Re: Why cheat by using warez when...

On Sun, 19 Mar 2000 18:53:10 -0500, "Mark F." <[email hidden]> wrote: >Good point, but u got people like me who will buy a peice of software, burn >the ISO of the cd as soon as i get home, and freakin return it, so whether >warez or buy, don't make a living difference here. Though, I am on the same >point where if a game is good, I go ahead and by, like gpl as an exaple >which is quality. > Well, Mark, you see, you are the problem, aren't you? Why on earth would you burn a copy of a game that wasn't good? Do you see where I'm coming from here? I agree with trying out the occasional game prior to it's ship date. Hey, call it curiosity, being an early adopter, corporate revenge, or whatever you will, but I think that if a game is good enough to burn, it's good enough to buy. Would I be wrong, Mark? If so, I'd like to hear why. Why would you steal from those who make gaming possible? Its one thing to try something out, and it's another thing to steal it. Wouldnt you agree?

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>"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in >message news:[email hidden]... >> ...you have Electronics Boutique? >> >> I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- >> day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for >> a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't >> like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. >> >> Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB >> and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, >> then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- >> board and legal, and still risk-free. >> >> (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 >> yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day >> policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that >> needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of >> RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) >> >> -- >> David. >> "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, >> really." >> (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

-- * rrev at mindspring dot com * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. * http://www.cabal.net

...you have Electronics Boutique? I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- board and legal, and still risk-free. (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

Good point, but u got people like me who will buy a peice of software, burn the ISO of the cd as soon as i get home, and freakin return it, so whether warez or buy, don't make a living difference here. Though, I am on the same point where if a game is good, I go ahead and by, like gpl as an exaple which is quality. "David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > > I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > > Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > board and legal, and still risk-free. > > (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) > > -- > David. > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > really." > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

>...you have Electronics Boutique? > >I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- >day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for >a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't >like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. No EBs anywhere nearby. That said, I really do like open return policies as I am much more likely to give a game a try. And having to ship it back for a 6-8 week wait on a refund check is not the same thing, not at all. I had to spend shipping and postage plus wait forever on my refunds for some SierraSports products back in '97. At that point I stopped buying games right when they came out and started to wait for a patch or two. -Tim

"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote > ...you have Electronics Boutique? Please remember that EB is not implemented in every country, or every city and village in the world ;-) > Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Well, it's goes back to the rhetoric question about "who came first? Egg or chicken?". Some people appreciate to have knowledge about the quality of a software they intend to buy before the release date. Quite like movie reviewers, who have special screenings before it's released to the main market. Or music reviewers. Or <insert any type of Entertainment>. When we discuss this in a mature way, it is benefitial, at the opposite of what happened with F1 2000, which went to far imho. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

I think that you mean "whoring". -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as hoaring > warez.

On Mon 20 Mar 2000 03:02:29p, Mrv wrote: >Bullshit the laws are not different. I am in theVideo Production >Business. Copying of someones work or program is illegal. Don't try >to bend the rules here just to make it okay. Furthermore I don't >think warez is okay, but like I said I love to try before I buy. >The hell with the developers. I have been burnt in the past and no >more!!! <snip> We had this problem in the UK not so long ago. Someone noticed that, the way our laws were framed, it was illegal to keep even a personal copy of a TV programme for over 28 days. The law was quickly changed, and it's now *definitely* legal to record off the telly for your own personal use. -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

You've got a very good point there, but its games like Viper that deserve the game play, but not all of its money, same going with nascar99 nice, but why pay for the same nascar2 twice. its deals like that when one makes an iso and returns other. new games, or major upgrades are worth like a icr1 to and icr2 of those old days, but not something silly like a n2 to n99. "rrevved" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Sun, 19 Mar 2000 18:53:10 -0500, "Mark F." <[email hidden]>wrote: > > >Good point, but u got people like me who will buy a peice of software,burn > >the ISO of the cd as soon as i get home, and freakin return it, sowhether > >warez or buy, don't make a living difference here. Though, I am on thesame

