NASCAR RACING, another take (not-so-long! :-))

[I wrote :) ] : Sim Dim-Lights: (really not that many so far) : -------------- : - Frame-Rate will be sluggish and detail may (will?) be in jeopardy of being : sacrificied to compensate. : - Sound on the SB-16 is a bit scratchy and noisy (more a function of my card : though I think) : - No experience with the modem option yet, but it seems Champ Season is still : not an option for H2H players. : - Manual includes an Index, but not a Glossary of terms used in the StockCar : world. No big deal to me and many are explained in the appropriate places : in the manual anyway. Would be quick reference for the NASCAR-newcomer. : - SVGA version is really not an option for full enjoyment, even on the : higher end 486's and low end Pentiums. Get used to low res. FAST! : - Some complaints about the Black Flag not going away. I have not seen this : problem (if it is one?) personally.... and I've seen the 'dark and dirty : rag' a few times myself ;-) : - I have noticed the restart race hot key-combo _sometimes_ will mess up the : flags and also permit you to pass any amount of cars on the pace lap without : penalty. Happened a few times one night, hasn't happened again since (?) : for sme reason (Noticed at Martinsville only so far). : - No penalization for 'rough-driving'. It seems you can crash cars till' the : proverbial cows come home and you don't suffer (outside of damage).... even : under yellow flag conditions. --- Some additions to this as of last night: - above, I mention the <restart hot key messing up flags>, well I've discovered more accurately when and why it happens. I'll share it here so others can avoid doing this and seeing the problem. It is avoidable and by no means a serious bug, more of an irratation. - basically if you hot-key restart the race exactly when the yellow flag comes out (ie. WAVING FRANTICALLY), then upon restart the flags become messed up a bit and you can pass all the cars etc. as I mentioned previous. However if you wait until the yellow flag "calms down" (ie. more-or-less 'drooping' on the screen) you are safe to restart. Therefore, just wait a second before hitting restart. Clears it up and the game resumes normally. - another item that concerns me a bit is how fast the AI-cars recover from a spin or accident. They tend to do complete 180's INSTANTLY and un- realistically after spins and rejoin the field. They seem to have no down time nor any problem 'righting' themselves back in the right direction. - also, has anyone seen multiple AI-car accidents? I'm currently in the process of running a 500-lapper at Martinsville and so far 2 AI-cars have lossed it and wiped out (no serious damage to them) on their own. No other cars have been collected in the carnage up to this point. ( 100 laps into the event). Other cars get collected if _I_ cause the accident though ;-) - crash-tollorence, though extremely good, may be a bit too low. I have done some banging with other cars, but more often then not it doesn't take too terrible much to get them spinning. Also, it seems AI cars do not bump/contact you (on there own) very much and if they do, the result (so far) seems to be always a spin for them. Now some other good things ;-): - DEFINATELY AI cars utilize the yellow flag periods! Regardless of their fuel status. They'll come in and at least pick up new 'shoes' if a number of laps have been completed under green. - Tire-wear is far more pre*** then fuel status (this is good!). Often you'll find a need to pit before your fuel is physically gone. Especially if your set-up is a bit off. Good work and seem realistic to me. - Though I seem to be able to turn faster then record speeds at Martinsville (only marginally faster though, 95 mph as opposed to 93... not much diff.) I was really impressed with Atlanta! After re-watching last weekends race and having a closer inspection of the telemetry, the speeds so far seem to BANG-ON! Almost frightenly so (in a good way ;-) ). With only minor tweaks to the presented set-ups I was hitting about 191-192 on the straights and 158-161 in the meat of the corners. That's impressive as you'll notice from DW, B.Elliot, and M.Martin's on-board telemetry in real life... these were the numbers I saw :-) Good attention to deatil! --- Well, back to work and the NASCAR-illiterates that work around me.... can you believe? A guy actually ask me after thumbing through the manual a bit, "why do you _have_ to worry about shock settings and stuff in NASCAR? I didn't know they did that!" ... I was floored and couldn't even answer, that's how off guard it caught me! :-) --- See ya all and thanks for listening! -- Christopher Goucher Atlantic Geoscience Centre work: (902) 426-4754 Dartmouth, Nova Scotia home: (902) 865-9270 CANADA

