Papy: ICR2 DOS patch??

------------ Graph of my ICR2 patch-patience (i.e., it's wearing ---------- awful thin). Original ICR2 installed on my machine -------- 11/25/95 12:53:38 pm. First "official" announcement ------ of the patch for bugs in ICR2 came almost 5 months ---- ago. The following is a copied message from Papyrus -- Tech Support: Subj: Re:ICR2 bug fixes ??? Date: 96-02-16 16:31:47 EST From: Papyrus2 -- in a couple of weeks from now. Steve, Papyrus ----------- end copied messages ------------------- I think I have been VERY VERY patient... Beware the fury of a patient man. John Dryden (1631-1700), English poet. Patience, the beggar's virtue, Shall find no harbour here. Philip Massinger (1583-1640) Patience. A minor form of despair disguised as a virtue. Ambrose Bierce (1842-1914) -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

[snip] Yeah, I'm so miffed about this that I might just have to go out to the software store and buy GP2 to get over it. :-) I used to be a satisfied Sierra customer (Front Page Sports Football/Baseball), but what they've done with FPSF96, FPSB96, and the ICR2 patch has been a disgrace. -- +------------------+--------------------------------------------+ | G. Warren Abao | Official BBL Jacksonville Jaguars Website: | +------------------++------------------------+------------------+ | SPOOOOOOOOOOON!!! | BBL Jacksonville 9-7 | IFL Chicago 10-6 | +-------------------+------------------------+------------------+

I have been taking a very "quiet" approach to this whole patch thing. I have given Sierra/Papy every benefit of the doubt. However, I ran across something that was very alarming today on Compuserve. It really doesn't relate to the patch but, instead, to the apparent "non customer oriented" attitude of Sierra/Papy. A guy posted a msg to Technical Support on the Sierra forum. He was having trouble getting voice recognition to work in the new MAC version of Indy Car. Technical support's response was that "voice recognition is an UNSUPPORTED FEATURE" The original "poster" responded by pointing out that the box (the sim came in) clearly stated that this was a FEATURE for the MAC version. Technical support again responded that this was an "unsupported feature" and instructed the gentleman to return/exchange the game if he was unhappy. If this technical support guy is incorrect, Sierra needs to educate their personnel. If this guy is correct, Sierra has comitted FRAUD. I don't ever remember this sort of problem with Papyrus. Maybe Papyrus needs to think about getting the hell away from Sierra. -------------- Michael Kirton

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>I have been taking a very "quiet" approach to this whole patch thing. >I have given Sierra/Papy every benefit of the doubt. However, I ran >across something that was very alarming today on Compuserve. It really >doesn't relate to the patch but, instead, to the apparent "non >customer oriented" attitude of Sierra/Papy. >A guy posted a msg to Technical Support on the Sierra forum. He was >having trouble getting voice recognition to work in the new MAC >version of Indy Car. Technical support's response was that "voice >recognition is an UNSUPPORTED FEATURE" The original "poster" responded >by pointing out that the box (the sim came in) clearly stated that >this was a FEATURE for the MAC version. Technical support again >responded that this was an "unsupported feature" and instructed the >gentleman to return/exchange the game if he was unhappy. >If this technical support guy is incorrect, Sierra needs to educate >their personnel. If this guy is correct, Sierra has comitted FRAUD. I >don't ever remember this sort of problem with Papyrus. Maybe Papyrus >needs to think about getting the hell away from Sierra.