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> >point where if a game is good, I go ahead and by, like gpl as an exaple > >which is quality. > > > > Well, Mark, you see, you are the problem, aren't you? Why on earth > would you burn a copy of a game that wasn't good? Do you see where > I'm coming from here? I agree with trying out the occasional game > prior to it's ship date. Hey, call it curiosity, being an early adopter, > corporate revenge, or whatever you will, but I think that if a game > is good enough to burn, it's good enough to buy. > > Would I be wrong, Mark? If so, I'd like to hear why. > > Why would you steal from those who make gaming possible? > Its one thing to try something out, and it's another thing to > steal it. Wouldnt you agree? > > >"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in > >message news:[email hidden]... > >> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > >> > >> I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > >> day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > >> a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > >> like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > >> > >> Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > >> and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > >> then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > >> board and legal, and still risk-free. > >> > >> (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > >> yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > >> policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > >> needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > >> RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) > >> > >> -- > >> David. > >> "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > >> really." > >> (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh) > > -- > * rrev at mindspring dot com > * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. > * http://www.cabal.net >

On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:43:24 -0500, "Mark F." <[email hidden]> wrote: >You've got a very good point there, but its games like Viper that deserve >the game play, but not all of its money, So, according to you, Viper Racing which was released ORIGINALLY as a budget title had great gameplay but didnt deserve your money and deserved to be stolen and burned on a CD? Since it only cost $29.99 originally, somehow, I think you either are an incredibly cheap bastard, or you just steal whatever you can get away with. Whichever the case, like I said, youre the problem, Mark. >same going with nascar99 nice, but >why pay for the same nascar2 twice. its deals like that when one makes an >iso and returns other. Sigh... so you have some kinda rules that apply to what you steal? BTW, do -you- consider yourself a thief? When store clerks at the mall arent looking, do you just take what you want, since the product is not worth the price they are asking? Answer this question, Mark! > new games, or major upgrades are worth like a icr1 >to and icr2 of those old days, but not something silly like a n2 to n99. > See above, thief.boy..

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>"rrevved" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Sun, 19 Mar 2000 18:53:10 -0500, "Mark F." <[email hidden]> >wrote: >> >> >Good point, but u got people like me who will buy a peice of software, >burn >> >the ISO of the cd as soon as i get home, and freakin return it, so >whether >> >warez or buy, don't make a living difference here. Though, I am on the >same >> >point where if a game is good, I go ahead and by, like gpl as an exaple >> >which is quality. >> > >> >> Well, Mark, you see, you are the problem, aren't you? Why on earth >> would you burn a copy of a game that wasn't good? Do you see where >> I'm coming from here? I agree with trying out the occasional game >> prior to it's ship date. Hey, call it curiosity, being an early adopter, >> corporate revenge, or whatever you will, but I think that if a game >> is good enough to burn, it's good enough to buy. >> >> Would I be wrong, Mark? If so, I'd like to hear why. >> >> Why would you steal from those who make gaming possible? >> Its one thing to try something out, and it's another thing to >> steal it. Wouldnt you agree? >> >> >"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in >> >message news:[email hidden]... >> >> ...you have Electronics Boutique? >> >> >> >> I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- >> >> day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for >> >> a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't >> >> like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. >> >> >> >> Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB >> >> and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, >> >> then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- >> >> board and legal, and still risk-free. >> >> >> >> (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 >> >> yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day >> >> policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that >> >> needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of >> >> RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) >> >> >> >> -- >> >> David. >> >> "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, >> >> really." >> >> (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh) >> >> -- >> * rrev at mindspring dot com >> * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. >> * http://www.cabal.net >> >

-- * rrev at mindspring dot com * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. * http://www.cabal.net

On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 12:21:18 GMT, "Cliff Roman" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Btw, for those of you that think it is ok cause companies like Papy/Sierra >"screwed" you, just remember they offer you a 30-day Free Return Policy on >all their games. If you buy ANY Sierra game and do not like it, within 30 >days you can return it to them and they will refund your money. Hi Cliff... If this comment is an oblique reference to my dissatisfaction with the broken promises related to Nascar Revolution, then FYI, Nascar Revolution was developed by EA Sports. The same people that now have released F1-2000. If not, then carry on .. -- * rrev at mindspring dot com * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. * http://www.cabal.net

On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:08:24 GMT, Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote: >You don't have a clue do you about when it comes to video do you? Yea, there's just so much to know. Gee, do I set for 2, 4 or 6 hour mode... how perplexing. You couldn't even make it clear if you meant duplicating video cassettes or taping from television, Einstein. What do you do for a living Mr. Video Expert... tape weddings? Tim

On Sun 19 Mar 2000 10:28:27p, ymenard wrote: >"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote >> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > >Please remember that EB is not implemented in every country, or >every city and village in the world ;-) I take that point, but it's pretty clear that a lot of the "lemme at the warez" types live in "remote hamlets" like New York or Glasgow...

