NASCAR, ICR2 - The HOG is DEAD!

I just got word from Charlie Heath at Papyrus. He thinks he's finally exterminated the venerable HOG bug. He's been running a test version on the Hawaii servers as verification, and so far, the results look encouraging. The plan is to build a new version of MULTI after he has a chance to go over the logs. For the novice, HOG is short for "Hand-Of-God" and refers to the situation where your car is teleported to a different place on the track for one frame and then back to whence it came. The end result is that you usually end up blowing a motor and flying into the nearest wall at 200+ mph, spewing debris all over the track. I'd like to stand him a virtual drink. Cheers! Dave "davids" Sparks Late Nite League http://www.sequoia-dev.com/Hawaii/latenite.html

Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG????

: I just got word from Charlie Heath at Papyrus. He thinks he's finally : exterminated the venerable HOG bug. He's been running a test version on the : Hawaii servers as verification, and so far, the results look encouraging. : The plan is to build a new version of MULTI after he has a chance to go : over the logs. [snip] : I'd like to stand him a virtual drink. Cheers! I'm sending one along too. This has been haunting them/us since ICR1. Now if they can put this in a patch for ICR2 (along with a yellow flag bug fix), I'll send along a whole virtual keg of one PacNW's finest micro-brews ;-) -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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>I just got word from Charlie Heath at Papyrus. He thinks he's finally >exterminated the venerable HOG bug. He's been running a test version on the >Hawaii servers as verification, and so far, the results look encouraging. >The plan is to build a new version of MULTI after he has a chance to go >over the logs. >For the novice, HOG is short for "Hand-Of-God" and refers to the situation >where your car is teleported to a different place on the track for one >frame and then back to whence it came. The end result is that you usually >end up blowing a motor and flying into the nearest wall at 200+ mph, >spewing debris all over the track. >I'd like to stand him a virtual drink. Cheers! >Dave "davids" Sparks >Late Nite League >http://www.sequoia-dev.com/Hawaii/latenite.html

Thanks, David. Couldn't have made any progress on this one without help from all the folks out there that sent in replay files, as well as the thousands of hours of testing time and logging capabilities we've got with Hawaii. After reviewing all the replays you guys sent in, and talking over the problem with a few other engineers at Papyrus, we finally developed a couple of hypotheses to test out ... and what do you know, we got lucky and trapped the offending conditions which triggered at least one of the variants of the teleport bug (AKA HOG). We've got a bit more testing to do to make sure the fix we've got works and doesn't induce any new problems, and there's still a chance there is more than one trigger for HOG, but I'm pretty confident we'll have a version of MULTI available shortly which zaps the main offender. After that it'll migrate into NASCAR II and any future releases. Thanks again to everyone for helping track this one down. Next on the list: the "delayed green flag" bug on Hawaii ... Charlie Heath, tech lead, NRL Papyrus Design Group

Make sure you get my name correct on the address on the keg...LEVESQUE. :) Adam Papyrus

>Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG???? Now you're jinxed. Someone else on the newsgroup recently made that statement to me, and within a few days got HOGGED. I've had it happen to me at least a half-dozen times in the last 4 months. Dave "davids" Sparks Late Nite League http://www.sequoia-dev.com/Hawaii/latenite.html

: Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG???? God must not even know you exist :-) I've seen his hand way too many times. However, it usually appears at certain tracks and aftering having put in extreme long times at a track. I'm talking about hours 'n hours of the same track. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

> Make sure you get my name correct on the address on the keg...LEVESQUE. :) > Adam > Papyrus Lush.<G> KenH

<lots'a snipping> Way t' go dudes! (and dudettes if applicable) I dunno 'bout the rest of ya, but this is way cool. Here we have normal (sorry Dave, gotta make you 'human' again to push a point) everyday users working with the 'code writers' in a public forum to fix a hard-to-find bug. WAY STINKIN' COOL!! ...kinda what I would envision a newsgroup would be created for in the first place.. Now I've got 'warm fuzzies'... Mike -don'tcha love it when a plan comes together?

> Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG???? For some, it's rare. I've only had one mild case of it and didn't crash when I got transported back to the track. I guess I was braking or something already.... Other people seem to be a magnet to the HOG bug. -which then makes them perfect candidates for beta testing! :-) Mike

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> >Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG???? > Shane, the HOG was pretty rare - maybe once out of 10,000 laps, depending > on the track. That's why it was so elusive for us to fix, since we > couldn't duplicate it; the only clue we had were the replays, and that gave > us something to start looking for. > Our lucky break was that we noticed son of HOG was also happening on Hawaii > servers ... the symptom there was that standings would suddenly go berserk > in the middle of a race for no apparent reason. One day I was puttering > along minding my own business in a Hawaii race, when suddenly I gained a > lap on the field. I decided to look at the server replay, and what'dya > know, on the server my car had teleported to the start finish line. > Bingo; that provided the hook to make something that normally required a > live driver and a few hundred hours of lap time possible to replicate by > putting some snooping code into the Hawaii servers and going to the beach > for the weekend. > Came in Monday morning, and the server logs gave us twenty examples of the > exact conditions we'd been scratching our heads over for three years. > I figure, for the next elusive bug, rather than a day trip to Good Harbor > beach, maybe I'll try a week at Maui. > Charlie Heath > Papyrus Design Group

