiddo?" |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

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> Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 > has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't > this deserve criticism? In case it's been forgotten, I do like F1 so I am > not bashing the game but not many people seem to realize this, maybe because > most of the sim drivers here on r.a.s. never tried POD since it is an arcade > type game. > Dave

Ok Dave. I don't have POD so what's the similarities?

% >Did I say the world hated Microsoft? % Um, yes you did: % "I'm positive now that the overblown (not constructive) CPR % criticism I read here on r.a.s. is due to some people having a weird % MS hatred." [soapbox mode = on] Microsoft gets the respect it deserves. It hypes its products beyond belief (and then fails to deliver). It treats its customers with little respect. It treats its competitors with even less. It thumbs its nose at anti-trust laws. Let's put it this way, I don't hate Micro$oft. I highly DISTRUST them. I dispise their attitude toward their customers. As a matter of fact they remind me alot of the old routine that Lily Tomlin used to do about the phone company (back in the days when the phone co. = AT&T): "We don't have to care, we're the Phone Company!" I find their tactics against their competition to be be deplorable. As the world changes, hopefully we will have less conflicts over despots and warmongers. However, we now have to deal with meglomaniacs like Bill Gates and Phil Knight who exemplify the new order of dictators, despots, and robber barons. [soapbox mode = off] CPR got picked apart here in r.a.s. for two reasons: 1) It was HYPED to high heaven and couldn't deliver on the hype 2) It is an incomplete and crippled product (and now we find that at least pertaining to the Glide port -- a deliberately crippled product). -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

% Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 % has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't % this deserve criticism? In case it's been forgotten, I do like F1 so I am % not bashing the game but not many people seem to realize this, maybe because % most of the sim drivers here on r.a.s. never tried POD since it is an arcade % type game. So?! What's your point? It is par for the course. The engine that F1SR is built upon is the same engine POD was constructed with. I highly suspect the same team worked on the product. Let's look in the history books..... Papyrus IndyCar Racing I -- great sim -- had some bugs and annoying idiosyncrasies Enter Papyrus NASCAR Racing 1 -- great sim -- Hmmmmm based on the same engine as ICR I -- guess what, same annoying bugs and idiosyncrasies Introduce IndyCar Racing II -- great sim -- modified sim engine (but still based on portions of ICRI/N1) -- Let's see, whoops some of the same troubling problems -- But, hey there are some new bugs and idisyncrasies too. Enter Papyrus NASCAR Racing 2 -- great sim -- modeled with the same engine as ICRII -- [you can fill in the blanks]. Yeh, it's stupid! Yeh, it doesn't make any sense. But, that's the way the cookies seem to crumble. One would think that if a software company is going to build future products on the core of a particular "engine", that they would want to fix the problems/bugs with the first product based on this engine. Instead, having sold the said product and wishing to not invest any more "developement funds" on a finished product, move on to the next product in the line -- bringing all of the idiosyncrasies and bugs with it. Happens all the time -- happens in everything -- automobile manufacturing, chip fabrications, software developement (including "real" software like Word), happens in marriages, etc. etc. etc. So? What's your point? -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Black sky yes, except that I only saw it in POD on one track if I recall right, and have yet to see it in F1RS. As for the rest, what were they again? Grass slowdown in POD? Slow menus in POD? *** http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

I'm not saying I have had all of these problems, but you can see them at the Ubi messsage boards. Black sky, driver compatibility problems (main bug), clunky menus, patches that fix one thing but mess up another, poor multiplay setup. No need to start an arguement, but I played POD regularly for months from the time it was released, and I still have nightmares (not really) about the hours I waisted screwing with the bugs in that program. I basically was forced into becoming an expert on them. F1 isn't as bad, but the bugs are very, very, familiar and the complaints I read are like a rerun of last year. Right now, I can't get the replay to work in the new CD I just picked up from the store yesterday. Davw >>Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1

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>>has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? >Black sky yes, except that I only saw it in POD on one track if >I recall right, and have yet to see it in F1RS. As for the rest, what >were they again? Grass slowdown in POD? Slow menus in POD? >*** >http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