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>> Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? > >Well, it's goes back to the rhetoric question about "who came first? >Egg or chicken?". Some people appreciate to have knowledge about >the quality of a software they intend to buy before the release >date. Quite like movie reviewers, who have special screenings >before it's released to the main market. Or music reviewers. Or ><insert any type of Entertainment>.

So presumably you'd be accepting of "warez" versions of CDs/videos/DVDs/etc etc etc.? >When we discuss this in a >mature way, it is benefitial, at the opposite of what happened with >F1 2000, which went to far imho. Sheesh. A balanced and sensible putting forward of an argument. What *is* going on with this NG? -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

On Mon 20 Mar 2000 12:02:39a, Mrv wrote: >That's fine and dandy David. But most people don't have the luxury >of being able to return software. Like where I am from, once you >leave the door that's it. You bought the damn thing. Only way to >return product is if it defective and then they will replace it with >a new one. So tough luck if it sucks too bad your out $50 dollars, >is that fair?<snip> No. I must say, I wasn't aware that EB were so unusual in their returns policy - quite a few shops have something similar in the UK. I don't think what you do is really *morally* wrong (I exclude that CD-burning person here), but it's still illegal. OK, so copying a CD onto cassette is also illegal, and everyone does that. Fair point. But for some reason I (personally) draw the line at warez software. I suppose what I really mean is: "don't use pirate software. Unless you really, really need to." :-) -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

On Mon 20 Mar 2000 04:07:39a, ymenard wrote: >"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote <snip> >> Sheesh. A balanced and sensible putting forward of an argument. >> What *is* going on with this NG? > >I didn't fully understood your first phrase. It's a good thing or >not?<snip> DO you mean "sheesh"? It's a fairly common euphemism for "shit". It was a (somewhat sarcastic...) expression of surprise that someone (you) had actually put forward a sensible and reasoned argument in favour of certain types of warez. -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

On Mon 20 Mar 2000 04:07:39a, ymenard wrote: >"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote <snip> per example me, EB has no store in Qu�bec <snip> Ah well, EB staff obviously can't speak French, you see. Actually, some of the ones I know have a bit of trouble with English... :-) -- David. "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 04:56:28 GMT, Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote: >Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as hoaring >warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I would like >to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one. Broadcast programs are free, genius. You don't see anyone here quacking about downloading freeware, do you? If you're talking about a movie on a pay channel, it's not comparable since the licensed is different. You're allowed to record it as long as you don't rebroadcast it publicly or charge for it. Tim

Please remember that EB is not implemented in every country, or every city and village in the world ;-) >>>>Well, it is in every city that has the internet! ;) Rik Anthrax - - "trust the government?? what are you, some kind of moron?" "Cato was right."

That's fine and dandy David. But most people don't have the luxury of being able to return software. Like where I am from, once you leave the door that's it. You bought the damn thing. Only way to return product is if it defective and then they will replace it with a new one. So tough luck if it sucks too bad your out $50 dollars, is that fair? I have bought alot of software in the past only to have been burnt. NO MORE. I am not ashamed of downloading warez as I have to check things out now. I glad I did with F1-2000 because it is nothing but junk. Out it went!!! When Gp3 comes out I will get the warez. If it is as good as it supposed to be, I will gladly buy a copy. I have no guilt the hell with software companies. I would say that 70% of the stuff released is junk anyway. Have a nice day. David Buttery wrote:

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> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > > I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > > Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > board and legal, and still risk-free. > > (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) > > -- > David. > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > really." > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

"Mrv" wrote <snip>. I have no guilt the hell with software > companies. I would say that 70% of the stuff released is junk anyway. It is very easy to be highly critical of the publishers. We have all been burnt buying titles that promise new features - only to find they end up on the shelf. Sure it leaves a bitter taste. How some titles ever make it to the publisher seems incredible (SOS for example). However, as sim enthusiasts it is easy for us to be too critical of titles that lack the purist physics models of GPL. Imagine a new computer owner looking for a decent F1 game & steering wheel to run on his shiny new Athlon 850. F1-2000 would surely be well received. Compared with say Formula 1 99 it is a proper sim - with plenty of potential life (aids to remove, AI to improve, setup options to discover). Perhaps we have to accept that this is the core market and hope to gain some spin offs in the form of physics patches from the developers or (more likely) third party add ons from the enthusiasts to get what we want. Tony

