RBR - first drive

I finally got my copy (PC edition running Momo Force -red wheel). After reading the previews I had already decided to ignore the driving school for my first run, and just go for it to see what happens, treating the drive as realistically as possible. I wanted to see how I well I could drive the car "out of the box" given that I've done a lot of rally driving (RWD) in the 80s and 90s. Well, I'm proud to say that I made it the end of the Harwood stage in one piece, and without requing assistance. However, I took it reasonably easy, and with a couple of wrong turns and 3 minor offs (ditches, reversing, etc) managed 5 minutes for my first run. The car is great to drive! Its exactly what I expected in terms of realism. I mostly turned into corners using throttle off oversteer, and the car behaved very naturally. I was able to get a few scandos happening, and also some nice sweeping drifts through the esses. Many other reviewers have complained of the car running wide out of tight corners. I didn't find this, but then again I was already sideways into the corners and just used enough throttle to turn to the outside. To be honest, I thought it would much more difficult to learn to drive. Of course I haven't been 10/10ths yet, and the finesse will come through learning the limits. That's enough for now - back to the sim. Tim

I finished the rally school in about an hour, and now trying for some serious times. I love the Finland (snow) stages, but they are nice and easy with plenty of nice sweeping drifts. For a real challenge, the tight, muddy Japanese stages are great. The fast Australian stages are just plain scary. My biggest problem now is disipline - remembering that this is sim, concentrating, and controlling the adrenilin. Fast times really do require smooth driving. Its easy to do in the rally school with little pressure, but once I'm out there its difficult not to overdrive, damage the car, and basically be slow. Now for a few more points: PC/Graphics performance. Its ok, but the framerate is a bit jerky sometimes. I'll need to tweak the video settings. I have a 3.2Ghz P4, but running an older Nvideo GeForce Ti4600 video card. I'm running at 1024x768x32 bit. Graphics quality. I like it a lot. Some people complain that the graphics aren't as spectacular as some of the other games out there, but like everything else about the game, the focus is on realism. The colours are quite natural and neutral, but those used to the F1 or Nascar series might consider RBR colours to be a little washed out. Let me put it this way, I feel like I'm on a real road, and get all the visual clues I need, rather than having the graphics stand out and distract me by being too ultra-realistic. Car physics - bloody fantastic. You can really feel all the camber, pot-holes, puddles and everything else you experience. The throttle has to be used just like in reality - you can only occasionally get away with full throttle for more than a second or two, but when you do, you really notice it! One of the outstanding aspects of the realism is when I crest a hill a touch too fast, or approach a fast sweeper too quickly. I get this momentary butterfly feeling in my stomach that is really quite scary! This game is like a fine wine. It needs to be sipped and appreicated as your palate takes in the all subtleties. It won't be case of taking a day or two to master it, then just try and improve my stage times by a few tenths at a time. The real challenge will be doing the full seasons to become a champion instead of a hot lapper. This will require careful risk analysis, keeping the car in decent shape for the next stage, and slowing building up competence over time. I want to back into real rallying soon, and feel that this will genuinely help my training. The only major downside is a lack of online "connection". It doesn't have to be head to head, but it would be great to be able to chat and spectate other drivers whilst taking turns on the stages, and being able to view other's replays and ghost them against my own driving style. I haven't touched the car setups yet - one thing at a time. Tim

In article <3Xh_c.291$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (eppy) wrote: > Car physics - bloody fantastic. You can really feel all the camber, > pot-holes, puddles and everything else you experience. The throttle has > to be used just like in reality - you can only occasionally get away > with full throttle for more than a second or two, but when you do, you > really notice it! Thanks for the extensive feedback, especially from someone who knows what they're talking about. I'm really looking forward to this hitting my mat now. Previously I'd kept my hopes under control because we've been promised an excellent rally sim so many times in the past! Andrew McP

Thanks for the extensive first review. I see that you have a pretty fast CPU. Does anyone know how smoothly RBR would run on an AthlonXP2100 with a Radeon 9700 Pro? Anyone know if there's a demo to be downloaded somewhere? Thanks! eppy wrote:

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> I finished the rally school in about an hour, and now trying for some > serious times. I love the Finland (snow) stages, but they are nice and easy > with plenty of nice sweeping drifts. > > For a real challenge, the tight, muddy Japanese stages are great. The fast > Australian stages are just plain scary. > > My biggest problem now is disipline - remembering that this is sim, > concentrating, and controlling the adrenilin. Fast times really do require > smooth driving. Its easy to do in the rally school with little pressure, but > once I'm out there its difficult not to overdrive, damage the car, and > basically be slow. > > Now for a few more points: > > PC/Graphics performance. Its ok, but the framerate is a bit jerky sometimes. > I'll need to tweak the video settings. I have a 3.2Ghz P4, but running an > older Nvideo GeForce Ti4600 video card. I'm running at 1024x768x32 bit. > > Graphics quality. I like it a lot. Some people complain that the graphics > aren't as spectacular as some of the other games out there, but like > everything else about the game, the focus is on realism. The colours are > quite natural and neutral, but those used to the F1 or Nascar series might > consider RBR colours to be a little washed out. Let me put it this way, I > feel like I'm on a real road, and get all the visual clues I need, rather > than having the graphics stand out and distract me by being too > ultra-realistic. > > Car physics - bloody fantastic. You can really feel all the camber, > pot-holes, puddles and everything else you experience. The throttle has to > be used just like in reality - you can only occasionally get away with full > throttle for more than a second or two, but when you do, you really notice > it! > > One of the outstanding aspects of the realism is when I crest a hill a touch > too fast, or approach a fast sweeper too quickly. I get this momentary > butterfly feeling in my stomach that is really quite scary! > > This game is like a fine wine. It needs to be sipped and appreicated as your > palate takes in the all subtleties. It won't be case of taking a day or two > to master it, then just try and improve my stage times by a few tenths at a > time. The real challenge will be doing the full seasons to become a champion > instead of a hot lapper. This will require careful risk analysis, keeping > the car in decent shape for the next stage, and slowing building up > competence over time. I want to back into real rallying soon, and feel that > this will genuinely help my training. > > The only major downside is a lack of online "connection". It doesn't have to > be head to head, but it would be great to be able to chat and spectate other > drivers whilst taking turns on the stages, and being able to view other's > replays and ghost them against my own driving style. > > I haven't touched the car setups yet - one thing at a time. > > Tim

Thanks for the extensive first review. I see that you have a pretty fast CPU. Does anyone know how smoothly RBR would run on an AthlonXP2100 with a Radeon 9700 Pro? Anyone know if there's a demo to be downloaded somewhere? Thanks!

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> I finished the rally school in about an hour, and now trying for some > serious times. I love the Finland (snow) stages, but they are nice and easy > with plenty of nice sweeping drifts. > For a real challenge, the tight, muddy Japanese stages are great. The fast > Australian stages are just plain scary. > My biggest problem now is disipline - remembering that this is sim, > concentrating, and controlling the adrenilin. Fast times really do require > smooth driving. Its easy to do in the rally school with little pressure, but > once I'm out there its difficult not to overdrive, damage the car, and > basically be slow. > Now for a few more points: > PC/Graphics performance. Its ok, but the framerate is a bit jerky sometimes. > I'll need to tweak the video settings. I have a 3.2Ghz P4, but running an > older Nvideo GeForce Ti4600 video card. I'm running at 1024x768x32 bit. > Graphics quality. I like it a lot. Some people complain that the graphics > aren't as spectacular as some of the other games out there, but like > everything else about the game, the focus is on realism. The colours are > quite natural and neutral, but those used to the F1 or Nascar series might > consider RBR colours to be a little washed out. Let me put it this way, I > feel like I'm on a real road, and get all the visual clues I need, rather > than having the graphics stand out and distract me by being too > ultra-realistic. > Car physics - ***y fantastic. You can really feel all the camber, > pot-holes, puddles and everything else you experience. The throttle has to > be used just like in reality - you can only occasionally get away with full > throttle for more than a second or two, but when you do, you really notice > it! > One of the outstanding aspects of the realism is when I crest a hill a touch > too fast, or approach a fast sweeper too quickly. I get this momentary > butterfly feeling in my stomach that is really quite scary! > This game is like a fine wine. It needs to be sipped and appreicated as your > palate takes in the all subtleties. It won't be case of taking a day or two > to master it, then just try and improve my stage times by a few tenths at a > time. The real challenge will be doing the full seasons to become a champion > instead of a hot lapper. This will require careful risk analysis, keeping > the car in decent shape for the next stage, and slowing building up > competence over time. I want to back into real rallying soon, and feel that > this will genuinely help my training. > The only major downside is a lack of online "connection". It doesn't have to > be head to head, but it would be great to be able to chat and spectate other > drivers whilst taking turns on the stages, and being able to view other's > replays and ghost them against my own driving style. > I haven't touched the car setups yet - one thing at a time. > Tim