Speaking of "Hand of God", I had the most unusual thing happen while watching a replay. Two AI cars were in the pit lane, side by side. When the car furthest away from the inside pit wall tried to pit, the "inside" car went through the wall (invisibly), where the pit crew would be, and came back (reappeared) through the wall at it's pit stall. I've seen many "bugs" that do various "weird" things occasionally. The funniest part about this one, was that the car was Lake Speed's. I'm sure many know of his, what some may call extreme, devout religious beliefs. Larry -- ____- /\ ____- /**\ HOME: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2412 __L_- /****\ __J_- /** -- **\ ____- /**/----\**\ Check my HOME Page for ORIGINAL ____- /**/ \**\ Modified Stock Car Stuff! - --- 812 ---

[snip] : Came in Monday morning, and the server logs gave us twenty examples of the : exact conditions we'd been scratching our heads over for three years. : I figure, for the next elusive bug, rather than a day trip to Good Harbor : beach, maybe I'll try a week at Maui. And you have the proof that it will work :) A week at Maui? Does this confirm the rumor about the naming of "Hawaii"? -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

>Funny I've raced both sims alot and never seen the HOG???? Shane, the HOG was pretty rare - maybe once out of 10,000 laps, depending on the track. That's why it was so elusive for us to fix, since we couldn't duplicate it; the only clue we had were the replays, and that gave us something to start looking for. Our lucky break was that we noticed son of HOG was also happening on Hawaii servers ... the symptom there was that standings would suddenly go berserk in the middle of a race for no apparent reason. One day I was puttering along minding my own business in a Hawaii race, when suddenly I gained a lap on the field. I decided to look at the server replay, and what'dya know, on the server my car had teleported to the start finish line. Bingo; that provided the hook to make something that normally required a live driver and a few hundred hours of lap time possible to replicate by putting some snooping code into the Hawaii servers and going to the beach for the weekend. Came in Monday morning, and the server logs gave us twenty examples of the exact conditions we'd been scratching our heads over for three years. I figure, for the next elusive bug, rather than a day trip to Good Harbor beach, maybe I'll try a week at Maui. Charlie Heath Papyrus Design Group

Dunno if this could be considered a bug... but try driving up pit road at Pocono the wrong way (slowly) and turning into one of the "bump outs" between pit road and the track... get ready for a ride. It's spectacular looking on the replay. 8^) -Steve -- ***************************************************************************** Steve Owen "While you sleep, I am plotting world domination." http://members.aol.com/StevenOwen/steve.htm NASCAR, Concerts, Counters & More *****************************************************************************

Wow.. I'm jealous. You get to spend hours 'n hours??? Gee. I am going to have to find a creative way to mix duct tape and child care. Mike

> Wow.. I'm jealous. You get to spend hours 'n hours??? Gee. I am > going to have to find a creative way to mix duct tape and child care. > Mike Hey now, never waste perfectly good duct tape on children (Whoa!). Seriously though, if I'm guessing correctly here, sounds like you and I are in the same boat. Thanks to "downsizing", I've been relegated to "Mr Mom" for the summer also. However, I am blessed with a very cooperative and well behaved nine year old daughter. I don't know why this is so. God knows I wasn't at that age! I do regret, however, not having a son at this point to share my hobbies with. I'm constantly being outvoted by "the women" on suggested activities. Hmmmmm... maybe I could enlarge and print out your post in "poster-size"........<G> Larry -- ____- /\ ____- /**\ HOME: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2412 __L_- /****\ __J_- /** -- **\ ____- /**/----\**\ Check my HOME Page for ORIGINAL ____- /**/ \**\ Modified Stock Car Stuff! - --- 812 ---

Not quite - I'm not the full-time Mr. Mom.... I just "get" to take care of them as soon as I get home. It's not much different, but I "get" to work all day, and then "get to" watch them at night too. So I got my 6 yr old daughter driving Nascar & ICR2... She's not great, but has turned some pretty quick laps at Cleveland and Michigan. You just don't want to be racing against her in H2H... She has no "line" except for the one she is currently on. :-) Great for honing those defensive driving skills! She can beat my wife at ICR2. The kid likes the game, but my wife gets dizzy watching the scenery going by. I guess if we can make her dizzy, the frame rate is good enough. Kind of a 'virtual seasick' thing. Mike "c'mon kids, let's play racecar!"