"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote > I take that point, but it's pretty clear that a lot of the "lemme at > the warez" types live in "remote hamlets" like New York or Glasgow... Of course I completly agree. Those "wear canni dload da warez" are clearly not part of the r.a.s. community. They are mostly lurkers or people who are clearly not what I call "hardcore simracers" in heart and mind. We don't need scums like that. What I said is that many of us (per example me, EB has no store in Qu�bec) hardcore simracers have no choice but to go "try it, see if I like it" instead of "buy it, see if I like it". Demo are not anymore what I research, as they are mostly rushed out, or give false impression of the final product.

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> >Well, it's goes back to the rhetoric question about "who came first? > >Egg or chicken?". Some people appreciate to have knowledge about > >the quality of a software they intend to buy before the release > >date. Quite like movie reviewers, who have special screenings > >before it's released to the main market. Or music reviewers. Or > ><insert any type of Entertainment>. > > So presumably you'd be accepting of "warez" versions of > CDs/videos/DVDs/etc etc etc.?

Of course not since It's not my domain. As a r.a.s. citizen, I guess many of us have a role, even if informal, to help people. It is the basic of our newsgroup. And when you help people, I consider that it's a plus to have the information before the title is release so you can help the rest of the community (lurkers, people who don't have the same experience or want to get answers about certain types of racing simulators). > Sheesh. A balanced and sensible putting forward of an argument. What > *is* going on with this NG? I didn't fully understood your first phrase. It's a good thing or not? Still, Im not sure what's going on also. Give it a week and people will calm down, I hope. Until Gp3 <sarcasm> -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote > DO you mean "sheesh"? It's a fairly common euphemism for "shit". It was > a (somewhat sarcastic...) expression of surprise that someone (you) had > actually put forward a sensible and reasoned argument in favour of > certain types of warez. Ah ok. I knew about sheesh, should had wrote "second sentence" ;) I wasn't sure if you were sarcastic or not in your comment, since I associated the full paragraph as one main idea. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as hoaring warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I would like to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one. David Buttery wrote:

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> On Mon 20 Mar 2000 12:02:39a, Mrv wrote: > > >That's fine and dandy David. But most people don't have the luxury > >of being able to return software. Like where I am from, once you > >leave the door that's it. You bought the damn thing. Only way to > >return product is if it defective and then they will replace it with > >a new one. So tough luck if it sucks too bad your out $50 dollars, > >is that fair? > <snip> > > No. I must say, I wasn't aware that EB were so unusual in their returns policy > - quite a few shops have something similar in the UK. I don't think what you do > is really *morally* wrong (I exclude that CD-burning person here), but it's > still illegal. OK, so copying a CD onto cassette is also illegal, and everyone > does that. Fair point. But for some reason I (personally) draw the line at > warez software. > > I suppose what I really mean is: "don't use pirate software. Unless you really, > really need to." :-) > > -- > David. > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really." > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

You lose that bet because I don't. <G> Mike Mrv wrote in message <[email hidden]>... >Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same ashoaring >warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? Iwould like >to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one.

Am I supposed to believe that?

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> You lose that bet because I don't. <G> > Mike > >Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as > hoaring > >warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I > would like > >to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one.

The laws on this are slightly different than pirating software. You are more than welcome to copy a show that is on tv Still making excuses why pirating software is ok? Btw, for those of you that think it is ok cause companies like Papy/Sierra "screwed" you, just remember they offer you a 30-day Free Return Policy on all their games. If you buy ANY Sierra game and do not like it, within 30 days you can return it to them and they will refund your money. All you need to do is tell them why you did not like it. You can tell them the color of the box was ugly and they will still return the money. (I got my money back for one of their games in about 2 weeks, pretty good considering it takes at least 6 to get rebates back from most companies) Even knowing this, I bet some of you will still use the same ole lame "testing the software" excuse to pirate N4 also. Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the sameas hoaring > warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? Iwould like

