F1RS (1.07) T3 Pedal Adjustment--HELP!!!!

Well, after hearing all the raves about F1RS here I quit waiting for the U.S./North American version and got my U.K. import...although the graphics are crisp and the weather effects are awesome, it feels like I am driving in slow motion compared to the blockier but way more effective (for generating a sense of speed) CART:PR. Driving wise, it is too early to tell, but initial impressions are that it feels more like GP2 (canned and over-controlled) than the immensely more realistic CART:PR. However, it took a month of fiddling to get CART:PR to feel like anything other than a bucket of bolts flailing itself uncontrollably all over the road, so I hold out hope for F1RS. My question: I have a T3 and am wondering how to get a respectable pedal set-up. First off, the wheel and pedals are correctly configured and calibrated in Win95 using the ProPanel. The adjustment for sensitivity in F1RS seems to do nothing of the sort. There is only precisely one spot for each of the acceleration and braking that I can use to prevent the two from interfering with each other. The car will idle above its normal idle speed (as though the pedal was being partly depressed) until I turn the sensitivity down to about somewhere in the 25% range (thanks for no digital output of the setting, UbiSoft). When I hit this point, I am left with a functioning but somewhat dull pedal response. The brakes are being applied (as though the pedal was partly depressed) unless I turn the sensitivity down to about 20%. Unfortunately, what I am left with is a pedal that needs to be depressed almost all the way to get any braking action whatsoever. Perhaps this is 80% no effect, as the slider would suggest--except that if I adjust it any higher, the brakes are on the whole time. The cars already have unrealistically high engine deceleration, and driving with the brakes on is ludicrous. Having to push the pedal 80% of the way down before anything happens is equally ludicrous. I am desperately hoping that I am missing something! I thought the braking in CART:PR was bad (only the first 30% of the pedal travel seems to be used), but I realise now that I would rather have the top-end of pedal travel doing the work instead of the bottom-end (if those two bad choices are the only options). I know at least one of you F1RS gurus will be able to shed some light on this as there is no way this sim. could have been pumped-up to its current r.a.s. levels if it has this seemingly obvious control flaw. Thanks in advance for your help. Marc. -- **************************************************************************** Marc Collins "Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine." ****************************************************************************

>Driving wise, it is too early to tell, but initial impressions are that it >feels more like GP2 (canned and over-controlled) than the immensely more >realistic CART:PR. However, it took a month of fiddling to get CART:PR to >feel like anything other than a bucket of bolts flailing itself >uncontrollably all over the road, so I hold out hope for F1RS. Are you sure that you have all of the driving aids off and that you're driving in "realistic" mode. Nothing seems canned to me in the game. I have a Thrustmaster Nascar Pro. I have it set to "combined" mode with the rudder pedal box unchecked. I set the accelerator, brake, and steering to 100%. With this, I get perfectly linear acceleration when I accelerate in idle. If you're getting some acceleration in idle, your controller isn't calibrated correctly. I believe the cars idle at 1600 RPMs. If you set the sensitivity towards the 0% range, you get zero acceleration and braking until the very end of the pedal movement, then 100% acceleration and braking. Some people have reported different behavior when running under Windows NT. Also, the game models the effect of downforce on braking. You can slam on the brakes hard if you're going fast, but you have to ease off of them as you slow down and generate less downforce. In fact, I don't think you can lock the brakes up at high speeds, which I believe is realistic. One other note. The game uses the default 5% deadband, which you can't modify via menus. However, you can patch your DirectInput dll to a different deadband value. I find a 2% deadband works great. You should never have any acceleration when not pressing the pedal, regardless of the sensitivity setting. I sounds like you're getting braking when you don't have your foot on the brake. I haven't noticed any unrealistic engine deceleration. Again, it sounds like you have calibration problems. Are you using the "separate" mode for the T3? I found horrible spiking in this mode when testing in the Pro Panel utility. It is. -- Kevin (Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

