Re: Fixing MSFF

Warren Reicho <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7th1it$182c$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (9 lines)

> Good or not, finally I have that MSFFWheel. > Now I clearly understand, what Alison meant in "notchy, grindy feel". > Have anyone solved it ? And how to remove the cover of the wheel safely ? > > Thank you. > > PS. Generally, I am not satisfied with the MSFF. Moving the force-feedback > aside, Nascar Pro had better feel and was almost REAL to touch. > "NOFORCE" zone at center, when with some small steering corrections you

can > feel something like the stops about +/- 5 degrees from center.Andweakening > the force settings makes this just worse - it grows.. > The wheel is too loud ( especially in CMR ), and my wife Alice sleepsworse > last days. I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl. Yes it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF wheel. Joel Willstein [email hidden]

lol, I am completely opposite Nascar pro is a toy to me, so the msff is way better than nascar pro, oh and my nascar pro broke after 2 months, I had msff ever since it came out without any problems. The msff is definitely built a whole lot better than the flimsy pro wheel

Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its pedals, pots..) What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have to try Logi, then sell one of them . MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord so the strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. > I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl.Yes

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> it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge > improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. > > If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. > However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF > wheel. > > Joel Willstein > [email hidden]

Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its pedals, pots..) What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have to try Logi, then sell one of them . MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord so the strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. Thanks for reply. Warren Joel Willstein <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7tj4qv$rd7$[email hidden]... > > Warren Reicho <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7th1it$182c$[email hidden]... > > Good or not, finally I have that MSFFWheel. > > Now I clearly understand, what Alison meant in "notchy, grindy feel". > > Have anyone solved it ? And how to remove the cover of the wheel safely? > > > > Thank you. > > > > PS. Generally, I am not satisfied with the MSFF. Moving theforce-feedback

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> > aside, Nascar Pro had better feel and was almost REAL to touch. > > "NOFORCE" zone at center, when with some small steering corrections you > can > > feel something like the stops about +/- 5 degrees from center.And > weakening > > the force settings makes this just worse - it grows.. > > The wheel is too loud ( especially in CMR ), and my wife Alice sleeps > worse > > last days. > > > I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl.

Yes

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> it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge > improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. > > If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. > However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF > wheel. > > Joel Willstein > [email hidden] >

"Warren Reicho" <[email hidden]> writes:

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> Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's > not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its > pedals, pots..) > What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if > possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best > wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have > to try Logi, then sell one of them . > MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : > > 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. > 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in > control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. > 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when > moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit > the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord so the > strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. >

Many good points. Let me twist it around and do the "3 things that I like with the MSFF" 1. It's solid engineering. 2. The angle of the wheel and the height of it when clamped to my desk give me a more car-like feeling. Many other wheels are standing on the desk and have a angle so it feels like driving a bus. 3. The profiler. I find it so easy to adjust to every game that are able to run in a windows dos-box (not N2 that is, which is the only game it doesn't work with) Ahh, i really felt good to be positive once in a while :) Have a great weekend everybody. -- Olav K. Malmin remove spam when replying

Warren Reicho <[email hidden]> wrote: : MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. I got used to it. First few times it was weird - like you were steering from "notch" to "notch" - but after a while you get the hang. : 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in : control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. Doesn't bother me. : 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when : moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit : the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord so the : strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. This bothers me too - also even just with return to center it seems to have some lag. It may be my imagination but it seems like it could be getting worse too. I don't know for sure. It's bad even if you've just got return to center on and you waggle the wheel. It's like it takes the wheel some time to "catch up" - annoying. -- Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York. email: [email hidden] www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its pedals, pots..) What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have to try Logi, then sell one of them . MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a *** cord so the strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. Thanks for reply. Warren > > Good or not, finally I have that MSFFWheel. > > Now I clearly understand, what Alison meant in "notchy, grindy feel". > > Have anyone solved it ? And how to remove the cover of the wheel safely ? > > Thank you. > > PS. Generally, I am not satisfied with the MSFF. Moving the force-feedback

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> > aside, Nascar Pro had better feel and was almost REAL to touch. > > "NOFORCE" zone at center, when with some small steering corrections you > can > > feel something like the stops about 5 degrees from center.And > weakening > > the force settings makes this just worse - it grows.. > > The wheel is too loud ( especially in CMR ), and my wife Alice sleeps > worse > > last days. > I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl.

Yes

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> it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge > improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. > If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. > However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF > wheel. > Joel Willstein

If you're using MSFF in GPL, Put this line to your core.ini file to [ joy ] section, and I assure you there is no null zone. force_feedback_latency = 0.00001 ; force feedback latency (secs) PS. ^ I use that setting myself. Here is my complete settings for MSFF with GPL: allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it force_feedback_damping = 001.000000 ; force feedback damping coefficient force_feedback_latency = 0.00001 ; force feedback latency (secs) max_steering_torque = 0025.000000 ; steering torque in N*in giving max device force ....and Sidewinder panel: Forcestrength to: low Centering force to none. In games without FF(or poor FF), I agree that Nascar Pro is better(except the pots...).

Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its pedals, pots..) What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have to try Logi, then sell one of them . MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord so the strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. Thanks for reply. Warren Joel Willstein <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7tj4qv$rd7$[email hidden]... > > Warren Reicho <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7th1it$182c$[email hidden]... > > Good or not, finally I have that MSFFWheel. > > Now I clearly understand, what Alison meant in "notchy, grindy feel". > > Have anyone solved it ? And how to remove the cover of the wheel safely? > > > > Thank you. > > > > PS. Generally, I am not satisfied with the MSFF. Moving theforce-feedback

Quoted text (12 lines)

> > aside, Nascar Pro had better feel and was almost REAL to touch. > > "NOFORCE" zone at center, when with some small steering corrections you > can > > feel something like the stops about +/- 5 degrees from center.And > weakening > > the force settings makes this just worse - it grows.. > > The wheel is too loud ( especially in CMR ), and my wife Alice sleeps > worse > > last days. > > > I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl.

Yes

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> it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge > improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. > > If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. > However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF > wheel. > > Joel Willstein > [email hidden] >

Actually, I like MSFF, it has many advantages than any other wheel, but it's not the best.And any other wheel is not the best, even Logi.( I mean its pedals, pots..) What I really don't like is some of its issues, that I want to fix myself if possible. MSFF isn't better than Nascar Pro, of course, now it's the best wheel I ever raced and I won't change it to Logitech blindly, first I have to try Logi, then sell one of them . MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you hit the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a *** cord so the strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. Thanks for reply. Warren > > Good or not, finally I have that MSFFWheel. > > Now I clearly understand, what Alison meant in "notchy, grindy feel". > > Have anyone solved it ? And how to remove the cover of the wheel safely ? > > Thank you. > > PS. Generally, I am not satisfied with the MSFF. Moving the force-feedback

Quoted text (11 lines)

> > aside, Nascar Pro had better feel and was almost REAL to touch. > > "NOFORCE" zone at center, when with some small steering corrections you > can > > feel something like the stops about 5 degrees from center.And > weakening > > the force settings makes this just worse - it grows.. > > The wheel is too loud ( especially in CMR ), and my wife Alice sleeps > worse > > last days. > I've been using a MSFF wheel since the 1.1 patch came out for gpl.

Yes

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> it has a grindy feel, but you quickly get use to it. I found it a huge > improvement over the bungie cord that my T2 used. > If you don't like the MSFF,I would suggest a Logitec wheel. > However,Alison uses them both,and is slowly coming to terms with the MSFF > wheel. > Joel Willstein

Thank everybody who replied, and sorry for multiple posts - sometimes my provider works VERY strange, so you sure that posting failed and try to post again several times. And then anywhere you sure that post failed, cos there is no message in NG, you spit ,you #$^%$ , and next day you see all of them and get crimson. Thank you, Marko,cannot wait til I get home from office to try these settings. Chair is burning. I tried to experiment with different settings based on many advices from the Web, but couldn't choose which of them comforts me the best. As I feel that setting FF to better feel of grip decreases wheel reaction of gravel, bumps etc. and vice versa. Neither is good. I know that if I want to make a fast lap......I want both fish and ... Blah-blah-blah... Have a best times! Marko Viitanen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7tlse0$1di$[email hidden]... > If you're using MSFF in GPL, Put this line to your core.ini file to[ joy ] > section, and I assure you there is no null zone. > > force_feedback_latency = 0.00001 ; force feedback latency (secs) > > PS. ^ I use that setting myself. Here is my complete settings for MSFFwith

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> GPL: > > allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it > force_feedback_damping = 001.000000 ; force feedback damping > coefficient > force_feedback_latency = 0.00001 ; force feedback latency (secs) > max_steering_torque = 0025.000000 ; steering torque in N*in giving > max device force > > ....and Sidewinder panel: > > Forcestrength to: low > Centering force to none. > > In games without FF(or poor FF), I agree that Nascar Pro is better(except > the pots...). > > Warren Reicho kirjoitti viestiss� <7tk9vm$1di0$[email hidden]>... > >MSFF is great, but there are 3 thing that dissapoint me now : > > > > 1. "Grindy feel" - maybe I'll get use to it, sure. > > 2. Impossibility to setup the forse and return to center strenght in > >control panel not in fixed values - I believe in new version of software. > > 3. And the most serious I dislike is that null zone at center , when > >moving the wheel lightly first meets no interference,then suddently you

hit > >the barrier, light but incomfortable .Nascar Pro have a rubber cord sothe > >strenght increases gently from nothing too full at max lock. > >