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> to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one. > > David Buttery wrote: > > > On Mon 20 Mar 2000 12:02:39a, Mrv wrote: > > > > >That's fine and dandy David. But most people don't have the luxury > > >of being able to return software. Like where I am from, once you > > >leave the door that's it. You bought the damn thing. Only way to > > >return product is if it defective and then they will replace it with > > >a new one. So tough luck if it sucks too bad your out $50 dollars, > > >is that fair? > > <snip> > > > > No. I must say, I wasn't aware that EB were so unusual in their returns

policy > > - quite a few shops have something similar in the UK. I don't think whatyou do > > is really *morally* wrong (I exclude that CD-burning person here), butit's > > still illegal. OK, so copying a CD onto cassette is also illegal, andeveryone > > does that. Fair point. But for some reason I (personally) draw the lineat > > warez software. > > > > I suppose what I really mean is: "don't use pirate software. Unless youreally, > > really need to." :-) > > > > -- > > David. > > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,really." > > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh) >

Am I supposed to believe that? "Michael P. Mabrey" wrote:

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> You lose that bet because I don't. <G> > > Mike > > Mrv wrote in message <[email hidden]>... > >Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as > hoaring > >warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I > would like > >to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one.

Bullshit the laws are not different. I am in theVideo Production Business. Copying of someones work or program is illegal. Don't try to bend the rules here just to make it okay. Furthermore I don't think warez is okay, but like I said I love to try before I buy. The hell with the developers. I have been burnt in the past and no more!!! Cliff Roman wrote:

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> The laws on this are slightly different than pirating software. You are > more than welcome to copy a show that is on tv > > Still making excuses why pirating software is ok? > > Btw, for those of you that think it is ok cause companies like Papy/Sierra > "screwed" you, just remember they offer you a 30-day Free Return Policy on > all their games. If you buy ANY Sierra game and do not like it, within 30 > days you can return it to them and they will refund your money. All you > need to do is tell them why you did not like it. You can tell them the > color of the box was ugly and they will still return the money. (I got my > money back for one of their games in about 2 weeks, pretty good considering > it takes at least 6 to get rebates back from most companies) > > Even knowing this, I bet some of you will still use the same ole lame > "testing the software" excuse to pirate N4 also. > Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same > as hoaring > > warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I > would like > > to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one. > > > > David Buttery wrote: > > > > > On Mon 20 Mar 2000 12:02:39a, Mrv wrote: > > > > > > >That's fine and dandy David. But most people don't have the luxury > > > >of being able to return software. Like where I am from, once you > > > >leave the door that's it. You bought the damn thing. Only way to > > > >return product is if it defective and then they will replace it with > > > >a new one. So tough luck if it sucks too bad your out $50 dollars, > > > >is that fair? > > > <snip> > > > > > > No. I must say, I wasn't aware that EB were so unusual in their returns > policy > > > - quite a few shops have something similar in the UK. I don't think what > you do > > > is really *morally* wrong (I exclude that CD-burning person here), but > it's > > > still illegal. OK, so copying a CD onto cassette is also illegal, and > everyone > > > does that. Fair point. But for some reason I (personally) draw the line > at > > > warez software. > > > > > > I suppose what I really mean is: "don't use pirate software. Unless you > really, > > > really need to." :-) > > > > > > -- > > > David. > > > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > really." > > > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh) > >

You don't have a clue do you about when it comes to video do you? "Tim O." wrote:

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> On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 04:56:28 GMT, Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is just the same as hoaring > >warez. I bet everyone in this Ng does it. But that is okay right? I would like > >to hear the comments of the goody boys on this Ng on this one. > > Broadcast programs are free, genius. You don't see anyone here > quacking about downloading freeware, do you? > If you're talking about a movie on a pay channel, it's not comparable > since the licensed is different. You're allowed to record it as long > as you don't rebroadcast it publicly or charge for it. > > Tim