Great review; can't wait for mine to arrive now! I have an old TM Ferrari FFB wheel which has been great so I hope it performs well. I have a P4 2.4 with the same video card (MSI) and 1GB of RAM; I'm hoping I can run smoothly at 1024x768x32... - F50 GT eppy wrote: > PC/Graphics performance. Its ok, but the framerate is a bit jerky sometimes. > I'll need to tweak the video settings. I have a 3.2Ghz P4, but running an > older Nvideo GeForce Ti4600 video card. I'm running at 1024x768x32 bit.

Thanks for the positive feedback of my reviews today. This is my last one, as my shoulders and hands are killing me - its time to get out of here and enjoy the late English summer! Roadside Objects This has the best moddelling of roadside objects that I've experienced. Each object has the mass and density that you would expect, and you can really feel it when you run into things. On the rally school stage there is a wooden fence running along the road. Glancing into it rusults in a solid thud and spin, with the wooden posts all flying off in an incredibly realistic geometric progression - you'll have to wait a replay on your own copy to appreciate this. Another glimpse of attention to detail was when I understeered coming into a fast sweeper and head butted the start of the armco on the outside of the road. The "head" at the start of the armco dented (don't ask about my car!), and then I noticed the first 5 meters of railing slghtly resonate for a couple of seconds, quickly increasing in frequency and decreasing in distortion, just like you would expect from a legth of thin, fairly solid metal. The only roadside object I didn't enjoy hitting was the Marshall. I won't go into the details of seeing red... Driving a realistic WRC car. Most of you will be thinking - "hey, I can handle this, I know how to handle oversteer". You'll learn this is false assumption on the first corner - RBR is all about handling understeer. 4WD rally cars pull as well as push. Their natural tendancy is to understeer at the limit especially at low speed. If you turn in and try to accellerate hard out of a 90 degree corner, you'll just understeer straight off the road. These cars have to be chucked sideways into the tigher corners, but dont' rely on the brakes to do so. Setting up rear wheel brake bias might help on these corners, but good luck the first time you approach a fast downhill sweeper and need to brake! The cars really do require judicious use of the hand-brake on any over 90 degrees, and for medium speed curves you'll need to unbalance the car to get turn-in before power-sliding through the corner on opening curves, or usng throttle off oversteer on tightengin curves. RBR really makes you think! Not only do you have to master at least 4 very different ways of sliding a car, but make spilt second decisions when driving as to which approach to commit to. I think the key that will determine the really outstanding drivers is how they cope with the situations where they have over-cooked things a bit. To beome a fast driver, you'll always be looking down the road the and making sub-concious decisions about how to take the 2nd and 3rd curves ahead as you are already commiting to the current curve. For example, you may find that the crest of the hill you're on with an opening left hander at the bottom is more sudden than you expected. The road is turning slightly right as you go over the crest and you feel the car getting light. What are you thinking? Many drivers will be thinking about how to get through the crest saftely. They'll want to ride out the crest with a little more right lock, calculating that the understeer won't be bad enough to run entirely off the road. These drivers will make it through the crest ok, but plough off the road at bottom of the hill. The really good drivers will be focusing on the left hander at the bottom of hill, which they were planning to power oversteer around. As the car crests, they'll throw on plenty of right lock and trip the car into oversteer as the weight transfer to the front over the crest. The'll then throw on full opposite (left) lock and brake coming down the hill in order to both slow the car down and set the car up for the left hander at the bottom, effecting a double scando over the crest and down the hill. The reason I mention this scenario is that it happened to me on a RBR stage. Aferwards, I realised that I just relied on real world experience to get me through, as all the thinking above happend at the sublimininal level in a second or so. Never on a PC sim before have I just re-acted in a such reflex (real world) way before in a complicated situation and found that it just worked. Bfn, Tim

"eppy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:0Dh_c.283$[email hidden]...

