Microsoft Cart, car all over the track

I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and sensitivity control with no luck. Any ideas on how to stablize the car? Also, evertime I exting Cart, my desktop icons are shifted all about. Any Ideas. g

Yah. That is one main issue among a ton of others. See any yellow flags? Good "SIM" eh? Take it back. It ain't worth your time or money.

It is very difficult to get a good steering setup in this game. To cut down on sensitivity you can lower the wheel lock setting, increase the null zone (after patching) and setup your wheel as a joystick, instead of a race car controller. Good luck...I've fiddled with the steering for more hours than I've played this game and still can't find a steering setup I actually like. It's either too twitchy or too slow to respond...no middle ground here. Poor coding I guess. That is one of the many reasons this game gathers dust on my shelf and F1RS is getting all my spare time. Better control and better AI! Ken The Game Pad http://gamepad.org/

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> I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro > wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. > The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and > sensitivity control with no luck. > Any ideas on how to stablize the car? > Also, evertime I exting Cart, my desktop icons are shifted all about. > Any Ideas. > g

I can tell you that it will NOT get any better. Even if you do find a set-up you are happy with, it will not be the same next time you start the game ( notice I said game and not "sim" ) Take it back while you still can and get F1RS or even GP2. They are both a lot more fun to drive and much better to look at as well. Don

Don't listen to the bullshit advice from some of these r.a.s. people. My cars handle perfectly. You just need some good setups. E-mail me and I will be glad to help you if you'd like. Dave

Have the same set-up as you and had the same problem...and almost gave up on it. However, now that it is working properly, I can say that CART:PR has phenomenal steering. 1) Make sure you are using the patched version of CART:PR. 2) Get your steering properly calibrated in the Thrustmaster Control Panel. 3) Back off the null zone to 1% or 2%--anything more and the steering will jerk from dead centre to whichever direction you are turning. 4) Set the non-linear adjustment to 0. Anything else is fake--real cars don't have non-linear steering (at least not the way it is programmed into a computer simulation). 5) Set the speed sensitive steering as low as possible. I use 10% (and wish I could use 0) and a little bit of this fakery may be necessary as a wheel controller does not modify its input requirements as you go faster, the way a real car would. 6) Most important!! Get the patch that allows you to modify the DirectX built-in null zone (5%) to a lower setting (again, I use 1%). This improved all the other DirectX games immensely, too. 7) If you are not a car set-up wizard then download some Pro set-ups from The Apex or another CART:PR site. 8) Possibly a last step...re-calibrate everything again now that the DirectX has been altered. As much as people here like to run down CART:PR (and the AI does still suck and there are several other glaring problems that remain after the patch), with proper set-ups and a controller that is properly configured and calibrated it blows away every other sim. on the market except for F1RS in the driving feel realism and accuracy department. A lot of steps, but it is worth it. P.S., Like every other sim., if your frame rates are not high, then the control will suffer commensurately, so also turn-down the graphics if you don't have a high-end video card and/or CPU. Marc.

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>I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro >wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. >The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and >sensitivity control with no luck. >Any ideas on how to stablize the car? >Also, evertime I exting Cart, my desktop icons are shifted all about. >Any Ideas. >g

>6) Most important!! Get the patch that allows you to modify the DirectX >built-in null zone (5%) to a lower setting (again, I use 1%). This improved >all the other DirectX games immensely, too. CPR allows you to set the null zone, so there should be no reason to patch the DirectInput dll (for this game). That default 5% null zone should only be used if the game doesn't allow you to set a null zone and the game chooses to use the default 5% null zone. Also, games don't have to use the default null zone that DirectInput provides. -- Kevin (Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

Sure they do..... > Don't listen to the bullshit advice from some of these r.a.s. people. My > cars handle perfectly. You just need some good setups. E-mail me and I will > be glad to help you if you'd like. > Dave

>I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro >wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. >The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and >sensitivity control with no luck. >Any ideas on how to stablize the car? It takes a combination of setup and steering control adjustments to make it work. If your TM Nascar Pro is fairly new, it probably doesn't need much of a null zone, so leave that at 0-2%. The other thing is that oversteer is heavily built into the setups, so if faster turns are causing your car to jerk all over the place, take out some front wing or add rear wing. I've messed with combinations of settings on the non-linear steering and speed sensitive steering slider. In order to get settings you can live with you really need to determine at what speeds you don't like the handling. If the car is all over the road even at very low speeds, its likely you need to work with the non-linear steering slider, since that isn't affected by speed. Try increasing it to get rid of some of the twitchiness around the middle. Leave speed sensitive steering at 50% or less until you've gotten the low speed stuff taken care of. Once you have, if you find that your car is too quick to jump around at high speeds, try turning up the speed sensitive steering switch up while leaving the nonlinear steering slider alone. Finally, car setup and practice will help the rest. I read all the other responses to your post and its a shame that people just choose to use your question as an excuse to trash the game some more while not making any attempt to answer your question. I'll leave the decision to keep it or take it back to you, but I hope that the above helps you tune the steering more. Its never going to be great, but it might become fairly tolerable. Randy

