For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's
after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is what you've been
waiting for!
Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the
open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com &
follow the links to the Papyrus area):
http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm
You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test.
Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide (included in the client
as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the ride of your life!
We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get a busy signal,
PLEASE try again later.
See you online!!!
Ed Martin
Papyrus Design Group
★ Landmark threadPapyrus opens beta of multiplayer NASCAR Racing (Hawaii)
Papyrus announced the open beta of multiplayer NASCAR Racing, the Papyrus Network client nicknamed 'Hawaii'. The HAWAII.EXE client was downloaded from Sierra's site and BBS and connected by long-distance dial-up to a Boston server. Beta testers praised racing against people, while others raised long-distance costs, latency, modem trouble and wreckers. Ed Martin said Papyrus wanted to cut costs, and Rick Genter explained why typical internet latency made TCP/IP racing impractical at the time.
With Ed Martin (Papyrus); Rick Genter (Papyrus)
Automated summary.
Quoted text (7 lines)
> Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the > open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & > follow the links to the Papyrus area): > http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm > You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test.Quoted text (8 lines)
> Well, the Papyrus Home page looks the same as always (with no news about the > miltiplayer client) and www.sierra.com responds with a server error. How and > where can we get the needed software? > -- > Eric T. Busch > Emory University> Eric,
> I just double checked www.sierra.com & it is up. Try it again. If you
> still have a problem there, the client will also be posted on AOL &
> CompuServe (keyword / go SIERRA). It may take time for www.siarra.com,
> AOL & CompuServe to recycle with the new info...
Hm... I still can't connect to http://www.sierra.com This is what I get:
--
Server Error
This server has encountered an internal error which prevents it from fulfilling
your request. The most likely cause is a
misconfiguration. Please ask the administrator to look for messages in the
server's error log.
--
I can however, connect to the Papyrus Page itself fine at:
http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm but there is no sign of the
multi-player service there. Is the software available at a ftp site? I already
tried ftp.std.com with no luck.
--
Eric T. Busch
Emory University
Quoted text (15 lines)
>For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's >after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is what you've been >waiting for! >Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the >open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & >follow the links to the Papyrus area): >http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test. >Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide (included in the client >as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the ride of your life! >We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get a busy signal, >PLEASE try again later. >See you online!!! >Ed Martin >Papyrus Design GroupNever mind, I just saw the notice, it is ok for us to say things...
Ok, for all you guys who have been waiting for this, here's the beef
so to speak...
I've been Lucky enough to beta test this network since Jan, and I can
honestly say it's changed my entire attitude about this sim. It's
just not fun any more to play against the computer. There is
absolutely NOTHING like racing against 20 -30 other guys!
For everyone who's wondering, here are the things that are different
from the "home" version to the one online. There is a lot of stuff
online that has been added, alot of which some of us have been begging
for for a while.
If you loose the car coming out of turn 2, and smash the car up bad...
no prob, just head to the pits, and start to repair the damage..what
the pace car is coming around... tell the pit crew to stop repairing
the damage, and head back out without loosing a lap!
If not, let's say you have suspension damage and can't continue, then
hey call the friendly tow truck, and it'll whip right out and pick you
up!
There are some other things, but I don't know exactly how far we can
go...
Anyway, I can say this, it's absolutely the most fun I've ever had on
a computer system... I mean the MOST.
You can start racing series like the one's online here and and compete
against each other, only you don't have to compare stats or wonder if
anyone's cheating cuz if someone's plowing through the field, buddy
you'll know it!
Or you can opt to run short sprint races against anyone that's***
around!
Everyone is assigned a skill level from 0-15 and it goes up or down
depending on how you race against everyone. The people who tend to
smash through the field and wreck people will stay at the lower levels
why the people who drive smart and don't cause wrecks will move on up.
Not to mention not tick off everyone :) There's nothing worse than
getting taken out of a race from a guy who can't hold a line!
You can also run Iroc races by nominating a race with a forced setup,
e.g. the fast setup, then race against everyone with nothing but your
driving ability to get you through (one of my personal favs).
Well, that's all I've got to ramble about, for those of you who get
online PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read a file called Nim's Tips. It's the
online bible so to speak and if you follow the rules in it, you'll get
along great with everyone, and hopefully we won't have to many people
trying to run 2 wide throught the tri-oval at dega...don't try it it
won't work. (Believe me, I know)
By the way, Drafting at dega is nothing short of awesome! Of course
most of us have ran it so much we now hate the track but hey, it's fun
:)
--
[link lost in import: /~bms/index.htm]
Beta Tester Hawaii Network - bsimpson online
"It's Always Darkest before it goes totally Black"
Quoted text (30 lines)
>For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" > and "Well, it's >after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is > what you've been >waiting for! >Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested > in joining the >open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect > to sierra.com & >follow the links to the Papyrus area): >http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to > test. >Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide > (included in the client >as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the > ride of your life! >We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get > a busy signal, >PLEASE try again later. >See you online!!! >Ed Martin >Papyrus Design GroupQuoted text (14 lines)
>> Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the >> open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & >> follow the links to the Papyrus area): >> http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >> You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test. >Well, the Papyrus Home page looks the same as always (with no news about the >miltiplayer client) and www.sierra.com responds with a server error. How and >where can we get the needed software? >-- >Eric T. Busch >Emory UniversityOk the sierra page is down so try the Sierra BBS. It's # is 206-644-0112 and
the file is called hawaii.exe. It's about 860k. Configuration and log on are
very easy all you pay for is the call (long distance to Boston).
Logged on a little while ago, and not too many people were on. ONly Loudon was
up and I hopped on and there were only 4 guys there but we practiecd a bit.
Had one guy hit me causing us both to spin and a message comes across the top
saying SPIN in Turn TWO! Nice. Then Qual starts (automatically), and you qual
by yourself. You then have a few minutes to warmup (read: Grab your setup), and
the race starts automatically. (It gives you a time warning ) regardless if you
are ready or not. When I got on noone else was ready but me so I took off
anyone and others started several laps down.
Anyway, the point is I got on with no problem. Now we need more people.
Los
Can you please tell me where this client is located?
-
Quoted text (22 lines)
> For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's > after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is what you've been > waiting for! > Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the > open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & > follow the links to the Papyrus area): > http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm > You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test. > Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide (included in the client > as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the ride of your life! > We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get a busy signal, > PLEASE try again later. > See you online!!! > Ed Martin > Papyrus Design GroupQuoted text (22 lines)
> For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's > after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is what you've been > waiting for! > Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the > open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & > follow the links to the Papyrus area): > http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm > You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test. > Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide (included in the client > as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the ride of your life! > We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get a busy signal, > PLEASE try again later. > See you online!!! > Ed Martin > Papyrus Design Group> Either this is a hoax or Sierra has yet to update the page on this.
> I followed the link and saw nothing new.
> Dan
Dan,
It's not a hoax... really! There has been a problem with www.sierra.com
since last night. The page has not been updated as of right now (1:50PM
EDT, Tuesday). However, it will be updated within the next hour.
In the mean time, the file is currently available on CompuServe in the
The file is called HAWAII.EXE.
Sorry about the delay. Sometimes, technology just doesn't work right!
--
Ed Martin
Papyrus Design Group
Ed,
this maybe a little premature but are there any plans to add this
WONDERFUL access thru PoP's in local cities or thru some type
of game server?? I can see myself in divorce court with a LD
phone bill! Hehe
Thanks,
Andy A
We experienced a major web server crash last night which caused the
delay in posting HAWAII.EXE to
http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm but it's up there now!
Before trying to dial in, PLEASE read the User's Guide included in
HAWAII.EXE (it's called GUIDE.DOC [MS Word format w/ screen shots] &
GUIDE.TXT (plain text)
See you online!
--
Ed Martin
Papyrus Design Group
This is not a hoax. I don't know about finding the file on the Sierra home
page, but you can log into the Sierra BBS like I did (2066440112 N81) and go
to the library and dl HAWAII.EXE. That's what you need. It's not under racing
but some otehr file library. However, since you know the name you can DL it
from the Library mainmenu.
Los
Downloaded it, and was on-line within 10 minutes and now I'm ***ed.
try the sierra bbs untill the website is up
206-644-0112
please, please read the documentation .... 'specially the parts about
SAFE RACING !!! thanks
looking forward to seeing you there
I was on there earlier too. However I am a little nervous about paying
for calls to Boston. That could get expensive. I do plan to use it a
little though.
Quoted text (12 lines)
> >It's not a hoax... really! There has been a problem with www.sierra.com > >since last night. The page has not been updated as of right now (1:50PM > >EDT, Tuesday). However, it will be updated within the next hour. > Ed, > this maybe a little premature but are there any plans to add this > WONDERFUL access thru PoP's in local cities or thru some type > of game server?? I can see myself in divorce court with a LD > phone bill! Hehe > Thanks, > Andy AWell, I e***dly loaded Hawaii only to find that "eterm" wouldn't
recognize my Com 4 setup (with IRQ 2). The dumb part is is that it won't
let me (as far as I know) override it because I know it works.....
Anyway, needless to say tonight my setup is gonna change to something that
allows me on to find out what all the rave reviews are about. <G>
Phil
Quoted text (9 lines)
> >> For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's > >-- > >Ed Martin > >Papyrus Design Group > It worked great at 2:00 pm today and I got to run in a race. Now I get > an "incorrect version number" message when I try to go to the Scheduler. > Did a new version come out that fast???I second that. Phone bill is going to kill the average man. How about a future
telenet or something! Or is this service going to provide a 1 800 number with
a membership? I hope it wont cost much, if anything.
Looks good so far.. Few problems with idiots and yellow flags. I was black
flagged when it TOLD ME to pass car #2.. Kind of confusing. But a great
experience. My hats off to you!
J.F.
Rub-N-is-Racing...........................
>> For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's
>--
>Ed Martin
>Papyrus Design Group
It worked great at 2:00 pm today and I got to run in a race. Now I get
an "incorrect version number" message when I try to go to the Scheduler.
Did a new version come out that fast???
Quoted text (17 lines)
>>Ed, >> this maybe a little premature but are there any plans to add this >> WONDERFUL access thru PoP's in local cities or thru some type >> of game server?? I can see myself in divorce court with a LD >> phone bill! Hehe >> Thanks, >> Andy A >I second that. Phone bill is going to kill the average man. How about a future >telenet or something! Or is this service going to provide a 1 800 number with >a membership? I hope it wont cost much, if anything. >Looks good so far.. Few problems with idiots and yellow flags. I was black >flagged when it TOLD ME to pass car #2.. Kind of confusing. But a great >experience. My hats off to you! > J.F. > Rub-N-is-Racing...........................I logged on tonight at about 8:00 and it worked great! Ran a 50 lapper at
Bristol with 10 other guys and had a great time!!!!!!!!!
Thank You Papyrus!!!!!!!!!!
If open beta testing lasts more than two months, I'm moving to Boston
<g>.
Phil
<PJYoung on Hawaii>
Actually, if you go here, you don't see it.
try this instead:
IN Netscape, erase the last part and just open:
http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy
You'll get a directory - and the HAWAII.EXE file is located there.
Click once on it to download.
** Works Great - except for:
1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm
about to run up.
2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap.
------- Please!!!! --------
Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world.
I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on the
pace lap.
(but it IS REAL)
Mike
: Dan,
: It's not a hoax... really! There has been a problem with www.sierra.com
: since last night. The page has not been updated as of right now (1:50PM
: EDT, Tuesday). However, it will be updated within the next hour.
: In the mean time, the file is currently available on CompuServe in the
: The file is called HAWAII.EXE.
: Sorry about the delay. Sometimes, technology just doesn't work right!
: --
: Ed Martin
: Papyrus Design Group
It's 1:30am Central time here, just got the NASCAR multiplayer beta from
the Sierra web site. Here's the URL right to the file, for those of you
who don't want to wade through the menus:
http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/hawaii.exe
I got connected but couldn't join a race - it would run Nascar which
would then just sit on a screen that says "Waiting for connection" or
something like that. The after about 20-30 seconds it displayed a
message "Bad latency < 2.5 seconds" and exited. I have a 28.8k modem.
Joe
Quoted text (15 lines)
>For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's >after April 1st... tell us what's going on with multiplayer NASCAR", this is what you've been >waiting for! >Multiplayer NASCAR Racing is now in open beta testing. If you are interested in joining the >open beta, you can download the multiplayer client from www.sierra.com (connect to sierra.com & >follow the links to the Papyrus area): >http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >You will need a copy of NASCAR Racing, the full retail product in order to test. >Once you download the multiplayer client, read through the User's Guide (included in the client >as guide.doc & guide.txt), install & setup as directed, and get ready for the ride of your life! >We will have limited capacity during the open beta testing stage, so if you get a busy signal, >PLEASE try again later. >See you online!!! >Ed Martin >Papyrus Design GroupSo, it exists. And it works.