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>I finally got my copy (PC edition running Momo Force -red wheel). > > After reading the previews I had already decided to ignore the driving > school for my first run, and just go for it to see what happens, treating > the drive as realistically as possible. I wanted to see how I well I could > drive the car "out of the box" given that I've done a lot of rally driving > (RWD) in the 80s and 90s. > > Well, I'm proud to say that I made it the end of the Harwood stage in one > piece, and without requing assistance. However, I took it reasonably easy, > and with a couple of wrong turns and 3 minor offs (ditches, reversing, > etc) managed 5 minutes for my first run. > > The car is great to drive! Its exactly what I expected in terms of > realism.

Hearing this from someone who has actually driven a Rally car means something. It has to be good. I only ran a bit of the Rally School. I couldn't say whether it drove like a Rally car or not, having never driven such cars in real life. All I know is that it feels different than any Rally game I've tried, and I've tried all of them. :) Alanb

> Many other reviewers have complained of the car running wide out of tight > corners. I didn't find this, but then again I was already sideways into > the corners and just used enough throttle to turn to the outside. Sounds like they were locking the brakes. You almost need to play with headphones in order to hear the skidding sound when you've locked the wheels up. It's quite easy to lockup on loose surfaces at low speeds but once you're conscious of it, you can avoid it and as you say, you really need to enter >90deg corners sidways in order get through them properly.

Steve Simpson wrote: > Sounds like they were locking the brakes. You almost need to play with > headphones in order to hear the skidding sound when you've locked the wheels > up. It's quite easy to lockup on loose surfaces at low speeds but once > you're conscious of it, you can avoid it and as you say, you really need to > enter >90deg corners sidways in order get through them properly. doubt locking brakes was the issue... I go into quite a few corners slithering around under locked brakes no worries. It'd just be the fact that they weren't entering sideways, as you say... I don't think the game is that difficult that it can't be appreciated by someone who enjoys driving after a bit of play. If the reviewers don't enjoy driving then buggers me what they're doing reviewing a driving sim. Charlie

> I don't think the game is that difficult that it can't be appreciated by > someone who enjoys driving after a bit of play. If the reviewers don't > enjoy driving then buggers me what they're doing reviewing a driving > sim. Agreed. They sit through 20 hours of fragging imps, they should really take some time to really get to learn how to drive. I've played RBR for an hour and a half now and I can get through any of the stages without much problem if I drive carefully.. that's quite exciting, and I can't wait to start pushing the limit quite a bit more. Of course, I do have some "seat" time with a lot of other rally games.. but I'd say any reviewer could be a decent driver with only a few hours of practice, especially after the rally school. So I don't see what the reviewers problems are with this game... maybe not enough flash for them.

"Charlie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Steve Simpson wrote: > >> Sounds like they were locking the brakes. You almost need to play with >> headphones in order to hear the skidding sound when you've locked the >> wheels >> up. It's quite easy to lockup on loose surfaces at low speeds but once >> you're conscious of it, you can avoid it and as you say, you really need >> to >> enter >90deg corners sidways in order get through them properly. > > doubt locking brakes was the issue... I go into quite a few corners > slithering around under locked brakes no worries. It'd just be the fact > that they weren't entering sideways, as you say... > > I don't think the game is that difficult that it can't be appreciated by > someone who enjoys driving after a bit of play. If the reviewers don't > enjoy driving then buggers me what they're doing reviewing a driving > sim. > > Charlie

I agree. Driving RBR is not terribly difficult. It just takes some practice to run fast, that's all. Now with the XBox version and a controller, though not impossible, driving has to be more difficult than using a wheel with a PC. Alanb

> I don't think the game is that difficult that it can't be appreciated by > someone who enjoys driving after a bit of play. If the reviewers don't > enjoy driving then buggers me what they're doing reviewing a driving > sim. Agreed. Good point.