Ken, That's right Ken, my goal in life is to hang out here on r.a.s. and tell lies. If you would like, why don't you come to the Game Zone and see for yourself how well my cars handle. I can ride inches from the wall all along the straightaway at tracks like Miami and St. Louis and I can handle the street and road courses fine too. The cars respond perfectly to whatever input I give them. The people on the Zone seem to have cars that handle great too. Take a look. The reason they do is because they and I know how to set up a car and how to drive. Maybe when/if you tried CPR the problem was YOU. It simply could be that you can't drive very well. Dave >Sure they do.....

Whatever....I have no time for your infantile insults. Later, Ken

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> Ken, > That's right Ken, my goal in life is to hang out here on r.a.s. and tell > lies. If you would like, why don't you come to the Game Zone and see for > yourself how well my cars handle. I can ride inches from the wall all along > the straightaway at tracks like Miami and St. Louis and I can handle the > street and road courses fine too. The cars respond perfectly to whatever > input I give them. The people on the Zone seem to have cars that handle > great too. Take a look. The reason they do is because they and I know how to > set up a car and how to drive. Maybe when/if you tried CPR the problem was > YOU. It simply could be that you can't drive very well. > Dave > >Sure they do.....

Go to car setup and use the Race Car Engineer feature. The Default car setup is usually soft. On The Question " How does is the car's ride " Choose answer " Tool soft and imprecise." The Race Car engineer will adjust the damper and spring setting to a harder and more precise feel. Try it you'll be surprise how different it feels.

Lets be fair. Some of the problem lies with CPR as well. I decided not even to run the Long Beach CARTorl race today because getting used to driving a CPR car completely wrecks my ability to drive an F1RS car because the physical inputs and oversteering physics model supercede your ability to overcome them with setups or driving controls. CPR can be made more fun, but it takes work. That's one of its biggest problems -- it takes work and a willingness to let go of things you know are wrong in order to properly enjoy it. F1RS, NASCAR 2, and IndyCar 2 didn't suffer from these problems. Randy

>Any ideas on how to stablize the car? Can't help you here - I've never had a problem with my steering... However: I did have this problem, and updated video drivers solved it. Check your video card manufacturer's website for the drivers you need... - Mike. ============================================ Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN My new philosophy is to never explain my philosophies. I wish I could tell you why. ============================================

You also may need the CPR patch - only the patch has the adjustable deadzone setting that some systems need to drive smoothly. I was all over the road too, until the patch allowed me to set a large deadzone. Joe

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> I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro > wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. > The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and > sensitivity control with no luck. > Any ideas on how to stablize the car? > Also, evertime I exting Cart, my desktop icons are shifted all about. > Any Ideas. > g

There's a HIGHLY-active, consumer-friendly Microsoft presence right here in this newsgroup...why, I'll bet they've ALREADY contacted you to help you out with your problems. There are a couple of real MS aces -- Dean Lester and John Browne, who LIVE to see CPR become the "greatest racing sim of all time". Of course, that's what it was *advertised* as when it was released, but hey! They're a small, struggling company, with limited resources to debug anything as complex as a game. Good luck...you'll need it. Bart Brown

I am just telling my experience. I adjusted the in-game null zone as soon as I applied the patch but did achieve "proper" and expected control until after I applied the DirectX patch (with a different game in mind). The difference between the control and feel now and with just the patch applied and none of my other steps is so HUGE that I can't write "huge" big enough to make the point. Marc.