This is going to change the way we do auto racing.
Who knows how this will be implemented? Rick?
Nah.
There have been two sides to this..... One group waits in
anticipation for "HAWAII", and the rest deny it's existence.
Not a very good way to run a dog 'n pony show.
So lets stop the song 'n dance and talk freely now, eh? How soon
can we just connect using a TCP/IP address instead of
the long distance phone number? It will take HOURS to get in
a decent race or two.... It only makes sense to use an already
existing internet access instead of phone bill city. :-)
It's only beta...and they want testers. I'd be happy to give
this beta a good test if I didn't have to do the long distance
thing... (wait till my wife sees this phone bill. :-(
Mike aka Dr2.... y'know, the one in the back stuck behind the wrecked
cars at the start of the pace lap....
Quoted text (8 lines)
>** Works Great - except for: >1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm >about to run up. >2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. > ------- Please!!!! -------- >Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. >I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on the >pace lap.> I also have a question. I read the guide.txt file that comes in HAWAII.EXE. It says
> something about averaging scores from the past 10 races that a driver competes in and then
> re-assesses the driver's rating. Does this mean that you have to run 10 races to get off of
> level 0. Or are drivers re-evaluated after every race and up to the last 10 races are used in
> the average?
Drivers are re-evaluated after each race. If you have less then 10 races, the non-run races
will be counted as zeros, and averaged as such.
Mike
Quoted text (9 lines)
> Ed, > this maybe a little premature but are there any plans to add this > WONDERFUL access thru PoP's in local cities or thru some type > of game server?? I can see myself in divorce court with a LD > phone bill! Hehe > Thanks, > Andy A > Andy,Quoted text (8 lines)
> I second that. Phone bill is going to kill the average man. How about a future > telenet or something! Or is this service going to provide a 1 800 number with > a membership? I hope it wont cost much, if anything. > Looks good so far.. Few problems with idiots and yellow flags. I was black > flagged when it TOLD ME to pass car #2.. Kind of confusing. But a great > experience. My hats off to you! > J.F. > Rub-N-is-Racing...........................J.F.,Quoted text (13 lines)
>Everyone is assigned a skill level from 0-15 and it goes up or down >depending on how you race against everyone. The people who tend to >smash through the field and wreck people will stay at the lower levels >why the people who drive smart and don't cause wrecks will move on up. >Not to mention not tick off everyone :) There's nothing worse than >getting taken out of a race from a guy who can't hold a line! >Well, that's all I've got to ramble about, for those of you who get >online PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read a file called Nim's Tips. It's the >online bible so to speak and if you follow the rules in it, you'll get >along great with everyone, and hopefully we won't have to many people >trying to run 2 wide throught the tri-oval at dega...don't try it it >won't work. (Believe me, I know)Making a game networkable and making a game work on the Internet are two
different things. A high-speed, real-time action game WILL NOT WORK with
typical Internet latencies. I'm not talking about throughput. You can have
a T1 connection to the Internet and be able to up/download data at a
1MB/sec, but if the round trip packet time is anything over about 0.2
seconds, it just isn't going to work.
Rick Genter
Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II
Sierra On-Line, Inc.
Quoted text (23 lines)
> So, it exists. And it works. > This is going to change the way we do auto racing. > Who knows how this will be implemented? Rick? > Nah. > There have been two sides to this..... One group waits in > anticipation for "HAWAII", and the rest deny it's existence. > Not a very good way to run a dog 'n pony show. > So lets stop the song 'n dance and talk freely now, eh? How soon > can we just connect using a TCP/IP address instead of > the long distance phone number? It will take HOURS to get in > a decent race or two.... It only makes sense to use an already > existing internet access instead of phone bill city. :-) > It's only beta...and they want testers. I'd be happy to give > this beta a good test if I didn't have to do the long distance > thing... (wait till my wife sees this phone bill. :-( > Mike aka Dr2.... y'know, the one in the back stuck behind the wrecked > cars at the start of the pace lap....The solution, of course, would be a Sierra-type online service with a
rate schedule. Of course, I wouldn't expect a nice low MONTHLY rate
(i.e. ISP style 19.95/unlimited type stuff) but to me that sounds like
the best way to integrate PoP, low latency, etc.
_________________________________________
Tony Johns
IWCCCARS Project Coordinator
http://www.xmission.com/~iwcc/project.htm
>Making a game networkable and making a game work on the Internet are two
>different things. A high-speed, real-time action game WILL NOT WORK with
>typical Internet latencies. I'm not talking about throughput. You can have
>a T1 connection to the Internet and be able to up/download data at a
>1MB/sec, but if the round trip packet time is anything over about 0.2
>seconds, it just isn't going to work.
Hi Rick,
How are you planning on pricing/rolling out this service once it's out
of Beta? I'm calling from Vancouver, Canada, which is tremendously
expensive (not something I can afford more than once or twice a month,
and even then only late at night).
What about a 1-800 number with a monthly or even hourly fee to cover
it? I think this would save a lot of money overall because
long-distance phone service is so much cheaper in the US than it is
here.
Joe
Quoted text (8 lines)
>As for TCP/IP, like I've said in other posts, a top priority for us is >to drive the cost of multiplayer NASCAR down as low as possible. Yes, >the internet would be a great way to do that cost-wise, but given our >latency requirements, the internet just isn't viable at this time. With >that said, there are a number of comapnies doing some promising things >with low latency games over the internet. All I can asy for now is that >we're on top of it, and we will do everything we can to make it as >inexpensive as possible.Quoted text (24 lines)
> > >> follow the links to the Papyrus area): > > >> http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm > Actually, if you go here, you don't see it. > try this instead: > IN Netscape, erase the last part and just open: > http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy > You'll get a directory - and the HAWAII.EXE file is located there. > Click once on it to download. > ** Works Great - except for: > 1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm > about to run up. > 2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. > ------- Please!!!! -------- > Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. > I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on the > pace lap. > (but it IS REAL) > MikeYou'd have to ask Ed. I really have no idea how the service will be rolled
out.
Rick Genter
Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II
Sierra On-Line, Inc.
Quoted text (9 lines)
> >> For all those who have been asking "What's going on with The Papyrus Network" and "Well, it's > >-- > >Ed Martin > >Papyrus Design Group > It worked great at 2:00 pm today and I got to run in a race. Now I get > an "incorrect version number" message when I try to go to the Scheduler. > Did a new version come out that fast???: Well, I e***dly loaded Hawaii only to find that "eterm" wouldn't
: recognize my Com 4 setup (with IRQ 2). The dumb part is is that it won't
: let me (as far as I know) override it because I know it works.....
Yeah, I have my modem set up on Com 3 but the IRQ is at 5... I was really
disappointed to find out that hawaii didn't seem to recognize IRQ 5 :(
Should I go through my computer and redo my IRQ's or should I wait for a
patch?
Decisions.... decisions...
: Anyway, needless to say tonight my setup is gonna change to something that
: allows me on to find out what all the rave reviews are about. <G>
: Phil
--
\ /
______| |______________________ ______________________| |______
|||||||(*)=SKULLCRUSHER=========`> <'======================(*)|||||||
~~~~~~| |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~' `~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| |~~~~~~
/ _____________________ \
http://rio.atlantic.net/~ujj/ ____/--\___, ____/--\___,
http://rio.atlantic.net/~ujj/nascar/ |-O-----O--| |-O-----O--|
----------------------------
: What about a 1-800 number that you charge access for? This is
: generally cheaper than personal long-distance rates, and is much, much
: cheaper than the LD rates in some areas (Canada, for example).
That would be nice... but what if this is a real big hit and the 1-800
number is always busy during the time that you want to play. I would hate
to pay $x.xx per month for a busy signal :(
What is the max dialing capacity anyway?
: Joe
Later
Ujj
--
\ /
______| |______________________ ______________________| |______
|||||||(*)=SKULLCRUSHER=========`> <'======================(*)|||||||
~~~~~~| |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~' `~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| |~~~~~~
/ _____________________ \
http://rio.atlantic.net/~ujj/ ____/--\___, ____/--\___,
http://rio.atlantic.net/~ujj/nascar/ |-O-----O--| |-O-----O--|
----------------------------
>I was on there earlier too. However I am a little nervous about paying
>for calls to Boston. That could get expensive. I do plan to use it a
>little though.
SPRINT .10 a minute 10% cash back
Thanks Jim and Brian for the info! As many of the users will quickly find
out... the long distance phone bill will be a bit much on the ol'
expenses. So, perhaps to aid in reducing a lot of the phone bills,
especially now that setups will be shared a lot more (hopefully)... I've
created the following mailing list:
Mailing List: Papyrus Racing Simulation Discussions
This list has two purposes. 1) To allow users of the Papyrus NASCAR
Racing Simulation to exchange ideas, setups, and other information.
2) To allow users of the Papyrus/Sierra Multi-Player Racing Network
to exchange experiences, setups, and other information. These two
different purposes are so closely related, and useful to each group
of users, that this single list should suffice.
1) To subscribe to the list send email to the list sponsor with the email
message: subscribe multi
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R.A.S.N. ... there's no place like home...
Quoted text (39 lines)
> >** Works Great - except for: > >1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm > >about to run up. > >2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. > > ------- Please!!!! -------- > >Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. > >I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on the > >pace lap. > I got on last nite and raced in Atlanta and 'Dega. I got nailed by several > idiots who either a) don't know how to drive, or b) don't have the sense god > gave a brick. People who don't know how to drive will be a real problem. > I also couldn't seem to use my own car. I weas using a different car in both > races, and there didn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to the sim's selection. > I also couldn't find anything about this in the docs. > I think that: > 1) If someone nominates a race, they should be able to set a mininmum skill > level for joining. This will keep the***wads off the track. > 2) There should be some mechanism which allows us to upload our cars to the > service so we can race with our own paintjobs and other drivers can see > them. > 3) The "service" should have local access numbers (at least one for every > major metropolitan area). The long distance charges are enough to keep me > from calling more than once a month. > 4) Papyrus should make a network version of the game which allows up to 8 (or > 10) humans in a given race (like Descent). This would make it playable over > the internet as well. They obviously have the knowledge for doing this. > /=================================================\ > | John Simmons (Redneck Techno-Biker) | > | http://www2.connectnet.com/users/jms/index.html > \=================================================/Quoted text (14 lines)
> >As for TCP/IP, like I've said in other posts, a top priority for us is > >to drive the cost of multiplayer NASCAR down as low as possible. Yes, > >the internet would be a great way to do that cost-wise, but given our > >latency requirements, the internet just isn't viable at this time. With > >that said, there are a number of comapnies doing some promising things > >with low latency games over the internet. All I can asy for now is that > >we're on top of it, and we will do everything we can to make it as > >inexpensive as possible. > What about a 1-800 number that you charge access for? This is > generally cheaper than personal long-distance rates, and is much, much > cheaper than the LD rates in some areas (Canada, for example). > JoeQuoted text (20 lines)
> >Making a game networkable and making a game work on the Internet are two > >different things. A high-speed, real-time action game WILL NOT WORK with > >typical Internet latencies. I'm not talking about throughput. You can have > >a T1 connection to the Internet and be able to up/download data at a > >1MB/sec, but if the round trip packet time is anything over about 0.2 > >seconds, it just isn't going to work. > Hi Rick, > How are you planning on pricing/rolling out this service once it's out > of Beta? I'm calling from Vancouver, Canada, which is tremendously > expensive (not something I can afford more than once or twice a month, > and even then only late at night). > What about a 1-800 number with a monthly or even hourly fee to cover > it? I think this would save a lot of money overall because > long-distance phone service is so much cheaper in the US than it is > here. > JoeQuoted text (20 lines)
>> >> follow the links to the Papyrus area): >> >> http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >Actually, if you go here, you don't see it. >try this instead: >IN Netscape, erase the last part and just open: >http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy >You'll get a directory - and the HAWAII.EXE file is located there. >Click once on it to download. >** Works Great - except for: >1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm >about to run up. >2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. > ------- Please!!!! -------- >Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. >I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft onQuoted text (12 lines)
>>** Works Great - except for: >>1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm >>about to run up. >>2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. >> ------- Please!!!! -------- >>Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. >>I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on the >>pace lap. >I got on last nite and raced in Atlanta and 'Dega. I got nailed by several >idiots who either a) don't know how to drive, or b) don't have the sense god >gave a brick. People who don't know how to drive will be a real problem.Ed,
First of all I personally havent had the CHANCE to get on the beta
site to run. I have made connection attempts for 3 hrs. straight
tonight tho! Logs me on just fine but I guess the server is totally
full everytime I call.