>- also, has anyone seen multiple AI-car accidents? I'm currently in the > process of running a 500-lapper at Martinsville and so far 2 AI-cars > have lossed it and wiped out (no serious damage to them) on their own. > No other cars have been collected in the carnage up to this point. > ( 100 laps into the event). Other cars get collected if _I_ cause > the accident though ;-) Yes, I've seen one. Before turn 3 at Michigan. I was about the 8th car in a big train. Elton Sawyer (2nd in the train) out of nowhere smacked the wall and spun. Everyone following him (including me!) was collected. I looked at reply angle after replay angle and never saw a reason for his wreck. -- +-----------------------------+-------------------------------------------- | BNR Inc. RTP North Carolina |USmail: 35 Davis Drive RTP, NC 27709 | +-----------------------------+--------------------------------------------

: : Sim Dim-Lights: (really not that many so far) : : -------------- : : - Frame-Rate will be sluggish and detail may (will?) be in jeopardy of being : : sacrificied to compensate. : : - Sound on the SB-16 is a bit scratchy and noisy (more a function of my card : : though I think) : : - No experience with the modem option yet, but it seems Champ Season is still : : not an option for H2H players. : : - Manual includes an Index, but not a Glossary of terms used in the StockCar : : world. No big deal to me and many are explained in the appropriate places : : in the manual anyway. Would be quick reference for the NASCAR-newcomer. : : - SVGA version is really not an option for full enjoyment, even on the : : higher end 486's and low end Pentiums. Get used to low res. FAST! My 486DX-33 with ATI Ultra (Mach 8 chip on ISA card) 8 meg RAM makes the game look pretty bad. Indy 500 and Ferrari Formula One from around 1988 look and drive better on a 68000 Amiga 100 than NASCAR does on my 486! What progress in 6 years... I tried SVGA with objects off and all textures off, 4 cars in front, 1 in back, -f for FM instead of digital sound (yuk!), and 2 motor sounds. I could barely stay on the track since the frame rate was so bad. The same setup in VGA runs fine, but the 'feel' of the car just isn't there like the games I loved on my Amiga. I think I'll have to stop using my computer as a game machine and buy something that was intended for the purpose. Anyone wanna buy a used copy of NASCAR? -- Brian R. Mayer Product & Manufacturing Systems

>: : in the manual anyway. Would be quick reference for the NASCAR-newcomer. >: : - SVGA version is really not an option for full enjoyment, even on the >: : higher end 486's and low end Pentiums. Get used to low res. FAST! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I've got a "high-end" Pentium (90 Mhz) and this game is still unplayable in SVGA mode without some tweaking. Granted, my graphics card isn't the best, but still, it makes we wonder who Papyrus thinks is actually going to be able to play this game! There are probably, what, 100 video-*** consumers there who have machines fast enough to handle it with all detail turned on, and of those probably only about 10 are NASCAR fans... :-) Anyway, I have found that (a) using the "mono" sound option, (b) reducing the number of opponents by 10 or so, and (c) turning off asphalt texture (and usually grass texture as well) allows for an acceptable frame refresh rate on my machine. The lack of road texture really takes away from the feeling of speed, but the SVGA graphics are so sharp that I think I can live with it! And the graphics and colors on the other cars are just incredible, made my jaw drop when I saw them actually. I really like the game, but it does bother me that it won't run w/ full detail on the fastest machine widely available right now... This one should definitely become a classic as machines that are fast enough to play it come out, but in the interim I have a feeling that Papyrus is going to get quite a bit of backlash about it. _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ --

`[1;31;47mRainbow V 1.06 for Delphi - Test Drive

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> I've got a "high-end" Pentium (90 Mhz) and this game is still > unplayable in SVGA mode without some tweaking. Granted, my graphics > card isn't the best, but still, it makes we wonder who Papyrus thinks > is actually going to be able to play this game! There are probably, > what, 100 video-*** consumers there who have machines fast enough > to handle it with all detail turned on, and of those probably only > about 10 are NASCAR fans... :-) Anyway, I have found that (a) using > the "mono" sound option, (b) reducing the number of opponents by 10 or > so, and (c) turning off asphalt texture (and usually grass texture as > well) allows for an acceptable frame refresh rate on my machine. The > lack of road texture really takes away from the feeling of speed, but > the SVGA graphics are so sharp that I think I can live with it! And > the graphics and colors on the other cars are just incredible, made my > jaw drop when I saw them actually. I really like the game, but it > does bother me that it won't run w/ full detail on the fastest machine > widely available right now... This one should definitely become a >classic as machines that are fast enough to play it come out, but in >the interim I have a feeling that Papyrus is going to get quite a bit >of backlash about it. > _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

