X-CAR: Demo impressions.

Having d/l the 9.6mb. demo and played around with it for some hours, i thought i'd write down some of my impressions. I used a P90 with 32mb ram, Ati-Mach64 graphic card, SB16 and a T2 for my "test" and ran the game in DOS mode. This i what i think: Good stuff: - Wet weather racing. - Pretty fast graphics. - Lots of setup stuff. - Many cars and engines to choose from. - 4 Test tracks. - Cool airjacks in pit! - Spotter function. - Pitboard. (boy did i miss that in N2) - Paintkit Can be improved stuff: - Dash board layout: Way to simple in my view. Tacho with no digits will make it hard to "see" how high you're revving on the various parts of the track. Guess some of those lamps on the dash is for a shift-light etc. - No. of instuments. Fuel and water temp. gauges is a must in a racecar. - Spotter: Kind of weird a "fellow" i would say. I know this is just a demo, but for him to just say "left" and then "clear" is not enough. I feel "he" lack professionalism (sp?). - Sound: Way to low in my view. Engine sound should be louder as should the spotter. (think about it: you're wearing a helmet and an earplug directlly into your ear, hence; you will hear the spotter quite good) - "Controlabillety": The control/steering menu is way to hard to understand and i hope it will get easier once you have a manual to guide you. I for one could not get my T2 to work properlly. - Cars: They kind of look odd, but i guess that's 'cause they're "fantasy-cars". I've heard some rumours about a car editor/builder and that souns great! - Framerates: I feel all the graphics "mumbo-jumbo" steal way to much fps. When i raced in the wet it felt like the car went faster (i.e. more feeling of speed) since the game didn't have to waste to much energy on displaying a whole bunch of thees etc. - Track: To me it looked like the track was way to small compared to the ***bit-view you get inside the car. I'm not quite sure why but to me it looks like the ca take up the whole width of the road. Anyway the ratio between the seating posistion and the track you see, i feel is wrong. - Roadholding: I have to agree with the person who wrote that it seemed like Berthesda (sp?) didn't quite make up their mind as to if they where making an sim or an arcade game. It's quite easy to correct spins and control a "loose" car, in my view way to easy. It's bloddy hard to correct a spin when you're doing 100mph. in a real racecar, belive me - i've tried. With this came you can almost go completely sideways and survive. On the other hand, if you have a car that understeers/pushes you almost have to completely stop to regain some grip. There seem to be a balance problem here. I do however think that the "driving-physics" would be quite good for a rallycross "sim". - Standings: Where are the standings/timesheets during practise? I know this is just a demo, but...... - Wet weather racing: How about rain and not only fog? I think F1GP1 really did a good job on their rain feature. Is it so hard to "copy"? Really bad stuff: - Misc. sound: This really has to go. In a racecar there's no way you'll ever hear the people on the stands cheering when you've got 8.000 rpm's from a V10. No way! That this feature is even there in the first place, strengthens the theory that they didn't know if the should make a sim or an arcade game. - "The hud": What's this s*** doing there in the first place? I know you can toggle it of, but then - how are you going to get all that vital info. Besides the text is way to small and hard to read. - Graphics: All the "mumbo-jumbo" is waisting framerates! You don't see birds flying miles up when you're racing - you consentrate your on the track. I want a sim that _is_ a sim not a movie. Far to much has been put into graphics related stuff instead of the simulation of driving a racecar. - Brakeing: How come no-one's been able to simulate braking as good as they did in GP2? With Carbon/Carbon breaks you sertainly lock-up quite often. I also feel that the difference between using all steel brakes and carbon/carbon was way to little. - Telemetry: Way to difficult to get any sense out of it. Better if they'd dropped it all together. - Ai's: Advanced Ai's it says - well i'm _not_ convinced! The first race i did at Mid-Ohio i lapped the whole field within 8 laps. Okey, it was on rookie but i was a rookie. When i tried Pro. later, i started dead last but passed half the field exiting turn 1. Advanced? Nop. Conclusion: Arcade game or sim? Hard to tell. I do asume i will buy it when it's released, but that will depend upon what types of tracks it contains and what features it's got. Just my $0.02 - any others ?? -- Ed_ - Norway "Early on, the cars were getting faster and faster. And with good reason: everybody was cheating." - Richard Petty

When's the last time you saw a purpose-built race car with a fuel (level) guage? I've never seen one (and in fact, I've argued for removing that guage from our products, but I've always lost... :-) ) ---Jim Sokoloff, Papyrus