And thank you guys a bunch! for your efforts!
NOW!
Second of all that was quite a lengthy reply and a well detailed one
at that. HOWEVER! you made on mistake! And I've said it here 1000
times.... Nascar Racing by Papyrus is NOT I repeat NOT a "fun game"
it is a s-i-m-u-l-a-t-o-r!! And after running NASCAR for 2 yrs. I
still have to correct my wife on that every night!
<ahem> thank you I feel better now :)
P.S. - I know noone at papyrus isn't going to respond to this part for
various reasons. But I still say a lil' prayer every night
that this will spark you guys/gals to work on NASCAR 2 <G>
<attaching big cinnamon buns to each side of my head gazing at >
< a trashcan. >
"help us papyrus gang! your our only hope......"
Is there life outside of NASCAR?
Andy A
>We're looking into more options than you can imagine. Again, the goal
>is to drive costs down as low as possible.
>However, for now, in beta test (while we're not billing), we have to go
>with the "617" solution.
>We're working on it!
Thanks, Ed, that's good enough for me.
Joe
> Our goal is to make sure that you do not end up in divorce court! :-) I
> can't discuss specific plans at this point, but suffice to say that a
> top priority to us is to drive the overall cost of mutliplayer as low as
> possible...... <snip>
> Ed Martin
> Papyrus Design Group
ThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYouThankYou!!!!
If you were to make this "extremely affordable"... ie:use existing
internet services which we are already paying for.... Nascar would be
the most popular game on the globe. Everyone would "just have to have
it" so they could use the service.
Let the "sales" group know that before they decide to make their
commission on the Hawaii project, please?
Mike "***ed"
>We're looking into more options than you can imagine. Again, the goal
>is to drive costs down as low as possible.
Uh oh, does this sound like the IRL to anyone else...?<g>
Eldred Pickett
I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?
: Given the public data networks that exist today, this can not be
: done. The internet, although
: widely available, can not provide reliable low latency. Yes, there
: are some promising things
: happening in low latency internet game services, but they are not yet
: done/"ready for prime
: time". Believe me, we are completely on top of all of this. Again, a
: top priority is low cost : access.
: In the open beta phase, given the current state of the art, we have to
: rely on point to point
: communications to give us the latency we need. Is it more expensive
: than we want? Yes. Are we
: doing everything possible to change that once we go live? ABSOLUTELY!!!!!
[clip]
: 6) Network version. Again, see point # 1 above, and see Rick Genter's
: posting as well. I assure
: you, a network version of NASCAR would NOT be playable over the
: internet. The internet as a
: whole provides unreliable latencies of up to 5 seconds (or more).
Ed,
What about people who want to play over a LAN? I know that at my
school, there are entire dorms linked with some sort of network. Plus,
i'm sure that if you put in network support, people would form local
racing clubs. I would gladly cart a PC system to someone's house or
other meeting place to have a race or two. I know this would require
some sort of server software, but with people buying faster hardware just
to play your games I think it's possible. The internet is not the only
network out here. :)
Quoted text (37 lines)
> >> >> follow the links to the Papyrus area): > >> >> http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm > >Actually, if you go here, you don't see it. > >try this instead: > >IN Netscape, erase the last part and just open: > >http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy > >You'll get a directory - and the HAWAII.EXE file is located there. > >Click once on it to download. > >** Works Great - except for: > >1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm > >about to run up. > >2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. > > ------- Please!!!! -------- > >Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. > >I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on > the > >pace lap. > >(but it IS REAL) > >Mike > All the neubies keep nominating races that have no pace lap and so > they never practice it together. > Pace laps require your full attention...no weaving to"heat" the > tires.... stagger your position on the track to give yourself runoff > room....maintain a constant speed when possible.....DO NOT CHAT, it > takes a hand off the wheel, your eyes off the road.....do not try > backing off for a flying start.... > Any suggestions from experienced Multi-testers is welcome here.. > Pacing safely takes practice and concentrationQuoted text (13 lines)
> Does this Hawaii patch change the standalone game in any way? Any patches > in this thing? Do yellow flags work? Oops...sorry...NASCAR works, right? > Not much of a NASCAR player...more into ICR2.. :) > How many humans on at once? > -- > Meek and obedient you follow the leader > down well trodden corridors into the valley of steel.. > Neil Yeatman, Ajax, Ontario, CANADAWarbirds works just fine despite occasional warps for the vast majority of
flyers, that's not really a good example. However, the latency requirements
for Warbirds is much less strigent than they are for NASCAR. Heck, even
with dial in NASCAR as it is now, there still some quirky warpy little
episodes happening occasionally like you're driving along with noone behind
you and in front of you and sudddenly your hood gets stove in!
Actually I had 2 questions.
1. Occasionally the server vomits and everyone gets dumped from a race after
it starts. (Happened twice last night). How does that effect ratings/ score?
2. What about home IPX network (not TCP/IP). Is that in any future release
plans for Papyrus.
Keep up the good work
Los
Quoted text (30 lines)
> : Given the public data networks that exist today, this can not be > : done. The internet, although > : widely available, can not provide reliable low latency. Yes, there > : are some promising things > : happening in low latency internet game services, but they are not yet > : done/"ready for prime > : time". Believe me, we are completely on top of all of this. Again, a > : top priority is low cost : access. > : In the open beta phase, given the current state of the art, we have to > : rely on point to point > : communications to give us the latency we need. Is it more expensive > : than we want? Yes. Are we > : doing everything possible to change that once we go live? ABSOLUTELY!!!!! > [clip] > : 6) Network version. Again, see point # 1 above, and see Rick Genter's > : posting as well. I assure > : you, a network version of NASCAR would NOT be playable over the > : internet. The internet as a > : whole provides unreliable latencies of up to 5 seconds (or more). > Ed, > What about people who want to play over a LAN? I know that at my > school, there are entire dorms linked with some sort of network. Plus, > i'm sure that if you put in network support, people would form local > racing clubs. I would gladly cart a PC system to someone's house or > other meeting place to have a race or two. I know this would require > some sort of server software, but with people buying faster hardware just > to play your games I think it's possible. The internet is not the only > network out here. :)?>I want to make one other important point in this regard. Classifying inexperienced drivers as
?>"idiots", "dickwads", "don't have the sense god gave a brick", or "don't know how to drive" is
?>totally unfair, and frankly, rude. How good were you the first time you tried the game? We are
?>in a MULTIPLAYER envirnoment. Not everyone is a "good"/experienced as you. Give everyone a
?>break & everyone will have fun. If you think you're that much better than someone else, then the
?>skill ranking system will move you up. Patience!!!!! This is a FUN GAME, right?????
While I think you have a good point in there somewhere, I
believe a distinction should be drawn between those of us (like
myself) who aren't all that good at Nascar, and those people who
somehow think that Nascar is a demolition derby. Hopefully the skill
rating will keep most people happy, but simple ettiquette should
dictate that everyone should at least learn enough about Nascar so
that they're able to make "safe" laps. At any rate, I do think it's
important that Nascar "gurus" be careful that they don't unfairly lump
"inexperience" in the same category as "obnoxiousness."
--Evan
Well,
I fixed my com 4 irq 2 problem by simply moving my irq to 3. No problem
now as multi worked like a charm.
Also, is sprint 10 cents a minute all day or just after 11PM? I got this
flyer in the mail that says I can get 9.5 cents a minute anytime of the
day, any day of the week just by dialing an access code and then the
number I want to reach - no need to drop my current ld service. The
company is called CGI, has anybody done this? They drop their 5.99
monthly charge for the first month so I plan to start that up on Wednesday
(May 1st) <g>.....
Phil
<PJYOUNG> on Hawaii
Quoted text (10 lines)
> > Either this is a hoax or Sierra has yet to update the page on this. > > I followed the link and saw nothing new. > > Dan > Dan, > It's not a hoax... really! There has been a problem with www.sierra.com > since last night. The page has not been updated as of right now (1:50PM > EDT, Tuesday). However, it will be updated within the next hour.>> I also have a question. I read the guide.txt file that comes in
HAWAII.EXE. It says
driver competes in and then
run 10 races to get off of
last 10 races are used in
races, the non-run races
What about if someone else wrecks you?? I was on last night, and out of
seven or eight races, I was wrecked six times by someone else, and four
of those were before I even moved. How does this count on my rating?
Mike
Quoted text (20 lines)
> >Making a game networkable and making a game work on the Internet are two > >different things. A high-speed, real-time action game WILL NOT WORK with > >typical Internet latencies. I'm not talking about throughput. You can have > >a T1 connection to the Internet and be able to up/download data at a > >1MB/sec, but if the round trip packet time is anything over about 0.2 > >seconds, it just isn't going to work. > Hi Rick, > How are you planning on pricing/rolling out this service once it's out > of Beta? I'm calling from Vancouver, Canada, which is tremendously > expensive (not something I can afford more than once or twice a month, > and even then only late at night). > What about a 1-800 number with a monthly or even hourly fee to cover > it? I think this would save a lot of money overall because > long-distance phone service is so much cheaper in the US than it is > here. > Joe>>I was on there earlier too. However I am a little nervous about
>paying
>>for calls to Boston. That could get expensive. I do plan to use it a
>>little though.
> SPRINT .10 a minute 10% cash back
Hey Mike, I switched to sprint about 2 months back....those bills were
killing me <G>. AT&T did me one better, called and gave me $100 in
cash and 50% off my phone calls.... which comes out to about $4.20 an
hour for the next 3 months... Sooo if you can swing it call em and
start bargaining, it works! After the 3 months...back to Sprint.
--
http://www.cris.com/~bms/index.htm
Closed Beta Tester Hawaii Network - bsimpson online
"It's Always Darkest before it goes totally Black"
Quoted text (35 lines)
>>> >> follow the links to the Papyrus area): >>> >> http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy/home.htm >>Actually, if you go here, you don't see it. >>try this instead: >>IN Netscape, erase the last part and just open: >>http://www.sierra.com/sierra/papy >>You'll get a directory - and the HAWAII.EXE file is located there. >>Click once on it to download. >>** Works Great - except for: >>1. It's a long distance number... I can't afford the phone bill I'm >>about to run up. >>2. Idiots. People who have no concept of a pace lap. >> ------- Please!!!! -------- >>Learn to drive on your own PC first, then join the world. >>I tried 2 races and both started with crashes in the first 50 ft on >the >>pace lap. >>(but it IS REAL) >>Mike > All the neubies keep nominating races that have no pace lap and so >they never practice it together. > Pace laps require your full attention...no weaving to"heat" the >tires.... stagger your position on the track to give yourself runoff >room....maintain a constant speed when possible.....DO NOT CHAT, it >takes a hand off the wheel, your eyes off the road.....do not try >backing off for a flying start.... > Any suggestions from experienced Multi-testers is welcome here.. > Pacing safely takes practice and concentration><attaching big cinnamon buns to each side of my head gazing at >
>< a trashcan. >
> "help us papyrus gang! your our only hope......"
I read the first line a couple times trying to figure out what the HELL you
were talking about. Then I read the second line...'Ah, I get it NOW'<g>
...may the force be with you...
Eldred Pickett
I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?
Do these incident points count if your the puntee. I found myself getting
dumped wile leading as well as just plain racing mistakes. The same guy
who dumped me dumped the pole sitter on the pace lap, idiot.
I can't really comment of future product releases. Stay tuned! :-)
--
Ed Martin
Papyrus Design Group
Quoted text (20 lines)
> >> I also have a question. I read the guide.txt file that comes in > HAWAII.EXE. It says > >> something about averaging scores from the past 10 races that a > driver competes in and then > >> re-assesses the driver's rating. Does this mean that you have to > run 10 races to get off of > >> level 0. Or are drivers re-evaluated after every race and up to the > last 10 races are used in > >> the average? > >Drivers are re-evaluated after each race. If you have less then 10 > races, the non-run races > >will be counted as zeros, and averaged as such. > >Mike > What about if someone else wrecks you?? I was on last night, and out of > seven or eight races, I was wrecked six times by someone else, and four > of those were before I even moved. How does this count on my rating? > MikeWell, wrecks are all counted against you... whetehr you caused it or>I have to commend Ed, Rick, and everyone at Papyrus....This multiplayer
service rocks....already spent WAY too much on a phone bill!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>There's virtually no way we could write the code to make accurate
> calls on who caused an accident.
> Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good"
> drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think
> of any other way to handle it.