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>>6) Most important!! Get the patch that allows you to modify the DirectX >>built-in null zone (5%) to a lower setting (again, I use 1%). This >improved >>all the other DirectX games immensely, too. >CPR allows you to set the null zone, so there should be no reason to patch >the DirectInput dll (for this game). That default 5% null zone should only >be used if the game doesn't allow you to set a null zone and the game >chooses to use the default 5% null zone. Also, games don't have to use the >default null zone that DirectInput provides. >-- >Kevin >(Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

Perhaps we should rerwrite the whole friggin OS to run this game!! Or maye TRI can fix the piece off shit like thay said they would. Whatever happened to "we will continue to support and fix this game for a long time. Bull ***ing shit. > Have the same set-up as you and had the same problem...and almost gave up on > it. However, now that it is working properly, I can say that CART:PR has > phenomenal steering. > 1) Make sure you are using the patched version of CART:PR. > 2) Get your steering properly calibrated in the Thrustmaster Control Panel. > 3) Back off the null zone to 1% or 2%--anything more and the steering will > jerk from dead centre to whichever direction you are turning. > 4) Set the non-linear adjustment to 0. Anything else is fake--real cars > don't have non-linear steering (at least not the way it is programmed into a > computer simulation). > 5) Set the speed sensitive steering as low as possible. I use 10% (and wish > I could use 0) and a little bit of this fakery may be necessary as a wheel > controller does not modify its input requirements as you go faster, the way > a real car would. > 6) Most important!! Get the patch that allows you to modify the DirectX > built-in null zone (5%) to a lower setting (again, I use 1%). This improved > all the other DirectX games immensely, too. > 7) If you are not a car set-up wizard then download some Pro set-ups from > The Apex or another CART:PR site. > 8) Possibly a last step...re-calibrate everything again now that the DirectX > has been altered. > As much as people here like to run down CART:PR (and the AI does still suck > and there are several other glaring problems that remain after the patch), > with proper set-ups and a controller that is properly configured and > calibrated it blows away every other sim. on the market except for F1RS in

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> the driving feel realism and accuracy department. > A lot of steps, but it is worth it. > P.S., Like every other sim., if your frame rates are not high, then the > control will suffer commensurately, so also turn-down the graphics if you > don't have a high-end video card and/or CPU. > Marc. > >I just got Precision Cart racing from Microsoft. I use a TM Nascar pro > >wheel and pedals. As I drive around the track I am all over the place. > >The steering is very sensitive. I've tried playing with the linear and > >sensitivity control with no luck. > >Any ideas on how to stablize the car? > >Also, evertime I exting Cart, my desktop icons are shifted all about. > >Any Ideas. > >g

Ken, If you were really insulted by my comments then I apologize. I viewed your comments as calling me a liar when I said that I have no problem with the handling of my cars in CPR. Dave >Whatever....I have no time for your infantile insults. > Later, Ken

Of course I meant did NOT achieve "proper"... >I am just telling my experience. I adjusted the in-game null zone as soon >as I applied the patch but did achieve "proper" and expected control until >after I applied the DirectX patch (with a different game in mind). The

OK, and I apologize for the "sure they do " remark. I guess I was a bit pissed at having my advice to the original poster being called bull**** advice-when I was really only trying to help the guy. Didn't mean to imply you are a liar...and should have held my tongue...one of my many weaknsses<BG>!! I just think that the steering in this game is very unrealistic...reguardless of the changes I've made to set up...yes some people may find ways to improve it...but in my opinion it feels more like the car steers with the rear wheels instead of the front ones! Perhaps it is possible to get it right...but I have honestly spent many hours trying and while I've made it much better than the defaults...it still isn't acceptable or realistic to me. Ken The Game Pad http://gamepad.org/

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> Ken, > If you were really insulted by my comments then I apologize. I viewed your > comments as calling me a liar when I said that I have no problem with the > handling of my cars in CPR. > Dave > >Whatever....I have no time for your infantile insults. > > Later, Ken

> CPR allows you to set the null zone, so there should be no reason to patch > the DirectInput dll (for this game). That default 5% null zone should only > be used if the game doesn't allow you to set a null zone and the game > chooses to use the default 5% null zone. Also, games don't have to use the > default null zone that DirectInput provides. Ah hah. I wondered why this was not a problem with F1RS. -- We are the Hosh! You will be assimilated! Lower your defences and surrender! Your technological and biological distinctiveness will be added to our own. Your culture will be adapted to service us. Resistance is futile. Have a nice &*($ing day!

Not necessary because the steps I provided work more than adequately. You are right, though, that news of the next patch and future support for CART:PR is LOOONNNGGGG overdue from MS/TRI. >Perhaps we should rerwrite the whole friggin OS to run this game!! >Or maye TRI can fix the piece off shit like thay said they would. >Whatever happened to "we will continue to support and fix this game for a >long time. >Bull ***ing shit.