Marc, I had the same problem. Does the following sound familiar - when you calibrate your wheel, it also asks you to calibrate the rudder? If this is the case, you need to get hold of Thrustmaster's ProPanel utility, then edit the properties of your wheel to remove the "rudder". For some reason the joystick definition for my wheel (T1 w/o adaptor) had an x-axis, a y-axis, and a rudder; the pedals were being read twice, once as the y-axis and a second time as the rudder. I guess this is what was causing F1RS' problem. If that fixes it, you'll probably want to set your sensitivities in F1RS back to about 80% each - at the 0% end of the scale the controls are pretty much on/off with no measurement inbetween. James [snip] >My question: I have a T3 and am wondering how to get a respectable pedal >set-up. First off, the wheel and pedals are correctly configured and >calibrated in Win95 using the ProPanel. The adjustment for sensitivity in >F1RS seems to do nothing of the sort. There is only precisely one spot for >each of the acceleration and braking that I can use to prevent the two from >interfering with each other. >The car will idle above its normal idle speed (as though the pedal was being >partly depressed) until I turn the sensitivity down to about somewhere in >the 25% range (thanks for no digital output of the setting, UbiSoft). When >I hit this point, I am left with a functioning but somewhat dull pedal >response. >The brakes are being applied (as though the pedal was partly depressed) >unless I turn the sensitivity down to about 20%. Unfortunately, what I am >left with is a pedal that needs to be depressed almost all the way to get >any braking action whatsoever. Perhaps this is 80% no effect, as the slider >would suggest--except that if I adjust it any higher, the brakes are on the >whole time. [snip] >Thanks in advance for your help. >Marc. >-- >************************************************************************* *** >Marc Collins >"Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine." >************************************************************************* *** -- James Bevan NeXTMail & MIME welcome

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>it feels like I am driving in >slow motion compared to the blockier but way more effective (for generating >a sense of speed) CART:PR. >Driving wise, it is too early to tell, but initial impressions are that it >feels more like GP2 (canned and over-controlled) than the immensely more >realistic CART:PR

I'm a freak I guess but I like CPR and F1 too. The problem with F1 is the sense of speed. It does feel like slow motion compared to CPR and this makes it too easy. No, I'm not trying to brag about what a good driver I am. It just seems so slow. Also, too easy to control. F1 is not actually a first release by Ubi Soft. It is really POD2. The reason F1 was made was because Ubi had the POD engine to build with. I got burnt out a year ago on the available sims and tried POD which came bundled with my computer. It hooked me and I became pretty good. I played against the best drivers and competed in the 10,000 contest (did not win :-( ). When I sat down to F1, it felt EXACTLY like I was racing POD with F1 cars and tracks. CPR puts some fear in me when I'm driving fast but I can cruise along yawning with F1. This is not a dig, but I sometimes wonder if the people who complain about CPR and praise F1, like F1 more simply because it's easier and has a better frame rate than CPR on most systems. Again, I like F1 and was/am a fan of the Ubi Soft developers for a long time but F1 is definitely easier than CPR. I've never driven a Champ car or an F1, but I'd assume that 900 hp should scare the hell out of me. Last thing, I have to rip Ubi Soft for the bugs in F1. I've read almost every post on F1 here at r.a.s. and the bugs that were in POD are alive and well in F1. Brings back the POD nightmares. Almost every one of them such as "black sky". Patches that don't work correctly. Since F1 IS NOT an all new product, these bugs appearing all over again is hard to forgive.

> I know at least one of you F1RS gurus will be able to shed some light on > this as there is no way this sim. could have been pumped-up to its current > r.a.s. levels if it has this seemingly obvious control flaw. Have you got "polls with interupts" checked? If so, uncheck it.