> >Can be improved stuff: > >- No. of instuments. Fuel and water temp. gauges is a must in a racecar. > When's the last time you saw a purpose-built race car with a fuel > (level) guage? I've never seen one (and in fact, I've argued for > removing that guage from our products, but I've always lost... :-) ) I can agree with you on this one, but how would you then know how much fuel you got? (please keep in mind that i said that the "hud"-display had to go - so you'll need something to tell you how much fuel you got!) I myself do race in an endurance series with a Mini and yes..... we don't use a fuel gauge. (Hmmm, feels like i'm arguing with myself.... :-))))) As for purpose-built race-cars, try: Porsche 956 Gr. C. Porsche 962 Gr. C Sauber C9 Gr. C. "More" purpose-built racecars than those were, i think it's hard to find.. -- Ed_ - Norway "Early on, the cars were getting faster and faster. And with good reason: everybody was cheating." - Richard Petty

How 'bout have your spotter say " We think you got about a quarter tank left" or whatever? That would be pretty cool! But since these are kinda IMSA cars... which imsa cars have fuel gadges? -- --Kai Fuller Senior Writer of IOR (previously INR) GO Thunderbirds!!!!!!! (WHL)

My impression is that a foam filled fuel cell is incompatible with a fuel level sender (at least the float type). Every race car I've ever seen with a fuel cell has had a fuel pressure guage, which doesn't tell you exactly the same information. (It will eventually tell you when you are about to run out, but it's not a nice analog response like on a passenger car...) ---Jim Sokoloff

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>>Can be improved stuff: >>- No. of instuments. Fuel and water temp. gauges is a must in a racecar. >When's the last time you saw a purpose-built race car with a fuel >(level) guage? I've never seen one (and in fact, I've argued for >removing that guage from our products, but I've always lost... :-) ) >---Jim Sokoloff, Papyrus

Not going to give us any feedback/opinions on Xcar demo, Jim?? C'mon. We know you've tried it. Spill your guts! Richard Scott IGN http://www.applink.net/rscott/ign/welcome.htm

Of course I've tried it. (And I've emailed some comments directly to Bethesda.) My feedback/opinions on the product are not particularly relevant for this public forum; Bethesda is a competitor of Papyrus, and it's not my place to gush about the things I liked in their demo, but it is MOST CERTAINLY inappropriate (IMO) for me to make disparaging comments about any competitor. (It just shows low class.) ---Jim Sokoloff

> My impression is that a foam filled fuel cell is incompatible with a > fuel level sender (at least the float type). Every race car I've ever > seen with a fuel cell has had a fuel pressure guage, which doesn't > tell you exactly the same information. (It will eventually tell you > when you are about to run out, but it's not a nice analog response > like on a passenger car...) I sit with the ATL catalogue in front of me. Aero Tech Labs or ATL is along with PREMIER Fuel Systems regarded as one of the biggest suppliers of fuel-cells. (at least in Europe) They _do_ supply float type fuel level gauges to most of their foam-filled cell's. I also know that U.S supplier JAZ also has gauges to their cell's.(Although I do not use one in the cell i've got in my [endurance racing] Mini.) Down at the workshop we've got a Reynard 89D (ex. Brabham - not quite sure if it was Geoff or David who drove it!). It's got a Premier cell installed and that one's got a pressure system instead of a level gauge. But in F3000 they didn't and don't - re-fuel during a race. So i guess it's a matter of what type of racing you're doing (i.e. sprint, endurance etc.) Yesterday a read thru an issue of Racecar Engineering (don't remember whilch no.) and it had an article about the Thunderbird's (T-birds are go!). There were some pictures from the dashboard in it and i spotted 5 (Autometer - i guess) gauges and a tacho. I know non of the were for fuel level (said so in the text), but mostly for temp's and pressure readings. I imagine then beeing oil (temp and press.), water-temp and fuel-press. But what's the last one for? I live in Norway and WC-car are sort of hard to come by up here....... :-(((( Anyway, having tried the XCAR sim. a little more (and getting more dissapointed) i eventually found a car with a MPG (miles per gallon) gauge. Damn, the more i try it - the worse it get's. Papyrus could have made this one a billion times better......... (hint, hint!) Some new finds: - The "VCR" (replay feature) *really* sucks big time. - Even with all mode's "realistic" - those Ai's sucks. Advanced? NO WAY! - You can only choose how much "pit-work" you would like (# of tires, wings, fuel etc.) in the pits. (Al ICR1) The game seems to go into a pause mode when you're jacked up. Not beeing able to choose "pit-work" before you enter the pit, will make multiplayer races suck! - No difference in sound between the different engines. Everyone who's been to Lemans or Daytona _do_ know that a Flat 6 and a V12 sound's different! - No sound in replay (Yet!). - Road way to narrow compared to the view you get inside the car. - Car control way to "point'ie"..... - Paintkit got alot of potential though..... - Highlight the options in the setup menu and press F1 for help - Wanna race one of those car's that "not avalible in demo"? Go to the paint kit and press load. This brings you to the car menu. DO NOT double click on the car you want, just highlight it and press done. Volia! You got a "new" car! -- Ed_ - Norway "Early on, the cars were getting faster and faster. And with good reason: everybody was cheating." - Richard Petty

