Playing N2 by Direct Connect

I want to hook two computers together to play Nascar2 by direct connect,but I want to know if there is away to hook them together some other way besides using a null modem cable. I have heard it can be done with Phone lines,if so I would like to know how to do this. Thanks, Kenneth

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> I want to hook two computers together to play Nascar2 by direct > connect,but I want to know if there is away to hook them together some > other way besides using a null modem cable. I have heard it can be > done with Phone lines,if so I would like to know how to do this. > Thanks, > Kenneth

Some modems will allow a phone line directly from one modem to the other. The problem then is getting the connection made. The Dialing computer won't see a dial tone. The Answer computer won't see a "ring". What you need to do is make to modem to modem connection outside of Nascar2. Run some kind of terminal (communications) program on both computers. Set the com port speed in the terminal program to the same that Nascar2 will use (9600 is what you want) Send to the dialing modem the command to not wait for dial tone (X0 does this for my USR modem) Tell the dialing modem to dial any number. When you hear the beep beep beep from the dialing modem, tell the Answer modem to answer (ATA for my modem) Then hopefully you will see a "connect 9600" on both systems. At that time you need to exit your terminal program yet leave the connection active. (Windows versions may have problems with this step.. I do it in Dos using DSZ.COM (it's old, but handy)) Run Nascar2, Multiplayer, and select Direct Connect. One person answers, the other dials. This direction doesn't have to match the original Dial/Answer from above. You will find that this connection is usually just a little better than a regular phone connection because no phone company hardware is generating noise. mykey

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>> One person answers, the other dials. This direction doesn't have to >> match the original Dial/Answer from above. >> You will find that this connection is usually just a little better than >> a regular phone connection because no phone company hardware is >> generating noise. >But, I can't figure any case in which this mechanism beats a null modem >cable. Each UART in the path will introduce additional latency; it seems >better to me to use only 2 UARTS (one per computer) rather than 4 (one >per computer and one per modem). >If the two computers are so widely separated in the same building to >require a longer line, use line drivers and run straight RS-232 (or 422) >over the physical wires, but don't throw extra modems in there... >To make it work, you'll also probably need a DC bias voltage source. (A >9 V battery is reported to work, but I've never tried it, since I've >never seen an advantage to it...) >---Jim

If I us Ethernet cards are a Null Modem Cable what is the greatest distances the two computers can be apart and still get good performance. Me and may cousin live next door to each other and we have measured it to be about 200 feet . We want to do this in order to keep from tying the phone line up all the time.

> One person answers, the other dials. This direction doesn't have to > match the original Dial/Answer from above. > You will find that this connection is usually just a little better than > a regular phone connection because no phone company hardware is > generating noise. But, I can't figure any case in which this mechanism beats a null modem cable. Each UART in the path will introduce additional latency; it seems better to me to use only 2 UARTS (one per computer) rather than 4 (one per computer and one per modem). If the two computers are so widely separated in the same building to require a longer line, use line drivers and run straight RS-232 (or 422) over the physical wires, but don't throw extra modems in there... To make it work, you'll also probably need a DC bias voltage source. (A 9 V battery is reported to work, but I've never tried it, since I've never seen an advantage to it...) ---Jim

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> >> One person answers, the other dials. This direction doesn't have to > >> match the original Dial/Answer from above. > >> You will find that this connection is usually just a little better than > >> a regular phone connection because no phone company hardware is > >> generating noise. > >But, I can't figure any case in which this mechanism beats a null modem > >cable. Each UART in the path will introduce additional latency; it seems > >better to me to use only 2 UARTS (one per computer) rather than 4 (one > >per computer and one per modem). > >If the two computers are so widely separated in the same building to > >require a longer line, use line drivers and run straight RS-232 (or 422) > >over the physical wires, but don't throw extra modems in there... > >To make it work, you'll also probably need a DC bias voltage source. (A > >9 V battery is reported to work, but I've never tried it, since I've > >never seen an advantage to it...) > >---Jim > If I us Ethernet cards are a Null Modem Cable what is the > greatest distances the two computers can be apart and still get good > performance. > Me and may cousin live next door to each other and we have > measured it to be about 200 feet . > We want to do this in order to keep from tying the phone line > up all the time.

I believe the "magic" number is about 2000' between the furthest nodes on one "chain". The ethernet problem is that if you also have ICR2 or any other game that doesn't support IPX. I haven't seen the message you are responding to, (other that in your qoute) so I'll respond to Jim assuming you didn't edit his message too bad. True.. Null modem is a better way to go, but the original post wanted a solution without null modem. Also, the technical experience to add the electronics you described isn't universal. The method I described only requires parts that these people probably already had. If the software supports is, ethernet is the better (of the choices listed) way to go. I suppose fiber optics would be even better, but who has it handy? mykey

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> If I us Ethernet cards are a Null Modem Cable what is the >greatest distances the two computers can be apart and still get good >performance. > Me and may cousin live next door to each other and we have >measured it to be about 200 feet . > We want to do this in order to keep from tying the phone line >up all the time.