To hell with Video Producers as well, and anyone in the film business. Sure, you're doing your job, but why should you get paid if people can get your stuff for free? I've been to bad movies based on previews that didn't accurately portray the film. I got burned for my $6 per ticket and got gouged on popcorn as well, and had the date pissed at me for taking her to a bad movie. So I guess it's alright if I pop into the theater without paying, take a camcorder in and make a bootleg, so I can let other folks "preview" the flick so they know whether to spend the $6 to see it there? THAT, my friend, is a valid analogy to Warez. BTW, since you're "in the biz", you do understand the concept of Fair Use? I can LEGALLY tape a program off the TV, a song off the radio, whatever - for my PERSONAL use. I can't charge to have the friends over to watch the taped movie, I can't make sell copies of the movie - but I can tape it and watch it until the tape breaks. What I CAN'T do legally is rent the movie from Blockbuster and dub it onto the other VCR - THAT is illegal - like burning a copy of a game I bought and giving the CD to a friend. I can backup disks or burn a CD copy for MY personal archival use however. I can do a tape off of a CD I own and play it in my car - I CAN'T legally make a copy of it and give to a friend or sell it. If it were illegal to tape programs off the TV - here is a frigging clue - THEY COULDN'T SELL VCRS and RECORDABLE TAPES. We'd all have PLAYERS and could only watch the movies we bought or rented at Blockbuster. Geez - if you're going to use analogies, make proper ones. -- Ken's Sig 3.01 "Who is the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?" - Obi-Wan Kenobi Go #43 and #44! volksy (at) yahoo (dot) com Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Bullshit the laws are not different. I am in theVideo Production Business. > Copying of someones work or program is illegal. Don't try to bend the rules > here just to make it okay. Furthermore I don't think warez is okay, but like I > said I love to try before I buy. The hell with the developers. I have been > burnt in the past and no more!!! > > Cliff Roman wrote: > > > The laws on this are slightly different than pirating software. You are > > more than welcome to copy a show that is on tv > >

Actaully, even if it was illegal to tape stuff (I have no clue to this, though), it would still be legal to sell recordable tapes and VCR's. You could buy them, it would just be illegal to use them, that's all. Doesn't make sense? Well, much of the legal stuff doesn't. Ken Beard wrote:

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> > If it were illegal to tape programs off the TV - here is a frigging clue - > THEY COULDN'T SELL VCRS and RECORDABLE TAPES. We'd all have PLAYERS and > could only watch the movies we bought or rented at Blockbuster. Geez - if > you're going to use analogies, make proper ones. > > -- > Ken's Sig 3.01 > > "Who is the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?" - > Obi-Wan Kenobi > > Go #43 and #44! > > volksy (at) yahoo (dot) com >

"Mrv" <[email hidden]> wrote: > Putting a tape in a VCR and recording a movie or a show is > just the same as hoaring warez. Sorry, that battle was already fought (and lost) by Jack Valenti and his cronnies back in the 70's. > But that is okay right? Better than OK, it is legal. Try studying up at: http://www.loc.gov/copyright/ Regardless, assuming you were right, the basis of your argument is 'two wrongs make a right'. Try that tack next time you are in traffic court and see where it gets you. - George

I would think that it is because we don't all live in the UK .....hehe :-) daw:-) David Buttery <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > > I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > > Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > board and legal, and still risk-free. > > (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) > > -- > David. > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > really." > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

No.. had nothing to do with you. My comment was because I know that when N4 comes out, people will pull this "try before you buy" crap also and when Sierra offers a no questions asked 30 day return policy, that excuse just wont hold up. rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 12:21:18 GMT, "Cliff Roman" <[email hidden]>wrote: > > >Btw, for those of you that think it is ok cause companies likePapy/Sierra > >"screwed" you, just remember they offer you a 30-day Free Return Policyon > >all their games. If you buy ANY Sierra game and do not like it, within30

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> >days you can return it to them and they will refund your money. > > Hi Cliff... If this comment is an oblique reference to my dissatisfaction > with the broken promises related to Nascar Revolution, then FYI, > Nascar Revolution was developed by EA Sports. The same people that > now have released F1-2000. > > If not, then carry on .. > > -- > * rrev at mindspring dot com > * unit.26 - s.p.u.t.u.m. > * http://www.cabal.net

"Mrv" <[email hidden]> wrote > Am I supposed to believe that? If I were you, I would ;) Mike isn't the type of person who says anything to impress. He's just well.. bizarre sometimes. Sorry Mike, had to take that out eh! > "Michael P. Mabrey" wrote: > > You lose that bet because I don't. <G> -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

"Rikanthrax" <[email hidden]> wrote > Well, it is in every city that has the internet! ;) Thanks, I always assumed that EBworld didn't changed their online store so I wasn't able to order a title from their website. Thanks for the info, mmm that's a good thing to know now! (they changed their policy from a year ago). -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

