GP:2 Engine Blowups/Breakdowns

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> Hello all GP-2 racers, > I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you > mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? Are their other > mechanical breakdowns? > Thanx you lucky devils, > Sal V. (Still wating in the USA)

I have tired to overrev the engine, but I haven't been able to blow the engine yet, but I didn't try real hard. OZ has told me that he did have an engine blow by overreving. There are many mechaniccal failures than can occur, and you have control whether they are enabled or not. Some I remember are electrica, tire puncture, transmission, etc. I'm doing this by memory so don't flame me if I misquote. It seemed there was about 8 categories. MadMikey "Sin City Boyz"

Hello all GP-2 racers, I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? Are their other mechanical breakdowns? Thanx you lucky devils, Sal V. (Still wating in the USA)

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> Hello all GP-2 racers, > I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you > mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? Are their other > mechanical breakdowns? > Thanx you lucky devils, > Sal V. (Still wating in the USA)

My son (9 years) was revvin down the straight at Hockenheim and he managed to blow the engine. He was in first gear at the time. That is the only one I've seen in several days and a ton of hours of running GP2. JEB

: I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you : mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter (not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). If you want the most unrealistic part of having a motor blow because of over-reving, then please stick to ICR2 and NCR. If you doubt it, then I can tell you first hand. I drove an ASA stock car at the Milwaukee mile. The car was not mine (it was a rent-a-ride). It was not a race, it was just jump in it and drive. The car was set up with short gears. Therefore, I was on the rev limiter before the start/finish line. That leaves quite a bit of straightaway left. I don't have experience so I kept my foot to the floor boards. I held the car on the limiter for half a straightaway. I did this for 15mins and NEVER blew the motor. So I ask again, why the hell do you want an unrealistic feature?

<snip> What if you were to suddenly change down without braking first?. Can (or even should) a rev limiter handle this? Just wondering, Richard

: : I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you : : mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? : Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most : passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter : (not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). : If you want the most unrealistic part of having a motor blow because of : over-reving, then please stick to ICR2 and NCR. : If you doubt it, then I can tell you first hand. I drove an ASA stock car : at the Milwaukee mile. The car was not mine (it was a rent-a-ride). It : was not a race, it was just jump in it and drive. The car was set up with : short gears. Therefore, I was on the rev limiter before the start/finish : line. That leaves quite a bit of straightaway left. I don't have : experience so I kept my foot to the floor boards. I held the car on the : limiter for half a straightaway. I did this for 15mins and NEVER blew the : motor. : So I ask again, why the hell do you want an unrealistic feature? Ouch, I think you may be a little unrealistic here. 1) You were in a rent-a-ride -- could it not be that they have a rev-limiter to prevent idiot newbies from blowing up their expensive engine? 2) As far as I know NASCAR does not have rev limiters. 3) It is possible to blow an engine even with a rev limiter if the gearing is forced too low, too quickly. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

No. Rev limiters only help in up-shifting. If you downshift too fast, it will blow the engine. I don't care what kind of race car you drive (or sim-drive). This is the case with the Formula 2000 cars I get to drive on Tuesday (the day F1GP2 gets released in the US. Ironic, eh?). If you over-rev them barrelling down the straight, they make a brrrappping noise which is the computer chip cutting the gas intake to the fuel injectors, letting you know you need to lift and lift quick. If you downchange and over-rev the engine, there is nothing to save you. So, although I haven't had a chance to play it (weep, weep), from what I have heard, F1GP2 is very realistic in this respect. > >: I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you > >: mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? > >Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most > >passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter

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> >(not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). > <snip> > >So I ask again, why the hell do you want an unrealistic feature? > What if you were to suddenly change down without braking first?. Can > (or even should) a rev limiter handle this? > Just wondering, > Richard

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>Subject: Re: GP:2 Engine Blowups/Breakdowns >Date: 21 Jul 1996 05:53:16 GMT >: I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you >: mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? >Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most >passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter >(not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). >If you want the most unrealistic part of having a motor blow because of >over-reving, then please stick to ICR2 and NCR. >If you doubt it, then I can tell you first hand. I drove an ASA stock car >at the Milwaukee mile. The car was not mine (it was a rent-a-ride). It >was not a race, it was just jump in it and drive. The car was set up with >short gears. Therefore, I was on the rev limiter before the start/finish >line. That leaves quite a bit of straightaway left. I don't have >experience so I kept my foot to the floor boards. I held the car on the >limiter for half a straightaway. I did this for 15mins and NEVER blew the >motor. >So I ask again, why the hell do you want an unrealistic feature?

Maybe because it's been in arcade games for YEARS, and people got used to it? Anyway, how much did it cost to drive the ASA stocker? It sounds like a BLAST! Eldred ________ Eldred Pickett I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?

>I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Yes In so far as I can tell, there is an RPM governer <rev limiter>, however I'm sure constant driver abuse would increase the probability of 'premature catastophic engine failure'. <g> Yes Regards, --- Cogito Ergo Sum --- * * Fidonet: (temporarily unavailable) * Keiron Rado, Brisbane, Queensland, Australia *

I can't talkt about an Indy car but I can tell you that YES you can over rev a Nascar Stock car, Just ask Jeff Gordon at Pocono last year! As for your ASA rent a ride maybe because they knew you knew nothing about the race car they would put in a rev limiter. Maybe they all have them, ASA is not Nascar though. Gene

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> >I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? > Yes > >Can you >mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? > In so far as I can tell, there is an RPM governer <rev limiter>, > however I'm sure constant driver abuse would increase the probability of > 'premature catastophic engine failure'. <g>

To those wondering about rev limiters in NASCAR, one of the crew chiefs demonstrated one at Pocono last Sunday. Just insert a chip which is set to the desired maximum revs. Rev limiter lights are also used. Chuck Stuart - Mesquite TX USA

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> : I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you > : mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? > Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most > passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter > (not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). > If you want the most unrealistic part of having a motor blow because of > over-reving, then please stick to ICR2 and NCR.SNIP>>>>> > So I ask again, why the hell do you want an unrealistic feature?