Well, this brings us to the question of just what exactly constitutes an
accident. I assume regular tapping (like in bump drafting) would not count
against you. But, does it have to be severe enough to bring out a yellow or
cause damage to a car before it counts? If so, what happens in races with both
of these options turned off?
--
Eric T. Busch
Emory University
> Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good"
> drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think
> of any other way to handle it.
What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris
Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a
good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing
the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the
drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get
the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii
is set up to do this, but it might help out alot.
There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100%
opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and
their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something.
David Martin
IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl
#26 Samuel Adams Chevy
> While I think you have a good point in there somewhere, I
> believe a distinction should be drawn between those of us (like
> myself) who aren't all that good at Nascar, and those people who
> somehow think that Nascar is a demolition derby.----snipped-------
At any rate, I do think it's
Just for the record.... I hope I didn't offend anyone by using the word
"Idiot".... It should only offend those who proudly call themselves
idiots.
I think you explained it better than I, Evan, when you mentioned the
inability for some to distinguish between Nascar and a demo derby.
I would never lump inexperience with idiocy. I did, however, make the
mistake of lumping "obnoxious" with "idiot". I will be careful not to
make the same mistake again.
I consider myself inexperienced with the game - when I get clear of the
"demo boys", I find I cannot catch up with the leaders. They have taken
the time to set up their car correctly, so I find myself in an amateur
class. However, I know the differece between racing and crashing.
(especially at that price)
Mike -"still one lap down"
Hey Papyrus !
You burnt somethin' into my screen !
Is it possible to play it over the NET too ? I hope so !
If not it wouldn't be too good !
Or is Papyrus still working to add an Internet Online Racing League ??(Pleasseeee!)
I think I'll dl it if it really works !!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* * * * * * BYE and always a good connection * * * * * *
* * * * * * wishes * * * * * *
*** W O D A N ***
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
___________
Important :
Please send all answers via CC (Email) back to me too, thanks !
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Quoted text (19 lines)
> > Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" > > drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think > > of any other way to handle it. > What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris > Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a > good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing > the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the > drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get > the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii > is set up to do this, but it might help out alot. > There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100% > opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and > their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something. > David Martin > IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl > #26 Samuel Adams ChevyQuoted text (7 lines)
>><attaching big cinnamon buns to each side of my head gazing at > >>< a trashcan. > >> "help us papyrus gang! your our only hope......" >I read the first line a couple times trying to figure out what the HELL you >were talking about. Then I read the second line...'Ah, I get it NOW'<g> >...may the force be with you... >Eldred PickettQuoted text (17 lines)
> >There's virtually no way we could write the code to make accurate > > calls on who caused an accident. > > Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" > > drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think > > of any other way to handle it. > Well, this brings us to the question of just what exactly constitutes an > accident. I assume regular tapping (like in bump drafting) would not count > against you. But, does it have to be severe enough to bring out a yellow or > cause damage to a car before it counts? If so, what happens in races with both > of these options turned off? > -- > Eric T. Busch > Emory UniversityYes, an incident is counted if & when it would be severe enough to bringQuoted text (17 lines)
> >There's virtually no way we could write the code to make accurate > > calls on who caused an accident. > > Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" > > drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think > > of any other way to handle it. > Well, this brings us to the question of just what exactly constitutes an > accident. I assume regular tapping (like in bump drafting) would not count > against you. But, does it have to be severe enough to bring out a yellow or > cause damage to a car before it counts? If so, what happens in races with both > of these options turned off? > -- > Eric T. Busch > Emory UniversityYes, an incident is counted if & when it would be severe enough to bring> Along these lines, I've had two "hiccups"...
> First...While qualifying, I had a big red box come up saying something
> to the effect of "Names packet ID error". Didn't bump me off or crash
> or anything like that but...it sure was hard as hell to qualify not
> being able to see my car.
This has also happened to me. The race continued fine. Fortunately it
happened just after coming out of the pits in qualifying, so it did not
seem to effect me.
I haven't seen this one, but I too have had a strange experience at Dega.
I've seen others report this in regular single player mode, but somehow my
Record Lap speed is up to 230 something. I've never raced without the
restrictor plate, and my real fastest lap is a 197.7xx. The change
definitely while online, because last time I raced there solo it was normal.
While it is no big deal, it is kind of strange.
--
Eric T. Busch
Emory University
> Is there life outside of NASCAR?
> Andy A
Sure.... It's called ICR2! :-)
Mike
> ?>I want to make one other important point in this regard. Classifying inexperienced drivers as
> ?>"idiots", "dickwads", "don't have the sense god gave a brick", or "don't know how to drive" is
> ?>totally unfair, and frankly, rude. How good were you the first time you tried the game? We are
> ?>in a MULTIPLAYER envirnoment. Not everyone is a "good"/experienced as you. Give everyone a
> ?>break & everyone will have fun. If you think you're that much better than someone else, then the
> ?>skill ranking system will move you up. Patience!!!!! This is a FUN GAME, right?????
I agree that people should be careful what they call each other, but shouldn't people drive
for several months against the AI before they dial in and reek havoc on a 'real' track. Let's
face it, I don't think that I could go down to NC Motor Speedway and start running around the
track, I at least need to start at Wake County Speedway. It shouldn't take too long for
inexperienced drivers to realize that they should not be dialing in. If it takes too long,
then maybe they do qualify as mentally challenged.
David Martin
IVL Series Director
I've also been on the past couple nights and have noticed that I've
had cars pop up out of nowhere. Needless to say, this really doesn't
give you too much of a chance of getting out of the way when you're
bearing down on this phanotom car at 180+.
I've yet to be able to connect at anything faster than 19.2 (using a
USR 28.8, btw).
Someone the other night said the car assignments are random right now.
I thought this was already true? On the downside this would also
create a hell of an elite racing group who naturally would lord over
the whole place. I've already seen self-professed "experts" pissing
and moaning.
Someone in an online chat the other night said this will be
implemented by the end of the year.
Yes, that would be great.
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Especially for the guy who found this offending: **
=============God, Country, Notre Dame====================
Along these lines, I've had two "hiccups"...
First...While qualifying, I had a big red box come up saying something
to the effect of "Names packet ID error". Didn't bump me off or crash
or anything like that but...it sure was hard as hell to qualify not
being able to see my car.
Secondly..In a race at 'dega with only me and one other guy, I must
have jumped the green flag on the start. While there was no blck flag,
or any other kind of notice in the race, I finished the whole race 10
laps down? Weird. I would expect some type of black flag or notice,
the same as in a single player game.
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Especially for the guy who found this offending: **
=============God, Country, Notre Dame====================
>I've yet to be able to connect at anything faster than 19.2 (using a
>USR 28.8, btw).
Jim - we are limiting the connection to 19.2K baud intentionally, to
minimize the possibility of a retrain if the modem isn't able to keep a
stable connection at a higher connect rate. Retrains aren't much of a
problem in the middle of a bulk download, but believe me, a half second gap
in the middle of a race waiting for the modem to decide if it can stay
connected at 26.4K baud rather than falling back to 24.2K baud is about as
much fun as a brick wall at the start-finish line. The key is having a
stable connection with low latency, rather than maximizing baud rate.
Charlie Heath
?Well,
?
?I fixed my com 4 irq 2 problem by simply moving my irq to 3. No problem
?now as multi worked like a charm.
?
?Also, is sprint 10 cents a minute all day or just after 11PM? I got this
?flyer in the mail that says I can get 9.5 cents a minute anytime of the
?day, any day of the week just by dialing an access code and then the
?number I want to reach - no need to drop my current ld service. The
?company is called CGI, has anybody done this? They drop their 5.99
?monthly charge for the first month so I plan to start that up on Wednesday
?(May 1st) <g>.....
Please let us know how it goes. I hate those damn phone
company ads, but Hawaii has forced me to start watching them. <g>
?Phil
?<PJYOUNG> on Hawaii
--Evan
<Jim McGuigan wrte this:
The downside here could be a problem. New guys or people like me who
can't afford to spend hours (and dollars) on long distance calls right
now (something about college) will hoved down the ladder to the point we
won't be able to race. Just hoping for cheaper access and some
consideration from the "experts" on us good drivers who just happen to be
poor right now.
Quoted text (20 lines)
>> Ed, >> this maybe a little premature but are there any plans to add this >> WONDERFUL access thru PoP's in local cities or thru some type >> of game server?? I can see myself in divorce court with a LD >> phone bill! Hehe >> Thanks, >> Andy A >> Andy, >Our goal is to make sure that you do not end up in divorce court! :-) I >can't discuss specific plans at this point, but suffice to say that a >top priority to us is to drive the overall cost of mutliplayer as low as >possible. We are investigating a wide variety of alternatives to >accomplish this. However, during the open beta period, we are going to >be relying on the "617" access. >-- >Ed Martin >Papyrus Design Group> MikeWell, wrecks are all counted against you... whetehr you caused it or
>not. There's virtually no way we could write the code to make accurate
>calls on who caused an accident.
>Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good"
>drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think
>of any other way to handle it.
Hi Ed,
How about programming for "blame" in the most obvious case? i.e., When
you rear-end someone, only the rear car should get penalized. That
should be pretty easy to program and would probably cover 90% of
accidents, especially fore of beginners.
Joe
>The key to this type of racing is PATIENCE.
>Respect has to be earned, and the only way you get that
>respect is to race fair, clean, and with thought, not with the gas
>pedal floored and "rubbing" drivers into the wall. IMHO
>--
BTW folks Brians' skill level as of 4/25/96 is a 10 of 15 ... listen to the
guy. We know how frustrating it can be to finally get on to MP and want to run
your hardest and win everything in sight. Dont ... you're gonna end up wrecking
more than you finish and in MP wrecks very seldom only take out one person. We
are all paying LD charges to access this thing and I hate being in a race
running my ***off and get nailed by a guy who is overdriving his abilities.
I strongly recommend that you download the skills.zip file from the files area
on the bbs next time you go up and read thru it. Skill levels will be what
allow you to get into races soon. If you're out there winning races but punting
folks to do it, your incident rate is going to go up and that deducts directly
from your skill level.
M***of the story ... drive safe, improve your skill level, make friends
thanks
Jim Warren
YES everyone involved is assessed incident pts. The rational being:
As you become more skilled you will learn to avoid a lot of wrecks and
that your overalll rating will then also reflect your defensive driving
skills.
All this racing with 0's and 1's will become invaluable as a teaching
aid.
Quoted text (14 lines)
>> MikeWell, wrecks are all counted against you... whetehr you caused it or >>not. There's virtually no way we could write the code to make accurate >>calls on who caused an accident. >>Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" >>drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think >>of any other way to handle it. >Hi Ed, >How about programming for "blame" in the most obvious case? i.e., When >you rear-end someone, only the rear car should get penalized. That >should be pretty easy to program and would probably cover 90% of >accidents, especially fore of beginners.Mike:
Maybe we should all introduce ourselves so the folks on this group
know who we are.
Later;
Mark McCuen
Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'markmc' (8/95)
> I may have missed this already, but what is the official definition of
> "incident" as it relates to the scoring system? If someone rubs against you and
> you smack the wall, but don't spin and recover is that an incident. If somewhat
> touches you on the pace lap, without causing an accident, but dents your fender
> is that an incident?
He told me earlier that any incident that is severe enough to cause a yellow flag
counts as an accident. Even in races where damage and yellows are turned off, the
computer knows how severe impacts would have been under normal circumstances. Also,
even if you did not cause the incident, if you are involved it is counted against
you. Ed said at this time they have no way to discriminate between who started and
who was just involved in it.
--
Emory University Graduate School of Arts & Sciences
Nascar Setups Page: http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~ebusch/
Hawaii Network UserName: Buschwick (4)
Quoted text (11 lines)
>>I've yet to be able to connect at anything faster than 19.2 (using a >>USR 28.8, btw). >Jim - we are limiting the connection to 19.2K baud intentionally, to >minimize the possibility of a retrain if the modem isn't able to keep a >stable connection at a higher connect rate. Retrains aren't much of a >problem in the middle of a bulk download, but believe me, a half second gap >in the middle of a race waiting for the modem to decide if it can stay >connected at 26.4K baud rather than falling back to 24.2K baud is about as >much fun as a brick wall at the start-finish line. The key is having a >stable connection with low latency, rather than maximizing baud rate.Quoted text (9 lines)
>> Along these lines, I've had two "hiccups"... >> First...While qualifying, I had a big red box come up saying something >> to the effect of "Names packet ID error". Didn't bump me off or crash >> or anything like that but...it sure was hard as hell to qualify not >> being able to see my car. >This has also happened to me. The race continued fine. Fortunately it >happened just after coming out of the pits in qualifying, so it did not >seem to effect me.Quoted text (19 lines)
> > Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" > > drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think > > of any other way to handle it. > What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris > Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a > good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing > the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the > drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get > the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii > is set up to do this, but it might help out alot. > There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100% > opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and > their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something. > David Martin > IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl > #26 Samuel Adams Chevypeople drive for several months against the AI before they dial in and reek
havoc on a 'real' track. Let's face it, I don't think that I could go down to
NC Motor Speedway and start running around the track, I at least need to start
at Wake County Speedway. It shouldn't take too long for inexperienced drivers
to realize that they should not be dialing in. If it takes too long,then maybe
they do qualify as mentally challenged.