Hmmm just got F1RS today at EB. They had 2 different packages and I assume one was the UK version. I bought the US version. I did notice in the back of the manual under the credits it says Special thanks to the POD Programming Team. Ok Now I installed the D3d full version as I dont have a 3Dfx card and click on the icon to run F1 and I get a black screen for a few seconds and then right back to my desktop. I do have 4 Mb on my video card. Another thing I noticed after installing F1RS is that it screwed up my sound in CPR (I bet they do that on purpose) so the end result is F1RS doesnt run and CPR is now screwed. F1RS is going back tommorrow! I tried!! Later >I'm not saying I have had all of these problems, but you can see them at the >Ubi messsage boards. Black sky, driver compatibility problems (main bug), >clunky menus, patches that fix one thing but mess up another, poor multiplay >setup. No need to start an arguement, but I played POD regularly for months >from the time it was released, and I still have nightmares (not really) >about the hours I waisted screwing with the bugs in that program. I >basically was forced into becoming an expert on them. F1 isn't as bad, but >the bugs are very, very, familiar and the complaints I read are like a rerun >of last year. Right now, I can't get the replay to work in the new CD I just

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>picked up from the store yesterday. >Davw >>>Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that >F1 >>>has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? >>Black sky yes, except that I only saw it in POD on one track if >>I recall right, and have yet to see it in F1RS. As for the rest, what >>were they again? Grass slowdown in POD? Slow menus in POD? >>*** >>http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/

On Fri, 3 Apr 1998 02:02:33 -0800, "George Sandman"

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>Another thing I noticed after installing F1RS is that it screwed up my >sound in CPR (I bet they do that on purpose) so the end result is F1RS >doesnt run and CPR is now screwed. >F1RS is going back tommorrow! I tried!! >Later

Are you for real?? THEY DID IT ON PURPOSE?!?!?

<<On Fri, 3 Apr 1998 02:02:33 -0800, "George Sandman"

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>Another thing I noticed after installing F1RS is that it screwed up my >sound in CPR (I bet they do that on purpose) so the end result is F1RS >doesnt run and CPR is now screwed. >F1RS is going back tommorrow! I tried!! >Later

Are you for real?? THEY DID IT ON PURPOSE?!?!?>> Such a statement is not terribly surprising coming from Mr. Sandman, one of the champion "everybody hates Microsoft" *** theorists/whiners. If someone had a similar result, but installed CPR and had their sound in F1RS screwed up, and then had the temerity to suggest that the CPR installation might be responsible for the sound problem, Mr. Sandman would be all over them like a cheap suit. Sorry, George -- CPR was screwed before it ever came out of the box. Bart Brown

On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:26:03 -0500, "David G Fisher" >Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 >has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't >this deserve criticism? In case it's been forgotten, I do like F1 so I am >not bashing the game but not many people seem to realize this, maybe because >most of the sim drivers here on r.a.s. never tried POD since it is an arcade >type game. Just keep it simple. POD was pure shit, and now F1RS is not the superb game that everyone (not me) thought it first was. I'll keep on playing GP2 with my friends on ONE computer , which you STILL cant do with any other racing game, and sit back and wait until GP3 arrives. Cheers.....Ken Remove "NOSPAM" from address for e-mail _____ _ _ _ _ _ _ ___ ___ ___ !_ _! |_| | | | | \| | _ \| __| \ | | | _ | !_! | .` | !_) | _!| !! / !_! !_! !_!\___/!_!\_!___ /!___!_!\_\

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>On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:26:03 -0500, "David G Fisher" >>Can one person FINALLY address my main of this long thread which is that F1 >>has the same bugs in it that POD had. What do you think of this? Doesn't >Just keep it simple. POD was pure shit, and now F1RS is not the >superb game that everyone (not me) thought it first was. I'll keep on >playing GP2 with my friends on ONE computer, which you STILL cant do >with any other racing game, and sit back and wait until GP3 arrives.

It appears you know nothing about the games you are bashing. Most likely you haven't even played F1RS, nor POD. Both POD and F1RS allow more than one person to race on one computer. First there is the split-screen multiplay option in both games allowing two persons to play simultaneously. Secondly there is the ghost mode, which allows n people to compete each other on the same machine. I don't know how you could have missed these, IF you really had played the two games. As for the excellence of F1RS, who made you the god to decide what people think about F1RS? Judging by the comments, most people do think it is a superb (superior to F1GP2), and magazine and online reviews only seem to agree. Too bad you have a problem with that, but to each his own. What is it with some of these F1GP2 advocates anyway? What makes them like poor framerates, non-variable weather and scripted spin outs so much that they need to try to convince everyone else that they cannot like anything else? *** http://www.netlife.fi/users/ttammi/