Sorry, you're wrong. Have a look at the copyright notice at the end of the credits for every TV show. -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- Cliff Roman <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:2JoB4.534$[email hidden]... > The laws on this are slightly different than pirating software. You are > more than welcome to copy a show that is on tv

You're applying double standards here .... or don't you see that? -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- Mrv <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Bullshit the laws are not different. I am in theVideo Production Business. > Copying of someones work or program is illegal. Don't try to bend the rules > here just to make it okay. Furthermore I don't think warez is okay, but like I > said I love to try before I buy. The hell with the developers. I have been > burnt in the past and no more

That's NOT a global ruling, Mr. Smiley. Different horses for different courses, old chap. -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- George M. Smiley <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:rrtB4.6048$[email hidden]... > > > > Sorry, that battle was already fought (and lost) by Jack > Valenti and his cronnies back in the 70's. > > > Better than OK, it is legal. Try studying up at: >

(snip) If it were illegal to tape programs off the TV - here is a frigging clue - THEY COULDN'T SELL VCRS and RECORDABLE TAPES. We'd all have PLAYERS and could only watch the movies we bought or rented at Blockbuster. Geez - if you're going to use analogies, make proper ones. (unsnip) Well, on the subject of making proper analogies, please explain why CD burners are made available to John Q. Citizen? -- Regards, Bruce Kennewell, Canberra, Australia. --------------------------- Ken Beard <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:%psB4.2498$2%[email hidden]... >

EB have a global policy, Dave. As much as I dislike the lack of "gaming" knowledge shown by EB staff (no requirement for gaming experience when applying for a job!) the company does have a liberal attitude towards returns. [email hidden] wrote:

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> Hiya > > Here in Australia they have a policy that you cannot return games (cd > burning and all that stuff etc). Although since moving to Brisbane > recently I noticed that EB is up here and am wondering if they have > that same policy of 10day return. In Adelaide where I moved from there > was a great hire PC game place called Interscape at Paradise so you > could try b4 buy. > > Dave > > On 19 Mar 2000 22:07:52 GMT, > [email hidden] (David Buttery) wrote: > > >...you have Electronics Boutique? > > > >I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > >day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > >a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > >like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > > > >Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > >and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > >then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > >board and legal, and still risk-free. > > > >(If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > >yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > >policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > >needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > >RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".)

they dont do that in Houston,Texas, just look at me like i am nuts when i ask! "David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> ...you have Electronics Boutique? > > I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- > day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for > a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't > like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > > Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB > and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, > then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- > board and legal, and still risk-free. > > (If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 > yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day > policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that > needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of > RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".) > > -- > David. > "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, > really." > (Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh) >

Hiya Here in Australia they have a policy that you cannot return games (cd burning and all that stuff etc). Although since moving to Brisbane recently I noticed that EB is up here and am wondering if they have that same policy of 10day return. In Adelaide where I moved from there was a great hire PC game place called Interscape at Paradise so you could try b4 buy. Dave On 19 Mar 2000 22:07:52 GMT, [email hidden] (David Buttery) wrote:

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>...you have Electronics Boutique? > >I don't know about elsewhere in the world, but in the UK, EB has a 10- >day "no fuss returns" policy. In other words, you can return a game for >a refund, even if it's not faulty, on the grounds that you just don't >like it, assuming it's in mint condition with the receipt. > >Given this, why the hell do people need warez versions? Just go into EB >and buy the game honestly. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out, >then take it back to the shop and get your refund/excange. All above- >board and legal, and still risk-free. > >(If it's of interest, I was talking to a member of staff about F12000 >yesterday, and he was expecting a lot of returns under their 10-day >policy. As he said: "they're going to have a problem with a game that >needs this kind of spec to run properly - especially the 128 megs of >RAM, seeing as most new PCs only come with 64 megs these days".)