Let's have just a little reality check here. What Papyrus has done is started
an online ENTERTAINMENT service, regardless of how realistically some of us
take this. People are always going to hop on and check it our or race with
little experience. To think they everyone should race for months before hopping
online is living in Vaporland.
Still, Papyrus has already resolved this question to a certain degree with
their skill rating system, as well as all their series races. If somebody is so
concerned for their skill rating, they need only:
1. Click on the info feature for any given race and see the skill level needed
and the skill level of those involved. If a person is at level 6 or 7, and
choose to race in the naturally extreely hazordous environment of a level zero
race, then they are probably more an "idiot" (to use your term) then the level
zero people. That's like a winston cup driver taking his car down to Wake
county Speedway, and complainng because 30 rookies wracked him up on the first
turn!
2. Also the series events are an excellent way to egt out of the normal
mish-mash, once you move up a few levels. Unitil you climb up a few levels, you
just have to deal with it.
3. once you move past level zero, (say for instance, level 2), then nominate
races that start only at level 2 or higher, to screen out newbies.
I'm not trying to sound atagonistic here, but we use d to hear this kind of
thing in the early days of Air warrior and Warbirds, until people started to
realise that it's in the best interest of all of us to attract as many people
as possible, this way, papyrus, like ici games and kesmai, will be able to get
the kind of revenue, to make this service, everything we want it to be.
Until, then close your eyes and pray when you speed through those first lap
turn one wrecks! <g>
Los
Ed,
I may have missed this already, but what is the official definition of
"incident" as it relates to the scoring system? If someone rubs against you and
you smack the wall, but don't spin and recover is that an incident. If somewhat
touches you on the pace lap, without causing an accident, but dents your fender
is that an incident?
Los
Quoted text (20 lines)
>>The key to this type of racing is PATIENCE. >>Respect has to be earned, and the only way you get that >>respect is to race fair, clean, and with thought, not with the gas >>pedal floored and "rubbing" drivers into the wall. IMHO >>-- > BTW folks Brians' skill level as of 4/25/96 is a 10 of 15 ... listen to the >guy. We know how frustrating it can be to finally get on to MP and want to run >your hardest and win everything in sight. Dont ... you're gonna end up wrecking >more than you finish and in MP wrecks very seldom only take out one person. We >are all paying LD charges to access this thing and I hate being in a race >running my ***off and get nailed by a guy who is overdriving his abilities. >I strongly recommend that you download the skills.zip file from the files area >on the bbs next time you go up and read thru it. Skill levels will be what >allow you to get into races soon. If you're out there winning races but punting >folks to do it, your incident rate is going to go up and that deducts directly >from your skill level. >M***of the story ... drive safe, improve your skill level, make friends >thanks >Jim WarrenQuoted text (16 lines)
>> Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good" >> drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think >> of any other way to handle it. >What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris >Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a >good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing >the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the >drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get >the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii >is set up to do this, but it might help out alot. >There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100% >opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and >their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something. >David Martin >IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl >#26 Samuel Adams ChevyQuoted text (16 lines)
> > ?>I want to make one other important point in this regard. Classifying inexperienced drivers as > > ?>"idiots", "dickwads", "don't have the sense god gave a brick", or "don't know how to drive" is > > ?>totally unfair, and frankly, rude. How good were you the first time you tried the game? We are > > ?>in a MULTIPLAYER envirnoment. Not everyone is a "good"/experienced as you. Give everyone a > > ?>break & everyone will have fun. If you think you're that much better than someone else, then the > > ?>skill ranking system will move you up. Patience!!!!! This is a FUN GAME, right????? > I agree that people should be careful what they call each other, but shouldn't people drive > for several months against the AI before they dial in and reek havoc on a 'real' track. Let's > face it, I don't think that I could go down to NC Motor Speedway and start running around the > track, I at least need to start at Wake County Speedway. It shouldn't take too long for > inexperienced drivers to realize that they should not be dialing in. If it takes too long, > then maybe they do qualify as mentally challenged. > David Martin > IVL Series DirectorConnecting to Hawaii at any speed above 9600 baud provides absolutely no
benefit.
Rick Genter
Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II
Sierra On-Line, Inc.
Quoted text (24 lines)
> >Actually I had 2 questions. > >1. Occasionally the server vomits and everyone gets dumped from a race after > >it starts. (Happened twice last night). How does that effect ratings/ score? > Along these lines, I've had two "hiccups"... > First...While qualifying, I had a big red box come up saying something > to the effect of "Names packet ID error". Didn't bump me off or crash > or anything like that but...it sure was hard as hell to qualify not > being able to see my car. > Secondly..In a race at 'dega with only me and one other guy, I must > have jumped the green flag on the start. While there was no blck flag, > or any other kind of notice in the race, I finished the whole race 10 > laps down? Weird. I would expect some type of black flag or notice, > the same as in a single player game. > ========================================================= > ==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems== > ==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service== > == == > ** Especially for the guy who found this offending: ** > =============God, Country, Notre Dame====================On Sat, 27 Apr 1996 02:29:31 -0400, Donald Lewis
True...I've already read one post here in which the author mentioned
something at the end about letting the newbies know they shouldn't be
dialing in. The service isn't even out of beta and we already have
someone saying that the less experienced shouldn't even bother calling
in.
Yeah, I know, I can hear it already: "I'm calling long distance and I
don't need to be wrecked by some newbie." Well guess what, maybe the
newbie does pretty good against AI cars but hasn't run against all
these "self-proclaimed experts who posess the talent but not the bucks
needed for their own real NASCAR team." Ok, so maybe I'm stretching
their opinion of themself, but damn if they don't come off that way
when they pontificate here.
I'm not great online (i.e I don't finish last, but don't look for me
in the top 5 either), but in an offline game with opponents at 100%, I
usually end up in the top10. Is that too lame to be racing online?
Don't be surpised if some of the online experts think so.
Most likely this is why Papyrus developed the rating season. Too bad
the "experts" want to jump right up to 15 cause they're so good. I
have nothing against these guys who are better than I am at NASCAR
Racing, but give it a rest. They should put in their time and they'll
never have to bother with all the newbies they despise. Besides, it
shouldn't take all that long considering how good they are.
Guess I wont be making too many friends here with my opinions, but oh
well, someone's gotta say it. I'm sure Papyrus didn't create this
service as a pet project for all the people with Earnhardt Egos and Al
Bundy budgets.
OK, flame away....
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
Quoted text (11 lines)
><Jim McGuigan wrte this: >>On the downside this would also >>create a hell of an elite racing group who naturally would lord over >>the whole place. I've already seen self-professed "experts" pissing >>and moaning. >The downside here could be a problem. New guys or people like me who >can't afford to spend hours (and dollars) on long distance calls right >now (something about college) will hoved down the ladder to the point we >won't be able to race.> Frankly, that's the beauty of multiplayer NASCAR. 99% of the people
> online will NEVER EVER have the chance to drive a car around Bristol. But
> you can on Hawaii. That's what we're all about!
> --
> Ed Martin
> Papyrus Design Group
Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around Bristol? Inquiring minds
would like to know! :-)
Regards Pete
Quoted text (9 lines)
> >from your skill level. > >M***of the story ... drive safe, improve your skill level, make friends > >thanks > >Jim Warren > Stop it Jim, you're making me blush <G> > -- Brian, maybe we can get a red car permanently assigned to you! :-): How about programming for "blame" in the most obvious case? i.e., When
: you rear-end someone, only the rear car should get penalized. That
: should be pretty easy to program and would probably cover 90% of
: accidents, especially fore of beginners.
I might be wrong, but this sounds like a really bad idea. If someone pulls
their slower car into the path of a faster car... its the SLOWER/FRONT
cars fault for the incident. Not only would a "blame" factor be wrong in
most cases; But it would also create a lot of animosity on the track for
retribution. Most accidents aren't due to rearending each other (except
maybe on pace laps)... they're caused more often by side-side racing and
neither gives up position. If a driver is intentionally blocking a faster
driver... there's a rearend collision on the horizon in most cases.
bill
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go fast, turn left.
You're stretching it a bit there. Even a 0 skill level can race.
Okay, time for my $0.02 worth here.
I'm sure there are drivers who feel that a "newbie" shouldn't even call
in, but let's define Newbie because I will GUARANTEE you, I know exactly
where that sentiment is coming from. Here we go:
* A newbie isn't even the proper term. Someone 'new' on the server does
not a bad driver make... and right there IS the proper term; Bad Driver.
* So what is a bad driver?
1. A guy who does not take his driving seriously. He/she/it gets out on
the track, bangs the AI all over the place, drives backwards, and
generally 'plays'. Yes, I know this is a game, but it is a game based on
very serious competition. The whole program is a very realistic
simulator and many, Many people have used this as a place to drive
for-real since this may be the closest they ever get. MultiPlayer Need
for Speed might be a better place for a 'player'
2. An inexperienced driver. I don't think it would be wise to go out,
buy Nascar and then log onto the server the next week. Putting in seat
time and learning to drive consistently at these speeds can be done
offline. the AI can teach you a lot. Some say the AI is way too
unaggressive. My take is that the AI drives like patient, smart drivers,
a real virtue no matter what you race and the mark of a champion. I'd
say the ability to move amongst the AI without crashing them would be an
ideal indicator of whether one was ready for Multiplay.
Y'know, the 'exposed tip of the iceberg' in racing is to go fast and get
there first. The part of racing that is known only by the true champions
is the ability to drive smart, be patient, give and take, focus and
concentrate, stay out of trouble. I have been driving this sim
religiously since November of 1994 and I *still* see myself grow in these
areas. This is not easy stuff to learn. It comes to you a lap at a time
and even then, only if you're paying attention. The guys and gals that
have an ongoing love affair with REAL racing and this sim will always
take a dim view of people who who stick it out there, bash it up, and
then go on to the next thing. What's wrong with a little respect for
those who have put in much ***, Sweat and Gears to be a damn fine
driver? They have a lot more in this than the rest of you can imagine,
and sure they may be a lot more ***retentive about it, but this is REAL
to them, and they have been in the midst of racing action to a level that
would rival what you see on TV on Sunday. It's amazing. They can't
fathom why anyone wouldn't want to race at the highest quality level
possible, and human nature will force them to look down their nose at
anyone who only cares to half-ass it.
Call it elitism if you will, I prefer the term 'passion'
There's a number of experts on that server. Whether they are
self-proclaimed or not does not dilute the fact that they ARE experts.
I imagine some yay-hoos/closed beta testers will come here and
pontificate to build up their egos. Some damn good drivers/closed beta
testers may protectively speak their feelings as individuals who have
spent many, many hours to get this project ready for this stage. It's up
to you to figure out which one is which.
That would depend on _how_you_go_about_getting into the top 10.
It's not about being fast or slow. It's about being a good, fast, Clean
driver. If you are Clean, REALLY Clean, the experts will love you, trust
me.
The ones that _are_ good already have begun the trip there, the ones that
aren't have, and will continue to have numbers that show it.
Later
MMc
And one for every State in Australia. Why is it called Hawaii if it
is based in Boston? At least Hawaii is closer to Canberra.
Cheers,
Craig.
******************************************************************************
Canberra, Australia
IVL Toys-R-Us #43 Pontiac - Rick Higbee Motorsports
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~hoppy1
******************************************************************************
> YES everyone involved is assessed incident pts. The rational being:
>As you become more skilled you will learn to avoid a lot of wrecks and
>that your overalll rating will then also reflect your defensive driving
>skills.
> All this racing with 0's and 1's will become invaluable as a teaching
>aid.
how do you avoid being spun out on the pace lap if you are the pole
sitter? this guy just drove up and blam put the guy in the wall. seems
kinda unfair if you are unlucky enough to race with idiots that you have
to be that much better just to move up. besides racing goood and clean I
got to watch out that morons don't take me out in the pits and shit.