Brad, Papyrus will know doubt take some backlash about the "processor appetite" I have a p-90 with a Stealth 2 meg vram. But for the first time with a game I had to tweek. I've never had to make a boot disk ect. But with this one I did. Removed smartdrv, setver, etc. After I made the boot disk, I then put in on the HD rename config's and autoexec's and ran memmaker. I then ended up with over 7500k of memory. This made a vast differance in the game even in vga. I then put those config's and stuff in my muti config.sys file and away I go. Just a thought here I'm no expert. But I was so used to just installing a running, that I was suprised I had to "tweek" Might try the boot disk program and see what happens, remember to add what you need for the sound card. Hope this helps, Gerald > -- NASCAR SVGA It Will Never Be the Same Again!! `[1;34;47mRainbow V 1.06 for Delphi - Test Drive

Jeeze, I can't believe everyone is still complaining about this. Papyrus comes up with something that can't really be played fully on today's fastest hardware, so rather than make changes so it'll work, THEY GIVE YOU THE POWER to set the graphics to whatever you desire. I'm glad that -I- have the power to decide which part of the eye-candy I can live without to make it work, RATHER than the software company mandating it for me. And how about the future? You know, the world will not end with P90 systems. In 2-3 years when systems are running 10X (or more) the performance of what they are today, we'll still have this game, and we'll be able to take advantage of it even more. Which tact would you have wanted Papyrus to have taken: 1) Release no SVGA version at all because the majority of the systems out there wouldn't be able to do it? 2) Release an SVGA version where Papyrus decided FOR YOU what aspects of the graphics, sound, and gameplay were and were not important so that it would run well on a majority of the machines out there? 3) Release an SVGA version designed so that you can decide for yourself what is important and what is not, and that has room to grow for the future? I for one am glad they chose #3. Stop whining about it. Later... Steve

---Hmmm, that actually wasn't a problem for me. I've already had to run memmaker, etc., in the past, so for me even with the CD-ROM driver installed I have plenty of memory free.... I suggest using multiple bootup configurations, which is what I do - i.e., in some instances there's no point to load the mouse driver, for example, and I have an option which lets me avoid doing so. And now I hear that it's possible to actually install the SVGA version to the hard drive, which will eliminate the need to load the CD-ROM driver! So basically memory problems aren't a concern for me... ---Well, thanks for the advice. I think the "tweaking" I'm talking about is more related to lack of processing speed (yes, even with a P-90!!). How- ever, using the detail/texture/sound settings I mentioned in the last post, I'm getting a great tradeoff between amazing visuals and frame refresh rate (in fact, even with digital sound *on* it's acceptable as well). When I first bought the game, I thought I was going to end up having to use the VGA version exclusively for my serious *** purposes... but now I'm thinking the SVGA version will be fast enough (especially if I ever get a better video card). ---Yep, I agree. I guess I'm a sucker for the "eye-candy" everyone keeps talking about... :-) _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

: Anyone wanna buy a used copy of NASCAR? I spoke prematurely. First I'm going to check with ATI for a VESA driver (I was using one from Links 386, and the new ATI windows driver did wonders for Windows apps). Second, Babbages says I can return it, so no sense taking a loss. Thanks for the offers, but I'll have to retract my original posting. -- Brian R. Mayer Product & Manufacturing Systems

: [I wrote :) ] : - also, has anyone seen multiple AI-car accidents? I'm currently in the : process of running a 500-lapper at Martinsville and so far 2 AI-cars : have lossed it and wiped out (no serious damage to them) on their own. : No other cars have been collected in the carnage up to this point. : ( 100 laps into the event). Other cars get collected if _I_ cause : the accident though ;-) Get this I am new to this type of racing and the manual says to start out at Talladega. Fine I start practice and doing very good, not the best. Finally start the race and about the 8th lap I hear two cars hit, then two more bumps, I am alone in the back of the field but ease up on the gas thinking to my self "I didnt do it" I coming out of turn 3 at 165mph and TOO LATE! 15 car pileup ahead. I brake but didnt work, into the other cars. Engine gone. I watch awhile and seen some of the other cars limped back into the race. I watch the replay over at diferent views and cars to see how it happened. Just didnt expect that since ICR didnt have too many AI crashes. I guess next time I gotta watch out.