Most likely: voltmeter; second most likely: ammeter. ---Jim Sokoloff

>My impression is that a foam filled fuel cell is incompatible with a >fuel level sender (at least the float type). Every race car I've ever >seen with a fuel cell has had a fuel pressure guage, which doesn't >tell you exactly the same information. (It will eventually tell you >when you are about to run out, but it's not a nice analog response >like on a passenger car...) Yeah, but you've also got a crew chief measuring how much gas you're using up and doing a pretty good job of estimating how much fuel you'll need to finish the race. Ever try driving Sears Point while punching buttons on a calculator? Sure, the fuel guage is unrealistic, but so are the in-car tire wear bars and tire temps. Certain compromises are necessary because it's a sim, and you don't have a full pit crew doing all the work for you. Dave Sparks IWCCCARS Project: http://www.theuspits.com/iwcccars Late Night League: http://www.sequoia-dev.com/Hawaii/latenite.html Hawaii Handle: davids

XCAR is NOT a sim! Yep! It's true! I've been playing/testing this demo for some time now and i haven't found anything that makes my verdict change. THIS GAME EVEN HAS MISSILES IN IT !!!! What the ""&"/ are missiles doing in a racing sim ??? Beats me, but if you care to drive missiles with wheels then goto the xcardemo\cars directory. Open the file CAR00.DES with notepad, change the _car 3d data file_ name to missile.3d and then run the game!! Check out exteranl view! Boy this sucks...... -- Ed_ - Norway "Early on, the cars were getting faster and faster. And with good reason: everybody was cheating." - Richard Petty

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> My feedback/opinions on the product are not particularly relevant for > this public forum; Bethesda is a competitor of Papyrus, and it's not > my place to gush about the things I liked in their demo, but it is > MOST CERTAINLY inappropriate (IMO) for me to make disparaging comments > about any competitor. (It just shows low class.) > ---Jim Sokoloff

Right on Jim! That shows class! But Im pretty sure you laughed your ass off after trying it! :>) -DG-

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> >Not going to give us any feedback/opinions on Xcar demo, Jim?? > >C'mon. We know you've tried it. Spill your guts! > Of course I've tried it. (And I've emailed some comments directly to > Bethesda.) > My feedback/opinions on the product are not particularly relevant for > this public forum; Bethesda is a competitor of Papyrus, and it's not > my place to gush about the things I liked in their demo, but it is > MOST CERTAINLY inappropriate (IMO) for me to make disparaging comments > about any competitor. (It just shows low class.) > ---Jim Sokoloff

I like your style Jim! But then that's my own comments, and not that of my employer! :) Clee

Well, why not have your crew cheif buzz in and give you vital info? push F4 and He would tell you what your tire temps were on the last run (after they tested them) and with F5 they could estimate how your tires are doing. Same w\ fuel levels. They could tell you aproximatly how much fuel you have left. I would like nascar 3 or 4 to go in his direction oposed to the "HUD" that's in all of the papy sims right now. my .02 cents anyways -- --Kai Fuller Senior Writer of IOR (previously INR) GO Thunderbirds!!!!!!! (WHL)

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> >Yesterday a read thru an issue of Racecar Engineering (don't remember > >whilch no.) and it had an article about the Thunderbird's (T-birds are > >go!). There were some pictures from the dashboard in it and i spotted 5 > >(Autometer - i guess) gauges and a tacho. I know non of the were for fuel > >level (said so in the text), but mostly for temp's and pressure readings. I > >imagine then beeing oil (temp and press.), water-temp and fuel-press. But > >what's the last one for? > Most likely: voltmeter; second most likely: ammeter. > ---Jim Sokoloff

If it was on a FORD, third guess would be a parking meter!! ":>) -DG-

Haha !!!! Tell that one to Dale Jarrett I'd bet he'd get a kick out of it!

It's called an Easter egg!