: True...I've already read one post here in which the author mentioned
: something at the end about letting the newbies know they shouldn't be
: dialing in. The service isn't even out of beta and we already have
: someone saying that the less experienced shouldn't even bother calling
: in.
: Yeah, I know, I can hear it already: "I'm calling long distance and I
: don't need to be wrecked by some newbie." Well guess what, maybe the
: newbie does pretty good against AI cars but hasn't run against all
: these "self-proclaimed experts who posess the talent but not the bucks
: needed for their own real NASCAR team." Ok, so maybe I'm stretching
: their opinion of themself, but damn if they don't come off that way
: when they pontificate here.
: I'm not great online (i.e I don't finish last, but don't look for me
: in the top 5 either), but in an offline game with opponents at 100%, I
: usually end up in the top10. Is that too lame to be racing online?
: Don't be surpised if some of the online experts think so.
: Most likely this is why Papyrus developed the rating season. Too bad
: the "experts" want to jump right up to 15 cause they're so good. I
: have nothing against these guys who are better than I am at NASCAR
: Racing, but give it a rest. They should put in their time and they'll
: never have to bother with all the newbies they despise. Besides, it
: shouldn't take all that long considering how good they are.
: Guess I wont be making too many friends here with my opinions, but oh
: well, someone's gotta say it. I'm sure Papyrus didn't create this
: service as a pet project for all the people with Earnhardt Egos and Al
: Bundy budgets.
Maybe one of the things Papyrus could put into Hawaii V2 (hehe) is a
'driving school', where more experienced drivers could teach us less
talented folks without hurting anyone's ratings if someone wrecks. Hell, I
can't even drive well enough to finish a race in single player mode yet,
and not because I drive like a suicidal on crack. I need guidance. ;)
Yeah, that's a good idea.
--
______________________________________________
1986 Mustang 5.0 .~ ___________________ _________/
Under Construction / .~ / /
Pardon my Bondo dust / / ,-------+ / /
___________________ / / / / / /
_______________ / / `--------' / / /
_________________/ (_________________________/ /________/
Much of the debate here on R.A.S is really about multiplayer online culture, na
d we've seen these same converstations in the early stages is Air Warrior and
Warbirds. Just to echo Mark's point here, you will receive much more respect
as a clean, (if you will, TEAM), player than just someone who goes fast and
wins races without regard for others. Likewise verterans that take the time to
help out new guys and impart advice, will also receive much more respect oin
the online culture than those who ignore others. (I'm not saying there's poeple
here that do that, just making a point). I don't think there's anyone here that
hasn't at one point been the cause of an accident, especially in the early part
of their career, becaus ethat's what learning is all about. It really is
amazing however, how much, just droiving clean, and to survive will propell you
up the ranks here.
I hate to tell war stories, but just one very typical example. I smaked my car
up in qual at Martinsville and qualed 32, dead last in the pack. I jsut took
the attitude of drive slow and stay out of trouble. That, combined with a
little luck, had me in 8th place by like the 4th lap, (I eventually finished
3rd out of 32). I made an effort not to race anyone, but just stay alive and I
finished without a dent. I really believe this is the way to move up in the
earlier lesser skill races. (Luck helps!)
Anyway, good comments, Mark.
Los
I
Next time ,just hit enter
They should put in their time and they'll
I guess it bothers me that you have come to believe that the
original testers feel this way, maybe it shouldn't.
Last tues Hawaii went "live", and I think I doubled my phone bill.
The "old timers" I've encountered have actually enjoyed this wild last
5 days.
Watching the neubies scurrying around from race to race, trying to
check out everything, making the same mistakes, and doing the same
annoying things ("How many laps", "is pace on") that we did is pure
nostalgia.
How can we despise you guys? Hell, we spent MANY hours trying to
make sure Hawaii would work in anticipation of this event . Many
evenings we loaded up our phone charges and for hours nothing worked
right! For months we were limited to 5% races. Constant disconnects,
huge warps, were the norm. All for one purpose so that this would work
when you got here.Those "Pass Car..." messages, the spotter, relative
position chart, and many many other improvments came from some very
dedicated (more than I) unpaid testers. These guys poured their souls
into this....Brian Tate and Terry Adams instantly come to mind but
there are others of course. We wanted to see this week come and I have
had a blast watching you guys play, fight, argue, congradulate, whine,
cry, complain, laugh, and I know theres been some heart thumping
finishs for many of you.
When one of those guys says something, heed the tone, he just might
be trying to help. And Pleeeze lets try and keep this a family board.
Since tues I have raced every night with the neubies and had a great
times and some less than memorable ones too. Some of you are terrific
wheel jockeys and have a great attitude and some are great drivers and
.oh well...
Please don't flame me, I have had that done all week. Many have put in
a ton of time on Hawaii so I'm sure you'll understand if many of us
feel as though Hawaii belongs to "us".....it doesn't and we know it! We
just feel
like it does! <G>.
We can't despise you its too much deja vu!
MLang
PS special mention to Junk from Nasscar ...GREAT run at MIS last
night. (do something about that name its scary<G>)
>Guess I wont be making too many friends here with my opinions, but oh
>well, someone's gotta say it. I'm sure Papyrus didn't create this
>service as a pet project for all the people with Earnhardt Egos and Al
>Bundy budgets.
>OK, flame away....
No, that was a very reasonable post, the best one I've seen on the
subject.
Joe
Quoted text (9 lines)
>>I've yet to be able to connect at anything faster than 19.2 (using a >>USR 28.8, btw). >Connecting to Hawaii at any speed above 9600 baud provides absolutely no >benefit. >Rick Genter >Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II >Sierra On-Line, Inc.<Snip>
That would make it kinda hard to get turned back around if you spin and
end up facing the wrong direction.
Steve
+-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| All the worlds a stage, | ("'-''-/").___..--''"'-._ |
| and there's a comedy playing. | '6_ 6 ) '_. ( ).'-.__.') |
| May as well enjoy the show. | (_Y_.) ._ ) '._ '. ''-..-' |
| | _..'--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' |
+-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Go Dale Earnhardt #3 | Go Rusty Wallace #2 | +-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| Split_S on IRC Split_S on Hawaii sp-s on Warbirds | +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Quoted text (11 lines)
>> First...While qualifying, I had a big red box come up saying something >> to the effect of "Names packet ID error". Didn't bump me off or crash >> or anything like that but...it sure was hard as hell to qualify not >> being able to see my car. >> Secondly..In a race at 'dega with only me and one other guy, I must >> have jumped the green flag on the start. While there was no blck flag, >> or any other kind of notice in the race, I finished the whole race 10 >> laps down? Weird. I would expect some type of black flag or notice, >> the same as in a single player game. >PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE send tech support questions & comments toQuoted text (7 lines)
>Mcguigan) writes: >>I've yet to be able to connect at anything faster than 19.2 (using a >>USR 28.8, btw). >Connecting to Hawaii at any speed above 9600 baud provides absolutely no >benefit.Organization: Deep In The Heart Of The South
Distribution:
: > -- Brian, maybe we can get a red car permanently assigned to you! :-)
:
I'd like to request that "puke" green car... especially for the warping
issue we used to have :-)
bill
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go #3 #24; Crossing the finish line in 1st: Davey, Alan, Neil, Rob, Rodney!
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > Frankly, that's the beauty of multiplayer NASCAR. 99% of the people > > online will NEVER EVER have the chance to drive a car around Bristol. But > > you can on Hawaii. That's what we're all about! > > -- > > Ed Martin > > Papyrus Design Group > Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around Bristol? Inquiring minds > would like to know! :-) > Regards PeteQuoted text (47 lines)
> They should put in their time and they'll > >never have to bother with all the newbies they despise. Besides, it > >shouldn't take all that long considering how good they are. > >OK, flame away.... > I guess it bothers me that you have come to believe that the > original testers feel this way, maybe it shouldn't. > Last tues Hawaii went "live", and I think I doubled my phone bill. > The "old timers" I've encountered have actually enjoyed this wild last > 5 days. > Watching the neubies scurrying around from race to race, trying to > check out everything, making the same mistakes, and doing the same > annoying things ("How many laps", "is pace on") that we did is pure > nostalgia. > How can we despise you guys? Hell, we spent MANY hours trying to > make sure Hawaii would work in anticipation of this event . Many > evenings we loaded up our phone charges and for hours nothing worked > right! For months we were limited to 5% races. Constant disconnects, > huge warps, were the norm. All for one purpose so that this would work > when you got here.Those "Pass Car..." messages, the spotter, relative > position chart, and many many other improvments came from some very > dedicated (more than I) unpaid testers. These guys poured their souls > into this....Brian Tate and Terry Adams instantly come to mind but > there are others of course. We wanted to see this week come and I have > had a blast watching you guys play, fight, argue, congradulate, whine, > cry, complain, laugh, and I know theres been some heart thumping > finishs for many of you. > When one of those guys says something, heed the tone, he just might > be trying to help. And Pleeeze lets try and keep this a family board. > Since tues I have raced every night with the neubies and had a great > times and some less than memorable ones too. Some of you are terrific > wheel jockeys and have a great attitude and some are great drivers and > .oh well... > Please don't flame me, I have had that done all week. Many have put in > a ton of time on Hawaii so I'm sure you'll understand if many of us > feel as though Hawaii belongs to "us".....it doesn't and we know it! We > just feel > like it does! <G>. > We can't despise you its too much deja vu! > MLang > PS special mention to Junk from Nasscar ...GREAT run at MIS last > night. (do something about that name its scary<G>)Quoted text (15 lines)
> What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris > Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a > good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing > the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the > drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get > the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii > is set up to do this, but it might help out alot. > There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100% > opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and > their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something. > David Martin > IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl > #26 Samuel Adams ChevyThat's a good idea, both Air Warrior and Warbirds do that.
BTW, how about an FTP or www site dedicated to the Hawaii project? This way we
can participate in bbs discussions and get the latest poop without
a: Paying LD charges.
b: Cluttering p this board for all the poos souls that can't access the Hawaii
project.
The World Group Manager client software would be a good way to go here.
OR, how about having a new newsgroup just for this.
Los
>> Yes, in the begining, because everyone must start at the bottom, "good"
>> drivers" will have to fight it out with "bad" drivers, but I can't think
>> of any other way to handle it.
>What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors.
Let Tony Johns, Chris
series directors suggest a
other people from surfing
directors notify the
that must be used to get
don't know that Hawaii
already and can run 100%
loyalty to Papyrus and
That's fine if you've raced in one of these series', but I can run with
most people, and you or the others don't know me.
Mike
>Maybe one of the things Papyrus could put into Hawaii V2 (hehe) is a
>'driving school', where more experienced drivers could teach us less
>talented folks without hurting anyone's ratings if someone wrecks. Hell, I
>can't even drive well enough to finish a race in single player mode yet,
>and not because I drive like a suicidal on crack. I need guidance. ;)
>Yeah, that's a good idea.
I think someone like you would be looked at differently than someone who
seemingly wrecks people deliberately. I've seen at least two
drivers who decided that the caution laps were a perfect time to try and take
out the rest of the field. If I *could* identify them, I would(to warn
others). Unfortunately, I don't even know the people who made me not want to
try Hawaii again... :(
Eldred Pickett
I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?
I got on late Friday night/early Sat. morning and tried it out
(yes, even this po' boy had to try it at least once ;). I ran a 9
lapper with 33 competitors at Talladega. Things went well, with one
exception: everyone qualified at 188-195, but the guy on the pole
was 212 or so. Maybe a warp?
The race was a demo-derby (no pace lap). I lucked out though and
got a late start, starting from the pits and missing all of the fun. ;)
I ended up 6th and only lost 10 sec or so to the winner (once I was
up to speed) so I can't complain. I'll wait until they come up with
a cheaper connect method and adapt it to ICR2 (or will it be ICR3 by
then? ;) Oh, yeah, and wait until I upgrade to something faster than
my DX2/66 -- low res NASCAR isn't too cool with the unpredictable moves
of the human drivers.
Good work, Rick, Ed, et al!
Pick one or more: Model Rockets (competition-NERCB) / PCs (even Atari!) /
ICR-PRO / NASCAR-NRL / Who needs a life when you have multiple non-lives?
I thought I should add a few comments to this thread. First there
are networks that can give global access and low latency. I
support the worlds largest Frame Relay network for MCI. This
network gives round trip delay numbers for here (Bay area CAl.) to
EUROPE in the 250ms. range and to Japan in the 300ms range. In
the US and Canada the delay is in the 100ms range. This would
provide a suitable enviroment for Multi Player Racing. Also with
Remote lan access (ie. 800 number access in all areas of the US
and most of Canada) you would have the best possible coverage.