You apparently didn't read the rest of my post. I'm totally e***d about this game - in fact, I'm thinking about purchasing a T1 since I now have two great games to play it with (the other being ICR, of course). I fully agree with you that it's a good thing that Papyrus chose to let *us* decide what textures are on, and that they released the SVGA version in the first place. Definitely a new standard in racing games (to state the obvious). Questions: (1) I assume Papyrus is planning on having and expansion pack (or packs) for this game, right? Some of my favorite tracks aren't here, and I'm just wondering for future reference since I haven't heard any mention about it. (2) I notice on the back of the box that they have a picture of Martinsville at night - and I read in the manual that you can only race the night tracks if you're running the championship. I haven't had enough free time to get that far yet - has anyone else? It looks like it'd be pretty cool... _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

Everyone, Been playing Nascar to my eyes are tilted at 38 degrees. <G> Great, Great, Great, Sim. Has anyone noticed any thing dumb in the pitting of the Ai? All in all the AI seem to be great. But it seems like in yellow flag pitting, about 10 will go in, then some more the next lap. These are all cars on the lead lap. I've seen those that were in front of me coming down for the green suddenly make the pit stops. Doesn't make an sense. Anybody else notice this. Also on the save game deal. If you save between sessions it seems fine. But if you have to save during a race. And 500 miles at Bristol your gonna want to save. It takes all the lapped traffic and puts them behind you, it also seems like you lose whatever lead you have, and everybody start from a standing start. Is that the way everybody's is working? Thanks, Gerald NASCAR SVGA: You can't make me go back `[1;33;47mRainbow V 1.06 for Delphi - Test Drive

: : : Sim Dim-Lights: (really not that many so far) : : : -------------- : : : - Frame-Rate will be sluggish and detail may (will?) be in jeopardy of being : : : sacrificied to compensate. : : : - Sound on the SB-16 is a bit scratchy and noisy (more a function of my card : : : though I think) : : : - No experience with the modem option yet, but it seems Champ Season is still : : : not an option for H2H players. : : : - Manual includes an Index, but not a Glossary of terms used in the StockCar : : : world. No big deal to me and many are explained in the appropriate places : : : in the manual anyway. Would be quick reference for the NASCAR-newcomer. : : : - SVGA version is really not an option for full enjoyment, even on the : : : higher end 486's and low end Pentiums. Get used to low res. FAST! : My 486DX-33 with ATI Ultra (Mach 8 chip on ISA card) 8 meg RAM makes the game : look pretty bad. Indy 500 and Ferrari Formula One from around 1988 look and : drive better on a 68000 Amiga 100 than NASCAR does on my 486! What progress : in 6 years... : I tried SVGA with objects off and all textures off, 4 cars in front, 1 in : back, -f for FM instead of digital sound (yuk!), and 2 motor sounds. I : could barely stay on the track since the frame rate was so bad. The same : setup in VGA runs fine, but the 'feel' of the car just isn't there like : the games I loved on my Amiga. I think I'll have to stop using my computer : as a game machine and buy something that was intended for the purpose. : Anyone wanna buy a used copy of NASCAR? Well I have in lo-res all detail set to top with 18 cars in front and 10 behind, and I don't think it would be possible for it to be much smoother. This is on a 486DX2-50 16 meg with a slow ISA video card. Ok not the base model of things but since this is a DX2 the real speed is only 25Mhz. I have one possiblity for it going really fast on my computer, I have all sound turned off as my sound card is a windows one and not many games support it yet (Magic Carpet demo does, I must commend BullFrog for getting something right :) ). Adam.