I read this same thread on Compuserve today as well, and I could not believe it. I have purchased every Papyrus product since Indianapolis 500 - The Simulation(as I'm sure most eveyone here has). The last three Novembers(Indycar 1, Nascar, Indycar 2) have been like an early Christmas for me. Papyrus always had a great BBS, and pretty good tech support. I once got tech support on the BBS on a Sunday(Memorial Day Weekend) to help me get my freshly installed Indianapolis Motor Speedway track pack working properly!!! I also greatly appreciate the job Ed, Scott, and Rick have done answering everyone's questions and flames over the past months. Not many other companies would do this(although in this day and age it should be a given). However, this Windows 95/Dos /Mac release of Indycar 2 has been a fiasco no matter how you look at it. I bought Indycar 2 for DOS the day it came out and have enjoyed it bugs and all. I've been waiting for the patch since I first heard of it in Jan. 96. Rick definitely stated that the patch would be available to us for download in the middle of June, and that it would include the Windows 95 update. Apparently, he didn't have the authority to state this, and upon his departure from Sierra/Papyrus, Ed who had nothing to do with the Indycar project had to take the heat. So the Win95/DOS/Mac version appeared in the stores for everyone to buy, but still no DOS patch for us original buyers. So, being the freak that I am, I went and bought the thing. Don't bother with the Windows 95 version. It has a very good interface, menus, painkit, etc. but it is just not worth the installation hassles/performance hit(Windows 95 fault, not Papyrus). Fortunately, I don't have a Mac, so I do not know if the voice recognition is not functional. However, I do know that it is clearly stated on the box, and in the manual. This was used heavily as a selling point for the Mac version. I sincerely hope that the Sierra employee on Compuserve is confused, if not, this type of customer service/false advertising is just unexcusable. Is it Sierra? Papyrus? Who? I believe the industry as a whole is the problem. I am a programmer who has been working on a project for 2 years, so I know what it takes; testing, time, money, blah, blah, blah. There is no other industry that could get away with the consistent release of buggy, poorly documented, terribly supported products like the computer *** industry does. And its people like me that are to blame, because after countless frustrations and thousands of dollars spent, I can't stop myself from rushing out to by the next BIG game.Sierra brought me some of my fondest memories of computer ***(Space Quest/King Quest/Heroes Quest, etc.). But over the last few years, they have become one of the worst offenders(anyone else buy Outpost?!!), especially in customer support. It should take more than the ability to say the phrase "Have you created a boot disk yet?" to make you a tech support person. I always considered Papyrus one of the best companies out there, and I know I will still be first in line to buy Nascar 2 no matter what. However, the consumers need to voice their dissatisfaction if anything is going to change. I suspect and hope these most recent frustrations are the fault of Sierra, but don't forget that Indycar 1 claimed head to head modem support when it first came out, but a patch actually added that a few months later. Hmmm..... Don Chapman --------------------------- "Waiter there is a fly in my soup." "We are working on that sir, please eat around it for now and we will let you know when you can pay to have it fixed."

> Maybe Papyrus > needs to think about getting the hell away from Sierra. > -------------- > Michael Kirton Are you kidding, they all took their stock options and now don't give a damn. Why do you think Rick Genter left? They got their money. That's what it's about.. start a company, build a good selling product, sell it to a bigger one, cash in and leave. The windows 95 version is terrible, the control lag renders it unplayable for serious racing. Why you have to run the paintkit in 256 color mode is beyond me, surely they could have dealt with the palette issue in some way. I would like to use it, but I'm not going to have windows thrash through my icons and screen to reduce color depth for it. None of my other software has problems with higher resolutions.. the frame rate counter screws up begins flashing a third digit...

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>> Maybe Papyrus >> needs to think about getting the hell away from Sierra. >> -------------- >> Michael Kirton >Are you kidding, they all took their stock options and now don't give a >damn. Why do you think Rick Genter left? They got their money. That's >what it's about.. start a company, build a good selling product, sell it >to a bigger one, cash in and leave. The windows 95 version is terrible, >the control lag renders it unplayable for serious racing. Why you have >to run the paintkit in 256 color mode is beyond me, surely they could >have dealt with the palette issue in some way. I would like to use it, >but I'm not going to have windows thrash through my icons and screen to >reduce color depth for it. None of my other software has problems with >higher resolutions.. the frame rate counter screws up begins flashing a >third digit...

If this is the Jeff Haas that I used to know then I surprised at you. You of all people should know that Rick was an employee of Papyrus and did not own stock in the company. For all we know, Rick may have had long term plans to start his own comapny. Perhaps his only obligation was to "finish" the project he had been working on before he could leave. Making Rick out to be a money g*** is plain wrong. He always had time for an ex-tech support person like myself to explain what was going on. Your other points may be valid...I don't know as I don't have Win 95. Mike

Technical support's response was that "voice

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> recognition is an UNSUPPORTED FEATURE" The original "poster" responded > by pointing out that the box (the sim came in) clearly stated that > this was a FEATURE for the MAC version. Technical support again > responded that this was an "unsupported feature" and instructed the > gentleman to return/exchange the game if he was unhappy. > don't ever remember this sort of problem with Papyrus. Maybe Papyrus > needs to think about getting the hell away from Sierra. > Michael Kirton

You're right! Sierra (in my previuos experience)have always been a bunch of ***ers!! Papyrus,on the other hand was always helpful and freely informative... Getting involved with Sierra,was a serious mistake,but it may have been a case of "no choice". In any event...the papyrus people,still seem to be doing their bit,to keep us all happy,unless of course,Coroprate gagging takes place to keep them quiet.. SO...we need to appreciate the help we get from them,when they are able. Sierra is not dedeicated enough to it's products... rgs

>This seems to be a recuring theme in ras. Although Ed and the guys can't voice their >true feelings, it must be terribly frustrating for the Papyrus tech group. Reference the >heat they have taken lately for promising things they were used to being able to deliver >but which were now clearly out of their control. >Chuck Stuart - Mesquite TX USA I have a feeling you are right. -------------- Michael Kirton