I also would like a lan version to allow local club racing. I
also have been looking for the Brickyard 500 game to add the Indy
track to my collection, any help?
In closing look at MCI's network as a solution for Global dial-in
access to a host. Jim Parkhurst / Second Level Support Frame
Relay..
Quoted text (9 lines)
> Since tues I have raced every night with the neubies and had a great >times and some less than memorable ones too. Some of you are terrific >wheel jockeys and have a great attitude and some are great drivers and >.oh well... > Please don't flame me, I have had that done all week. Many have put in >a ton of time on Hawaii so I'm sure you'll understand if many of us >feel as though Hawaii belongs to "us".....it doesn't and we know it! We >just feel > like it does! <G>.Quoted text (7 lines)
>BTW, how about an FTP or www site dedicated to the Hawaii project? This way we >can participate in bbs discussions and get the latest poop without >a: Paying LD charges. >b: Cluttering p this board for all the poos souls that can't access the Hawaii >project. >The World Group Manager client software would be a good way to go here. >OR, how about having a new newsgroup just for this.I don't disagree that these types of drivers have no place racing
against drivers who want some decent competition.
Somehow the terms "game" and "serious competition" seem out of place
when used together. Sure there are guys who take this seriously (maybe
way too seriously)...but if they expect to find NASCAR quality driving
all the time on a public network, they're setting themselves up to be
disappointed. Should they expect a good time and people driving to
win? Yes, no doubt about it. But along with it comes the idiots,
inexperienced, or whatever you want to call them. Nature of the Beast.
But as someone else said, the skill ratings will eventually weed out
the lamers. Then they'll be racing by themselves and can have all the
demo derby action they want. Unfortunately anyone starting out will
have to bob and weave around these guys long enough to work their
rating up.
Don't disagree with this either.
I kind of doubt that this is in any way a majority or even significant
minority of the people racing online. To begin with, anyone who wasn;t
interested in NASCAR Racing, doesn't follow the subject close enough
to realize that Hawaiii even exists.
Which is why I've pretty much limited myself to Talladega online.
Hell, if I can;t stay clean there, I have no business being on the
short tracks.
I think this is true even in real life racing. I doubt that Earnhardt
would profess to having mastered the sport.
Nobody likes jerks that are just out there to cause trouble, that's
for sure. And there's nothing wrong with respecting those who've
attained the best skills...but there was a time when they were green
too. They have no business calling for the heads of newbies because
they're better.
Fine, put your "passion" on display at the track. There's no better
way to show it than to blow the rest away. The best drivers do their
talking on the track.
And I suggest that being an expert doesn't give you the right to be a
demanding jerk.
I race as clean as possible. I never spin anyone out on purpose
(unlike the man in the black #3).
Yes, and that should be the end of it. No need to call for the banning
of newbies.
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
Quoted text (11 lines)
>: I'm not great online (i.e I don't finish last, but don't look for me >: in the top 5 either), but in an offline game with opponents at 100%, I >: usually end up in the top10. Is that too lame to be racing online? >: Don't be surpised if some of the online experts think so. >Maybe one of the things Papyrus could put into Hawaii V2 (hehe) is a >'driving school', where more experienced drivers could teach us less >talented folks without hurting anyone's ratings if someone wrecks. Hell, I >can't even drive well enough to finish a race in single player mode yet, >and not because I drive like a suicidal on crack. I need guidance. ;) >Yeah, that's a good idea.Yeah, you'd think that would work. I did hit enter and the box turned
from red to grey.
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
>> They should put in their time and they'll
>>never have to bother with all the newbies they despise. Besides, it
>>shouldn't take all that long considering how good they are.
> I guess it bothers me that you have come to believe that the
>original testers feel this way, maybe it shouldn't.
Actually I don't feel that way about "all" the original testers. In
fact I have no idea who they are. What set me off on the original rant
was a post I read calling for the banning of newbies. I, being a
newbie to online racing had to say something.
I understand what you mean..it just takes some familiarity to the
system. It wouldn't surprise me if many people don't even notice the
number of laps and race flags (pace, damage, yellows, day/night)
listed on the track screen.
Don't think it's unapreciated. I'm thrilled it works as good as it
does and I'm not naive enough to think it wasn't always this way.
When I race online, I pretty much run the race and keep quiet. That is
unless someone does something really dumb. Like spinning me out on the
pace lap to the point of me not being able to get myself righted,
until the green has dropped.
No flames from me, you're points are valid. I wish I could have been a
tester. Then maybe I wouldn't be stuck in the back so much <G>
Exactly why I couldn't understand all the griping about newbies.
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around Bristol? Inquiring minds > > would like to know! :-) > > Regards Pete > I can't tell you that! :-) But they are out there. Y'all might be > surprised who you're REALLY racing sometimes! > -- > Ed Martin > Papyrus Design Group> : > -- Brian, maybe we can get a red car permanently assigned to you! :-)
> :
> I'd like to request that "puke" green car... especially for the warping
> issue we used to have :-)
> bill
Bill, are you suggesting that Brian makes you sick to your stomach, or is
justed a warped individual! Hmmmm or maybe both! (G)
Pete
>> Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around Bristol?
> Inquiring minds
>> would like to know! :-)
>I can't tell you that! :-) But they are out there. Y'all might be
>surprised who you're REALLY racing sometimes!
Well, it's well known that Bobby Labonte is a BIG fan of the sim, and has made
public appearances to race against other NASCAR sim racers. Now, whether he's
raced on Hawaii or not, I don't know. Personally, I doubt he has the time to
race online right now. :-)
Pat
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pat Campbell The Chevy Monte Carlo 6,94,88,16,4,25
Lexington, AL NASCAR's Wide Load War Eagle!!!
Home Page: http://fly.hiwaay.net/~pscampbe/pscindex.html
NASCAR Stats: http://fly.hiwaay.net/~pscampbe/nascstat.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> That's fine if you've raced in one of these series', but I can run with
> most people, and you or the others don't know me.
> Mike
Online Racing Series' are going to become very popular soon. The good thing about them is you
can boot the demolition people out by changing the password. If you can drive real well, then
you'll always be welcome to drive with me. Most people who have been driving Papyrus NASCAR
Racing for several months have already joined one of these series or at least thought about
it. The inexperienced drivers that everyone keeps complaining about are people who probably
haven't driven for very long in any context, series or no. I do believe that there are plenty
of people out there who, like yourself, are not involved with a series but are very perficient
drivers. You're just the kind of drivers we want. Serious about racing and serious about NOT
wrecking.
David Martin
IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl
#26 Samuel Adams Chevy
HAWAII dgm26sam
On Sunday, April 28, 1996, Los wrote...
> >Okay, time for my $0.02 worth here.
> >I imagine some yay-hoos/closed beta testers will come here and
> >pontificate to build up their egos. Some damn good drivers/closed beta
> >testers may protectively speak their feelings as individuals who have
> >spent many, many hours to get this project ready for this stage. It's up
> >to you to figure out which one is which.
Well I met one beta tester last night, that was not only understanding but
very helpful. Robb, was kind enough to take me aside after the race, and
calmly explain what I SHOULD/COULD have done to get past him. (we were
racing on Atlanta, both on worn tires and I tried to pass when I shouldn't
of)
I try to keep it as clean as possible, but as many have said accidents do
happen.
--
Andy
http://www.westol.com/~ridger
Kali/Nascar/Win95
Well said Michael. As beta testers you guys did a great job. I've only
met one beta tester online, and he was very helpful. Hope the rest of the
guys have your patience. :)
--
Andy
http://www.westol.com/~ridger
Kali/Nascar/Win95
?: True...I've already read one post here in which the author mentioned
?: something at the end about letting the newbies know they shouldn't be
?: dialing in. The service isn't even out of beta and we already have
?: someone saying that the less experienced shouldn't even bother calling
?: in.
?
?: Yeah, I know, I can hear it already: "I'm calling long distance and I
?: don't need to be wrecked by some newbie." Well guess what, maybe the
?: newbie does pretty good against AI cars but hasn't run against all
?: these "self-proclaimed experts who posess the talent but not the bucks
?: needed for their own real NASCAR team." Ok, so maybe I'm stretching
?: their opinion of themself, but damn if they don't come off that way
?: when they pontificate here.
?
?: I'm not great online (i.e I don't finish last, but don't look for me
?: in the top 5 either), but in an offline game with opponents at 100%, I
?: usually end up in the top10. Is that too lame to be racing online?
?: Don't be surpised if some of the online experts think so.
?
?: Most likely this is why Papyrus developed the rating season. Too bad
?: the "experts" want to jump right up to 15 cause they're so good. I
?: have nothing against these guys who are better than I am at NASCAR
?: Racing, but give it a rest. They should put in their time and they'll
?: never have to bother with all the newbies they despise. Besides, it
?: shouldn't take all that long considering how good they are.
?
?: Guess I wont be making too many friends here with my opinions, but oh
?: well, someone's gotta say it. I'm sure Papyrus didn't create this
?: service as a pet project for all the people with Earnhardt Egos and Al
?: Bundy budgets.
?
?Maybe one of the things Papyrus could put into Hawaii V2 (hehe) is a
?'driving school', where more experienced drivers could teach us less
?talented folks without hurting anyone's ratings if someone wrecks. Hell, I
?can't even drive well enough to finish a race in single player mode yet,
?and not because I drive like a suicidal on crack. I need guidance. ;)
?Yeah, that's a good idea.
If crack makes you suicidal, you're an erratic driver
indeed. But that's a *great* idea, actually. If they got a
recognizable Nascar figure to teach the classes, they could probably
get a special "Training Course" track pack out of the deal. In fact,
Richard Petty isn't doing much these days, is he? =)
?--
? ______________________________________________
? 1986 Mustang 5.0 .~ ___________________ _________/
? Under Construction / .~ / /
?Pardon my Bondo dust / / ,-------+ / /
?___________________ / / / / / /
?_______________ / / `--------' / / /
?_________________/ (_________________________/ /________/
--Evan
>> > Frankly, that's the beauty of multiplayer NASCAR. 99% of the people
>> > online will NEVER EVER have the chance to drive a car around Bristol. But
>> > you can on Hawaii. That's what we're all about!
>> > --
>> > Ed Martin
>> > Papyrus Design Group
>> Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around
Bristol? Inquiring minds
WELL SAID ED
i got a question, I was a Martinsville and on the first lap there was a
crash in three and four involving 4 of the 12 cars. seeing as I was last
and wanted to improve my skill level i was taking it easy and threading my
way through the wrecks when I either clipped or was clipped by one of the
stopped cars as they had started to right themselves. anyhow this turned
my car into the wall where I ahd to slam on the brakes and I just taped
the wall. I put it in reverse backed away and then continued racing. there
was no yellows in this race. Does this count as an incident because the
rest of the race I ran hard and finised 6th or 7th and was polite and let
the faster guys go by me . I just hope that I can somehow move up. I know
I make mistakes and havegotten into and even caused my fair share of
wrecks ( in real life racing also) but I want to be able to run clean
eventually and not have to worry about idiots.
Gene Gagne
No flame here. I agree 100%. I have the same problem not last not first
but always around 6 or 7th. Sounds like we should start a support group.
" My name is Gane and I am a mediocore Nascar Racer...."
I wish I could get some of the more ***y ones in a real race. they cry
about the bumoing and such because of the phone bill. they ain't never
watched a months worth of work and a boatload of cash go in the drink
because somone messed up and took a few guys out at the start of the race.
I have run a 1/4 High banked oval and it is just like a Bristol event only
you are sore the next couple of days. But I digress, lets all just get
along ok?
Gene Gagne
Quoted text (8 lines)
><Snip> >>Or how about if a car is going backwards on the track for more than say 3 >>seconds, the guilty car is automatically removed from the race with 10 >>incident points. > That would make it kinda hard to get turned back around if you spin and >end up facing the wrong direction.Quoted text (9 lines)
>Subject: Re: Multiplayer Pace Laps >Date: 27 Apr 1996 14:32:43 GMT >> Any suggestions from experienced Multi-testers is welcome here.. >Mike: > Maybe we should all introduce ourselves so the folks on this group >know who we are. >Later; >Mark McCuen >Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'markmc' (8/95)Might surprise you how many earlr tester have actual track
experience and a few titles themselves.
I'm stilling paying off my race debts.