Thanks for your help... All aids are off...of course. I am using the T3 ProPanel and all is well there and in the regular "Game Controllers" panel. Combined, no rudder selected. The calibration seems to work perfectly in the panel (under test) and it works perfectly in all my other driving games (about 8). I have/had already applied the DirectX patch and set it to 1% (which works wonders for CART:PR and NFS2). I set the sensitivity to 100% each to test it and I need to depress the brake fully to get the engine speed down to idle in neutral! I don't seem to have a choice in selecting the controller in F1RS--it already says wheel and cannot be changed. I was about to try using the separate mode for the pedals, but you advise against that...any other suggestions as to why only this game seems to react "upside down" (and yes, I have tried it on other tracks than Melbourne :-) ). Thanks again to anyone who can help. Marc.

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>>Driving wise, it is too early to tell, but initial impressions are that it >>feels more like GP2 (canned and over-controlled) than the immensely more >>realistic CART:PR. However, it took a month of fiddling to get CART:PR to >>feel like anything other than a bucket of bolts flailing itself >>uncontrollably all over the road, so I hold out hope for F1RS. >Are you sure that you have all of the driving aids off and that you're >driving in "realistic" mode. Nothing seems canned to me in the game. >>My question: I have a T3 and am wondering how to get a respectable pedal >>set-up. First off, the wheel and pedals are correctly configured and >>calibrated in Win95 using the ProPanel. The adjustment for sensitivity in >>F1RS seems to do nothing of the sort. There is only precisely one spot

for >>each of the acceleration and braking that I can use to prevent the two from >>interfering with each other. >I have a Thrustmaster Nascar Pro. I have it set to "combined" mode with the >rudder pedal box unchecked. I set the accelerator, brake, and steering to >100%. With this, I get perfectly linear acceleration when I accelerate in >idle. If you're getting some acceleration in idle, your controller isn't >calibrated correctly. I believe the cars idle at 1600 RPMs. If you set the

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>sensitivity towards the 0% range, you get zero acceleration and braking >until the very end of the pedal movement, then 100% acceleration and >braking. Some people have reported different behavior when running under >Windows NT. >Also, the game models the effect of downforce on braking. You can slam on >the brakes hard if you're going fast, but you have to ease off of them as >you slow down and generate less downforce. In fact, I don't think you can >lock the brakes up at high speeds, which I believe is realistic. >One other note. The game uses the default 5% deadband, which you can't >modify via menus. However, you can patch your DirectInput dll to a >different deadband value. I find a 2% deadband works great. >>The car will idle above its normal idle speed (as though the pedal was >being >>partly depressed) until I turn the sensitivity down to about somewhere in >>the 25% range (thanks for no digital output of the setting, UbiSoft).

When

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>>I hit this point, I am left with a functioning but somewhat dull pedal >>response. >You should never have any acceleration when not pressing the pedal, >regardless of the sensitivity setting. >>The cars already have unrealistically high engine deceleration, and

driving

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>>with the brakes on is ludicrous. Having to push the pedal 80% of the way >I sounds like you're getting braking when you don't have your foot on the >brake. I haven't noticed any unrealistic engine deceleration. Again, it >sounds like you have calibration problems. Are you using the "separate" >mode for the T3? I found horrible spiking in this mode when testing in the >Pro Panel utility. >>I thought the braking in CART:PR was bad (only the first 30% of the pedal >It is. >-- >Kevin >(Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

Thanks for your reply... I am already using the ProPanel as I said in my original message. Just to be sure, I checked the regular control panel and rudders are not checked. If I set both braking and accel. to 100%, I must depress the brake all the way to get the engine to idle at 1600 r.p.m. It does seem like something is registering backwards or upside down, yet the calibration and test modes work perfectly in the Pro Panel and the pedals respond "normally" in all other games. By the way, the steering seems fine set at 100%. Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated! Marc.