HEY BUD! WHAT's YOUR PROBLEM??? I was simply asking a question about the sim. Why don't you ask Jeff Gordon about missing a shift last year at Pocono!? Didn't you watch the race at Pocono yesterday? The Hendrick Team had lock-out levers on the shifter so the drivers couldn't MIS-SHIFT from 3rd to 2nd! Sure I know there are rev limiters but it's still possible to BLOW an engine by DOWNSHIFTING or MISSING a GEAR! You didn't have to downshift that ASA car to go into the corner did you??? Why do some of the F1 cars have those rev warning lights on the top of the steeringwheel or dash? Just to let them know when to shift? I don't think so. What if the rev limiter fails? I'm no expert but I'm allowed to ask questions about a new sim and DON'T NEED YOU TO ANSWER THEM BUDDY! Do you have GP-2 yet and have you tried to see if the engine can blow-up? I've already seen a message that says you can. Later, MUCH LATER! Sal V.

: HEY BUD! WHAT's YOUR PROBLEM??? : I was simply asking a question about the sim. First, let me apologize to Sal. I let the keyboard get ahead of the brain. Sorry. Let me try another approach. F1 cars have computers in them that do all of the engine 'management'. Things such as lifting slightly when shifting, limiting the revs, limiting speed in pits, etc. For upshifting the engine will not blow up because the revs are limited. You can (as I have in real life) hold a car on the limiter without fear of venting it out. Sure it don't sound so pretty good, but she'll hold together. For downshifting, the car WOULD blow up, but the computer won't let it. A NASCAR has a standard 'H' pattern. As I driver they can go from 4th to 1st in one change. However, F1 is sequential and must go 6-5-4-3-2-1. They can NOT skip a gear. The computer will manage the engine to limit the revs on a downshift. Listen to some of the drivers on the in-car shots when they are approaching a corner that requires downshifting. Listen to how fast they go down the gears. Listen to how the engine does not blow up. For realism, I do not want my engine to blow up from over-reving. From mechanical is a whole other story. It's all about computers and engine management. Even if it HAS been in arcade games, so what. Bad AI has been in all of them too, but have they changed that? Only slightly, I guess! :)

Any engine in the world will be blow up on a too quick downshift, except for the cars with intelligent gearbox like the porsches with their Tiptronic Gearbox (and now also Saab I believe). A F1 is not equiped with such electronics and blowups still happens in downshifts, even when they are within rev range.

> : I would like to know if it's possible to BLOW the ENGINE? Can you > : mis-shift or over-rev the engine to make it expire? > Why the hell do you want this. A real F1 car can't do it. Hey, even most > passenger cars won't let you over-rev a motor. It's called a rev limiter > (not to be confused with a speed limiter used during pit stops). WRONG. Most rev limiters deny the engine either sparks or fuel when a specific rev limit is reached. This only removes/reduces the ability to blow the engine when you are shifting up the gearbox. When you are shifting down the gearbox the rev limiter is unable to do anything about the speed of the road wheels affecting the speed of the enging revs, hence a blown engine. This is another way of blowing your engine and is done not as infrequently as you suggest in racing, hence the wish to introduce it into the game for more realism. Regards, Michael Knowles.

Let's see..... Total Porsche cost : $100,000 ish Total F1 cost : $1,000,000 ish Porsche engine/box : $15,000 ish F1 engine/box : $200,000+ F1 isn't exactly well known for cutting corners and saving costs, so you can be pretty sure that the absolute best of every available technology and equipment is used that is within the rules. Since the rules don't ban rev-limiting devices except where they infringe the rules on traction control, computer-controlled downshifts will not cause engine failure. Cheers! John _________________________________ __ _____| |_____ __ ________| |__| :| John Wallace | |__| |________ \ :| |::| :| Team WW Racing TSW | |::| | / > :| |::| :|_________________________________| |::| | < / :|__|::|____/ * Sim Racing News * \____|::|__| \ /______:/ \::/ http://sneezy.dcn.ed.ac.uk/simnews/index.htm \._____\ [link lost in import: /~harmon/simnews]

[snip] While this is true in most race cars with rev limiters, it is _not_ true of modern F1 cars. These cars have fly-by-wire throttles linked with their semi-automatic gearboxes and will not permit a downshift that would blow the engine. This was the major reason for keeping semi-auto gearboxes in 1994, at the time that other driver aids (traction control, ABS) were banned. Less blown engines = more money.

> : HEY BUD! WHAT's YOUR PROBLEM??? > : I was simply asking a question about the sim. > First, let me apologize to Sal. I let the keyboard get ahead of the > brain. Sorry. > SNIP}}}} Apology accepted! I'm starting to wish that I never asked, however the reason I asked was simply because every once and a while I accidently bump the SHIFTER on my T1, causing an UN-WANTED downshift and most of the time this results in a BLOWN engine! This happens in ICR-2 & Nascar Racing. So that's why I asked. Now I bought GP-2 today and also picked up 2 button-switches from the local electronic store wired & mounted them on the spokes of my T1 wheel! So now no need to worry about bumping the shifter and I now change gears with the buttons! The shifter is not active anymore! YEA! Sal V.