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>Sorry, you're wrong. >Have a look at the copyright notice at the end of the credits for every TV >show. >-- >Regards, >Bruce Kennewell, >Canberra, Australia. >--------------------------- > >Cliff Roman <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:2JoB4.534$[email hidden]... >> The laws on this are slightly different than pirating software. You are >> more than welcome to copy a show that is on tv

True, but if I record a TV show while I'm not home so I can watch it later, is that REALLY criminal...? I don't believe anyone is really going to complain about 'time-shifting'... There are a bunch of gray areas. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

>EB have a global policy, Dave. >As much as I dislike the lack of "gaming" knowledge shown by EB staff (no >requirement for gaming experience when applying for a job!) the company does >have a liberal attitude towards returns. Last time I needed to return a game at EB(it didn't run on my system the way I *thought* it should), the guy gave me a VERY hard time about it. So much so that I didn't buy anything from EB for about 3 years... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Bruce Kennewell <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > Well, on the subject of making proper analogies, please explain why CD > burners are made available to John Q. Citizen? >Data backup. Now, if you're asking about the dual CD burners, then it's a bit thornier. Stephen

Its not global it is up to the store manager. they dont allow returns at any of the EB stores here. "Leaky_Valve" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > EB have a global policy, Dave. > As much as I dislike the lack of "gaming" knowledge shown by EB staff (no > requirement for gaming experience when applying for a job!) the companydoes > have a liberal attitude towards returns. >

Exactly... it's fast, capacious and reliable. At about $1 for a disk it's also the cheapest per Meg of data (but not re-usable). Jan. =--- Stephen Ferguson <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8bf9p7$4tdcu$[email hidden]... <Snip>

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> Data backup. Now, if you're asking about the dual CD burners, then it's a > bit thornier. > > Stephen > > >

Stephen Ferguson wrote:

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> > Bruce Kennewell <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > Well, on the subject of making proper analogies, please explain why CD > > burners are made available to John Q. Citizen? > > > Data backup. Now, if you're asking about the dual CD burners, then it's a > bit thornier. > > Stephen

Multi-tasking data backup? -- Chuck Kandler #70 K&S Racing http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195 Competitor in the TopGear MGPRS2 league at: http://topgear.dhs.org/ Come on & join the fun! They'll call you names And spit in your face, But legends never die. --Gene Simmons

Backups of your own software or music? "Chuck Kandler" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Stephen Ferguson wrote: > > > > Bruce Kennewell <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > Well, on the subject of making proper analogies, please explain why CD > > > burners are made available to John Q. Citizen? > > > > > Data backup. Now, if you're asking about the dual CD burners, then it's

a

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> > bit thornier. > > > > Stephen > > > Multi-tasking data backup? > > -- > Chuck Kandler #70 > K&S Racing > http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195 > > Competitor in the TopGear MGPRS2 league at: > http://topgear.dhs.org/ Come on & join the fun! > > They'll call you names > And spit in your face, > But legends never die. --Gene Simmons >

Gotta say that EB here in the UK have always been spot on with regards to returns. The couple of CD's I have returned have been accepted back with no hassle whatsoever, they just ask for some feedback as to why it was returned. One I returned just because I didn't like it, didn't have any other problems with it and they still made no waves about taking it back. Same with hardware. I actually returned a soundcard about 1 month after I bought it and after explaingng to them that I had been unable to evaluate it due to working away unexpectedly they took it back good as gold. I only ever buy from anywhere else now if EB are definately not going to stock what I want and even then I am very reluctant due to most other stores very poor policies on returns. Peter Hooper

In article <buQD4.4542$[email hidden]>, "Peter Hooper" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>Gotta say that EB here in the UK have always been spot on with regards to >returns. The couple of CD's I have returned have been accepted back with no >hassle whatsoever, they just ask for some feedback as to why it was >returned. One I returned just because I didn't like it, didn't have any >other problems with it and they still made no waves about taking it back. >Same with hardware. I actually returned a soundcard about 1 month after I >bought it and after explaingng to them that I had been unable to evaluate it >due to working away unexpectedly they took it back good as gold. > >I only ever buy from anywhere else now if EB are definately not going to >stock what I want and even then I am very reluctant due to most other stores >very poor policies on returns. > >Peter Hooper > >EldredP <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> >EB have a global policy, Dave. >> >As much as I dislike the lack of "gaming" knowledge shown by EB staff (no >> >requirement for gaming experience when applying for a job!) the company >does >> >have a liberal attitude towards returns. >> >> Last time I needed to return a game at EB(it didn't run on my system the >way I >> *thought* it should), the guy gave me a VERY hard time about it. So much >so >> that I didn't buy anything from EB for about 3 years...

Then you're lucky. I may try to find an EB again and ask about their current return policy. We'll see. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.