Quoted text (11 lines)
>> : > -- Brian, maybe we can get a red car permanently assigned to you! :-) >> : >> I'd like to request that "puke" green car... especially for the warping >> issue we used to have :-) >> bill > Bill, are you suggesting that Brian makes you sick to your stomach, or is >justed a warped individual! Hmmmm or maybe both! (G) > Pete> Yesterday (Sunday) I had
>my best day so far. Although I won two races on Friday, last night
>was the best. I had the best backmarkers, very smart competitors, and
>a _VERY_ loose car at Martinsville. Although I had to give up my lead
>about 3 laps to go, I'm very happy with that race.
I'm very happy to be a 'best backmarker', too ;)
claff93
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Winston Cup 7 41 23 Busch South 9 34 47 NCTS 7 07
Busch North 47 44 34 Mod Tour 21 8 10A IRCA 93 39 96
Busch North & Modified Tour Home Pages at http://www.vgernet.net/aclaffie/
Your Attitude Will Be MODIFIED!
Talladega.
Rare occurrences of Martinsville and an occasional Atlanta, but for the
most part: Talladega.
Does anyone race a different track?
Has anyone even *tested* Watkins Glen?
I enjoy the road courses, but it doesn't look like I would get any
"takers".
To the Beta Testers: Has anyone tried running Hawaii on a converted
ICR2 track? Mid-Ohio and Elkhart Lake come to mind as being a couple
that would be fun with a horde of human opponents.
Mike -one lap down, waiting for affordability.
Quoted text (17 lines)
> > > Ed, who are these 1% online who are driving cars around Bristol? Inquiring minds > > > would like to know! :-) > > > Regards Pete > > I can't tell you that! :-) But they are out there. Y'all might be > > surprised who you're REALLY racing sometimes! > > -- > > Ed Martin > > Papyrus Design Group > Ed, I think I know what mean! I raced and talked to 2 guys one night, the one > drove a Busch Grand National and was asking the other for advice! The other seemed to > have a *** for corn flakes! :-) > Regards Pete>Mark McCuen
>Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'markmc' (8/95)
> Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'Epickett'. Nice to meet 'ya!
> Eldred Pickett
Steve McCormick
Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'SteveMc' (5/95)
Quoted text (19 lines)
> > What about going on recommendations of reputatable series directors. Let Tony Johns, Chris > > Keenan, Richard Scott, Tim Wortman, and myself among several other series directors suggest a > > good solid base of drivers that you can place into level 2. To keep other people from surfing > > the net and finding a good driver's name and apply as them, have the directors notify the > > drivers that they want to nominate and give them a special password that must be used to get > > the special level jump. Once you are in, you change your password. I don't know that Hawaii > > is set up to do this, but it might help out alot. > > There are alot of drivers that have been racing for a long time already and can run 100% > > opponent strength races any day of the week without crashing. Their loyalty to Papyrus and > > their work on the track over the past 2 years should count for something. > > David Martin > > IVL Series Director http://www.card.unc.edu/~ivl > > #26 Samuel Adams Chevy > I'm sorry but I don't think "the rest of us" would agree to that. We > don't need any more "Gods" deciding who does what. You run your series > and let Papyrus run theirs. Thank you.Why not have the "REAL DRIVERS" in for a guest race and let us see if
they are as good in *** racing??
Quoted text (9 lines)
>Subject: Hawaii: Something new? >Date: Tue, 30 Apr 1996 06:57:19 -0600 >Talladega. >Rare occurrences of Martinsville and an occasional Atlanta, but for the >most part: Talladega. >Does anyone race a different track? >Has anyone even *tested* Watkins Glen? >I enjoy the road courses, but it doesn't look like I would get any >"takers".Quoted text (7 lines)
>> Yesterday (Sunday) I had >>my best day so far. Although I won two races on Friday, last night >>was the best. I had the best backmarkers, very smart competitors, and >>a _VERY_ loose car at Martinsville. Although I had to give up my lead >>about 3 laps to go, I'm very happy with that race. >I'm very happy to be a 'best backmarker', too ;) >claff93: > : > -- Brian, maybe we can get a red car permanently assigned to you! :-)
: > I'd like to request that "puke" green car... especially for the warping
: > issue we used to have :-)
: Bill, are you suggesting that Brian makes you sick to your stomach, or is
: justed a warped individual! Hmmmm or maybe both! (G)
I know some of you laughed at it... especially my HAL pals.
But, just to explain, a little back ground first on what these WARP
issues were: Didn't matter how good you were, where you qualified, or
what kinda system you were using, but when the flags would wave, or the
server displayed a message, or for just no reason at all... cars would
disappear, reappear, sometimes INSIDE your own car, bounce off walls,
smash into each other, etc.
As testers we never really knew what would happen sometimes. I hosed up a
qualifying run at N.Wilkesboro, I think we had about 16 or 17 in it. My
intention was to start LAST. Yep, sometimes last was the place to be on
these warping starts. But I ended up in the middle. In the MIDDLE? No
way! I was a sitting duck for these WARP problems. It was going to mangle
me up good.
We KNOW it's gonna happen. You ever been in a race where you're NOT
afraid of the other drivers, but really afraid of what's going to happen
anyway? I've run many races with these guys, so we weren't too worried
about each other... just what would happen to us when that green flag waved.
Well, needless to say, when that green flag waved from the pace lap, all
my fears came true. Not only was I watching cars smash around me,
disappear, fly into the wall, parts go everywhere, but I was also
watching to make sure (like I could do anything about it anyway) that I
didn't just headram one of these smashed cars.
I barely mashed the gas at all when that flag went green. Then as the
damage started to pile up I just coasted. I went from 12th to 4th before
crossing the start/finish line. When I viewed the replay, I attributed my
LUCK to the color of my car, Puke Green (from the MULTICAR set). The
track just didn't like the looks of the car and wanted nothing to do with it.
It grabbed and tortured almost every car on the track, except
"puke green #32". It's a lucky car.
bill
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deep In The Heart Of The South
> Maybe, maybe not... People who brag about who they are, really are who
> they claim to be. :-)
> --
> Ed Martin
> Papyrus Design Group
Ed, they weren't bragging! In fact it was more of a personal chat. They were so
engrossed in a convo they didn't notice me there! And no names were mentioned! But I
sometimes listen very well. :-) Very interesting, until I made the mistake of asking a
question and guess what, they didn't answer any of them! :-)
I did get to race them, and they were very good!
Pete
If this is a call to 'put up or shut up', check out the top 20 driver
bulletin next time you log in. You'll find my name there.
So I suppose my passion is Already on display. If I've taken you wrong,
I apologize in advance for checkmating you so hard. It's just that I
took this as you accusing me of being all talk and no action. I assure
you, I have action.
Depends on what you are demanding and why you are demanding it.
I think any driver deserves the right to be angry when he is taken out by
and irresponsible and thoughtless act. Mistakes happen. Mark Martin and
Ricky Craven exemplified that last Sunday; 2 guys goin' for the same
piece of real estate, but wanton bangin' to get a spot is a cheapshot and
I'll rip up anybody, newbie OR pro, who drives like a punk.
Who's calling for the blanket banning of newbies. I'm not. The LA of
PFSS isn't. A newbie won the PFSS race tonite. Good for him. I brought
on a newbie who was staying in front of me at Martinsville in a modem
run. Good for him. We're gonna see a lot of new good talent come in now
that open beta is happening. I also heard of a couple of newbies that
were heard making a statement to the effect of; "let's start crashing
now". SCREW those guys. I call for _them_ to be banned. I hope they
both burn out on this and go back to playing Doom where they belong.
Quoted text (9 lines)
>>> Any suggestions from experienced Multi-testers is welcome here.. >>Mike: >> Maybe we should all introduce ourselves so the folks on this group >>know who we are. >>Mark McCuen >>Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'markmc' (8/95) >Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'Epickett'. Nice to meet 'ya! >Eldred PickettIn other words...a Premature Polish Victory Lap! <G>
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
>>How about programming for "blame" in the most obvious case? i.e., When
>>you rear-end someone, only the rear car should get penalized. That
>>should be pretty easy to program and would probably cover 90% of
>>accidents, especially fore of beginners.
Err right, like I never lift off the throttle in null-modem games. I do
that a lot to scare the other player into backing off. It would be great
if he was blamed for the ensuing accident. I can't play Hawaii but that
would seem a daft rule imposition.
Another silly point. Say I get pushed into a spin and manage to control
it but end up rolling the wrong way, what happens then? If you'd spent an
hour racing only to be removed with a lap to go, how pissed would you be?
Intentional crashes, like t-boning people at corners should be penalised
but would be hard to cover. I mean, if you get hit from behind you could
hit the car in front and so on and if you swerve to avoid a crash and hit
someone, who gets the blame? You or the guy you avoided?
Max
>>Hawaii Beta Test Driver 'Epickett'. Nice to meet 'ya!
>>Eldred Pickett
>Eldred,
>I bet you can't wait for the day you "charge" (get it) from the back
>of the pack to win the big race <G>
Ooh, don't mention 'charge'. That's why I can't afford anything NOW :)
Besides, I think I'm STUCK in the back of the pack....
____
Will work for (racing) speed...
Eldred Pickett
I am NOT paranoid. And why are you always watching me?!?
Just a minor point of correction, it was Mark Martin and Jeff Gordon, that
started/got in the original crash. Ricky Craven was just an innocent bystander
running in traffic when the spinning Martin card nailed him. Seen the race and
the replay about twenty times now.
Los
Not at all what I meant. I was just saying that instead of complaining
about newbies, work on your ranking and you'll soon not have to deal
witrh them. That's all. And this was meant as a collective "you", not
anyone in particular.
Angry, yes...Making a blanket statement about a whole group, no.
No disagreement with me on this one...
Someone did, in not those exact words. Basically claimed that newbies
should have it be known to them that thye shouldn't even bother
calling in.
Absolutely...
Of course....there's definitely no room on Hawaii for that kind of
crap.
Good line <G> And most likely, 100% correct!
=========================================================
==Jim McGuigan Power Switching & Conversion Systems==
==Hanover, PA Baltimore / Washington Field Service==
== ==
** Hawaii Driver: Knuckle Duster **
*********************************************************
I had my fingers crossed when I wrote that (that I was right). I was
emceeing a watch party and turned around just in time to see it and say
"HOLY SHIT!...who started that?!!", live and in public!
Haven't had time to watch the tape again either so I was trying to get it
right when I penned the reply.
"Did I say an hour?...My face is red...I stand corrected" :Prince
Thanks Los
> Yeah, RIGHT. I can't even run Watkins against the AI ! All I ever 'test' are
> the WALLS... :(
> Eldred Pickett
-
In sharp contrast to racing against AI, a race at Watkins Glen against
human players would be more even.... since no one seems to be "good" at
it, it would be slower lap times, but it would still be more interesting
than getting dizzy at "T"
Mike -I don't hate Talledega, but I like to "drive".
Quoted text (11 lines)
>><Snip> >>>Or how about if a car is going backwards on the track for more than say 3 >>>seconds, the guilty car is automatically removed from the race with 10 >>>incident points. >> That would make it kinda hard to get turned back around if you spin and >>end up facing the wrong direction. >By "going backwards" I meant travelling in the opposite direction (clockwise) >around the track.writes...
That might be a good idea but.. what if someone cuts someone off? What if
someone does not accellerate in a race with no pace lap?
There is a lot more to this than you think... someone could come down on the
front of your car entering a corner.. is that your fault?
I myself am more inclined to a bit of a change in the rating system... I have
raced I believe 6 races on the network... I finished a 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th
and was wrecked in the other race by an idiot off the start. This was an
exceptional circumstance and yet it plays into my rating. I think the lowest
and highest ratings shoud be chucked out before averaging it all out.. this
would be fairer to the consistent drivers and help weed out someone who
crashes consistently.
Just a thought.
Weyr
: >
: >Hi Ed,
: >
: >How about programming for "blame" in the most obvious case? i.e., When
: >you rear-end someone, only the rear car should get penalized. That
: >should be pretty easy to program and would probably cover 90% of
: >accidents, especially fore of beginners.
: >
: >Joe
: >
: That might be a good idea, what if someone cuts someone off? What if
: someone does not accellerate in a race with no pace lap?
: There is a lot more to this tha. someone could come down on the
: front of your car entering a corner.. is that your fault?
: I myself am more inclined to a bit of a change in the rating system.I have
: raced I believe 6 races on the network.I finished a 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th
: and was wrecked in the other race by an idiot off the start. This was an
: odd circumstance and yet it plays into my rating. I think the lowest
: and highest ratings shoud be chucked out before averaging it all out.. this
: would be fairer to the consistent drivers and help weed out someone who
: crashes consistently.
You can download the skill level formula from the Hawaii File directory. The
file is Skill.txt. Currently, a driver's two lowest race results are dropped
before they are averaged.
ML