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>Marc, >I had the same problem. Does the following sound familiar - when you >calibrate your wheel, it also asks you to calibrate the rudder? If this >is the case, you need to get hold of Thrustmaster's ProPanel utility, then >edit the properties of your wheel to remove the "rudder". For some reason >the joystick definition for my wheel (T1 w/o adaptor) had an x-axis, a >y-axis, and a rudder; the pedals were being read twice, once as the y-axis >and a second time as the rudder. I guess this is what was causing F1RS' >problem. >If that fixes it, you'll probably want to set your sensitivities in F1RS >back to about 80% each - at the 0% end of the scale the controls are >pretty much on/off with no measurement inbetween. >James >[snip] >>My question: I have a T3 and am wondering how to get a respectable pedal >>set-up. First off, the wheel and pedals are correctly configured and >>calibrated in Win95 using the ProPanel. The adjustment for sensitivity >in >>F1RS seems to do nothing of the sort. There is only precisely one spot >for >>each of the acceleration and braking that I can use to prevent the two >from >>interfering with each other. >>The car will idle above its normal idle speed (as though the pedal was >being >>partly depressed) until I turn the sensitivity down to about somewhere in >>the 25% range (thanks for no digital output of the setting, UbiSoft). >When >>I hit this point, I am left with a functioning but somewhat dull pedal >>response. >>The brakes are being applied (as though the pedal was partly depressed) >>unless I turn the sensitivity down to about 20%. Unfortunately, what I >am >>left with is a pedal that needs to be depressed almost all the way to get >>any braking action whatsoever. Perhaps this is 80% no effect, as the >slider >>would suggest--except that if I adjust it any higher, the brakes are on >the >>whole time. >[snip] >>Thanks in advance for your help. >>Marc. >>-- >>************************************************************************* >*** >>Marc Collins >>"Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine." >>************************************************************************* >*** >-- >James Bevan >NeXTMail & MIME welcome

>Thanks for your help... >All aids are off...of course. The aids screen is scrollable. Make sure that you scrolled down and turned them all off. CPR allows you to set the null zone manually, so I assume patching the Direct input dll will do nothing. You're definitely having controller problems. You might try this. Before you enter the calibration screen, very slightly depress your accelerator and brake. When you calibrate, don't let them come all the way back up. Then when you drive in the game and release a pedal completely, it should register as all of the way off. One other thing. Have you installed the latest patch, which is 1.07? Also, I've read of other people having control problems when they applied the nocd patch. -- Kevin (Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

>If I set both braking and accel. to 100%, I must depress the brake all the >way to get the engine to idle at 1600 r.p.m. It does seem like something is >registering backwards or upside down, yet the calibration and test modes >work perfectly in the Pro Panel and the pedals respond "normally" in all >other games. By the way, the steering seems fine set at 100%. Don't use Pro Panel. Calibrate it in Windows 95. Make sure it is set up as a steering wheel, not a joystick. Also, in F1RS, set the brake/acceleration sensitivity to 80% *not* 100% - it is much more linear that way. Rob

[fbs] This sounds exactly like the problems I experirenced with the unpatched game. I hesitate to suggest it but neverless; are you sure you have the a properly patched V1.07? -- Suck The Goat

No...of course not as that would ruin everything else too. Thanks for the suggestion, though. >> I know at least one of you F1RS gurus will be able to shed some light on >> this as there is no way this sim. could have been pumped-up to its current >> r.a.s. levels if it has this seemingly obvious control flaw. > Have you got "polls with interupts" checked? If so, uncheck it.

How does one tell which version they are running? I applied the patch and the main .exe was updated to that day's date, but I have not discovered where the "Help-->About" button is!! >> Path: broke.demon.co.uk!news.demon.co.uk!demon!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!

None of those suggestions made any difference to my problem, unfortunately...but thanks for trying.

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>>If I set both braking and accel. to 100%, I must depress the brake all the >>way to get the engine to idle at 1600 r.p.m. It does seem like something >is >>registering backwards or upside down, yet the calibration and test modes >>work perfectly in the Pro Panel and the pedals respond "normally" in all >>other games. By the way, the steering seems fine set at 100%. >Don't use Pro Panel. Calibrate it in Windows 95. Make sure it is set up as

a >steering wheel, not a joystick. Also, in F1RS, set the brake/acceleration >sensitivity to 80% *not* 100% - it is much more linear that way. >Rob