Kenneth, No problem for Ethernet 10-BaseT. Original RS232 (null Most modern equipment can go well beyond that distance without any problems at all. Since all you need is 9.6kbps, if you use good quality, low capacitance, shielded cable it'll will probably work fine. trouble. No guarantees on the null modem route though. Of course, there are also some other networking advantages to using Ethernet. Mike Radler Member - Hawaii Ace League http://www.dithots.org/hal

>If the two computers are so widely separated in the same building to >require a longer line, use line drivers and run straight RS-232 (or 422) >over the physical wires, but don't throw extra modems in there... Agreed, modems are out, but... Once you pay for the line drivers your almost up to the price of the Ethernet cards which will make it easier to hack your next door neighbor's system so he can't beat you ;-) Oops, I meant to say that you would have the other advantages associated with networking. Hmm... I've provided the bias voltage and have seen quite difference. Never tried a battery though... interesting low cost approach. Mike Radler Member - Hawaii Ace League http://www.dithots.org/hal

> I want to hook two computers together to play Nascar2 by direct > connect,but I want to know if there is away to hook them together some > other way besides using a null modem cable. I have heard it can be > done with Phone lines,if so I would like to know how to do this. You're somewhat asking two subtly different questions: 1. Is there a connection method other using null modem cable connected to the serial ports? 2. Can I use phone cable as the physical cable for any solution. 1. Yes, you could use a null modem cable, or Ethernet cables (or two honest-to-goodness modems, but that would be silly) The Null modem cables would connect the two computers serial ports. Ethernet cards are quite cheap, and if it's a semi-permanent condition that you'll have two computers in the same house, I'd spring the $50-$60 or so for two cheap ethernet cards and be able to use networking in the house for other apps than just NASCAR2 (and other null-modem cable games) The easiest way to cable these would be using BNC connected coax cable with appropriate terminators. This avoids having to buy a hub, which is used with unshielded twisted pair ethernet. 2. Depending on the distance involved, phone cable can carry RS-232 (null modem) signals quite well. If you get higher quality (Cat3 or Cat5) "phone cable (unshielded twisted pair)", it can carry ethernet traffic (10-BaseT for Cat3 and 10-BaseT or 100-BaseT for Cat5 cable). Cheapest and least technical competence needed is a null modem cable. Fastest and most expensive is 2 100-Base T and a 100-BaseT hub. In between (on all counts, but perfectly servicable, and the best "bang for the buck" IMO) is 2 10-BaseT cards and optionally a hub (if using UTP cables). ---Jim

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>>> One person answers, the other dials. This direction doesn't have to >>> match the original Dial/Answer from above. >>> You will find that this connection is usually just a little better than >>> a regular phone connection because no phone company hardware is >>> generating noise. >>But, I can't figure any case in which this mechanism beats a null modem >>cable. Each UART in the path will introduce additional latency; it seems >>better to me to use only 2 UARTS (one per computer) rather than 4 (one >>per computer and one per modem). >>If the two computers are so widely separated in the same building to >>require a longer line, use line drivers and run straight RS-232 (or 422) >>over the physical wires, but don't throw extra modems in there... >>To make it work, you'll also probably need a DC bias voltage source. (A >>9 V battery is reported to work, but I've never tried it, since I've >>never seen an advantage to it...) >>---Jim > If I us Ethernet cards are a Null Modem Cable what is the >greatest distances the two computers can be apart and still get good >performance. > Me and may cousin live next door to each other and we have >measured it to be about 200 feet . > We want to do this in order to keep from tying the phone line >up all the time.

Kenneth

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> If I us Ethernet cards are a Null Modem Cable what is the > greatest distances the two computers can be apart and still get good > performance. > Me and may cousin live next door to each other and we have > measured it to be about 200 feet . > We want to do this in order to keep from tying the phone line > up all the time.

10MBps Ethernet is spec'ed to around 150 meters I believe. Null modem cables with differential line drivers are good to several 1000 feet. Without line drivers, I don't know whether 200ft would work (I'd be reluctant to bet on it.) Be very careful to address the issue of isolating the building grounds in either scenario. Your house and his house are not at the same ground potential, and failing to address this problem can cause safety concerns and/or damage to the computers. ---Jim

>Cheapest and least technical competence needed is a null modem cable. >Fastest and most expensive is 2 100-Base T and a 100-BaseT hub. In >between (on all counts, but perfectly servicable, and the best "bang for >the buck" IMO) is 2 10-BaseT cards and optionally a hub (if using UTP >cables). >---Jim I agree with Jim. The best "bang for the buck" is two 10 Mbps cards. Get PCI cards since the end of ISA has been announced. :-) Just some ethernet trivia: 10 BaseT max length is 100m = 328' 10 Base2 max length is 185m = 607' 10 Base5 max length is 500m = 1,640' 10 BaseT uses Category 5 unshielded twisted pair 10 Base2 is sometimes called thinnet or cheapernet. 10 Base5 is sometimes called thicknet. 10 Base2 and 10 Base5 use coax with BNC twist on connectors between "T" connectors for each computer with a 50 ohm terminating resistor at each end of the network. No hub is required here. Max 30 computers. This is usually the cheapest setup for homes and small businesses. With 10 Base2 and 10 Base5, 10 Mbps is the only popular option. 10 BaseT usually requires a hub. I say usually, since in the special case of exactly TWO computers, you can get a special crossover cable made to allow TWO 10 BaseT cards to talk with each other without a hub. This type of wiring allows 10 Mbps and 100 Mbps, depending on the type of cards used. Beware if you are stringing this cable across a public right of way. I am sure there are all sorts of legal problems in that case. -- Best Wishes!!! Robert Huggins Raleigh, NC

> 10 BaseT uses Category 5 unshielded twisted pair Cat 3 meets the spec for 10-T. However, Cat-5 is so cheap that buying Cat-3 now makes little sense. (Using existing Cat-3 stock is fine, so long as you'll never want to go to 100MBps.) I wasn't aware of the 30 computer limit. I also can't think of the technical reason for it, but I'll have to check the network cabling book... Note however, that not all cards can successfully negotiate a connection with another card. (Generally a problem with the Plug-n-Pray 10/100 cards that look to negotiate with a hub on card initialization.) Also beware of grounding issues if connecting to another building. ---Jim